Hearthpwn

I personally prefer the secret build, but I see some pro players going stealth. Which one is better in your opinion?

https://www.vicioussyndicate.com/vs-data-reaper-report-127/

People seem to have such short memories when it comes to Rogue. Quest Rogue wasnt the only defining Rogue deck, yea? Rogues have had the most top tier decks out of all classes throughout hearthstone history and have been included in every HCT tournament winner's line up since the beginning. And is also the most nerfed class out of all classes since the beginning.

I'm a Rogue player, but even I recognise that Rogues were always competitive to top tier.

It seems like the champion of every HCT had various incarnations of Rogue in their line up from Oil to Tempo to Miracle to even Malygos Rogue.

Not to mention previous decks that got nerfed like Quest and Kingsbane. Rogues were always viable and competitive in some way every year. 

Seriously stop nerfing Rogue. It's already the most nerfed class in Hearthstone history. It's like a cycle: people complain about Rogue being weak -> Rogue gets busted cards -> People cry after a top tier Rogue deck emerges -> Core cards of that deck gets nerfed -> Said Rogue deck vanishes -> nobody remembers how busted Rogue was before and ask for better cards -> Repeat. Seriously?

When Tempo Rogue was top tier, people cried for shadowstep to be nerfed or HOFed. Quest Rogue was nerfed THRICE. Kingsbane Rogue vanished from the radar after Leeching Poison was nerfed. Mill Rogue was relegated to Wild only. It's like nobody wants Rogue to have a playable deck.

Yup, no good spells released this expansion to justify playing this card. This is one of the most overrated cards of this expansion. Mark my words.

Quote from OttawaCloset >>

Quote from GGwulf >>

Why does everyone seem to think that this card must be immediately removed? Playing this card means you're a control mage. Control mages dont have much to do with their mana. Control mages play board clear spells. Are you gonna be playing board clear spells every turn and does it matter if you're playing them for free or not?

Assuming you get to play flamestrike for free the next turn, what are you gonna do with the rest of your mana? As an aggro player, I will just keep going face ignoring it like I would ignore Ysera. As a control player, I wouldn't be caring if you are playing spells for free or not. Anyway control match ups are battles of attrition so you will be conserving your tools anyway. So why is it Kalecgos a soft taunt compared to Ysera? Ysera is even more of a must remove to opposing control players compared to Kalecgos because she gives you guaranteed value each turn. Maybe playing one spell for free each turn is not guaranteed value, in fact it's the opposite of that as you are using up your own resources.

 We have no idea what we are getting for Mage, might be pretty nuts with whatever the twin spell does. Make as much sense to praise as it does to bash it. It potentially could be a good legendary.

 You're right. We should wait to see if Mage will get any good twin spells. If Mages get something on the level of UI or Call of the wild or even Boomship, I will change my mind.

Why does everyone seem to think that this card must be immediately removed? Playing this card means you're a control mage. Control mages dont have much to do with their mana. Control mages play board clear spells. Are you gonna be playing board clear spells every turn and does it matter if you're playing them for free or not?

Assuming you get to play flamestrike for free the next turn, what are you gonna do with the rest of your mana? As an aggro player, I will just keep going face ignoring it like I would ignore Ysera. As a control player, I wouldn't be caring if you are playing spells for free or not. Control match ups are battles of attrition anyway so you should be conserving your tools. So why is Kalecgos a soft taunt compared to Ysera? Ysera is even more of a must remove to opposing control players compared to Kalecgos because she gives you guaranteed value each turn. Maybe playing one spell for free each turn is not guaranteed value, in fact it's the opposite of that as you are using up your own resources.

Quote from Kaladin >>

Quote from GGwulf >>

I really think everyone is overrating this card. At 10 mana, it has to be game ending or give you a huge advantage when played. Think Zul'jin, Gul'dan, N'zoth, etc. What is the most you can do with this card? Play Pyroblast on the same turn? Play Flamestrike or Blizzard for free? That's not game ending.

