Hearthpwn

I'm starting to feel a bit picked on here.  I was hoping that this would be a fun community to join but from what I've experienced so far that hasn't been the case.

it is not a matter of trying to make others see a fantasy, if it doesn't work it doesn't work, but I would appreciate a rounded discussion around the concept like the one sylicas provided as opposed to being wholly negative.  

The final paragraph can be rephrased as:  

the main concern should be whether cards are op as they would be game breaking.

if you create a class that has a full set of cards that are perfect and always viable then the cards themselves may be balanced with the other cards in the game but the class will have an advantage over all of the other classes as it has a full set of useable cards whereas the existing classes do not.

all in all I have enjoyed this foray into card building but I feel I have been kind of beaten out of discussing my thoughts on cards as my experience is obviously lacking.

 I will probably continue using the submission topics but I am put off joining any future discussion.

Just a thought.  The existing classes of Hearthstone have cards that, whilst interesting or different, are not particularly playable or are highly situational.  

So when creating a genuine class shouldn't there be a few cards that have an interesting idea that may not always be all that useful but in the right situation could be?

the main concern should be whether cards are OP because that would be game breaking but by the same token if every one of the classes cards work brilliantly wouldn't that affect the balance of the classes as a whole rather than the cards themselves?

Quote from Sylicas >>

Quote from bennotten>>

At first I was worried about the Blue Fairy because your class has easy access to spells with your Hero Power, but then your Blue Fairy only has 2 attack, so unlike the Mana Wyrm it can't trade up as well. I think it should be okay. 

The Hakurei Orb is interesting, a 2/2 weapon for 2mana is good and you can pay 1 extra mana for some utility.

I think Reimu's Spellcard effect is too expensive, because it doesn't do much if you don't have the board. I might be underestimating the ability though, since it's so unique.

Thanks for the feedback! :) Response in Spoiler Tag if you're interested!

Blue Fairy's main role is to be sticky on the board, not really so much on firepower like the Mana Wyrm in the late game~ There's the Hero Power to boost it's attack by a bit should there be a need.

Hakurei Orb is meant to give options if my opponent is playing a Zooish type of deck, so that you can kill more minions and protect your stuff. :3

I'll be honest, there will probably need to be a gameplan when Reimu comes up on the board. It's similar to how you should set up Archmage with spells in your hand so that you can get it's maximum effect immediately, since it will get killed on the next turn. I think it should be high-costed, because having higher-healthed taunts will be insane, since this shares damage with your Hero as well.

After some deliberations of simplifying my card mechanics and preventing card spam, as was suggested for another class earlier on, I decided to remove the restriction for casting only one Spellcard and tweaking my Hero's Power to 2, while at the same time, buffing the attack such that it lasts until your next turn! Hopefully this gives it a bit more flavour, while maintaining a bit of balance!

Quote from Tomerick88 >>

Hi guys just wanted to ask for some feedback on this specific card:

(Aquatic Ruin + Air Bubble)

 As it is now... I would never play this card in any decks that I make. The high cost and randomness of this card penalises you so bad if you are even slightly unlucky.

Let's take a more in-depth look:

You play this on Turn 8. Effectively, if you are paying 8 mana for something, it has better be something that is very good, if not you lose the game.

 

Since you don't get to play the bubble card most of the times... (remember, you paid 8 mana! You leave yourself a 4/5 chance of not being able to pay off the card immediately, and that's being on a Turn 10.)

 

What's the best case scenario? If you get a 0-mana bubble and the opponent gets a 10-mana bubble. What are the odds of that happening? A 1% chance.

 

In a very simplified format, assuming that it hits for 1 turn, this is how I would gauge the amount of mana you spend on the cards -

 

You

8 Mana + ___ bubble Mana.

 

Opponent

___ bubble Mana.

 

If You > Opponent's spent mana, then it's a bad outcome.

If Opponent = Your spent mana, it is neutral.

If Opponent > Your spent mana, it is a good outcome.

 

Total Outcomes: 121

Neutral Outcomes: 3

Good Outcomes: 2 + 1 = 3

Bad Outcomes: 121 - 6 = 115.

