Change their hero power to "randomly deal 0, 1, or 2 damage to enemy hero".
Suits the RNG theme that blizzard loves.
Alternatively how about "Deal 2 damage to a random enemy"? You're guaranteed to have some effect, the hero power could help control the board rather than forcing Hunters to run aggressive decks, and compared to the Mage hero power it ends up like Deadly Shot vs Assassinate - one has more effect for the cost at the price of randomness.
I just want a chance to emote "sorry" or "oops" when they end up spending 2 mana for nothing. Don't ruin my dream!
We shouldn't cry for nerfs. We should ask for buffs. Sure, nerfing one class would be easiest, but nerfs aren't fun...buffs on the other hand are. It would only be 8 times as much work, but we're not the ones doing it, Blizzard is...or should.
We shouldn't cry for nerfs. We should ask for buffs. Sure, nerfing one class would be easiest, but nerfs aren't fun...buffs on the other hand are. It would only be 8 times as much work, but we're not the ones doing it, Blizzard is...or should.
Spell damage x2 against hunter and minions under control of a hunter hero. Technically it's a buff, to all clases except hunter.
Well considering its one of the most popular classes to play, if something is too good, then they should balance the game to make it so that other classes arent left out in the cold. Why do you think Buzzard got the nerf it did? The problem now is that it didnt really matter because of the fact most hunter lists are a super aggro deck. its very hard to win games most of the time when they have coin. The play of undertaker+ coin cant not be underestimated. Highmane is another problem card, why do you think most people are running silences? because of highmanes. SBs and undertakers. As Amaz put it best, The highmane rule : getting hit by one one time is probably game over.
Undertaker is not the only problem, statistically more than 50% of the time you wont start with one. It is the synergy hunter creates between its low cost cards (i.e UT - scientist - bow or knife juggler - snake trap - unleash)
Simply nerfing undertaker, like buzzard would hurt but again not stop hunters. Most high level hunters I see don't run highmane either, regardless of how OP it is.
I believe the best nerf to a hunter (perhaps fair or perhaps unfair) would be enabling other classes to access flare or a card punishing some1 holding secrets. Takes away from mad scientist and the bow, which is more of a key to hunter start than undertaker IMO.
I think there's a more creative approach than simply tweaking numbers. Blizzard would do well to really look into limiting the abilities of cards rather than adjusting mana cost or stats. The buzzard costing 5 with awful stats is a nerf into oblivion, but limiting card draw to 2 or 3 per turn is not (would need testing of course). Same with the auctioneer, give it a draw limit.
There are a lot of creative ways to solve some of the issues with common cards that get way too insane value out of themselves. Change Mad Scientist to put a secret in hand that costs (2) less or something to that effect, or play it but reveal what it is (so you have to deal with it no matter what, the opponent gets the value of a free secret, but you know how to deal with it).
You could take this approach with a lot of the problem cards and really mix up how they can be played to give some implicit drawbacks or limits to them that make them playable but not in every deck ever made. Food for thought
Even if it doesn't stop them, nerfing Undertaker and Mad Scientist would definitely hurt Hunter quite a bit. Given that it's widely agreed those two cards are op and need to be changed even outside of "Hunter is op" discussions, those two should be given a big nerf before Hunter starts getting changed. The neutral secret card in GvG will definitely help with the Mad Scientist problem, but since Hunters can run more than two secrets the Scientist is still a problem anyways, especially when compared to Loot Hoarder. Undertaker gives aggro decks a far bigger early game minion (without a downside) than decks should have access to - a turn two Yeti should only be possible through gaining extra mana from cards like Innervate, not by filling up the board with independently good minions. Nerf Undertaker and Mad Scientist and aggro decks stop being such an overwhelming force.
(And as said above, don't just make them weaker stat-wise, but make them weaker ability-wise. Make Undertaker Just gain attack and it still trades up, but it isn't as impossible to remove. Make the Scientist not play the secret and it becomes an alternative Loot Hoarder which can be better or worse in different decks and situations - Secrets Mages and and Freeze Mages can still draw their central cards easily, but no more free mana and less value for the decks that don't rely on secrets entirely.)
Change their hero power to "randomly deal 0, 1, or 2 damage to enemy hero".
Suits the RNG theme that blizzard loves.
