Hi guys, Ramsay Bolton fan number one here :P. Today I want to talk about something that really annoys me and worries at the same time. The new Tavern Brawl has been released (the cooperative one, against Gearmaster Mechazod) and I think it's completly amazing, probably the best Tavern Brawl ever. The problem is, there are a lot of people complaining because it's too dificult for them. Here is a very popular thread about it called "This Brawl is too difficult": http://www.hearthpwn.com/forums/hearthstone-general/tavern-brawl/81049-this-brawl-is-too-difficult
Now, the first time I played it, I won and I thought that it was easy, but in the end it is not, and probably I was matched with a good player. It is also not very hard, but it's challenging, and that is what makes it so good. The same happens with the game overall, it's challenging specially at good ranks and legend, but it seems that bad players that only complain about everything and don't like to improve don't like this style of game. And this is a very, very bad thing for all of us.
We know what happened recently with the game and with the introduction of Mysterious Challenger... we have a deck that has a very good win rate and is one of the easiest to pilot out there. Now, I don't have too much problem with it neither, mostly because I played with Mage this seasons, but I have to admit that in the end it's a very powerful deck with no so much skill involved (although I think that hitting legend with it still has it's own merits). The thing is, it seems that Blizzard take note of this behaviour (players wanting things to be easier) and then they implement them on the game, harming it's quality.
Hardcore players and good players are probably the ones that most of the time milk this company with it's money, support and fanbase since a lot of time ago. So, does Blizzard really needs to satisfy the needs of this bad and annoying players while compromising the quality of the game?. I don't think so. I think that this game focus should be mostly for those that love challenges, having a good time, and not only caring about easy wins.
What do you think about this? Should Blizzard stop listening to this kind of players? Do we really need them?
Note: Guys, I finally changed the original thread title (Casual and bad players are harming Hearthstone) because it was obviously wrong and wasn't exactly what I was trying to say. Also, I edited this post a bit, thanks for your help :)
I understand why they listen to them, I know that the bulk of those players won't be making that climb to legendary. It is disappointing that blizzard would implement mechanics that make the game too easy. I enjoy the challenge that comes from building decks and trying things that may seem unorthodox. Hopefully we will all continue to see new things tried
I think you are definitely onto something, I have noticed it myself. Although this brawl is a step in a very good direction and I have faith in Blizzard that this game will curve out into something favorable for both sides of players.
This is Blizzard, just look at what they did to World of Warcraft, everything is so dumbed down, you can sit in one place all day and play the whole game. It's just Blizzard's way, they cater to the casual. The true hardcore are only a handful compared to the casual.
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You do not truly know someone, until you fight them.....
I think you are definitely onto something, I have noticed it myself. Although this brawl is a step in a very good direction and I have faith in Blizzard that this game will curve out into something favorable for both sides of players.
"I have faith in Blizzard..." stopped reading. Quote. Comment. Post. Quit.
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Always Squelch.
"Every time you beat an aggro deck, you make the world a better place". Kripp 2015
Same old debate since Vanilla Wow. "casual players are the worst! We want a game for pro's"
Guess what mate - only a very small percentage could be called "hardcore" and "pro's" in this game. And Blizzard made their choice long time ago - better work for a huge audience then a small group of "hardcore gamers".
Personally I've been waiting, praying that one day some sort of team-against-a-boss would be created and it has. I don't care how bad my opponent is, I love the concept. It's also a great way to learn how to work as a team and it's probably very easy to make friends this way!
It's not a bad idea to cater to those people too, the problem is when/if they think that catering to the lowest common denominator is a priority over almost everything. When the game feels more like playing the slot machines than playing chess, because anyone can win in the slot machines so the average idiot is happy, then there's a serious problem with the design philosophy of the game.
Anyway, i came out of this brawl thinking the exact opposite, i thought that it was too easy! I have won 4 out of 4 so far, and was amazed at all the "it's too difficult" comments that i found here and on reddit.
So, it is my fault for not being bad at this game and also because I don't let them have easy wins in a competitive enviroment. Yeah, that make sense... sigh...
