This thread is probably incredible pointless and due my mediocre written english a pain in the butt to read but I honestly don't care too much.
The last few days I came back to playing Zoo after month of abstinence and a failed "creative" deck I made myself after the nerf of Undertaker. I found the deck from Capen, made some minor changes and did play ladder and I think I haven't played as much ladder in month and the main reason is the enjoyment of playing a true Zoo deck again.
While Undertaker Zoo was without the shadow of a doubt the strongest Zoo deck, looking back at it did take away a lot of the enjoyment I had with Zoo. Instead of using every card in your deck as a tool for basically the same task, suddenly there was this one minion you really cared about which is not was Zoo should be about. Undertaker in Zoo was the shotgun on the renaissance fair, the gun in a bar brawl.
The beauty of Zoolock is not the brute power but the elegance of using numbers and tempo. People call Zoolock an aggro deck and it kinda was during the prime of DR Zoo but I never thought of it that way. For me Zoo unites both tempo, value and control in a way no other deck in HS does, the only aggressive part in Zoo is the tempo you try to develop. With Undertaker Zoo T1 - T3 were basically a given, you wanted to develop your Undertaker because you knew if you buff it up, you have the most powerful tool in the box.
Without undertaker it's not nearly that easy if you care about value and you should. You have to know what you have to expect from you opponent to get the best value of every single minion. Trading 1 for 1 just isn't good enough unless your minion did cost you a lot less mana. I never played a deck were the decision which one drop to play on T1 did influence the game so strongly because every minion matters and even if it's just a 1/1 that forces the opponent to use his AoE prematurely.
While I agree that Zoo is probably one of the easiest to learn decks, the skill cap is sky high. While most control decks are reactive and combo heavy and the skill there is to the when and how to set up the removal and the finisher, Zoo is much more proactive.
The amount of DR minions in Naxx gave Zoo a depth that it just didn't have before. Position and planing ahead got only more crucial and knowing your deck and the chances of the cards you draw got important. Trading and pressuring with Zoo is fairly easy, they key and challenge is in the positioning and composition of the board otherwise you'll not survive any AoE.
I think the beauty of Zoo is the intransigency and the simplicity. You go into a game with the intention of dictating it from start to finish, you don't only try to control the board but force sub-optimal plays from your opponent, denying and big value plays and you sacrifice life and cards if you have to for that. You life tab to yourself to HP amounts other decks would throw healing on themselves to keep up tempo and board advantage.
I think most Zoo players started playing Zoo for the same reason I did: necessity. It's incredible dust effective but still it's complex and because of that it's interesting to play.
So... yeah... This was utterly pointless but what ever. Yay zoo I guess.
PS: Gimme back 0 mana soulfire! Dark Bomb sucks and imp-losion is totally meh.
Zoo: The second easiest deck to learn as well as master in the entire game, while being too strong for it's own good. I can honestly say I am glad I rarely see it in the meta right now. Now all that's left is to phase out cancer hunter and push the meta more to mid range allowing all deck archetypes to be viable and the game becomes a little bit better.
Also, a few times you mentioned zoo being complex. You'll have to tell the world how playing out your hand, then drawing two cards a turn while playing both is in any way 'skill full'. Because you need to make good trades? So does every other deck in the game bar cancer hunter. Hence why it's the easiest, zoo comes in second because drawing two cards a turn lets you make poor trades and forgives you for it.
I haven't played Zoolock in quite a while - once I assembled the cards to make a decent Handlock, I've used that exclusively for Warlock quests, because it's one of my favourite decks.
But although I like Handlock a bit more, I always found Zoolock to be a really enjoyable deck to play. It's a deck that is never frustrating. You never find yourself cursing a horrible draw because really, there aren't any horrible draws. You're always playing, always acting, win or lose you never feel helpless or bored.
Zoo: The second easiest deck to learn as well as master in the entire game, while being too strong for it's own good. I can honestly say I am glad I rarely see it in the meta right now. Now all that's left is to phase out cancer hunter and push the meta more to mid range allowing all deck archetypes to be viable and the game becomes a little bit better.
Also, a few times you mentioned zoo being complex. You'll have to tell the world how playing out your hand, then drawing two cards a turn while playing both is in any way 'skill full'. Because you need to make good trades? So does every other deck in the game bar cancer hunter. Hence why it's the easiest, zoo comes in second because drawing two cards a turn lets you make poor trades and forgives you for it.
No way, zoo is not the second easiest deck to play, not by a longshot. In fact, Amaz was streaming Zoo today and repeatedly talked about how difficult zoo is.
I find midrange decks bar far the easiest decks to play - because they are basically "play a minion equal to your mana" for the first 5 turns.
Playing Druid? innervate shade, wild growth, shade, piloted shredder, sludge belcher, druid of the claw, boom, innervate + combo
Zoo probably has one of the most complex first 5 turns in hearthstone - because you always have choices to make. Lots of them - whereas with control decks your first 5 turns are basically praying for the right cards to show up in your deck. Control isn't inherently more complicated than zoo, that is a big misconception.
It is not about just emptying your hand, zoo is all about buffing the right minions, with high risk/reward for overextending. It is a really fun deck to play. You have to control to JUST the right point before going aggressive, because if you wait too long you're dead. But you can't go face, you will die too. I've come back to it recently and realizing how much I've missed it.