Alternatively how about "Deal 2 damage to a random enemy"? You're guaranteed to have some effect, the hero power could help control the board rather than forcing Hunters to run aggressive decks, and compared to the Mage hero power it ends up like Deadly Shot vs Assassinate - one has more effect for the cost at the price of randomness.
Though no matter whether or not Hunter is changed, Undertaker and Mad Scientist both still need a heavy nerf. Undertaker should just gain attack, not health, and Mad Scientist shouldn't play the secret - compare it to Loot Hoarder, which both has worse stats and doesn't give you the free mana of playing a card.
Quick Edit: After typing this I reread your comment and realized that you said "random enemy", not "random enemy minion" which I for some reason thought you said. As such, it wouldnt be quite as bad as I say below but I'm not going to go edit it.
In Short: Since it wouldnt be a pure board control device, it wouldnt be as bad as I thought.
However, I think that the idea of having Ragnaros type of randomness on a Hero Power would be very un-fun. If the only options are A. Force Hunters to be Aggressive (2 dmg to face) B. Give them insane board control tools (2 dmg to random minion) or C. Build so much randomness into the class skill that it convolutes the deckbuilding because there is no certainty in your hero power (2 dmg to random enemy) well, I would choose option A myself.
Could you imagine how OP Hunters would become at controlling the board with a power like that? It would remove pretty much every single minion played on turn 1 or 2 (although it would be an inadvertent buff to Haunted Creeper. As it would be one of the few strong openers against a Hunter deck) Imagine the combo abilities with Hunter's Mark, Explosive Shot, Kill Command, Explosive Trap, etc. Then Deadly Shot becomes an amazing card since the early control of Hunter would be so strong that mid-late game it will be hard to have multiple minions on board. So now Hunters have one of the most consistent, cheap hard removals in the game as well!
I mean a major reason why zoo is so good is its ability to trade up with Dark Iron Dwarf and Abusive Sargent, this hero power would give you that ability with just a traded drawback of randomness instead of needing a creature to cast it on. But then it can be used every single turn and can kill a minion on its own. Meaning that it can also be used when you have no minions on board or even to kill a minion without sacrificing your own!
Obviously without test servers or this change actually happening we have no way of knowing for sure but I seriously think this would make for even stronger Hunter decks. They would be a totally different style than the current standard but they would still be amazingly strong. With the right build they would become the absolute gold standard of board control.
Some classes being ubiquitous is honestly a lot better than others, I'd be really happy if Shaman took the lead for example because there's nothing really oppressive about that class. With Hunter, you're pretty much forced to play against whatever clock they establish, I think the class pisses people off for a reason.
I just want a chance to emote "sorry" or "oops" when they end up spending 2 mana for nothing. Don't ruin my dream!
"Put your face in the light!" - Tirion Fordring
We shouldn't cry for nerfs. We should ask for buffs. Sure, nerfing one class would be easiest, but nerfs aren't fun...buffs on the other hand are. It would only be 8 times as much work, but we're not the ones doing it, Blizzard is...or should.
Spell damage x2 against hunter and minions under control of a hunter hero. Technically it's a buff, to all clases except hunter.
"Put your face in the light!" - Tirion Fordring
What if two Hunters play each other? :Y
Auto avatar explosion for both before mulligan. That's only fair.
"Put your face in the light!" - Tirion Fordring
Well considering its one of the most popular classes to play, if something is too good, then they should balance the game to make it so that other classes arent left out in the cold. Why do you think Buzzard got the nerf it did? The problem now is that it didnt really matter because of the fact most hunter lists are a super aggro deck. its very hard to win games most of the time when they have coin. The play of undertaker+ coin cant not be underestimated. Highmane is another problem card, why do you think most people are running silences? because of highmanes. SBs and undertakers. As Amaz put it best, The highmane rule : getting hit by one one time is probably game over.
Hearthstone is a game of "copy and pasting"
Undertaker is not the only problem, statistically more than 50% of the time you wont start with one. It is the synergy hunter creates between its low cost cards (i.e UT - scientist - bow or knife juggler - snake trap - unleash)
Simply nerfing undertaker, like buzzard would hurt but again not stop hunters. Most high level hunters I see don't run highmane either, regardless of how OP it is.