LOL, well it wouldn't be a Blizzard game if somewhere, someone wasn't espousing how great they are and how there are too many "bads" playing the same game as them.
I think you are definitely onto something, I have noticed it myself. Although this brawl is a step in a very good direction and I have faith in Blizzard that this game will curve out into something favorable for both sides of players.
"I have faith in Blizzard..." stopped reading. Quote. Comment. Post. Quit.
Bitter little man/woman is bitter. Call it what you will but optimism is not a fault when paired with realism.
Any community will have an elite that's separate from the masses. Eliminate the "bad" players (who are mostly just new or casual, so I'm not sure how you can consciously despise either of those) and you're left with something like 5 or 10% of the current population of Hearthstone. Within that sliver you'd then have the top 10% claiming they're elite and the rest are trash, etc. Social stratification is inevitable, but Blizzard will cater to the quantity, not necessarily quality, because gaming success is measured in numbers.
Hearthstone is, by its very nature, a casual game, so it seems silly to complain that casuals are ruining it. If you want truly competitive card game go play magic the gathering or something.
Rollback Post to RevisionRollBack
Originality is the art of remembering what you heard while forgetting where you heard it.
The game was designed to be a casual experience from the start but as the nerds we are we decided to go tryhard mode and make tournaments out of it, if anything, the tryhard crowd is trying to ruin the game for the casuals but blizzard wont change a design perspective that is aparently working from a business standpoint. You can play the game however you like and set your own goals to get a feel of accomplishment or nerdy bragging rights, here is the catch, that wont give you the right to go around telling the other players how the game should be enjoyed. Yes Mysterious challenger is a design abomination but it has nothing to do with the players using the cards in their collections.
Hearthstone is, by its very nature, a casual game, so it seems silly to complain that casuals are ruining it. If you want truly competitive card game go play magic the gathering or something.
I have already played games like Magic the Gathering and the WOW TCG in the past, but this kind of "entertainment" is too expensive for me, so I prefer Hearthstone.
Also, so many easily butthurt people on this thread... WTF guys. I just don't want this game to die because of the probable decision of Blizzard to aim, in some cases, it's difficult level to very low standards lately. Why they should do this, if Hearthstone started like a good, challenging and successful game for everyone?. This is just Blizzard being too greedy, that is all... and we all know how things usually end for companies when they only want easy money...
P.D.: I'm an old school Blizzard fanboy (I used to play a lot of games like Starcraft: Broodwar, Diablo 2, Warcraft 3,etc) so I just don't want them to repeat some mistakes again...
In order to survive, the first thing a game needs is a solid playerbase. Yet here you are suggesting we should just cut off 95% of it ... sure
One thing is totally removing them from the playerbase and other, is to stop listening some of it's silly demands, wich is what I'm suggesting. They played this game a lot when things like Secret Paladin didn't exist (we already had Face Hunter for them), so they would probably still do it without the need of reducing the difficult level of the game even more...
Funny thing is, Blizzard games gain the player base more quickly when they don't cater to casuals than when they do. It seems that any game that's good enough will have casual players so why bother to cater to them?
Hi guys, Ramsay Bolton fan number one here :P. Today I want to talk about something that really annoys me and worries at the same time. The new Tavern Brawl has been released (the cooperative one, against Gearmaster Mechazod) and I think it's completly amazing, probably the best Tavern Brawl ever. The problem is, there are a lot of people complaining because it's too dificult for them. Here is a very popular thread about it called "This Brawl is too difficult": http://www.hearthpwn.com/forums/hearthstone-general/tavern-brawl/81049-this-brawl-is-too-difficult
Now, the first time I played it, I won and I thought that it was easy, but in the end it is not, and probably I was matched with a good player. It is also not very hard, but it's challenging, and that is what makes it so good. The same happens with the game overall, it's challenging specially at good ranks and legend, but it seems that bad players that only complain about everything and don't like to improve don't like this style of game. And this is a very, very bad thing for all of us.
We know what happened recently with the game and with the introduction of Mysterious Challenger... we have a deck that has a very good win rate and is one of the easiest to pilot out there. Now, I don't have too much problem with it neither, mostly because I played with Mage this seasons, but I have to admit that in the end it's a very powerful deck with no so much skill involved (although I think that hitting legend with it still has it's own merits). The thing is, it seems that Blizzard take note of this behaviour (players wanting things to be easier) and then they implement them on the game, harming it's quality.