I do not enjoy facehunter... find it boring.
I'm with OP on this one.
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This thread is probably incredible pointless and due my mediocre written english a pain in the butt to read but I honestly don't care too much.
The last few days I came back to playing Zoo after month of abstinence and a failed "creative" deck I made myself after the nerf of Undertaker. I found the deck from Capen, made some minor changes and did play ladder and I think I haven't played as much ladder in month and the main reason is the enjoyment of playing a true Zoo deck again.
While Undertaker Zoo was without the shadow of a doubt the strongest Zoo deck, looking back at it did take away a lot of the enjoyment I had with Zoo. Instead of using every card in your deck as a tool for basically the same task, suddenly there was this one minion you really cared about which is not was Zoo should be about. Undertaker in Zoo was the shotgun on the renaissance fair, the gun in a bar brawl.
The beauty of Zoolock is not the brute power but the elegance of using numbers and tempo. People call Zoolock an aggro deck and it kinda was during the prime of DR Zoo but I never thought of it that way. For me Zoo unites both tempo, value and control in a way no other deck in HS does, the only aggressive part in Zoo is the tempo you try to develop. With Undertaker Zoo T1 - T3 were basically a given, you wanted to develop your Undertaker because you knew if you buff it up, you have the most powerful tool in the box.
Without undertaker it's not nearly that easy if you care about value and you should. You have to know what you have to expect from you opponent to get the best value of every single minion. Trading 1 for 1 just isn't good enough unless your minion did cost you a lot less mana. I never played a deck were the decision which one drop to play on T1 did influence the game so strongly because every minion matters and even if it's just a 1/1 that forces the opponent to use his AoE prematurely.
While I agree that Zoo is probably one of the easiest to learn decks, the skill cap is sky high. While most control decks are reactive and combo heavy and the skill there is to the when and how to set up the removal and the finisher, Zoo is much more proactive.
The amount of DR minions in Naxx gave Zoo a depth that it just didn't have before. Position and planing ahead got only more crucial and knowing your deck and the chances of the cards you draw got important. Trading and pressuring with Zoo is fairly easy, they key and challenge is in the positioning and composition of the board otherwise you'll not survive any AoE.
I think the beauty of Zoo is the intransigency and the simplicity. You go into a game with the intention of dictating it from start to finish, you don't only try to control the board but force sub-optimal plays from your opponent, denying and big value plays and you sacrifice life and cards if you have to for that. You life tab to yourself to HP amounts other decks would throw healing on themselves to keep up tempo and board advantage.
I think most Zoo players started playing Zoo for the same reason I did: necessity. It's incredible dust effective but still it's complex and because of that it's interesting to play.
So... yeah... This was utterly pointless but what ever. Yay zoo I guess.
PS: Gimme back 0 mana soulfire! Dark Bomb sucks and imp-losion is totally meh.
Okay, I'm curious now :)
Can you share your decklist?
Thx
Zoo: The only deck in the game where minions matter.
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Zoo: The second easiest deck to learn as well as master in the entire game, while being too strong for it's own good. I can honestly say I am glad I rarely see it in the meta right now. Now all that's left is to phase out cancer hunter and push the meta more to mid range allowing all deck archetypes to be viable and the game becomes a little bit better.
Also, a few times you mentioned zoo being complex. You'll have to tell the world how playing out your hand, then drawing two cards a turn while playing both is in any way 'skill full'. Because you need to make good trades? So does every other deck in the game bar cancer hunter. Hence why it's the easiest, zoo comes in second because drawing two cards a turn lets you make poor trades and forgives you for it.
I haven't played Zoolock in quite a while - once I assembled the cards to make a decent Handlock, I've used that exclusively for Warlock quests, because it's one of my favourite decks.
But although I like Handlock a bit more, I always found Zoolock to be a really enjoyable deck to play. It's a deck that is never frustrating. You never find yourself cursing a horrible draw because really, there aren't any horrible draws. You're always playing, always acting, win or lose you never feel helpless or bored.
It's just a really pleasant deck to run.
No way, zoo is not the second easiest deck to play, not by a longshot. In fact, Amaz was streaming Zoo today and repeatedly talked about how difficult zoo is.
I find midrange decks bar far the easiest decks to play - because they are basically "play a minion equal to your mana" for the first 5 turns.
Playing Paladin? leper gnome, shieldbot, muster, piloted shredder, quartermaster, sylvanus, coin Tyrion.
Playing Druid? innervate shade, wild growth, shade, piloted shredder, sludge belcher, druid of the claw, boom, innervate + combo
Zoo probably has one of the most complex first 5 turns in hearthstone - because you always have choices to make. Lots of them - whereas with control decks your first 5 turns are basically praying for the right cards to show up in your deck. Control isn't inherently more complicated than zoo, that is a big misconception.
It is not about just emptying your hand, zoo is all about buffing the right minions, with high risk/reward for overextending. It is a really fun deck to play. You have to control to JUST the right point before going aggressive, because if you wait too long you're dead. But you can't go face, you will die too. I've come back to it recently and realizing how much I've missed it.
I do not enjoy facehunter... find it boring.
I'm with OP on this one.