I believe the best nerf to a hunter (perhaps fair or perhaps unfair) would be enabling other classes to access flare or a card punishing some1 holding secrets. Takes away from mad scientist and the bow, which is more of a key to hunter start than undertaker IMO.
December rank 74 legend :)
People should stop talking about nerfing hunter until gvg has had a clear impact on the meta
I think there's a more creative approach than simply tweaking numbers. Blizzard would do well to really look into limiting the abilities of cards rather than adjusting mana cost or stats. The buzzard costing 5 with awful stats is a nerf into oblivion, but limiting card draw to 2 or 3 per turn is not (would need testing of course). Same with the auctioneer, give it a draw limit.
There are a lot of creative ways to solve some of the issues with common cards that get way too insane value out of themselves. Change Mad Scientist to put a secret in hand that costs (2) less or something to that effect, or play it but reveal what it is (so you have to deal with it no matter what, the opponent gets the value of a free secret, but you know how to deal with it).
You could take this approach with a lot of the problem cards and really mix up how they can be played to give some implicit drawbacks or limits to them that make them playable but not in every deck ever made. Food for thought
Even if it doesn't stop them, nerfing Undertaker and Mad Scientist would definitely hurt Hunter quite a bit. Given that it's widely agreed those two cards are op and need to be changed even outside of "Hunter is op" discussions, those two should be given a big nerf before Hunter starts getting changed. The neutral secret card in GvG will definitely help with the Mad Scientist problem, but since Hunters can run more than two secrets the Scientist is still a problem anyways, especially when compared to Loot Hoarder. Undertaker gives aggro decks a far bigger early game minion (without a downside) than decks should have access to - a turn two Yeti should only be possible through gaining extra mana from cards like Innervate, not by filling up the board with independently good minions. Nerf Undertaker and Mad Scientist and aggro decks stop being such an overwhelming force.
(And as said above, don't just make them weaker stat-wise, but make them weaker ability-wise. Make Undertaker Just gain attack and it still trades up, but it isn't as impossible to remove. Make the Scientist not play the secret and it becomes an alternative Loot Hoarder which can be better or worse in different decks and situations - Secrets Mages and and Freeze Mages can still draw their central cards easily, but no more free mana and less value for the decks that don't rely on secrets entirely.)
Quick Edit: After typing this I reread your comment and realized that you said "random enemy", not "random enemy minion" which I for some reason thought you said. As such, it wouldnt be quite as bad as I say below but I'm not going to go edit it.
In Short: Since it wouldnt be a pure board control device, it wouldnt be as bad as I thought.
However, I think that the idea of having Ragnaros type of randomness on a Hero Power would be very un-fun. If the only options are A. Force Hunters to be Aggressive (2 dmg to face) B. Give them insane board control tools (2 dmg to random minion) or C. Build so much randomness into the class skill that it convolutes the deckbuilding because there is no certainty in your hero power (2 dmg to random enemy) well, I would choose option A myself.
Could you imagine how OP Hunters would become at controlling the board with a power like that? It would remove pretty much every single minion played on turn 1 or 2 (although it would be an inadvertent buff to Haunted Creeper. As it would be one of the few strong openers against a Hunter deck) Imagine the combo abilities with Hunter's Mark, Explosive Shot, Kill Command, Explosive Trap, etc. Then Deadly Shot becomes an amazing card since the early control of Hunter would be so strong that mid-late game it will be hard to have multiple minions on board. So now Hunters have one of the most consistent, cheap hard removals in the game as well!
I mean a major reason why zoo is so good is its ability to trade up with Dark Iron Dwarf and Abusive Sargent, this hero power would give you that ability with just a traded drawback of randomness instead of needing a creature to cast it on. But then it can be used every single turn and can kill a minion on its own. Meaning that it can also be used when you have no minions on board or even to kill a minion without sacrificing your own!
Obviously without test servers or this change actually happening we have no way of knowing for sure but I seriously think this would make for even stronger Hunter decks. They would be a totally different style than the current standard but they would still be amazingly strong. With the right build they would become the absolute gold standard of board control.
Some classes being ubiquitous is honestly a lot better than others, I'd be really happy if Shaman took the lead for example because there's nothing really oppressive about that class. With Hunter, you're pretty much forced to play against whatever clock they establish, I think the class pisses people off for a reason.
Everything they call as nerf, made hunter class stronger. I didnt expect blizzard nerf this joke class.