Hardcore players and good players are probably the ones that most of the time milk this company with it's money, support and fanbase since a lot of time ago. So, does Blizzard really needs to satisfy the needs of this bad and annoying players while compromising the quality of the game?. I don't think so. I think that this game focus should be mostly for those that love challenges, having a good time, and not only caring about easy wins.
What do you think about this? Should Blizzard stop listening to this kind of players? Do we really need them?
Note: Guys, I finally changed the original thread title (Casual and bad players are harming Hearthstone) because it was obviously wrong and wasn't exactly what I was trying to say. Also, I edited this post a bit, thanks for your help :)
I understand why they listen to them, I know that the bulk of those players won't be making that climb to legendary. It is disappointing that blizzard would implement mechanics that make the game too easy. I enjoy the challenge that comes from building decks and trying things that may seem unorthodox. Hopefully we will all continue to see new things tried
I hide behind a field of lazor beams
I think you are definitely onto something, I have noticed it myself. Although this brawl is a step in a very good direction and I have faith in Blizzard that this game will curve out into something favorable for both sides of players.
10/10 BM
This is Blizzard, just look at what they did to World of Warcraft, everything is so dumbed down, you can sit in one place all day and play the whole game. It's just Blizzard's way, they cater to the casual. The true hardcore are only a handful compared to the casual.
You do not truly know someone, until you fight them.....
Always Squelch.
"Every time you beat an aggro deck, you make the world a better place". Kripp 2015
Same old debate since Vanilla Wow. "casual players are the worst! We want a game for pro's"
Guess what mate - only a very small percentage could be called "hardcore" and "pro's" in this game. And Blizzard made their choice long time ago - better work for a huge audience then a small group of "hardcore gamers".
So no - casual gamers dont ruin your game.
Personally I've been waiting, praying that one day some sort of team-against-a-boss would be created and it has. I don't care how bad my opponent is, I love the concept. It's also a great way to learn how to work as a team and it's probably very easy to make friends this way!
It's not a bad idea to cater to those people too, the problem is when/if they think that catering to the lowest common denominator is a priority over almost everything. When the game feels more like playing the slot machines than playing chess, because anyone can win in the slot machines so the average idiot is happy, then there's a serious problem with the design philosophy of the game.
Anyway, i came out of this brawl thinking the exact opposite, i thought that it was too easy! I have won 4 out of 4 so far, and was amazed at all the "it's too difficult" comments that i found here and on reddit.
Get over yourself OP. Elitism like you display here is what really hurts the game more than anything.
It's not them who ruin game for you.
It's You who ruin game for them.
LOL, well it wouldn't be a Blizzard game if somewhere, someone wasn't espousing how great they are and how there are too many "bads" playing the same game as them.
10/10 BM
Any community will have an elite that's separate from the masses. Eliminate the "bad" players (who are mostly just new or casual, so I'm not sure how you can consciously despise either of those) and you're left with something like 5 or 10% of the current population of Hearthstone. Within that sliver you'd then have the top 10% claiming they're elite and the rest are trash, etc. Social stratification is inevitable, but Blizzard will cater to the quantity, not necessarily quality, because gaming success is measured in numbers.
Hearthstone is, by its very nature, a casual game, so it seems silly to complain that casuals are ruining it. If you want truly competitive card game go play magic the gathering or something.
Originality is the art of remembering what you heard while forgetting where you heard it.
The game was designed to be a casual experience from the start but as the nerds we are we decided to go tryhard mode and make tournaments out of it, if anything, the tryhard crowd is trying to ruin the game for the casuals but blizzard wont change a design perspective that is aparently working from a business standpoint. You can play the game however you like and set your own goals to get a feel of accomplishment or nerdy bragging rights, here is the catch, that wont give you the right to go around telling the other players how the game should be enjoyed. Yes Mysterious challenger is a design abomination but it has nothing to do with the players using the cards in their collections.
THE LEGEND!!!! (not really)