As a control mage, you have plenty of mana to spare during the late game. What are you gonna do with rest of the 10 mana once you've played your spell? Would you really have that many spells to cast every turn to make the most out of the 0 cost that this card gives? I can see this card fitting in some sort of burn mage combo deck but even there it's likely to be too slow. Definitely not the super legendary that everyone seems to think it is. I'm guessing it will be another Lady in White.

 

 You will build decks around this card, so yes.  A 10-mana card doesn't have to win the game on the spot, it merely has to threaten it.  This card has more tempo/value than Ysera (which sees some play) in that it provides you with something in the same turn it's played, AND must be removed immediately. 

 Ysera sees only fringe play and she is miles better than this dragon. Still not seeing the value of this dragon. 

- Control mage mostly plays AOE removal spells. What's the value of playing them for free? What's the best spell that you want to play for free? Pyroblast? 

- Value diminishes once you run out of spells to play or if you are not playing any spells at all that turn. Ysera gives you value every turn. Malygos wins you the game on the spot once played. What does this dragon give you other than a free spell? Most of the time, it'll just be a 4/12 body that will be ignored. 

- this is a 10 mana win more card. To determine whether it's a win more card, you just have to think about it this way. You are at 1 health and losing. Playing Zul'jin, Gul'Dan or N'zoth will have a high chance of turning the game around. What about this card? Will you play this when you're losing? No.

I really think everyone is overrating this card. At 10 mana, it has to be game ending or give you a huge advantage when played. Think Zul'jin, Gul'dan, N'zoth, etc. What is the most you can do with this card? Play Pyroblast on the same turn? Play Flamestrike or Blizzard for free? That's not game ending.

As a control mage, you have plenty of mana to spare during the late game. What are you gonna do with rest of the 10 mana once you've played your spell? Would you really have that many spells to cast every turn to make the most out of the 0 cost that this card gives? I can see this card fitting in some sort of burn mage combo deck but even there it's likely to be too slow. Definitely not the super legendary that everyone seems to think it is. I'm guessing it will be another Lady in White.

This is a freaking tutor card. It's definitely more than playable in a combo class like Rogue.

5 mana 6/14 Deathrattle: Draw Malygos anyone??

For those saying Valeera is weak, do remember that Quest Rogue was and is still a thing. The DK was core in that.

OP in Kingsbane too.

Lol @ meta defining. Lol @ combo priest got a big buff.

Okay maybe in midrange secret paladin or something but even in that case I'd rather make it hybrid aggro just because divine favor is so much more powerful.

I think this card will only see play if divine favor goes to HOF.

Quote from DirtyGoons >>

 

Quote from 1xbenx1 >>

From my review:

We’ve seen this effect with Prince Malchezar, and it’s not very good. Instead of morphing your deck into one with late game, why not just play some late game?

 

 The benefit comes vs aggro. 1 drop spells/minions are good to get a foot in the door but are "useless" later on vs control. Liam increases the topdeck quality for later in the game without drafting too greedy ala Prince Malchezar whichs legendaries are most likely a bad topdeck during turn 1-5.

Overall I don't think the quality of random legendaries is that bad, especially because we have a smaller set of cards. Some midrange/control pala play Elise Starseeker and I think Liam can be the same or better card in comparsion because it gets rid of your 1 drops and most likely more/better legendaries than Elise via Ungoro pack.

As an aggro paladin, you have divine favor as recharge. You want to be killing your opponent asap by swarming the board with high tempo little guys. Random legendaries do not help in your game plan at all. Nor does it transform your deck into a control deck somehow.

Watch real control players laugh while you play random, likely bad, legendaries with no synergy in your deck while they slowly stabilize from your aggro with Guldan, Jaina, Steal shenanigans, etc. You know, win conditions that their entire deck is actually built around and not randomized.