 

The outcomes are probably not exact, since I assumed that you taking damage is bad, but even then, you can clearly see how many more bad outcomes you'll get from good outcomes.

 

I don't really have anything to alter this card, because RNG does screw up games a lot of times. The least I could suggest is to remove the bubble from affecting you entirely so that the card doesn't destroy you. After all, using 8-mana to cast a spell that doesn't affect the board directly is really expensive.

Quote from DKPaladinMDL >>

My design for Melody minions, especially the higher-cost ones, is based on the idea that minions rarely survive until the next turn anyway. Look at Kvaldir raider and Archmage Antionidas. They're the kind of cards that will change the entire game if they live for one turn, and in the case of Antionidas, you will most likely literally lose the entire game if it lives for even a single turn. Angelcaller, while it does have a powerful effect, is built in such a way that when you do pull of its melody, it usually doesn't immediately end the game, since it furthers your advantage rather than actually bringing your opponent's health down to 0. It may be that in arena, this card is much more like a "win the game" card, since card advantage in arena is worth much more than constructed. 

I just took a look at your submission! It's funny, I can understand your class easier because our classes have a keyword that does similar effects~

Angelcaller - I find your reasoning on this quite valid. In fact, I'm guessing the reason why you placed the health at 7 is to avoid a 4-mana Fireball from killing the minion outright. (although I could be wrong :P) I would prefer it to be a 5/6 so that it's easier for heroes to deal with the card more easily though, since it is a Rare card.

 

Debut - Cool concept! I like the combo-esque effect of this card, it feels a bit like the Rogue combo of Prep into a Combo card.

 

Choir - Currently, I can't really see the power of this card because of the limitations of seeing only 3 cards. Whether it's balanced or not, depends on what we see in future sets!

 

What I'm more concerned about is that if you create many Melody minions with good snowballing effects, effectively, each of your Melody cards becomes a psuedo-Taunt like Legendaries with build-up effects. That's why for my class, I'm limiting the amount of cards with the Spellcard effects such that not all minions with that keyword become a high-priority taunt target.

 

I think we can only see your class as a full picture only when you release more cards. With the 3-card limit, we can't really gauge how powerful some cards really are, because some class cards are insane in certain classes! (ie Dreadsteed in pre-nerf Warsong Commander would be insane.)

Hi guys just wanted to ask for some feedback on this specific card:

The idea behind it is an extension of Curse of Rafaam.  You would likely play it in a control deck when you have board control with big minions to both avoid your opponent playing smaller minions and to stall until the use of Chaos Emeralds that can be seen in earlier pages.  The reason I made it 8 mana is that the air bubble could cost 10 if you are really lucky / unlucky and it would last too long if you could play it earlier.  It has the potential to buy you two turns of stalling your opponent and could be disastrous if you use it incorrectly.

if it isn't viable I would really appreciate alterations that could make it viable.

Quote from layrit >>

@Tomerick88

You are supposed to be able to get rid of him without too much trouble. If he was able to trade with 3/2 or 3/3 minions and get away with it he'd be too good. IF however he sticks he might get a ton of value.

Quote from layrit >>

Quote from layrit >>

I've been making some new cards for my Patrician class:

His name is Cedric. His current goal in life is to unite his two major hobbies: tortures and kittens.


Oh, don't look at him like THAT! He is human. He even has papers to prove it! Nobby, show them your papers!

He is a Troll and an Assassin...He might become a legend one day...



The Low King of the Dwarfs and the Diamond King of the Trolls playing a game of Thud after successful negotiation, nothing special, move along.

For the love of Io, not so loud! - But we are the Watch?! - That will only make things worse!

NIL MORTIFI, SINE LVCRE - No killing without pay.

It is generally a good idea to read what is written on the signs near the road...

Could you please lay down your weapons? We will still kill you but that would save us a lot of trouble.

These days even an ordinary cook can become an assassin...

I'd like to hear some feedback regarding these cards. Also I'd like to know if they are as appealing to the people who didn't read the Discworld novels as they are for those who did.

 Note: the Receipt is a 1mana spell that does nothing. In general it is beneficial for your opponent to have it (because they might somehow utilize it).

 

 

 I'd appreciate feedback.

Also, do you think I should put a shiner advertisement into my signature? =)

Quote from layrit >>

Quote from Tomerick88 >>

I think 2/3 is better as it needs to be stickier as a deterrent. 

The hunter thing kind of proves my point does it not because then all the classes 2 drops could have dealt with it before playing a weapon.  

 The point of having a threat is to force an answer, not to win the game outright. At least that is the case for a 2mana threat.

@jazzfan27

If you want to go with a 2/3 design I believe it should gain +2/+1 then (because you feel really stupid when you pay 4 mana trying to remove a 2mana threat and are actually unsuccessful in doing so).

I think 2/3 is better as it needs to be stickier as a deterrent. 

The hunter thing kind of proves my point does it not because then all the classes 2 drops could have dealt with it before playing a weapon.  

Quote from layrit >>

Quote from Tomerick88 >>

Ok That makes sense.  Does it not suffer from the same risk when combined with cloak of invisibility? And is it not more or less an inferior acidic swamp ooze in its current state as a two durability weapon could be completely use before its effect can be used?

 Acidic Swamp Ooze is a reactive card. Your opponent plays weapon - you answer it with the Ooze.

Rust Monster is a proactive card. You play Rust Monster and you dissuade your opponent from playing a weapon unless he can deal with the Rust Monster or has a Taunt in play.

Ok That makes sense.  Does it not suffer from the same risk when combined with cloak of invisibility? And is it not more or less an inferior acidic swamp ooze in its current state as a two durability weapon could be completely use before its effect can be used?

I was just thinking maybe it worked like enrage whereby they gain the stats but they are dead.  I'm trying to think of an instance where there is an effect where health is gained when taking damage and I can't think of one so you are likely correct that this would save it from death yes.  

I do still think it is probably too slow to be used as weapon removal which it seems to be primarily designed for.  I think the stealth deterrent Idea is something to explore acting like a weapon version of patient assassin but it's your card.

Quote from jazzfan27 >>

My latest card.

So, similar to Acidic Swamp Ooze, but, different.  This is designed to be played on turn 4 with Cloak of Invisibility.  But it's a decent 2 drop, even when facing a weapon class, because it will deal damage to the opposing hero if attacked with a weapon, meaning if you were to hit it with a fiery war axe it would kill the axe and leave a 3/2 Rust Beast in play.  Even a Truesilver is not strong enough to dispatch this fella.  Plus, if you use it in combination with the cloak you can attack first and just start growing making life difficult for weapon classes.

I understand what you mean now thanks.  This is an example of a card that would combo with the cards that boost animal friends.  I know this is another example of forced.

The class this is most like would be hunter which is almost always going to use beasts because of the forced synergy.

this is mixed with token dependance like paladin. However this class is also equally viable with mechs and ignoring the animal friend tokens and can be played aggro or control.

The natural synergies I can think of are checkpoint followed by mimirons head, raid leader, muklas champion and animal friends, chemical plant incident hero power. Animal friends and frostwolf warlord

I thought curious chao was more this classes version of Timberwolf. I costed it at 2 because of the early drop minions dropping animal friends when they die which makes it harder for your opponent to stop you getting value from it.  Would it be justifiable as a one drop?

This is the same reason that I costed adventurers spirit this way because your opponent will create animal friends when killing your mechs and then likely have run out of mana to counter the animal friends before you can use it.  Would it be better at +2/+2?  And if so what cost would you suggest?

could you elaborate on the forced synergy vs natural synergy? I am new to card creation and I cannot see the difference between the concepts presented here and something like bloodlust, bestial wrath, totemic might, quartermaster etc.

thanks for your time mate.  I hope I don't seem confrontational because I really am trying to learn.

Thanks @Layrit I just wanted to post some ones that show animal friend synergy also if you would be kind enough to evaluate.  Then I will stop for now as I am conscious of flooding the boards.