Buddy, you just don't understand what they mean. It's more about how they match you with people. Once you find where you're supposed to be in terms of your ranking then you will likely have a win rate close to 50% with some variance because the game mode has a lot of luck involved. This is because you will simply be matched with similarly skilled players ("Worthy Opponents").
My rank is around 6500. But if I was able to play players with a ranking of 2500 I guarantee my win rate would be 80% or higher and then taper off as my ranking rises and close in on the 50% mark. Simply by playing against people closer to my level. Not by some forced algorithm.
As a developer, I DO understand what it means. The Luck stat itself is literally rigging the game for or against you depending on how well you're doing. Then the pay to get 2 more choices increases your ability to get a better hero by 50%. It's not nefarious, It's not an insult to the game or anything sneaky. It's something they themselves have discussed and a norm in auto-battlers. I don't though, understand how you guys can't understand it.
Paying to get a 50% chance to get a better hero increases your chance to win exponentially, which is rigging. Adding a luck stat to keep you at 50% is rigging. Even pushing you to play against people better or worse than you based on your w/l and rating is rigging. It's literally all forced algorithms.
Dude, I don’t even play seriously BGs only 1 game every 2/3 days, and I’m around 7.4k mmr, don’t understand your point about being rigged…
My point is, it's something the developers themselves have stated they added into BGs, It's a normal thing in Auto-Chess kind of games. I'm not saying it's a bad thing, nor am I saying it's difficult. I'm just saying it's Definitely there, I don't understand how people can deny it when the dev's literally had a discussion on it where they explained how it all works.
There's nothing nefarious about it, but that doesn't mean it's not rigging the game. People are just too daft to see it how it is because "rigging is bad and it insults my precious game". I like the game just like ya'll, I'm just calling it as I see it, and when the Devs talk about the luck % and how it affects keeping you at around a 50% win rate. It's not "stretching it" or "making things up because you lose". It's literally listening to the devs themselves have said.
These rigging posts are getting more ridicolous every year. Why would they rig BGs in the first place? Why would they waste resources to keep everyone at 50% in a game mode thats pretty much free to play and has no rewards?
There is this game mode thats called arena. Maybe you have heard about it. If you are good at the game you can have a complete constructed collection just by playing arena. So it would make sense for Blizzard to rig it, so they can sell more packs. It would be actually beneficial for the company to keep everyone at 50% winrate in arena. But guess what? The best players winrate are not even close to 50%. Good arena players can maintain a winrate over 70%. So its pretty obvious that arena is not rigged.
But for some reason they are using some secret code to keep everyone at 50% in battlegrounds. OK.
They've LITERALLY SAID that they keep BG's win rates at 50% I'm not sure how you guys can keep denying something the developers themselves have been very open with. Also, NO ONE is saying it's bad, I've been literally saying It's something common in auto-chess battler type games.... which this is... I'm just acknowledging something THE DEVELOPERS THEMSELVES HAVE SAID. Which for some strange reason, none of you guys can comprehend, or accept since it's insulting your precious game.
It's not "some secret code" It's programming they've openly talked about. Why are you so daft? Is there something about what I'm writing that you can't comprehend?
You sound like a broken record. You are clueless and you've convinced yourself that you know everything. You don't even have a basic idea of what randomness and rigging mean. I'm done.
Yes because randomness is letting people choose from 2 extra heroes that is statistically proven to give you an advantage (BUT NOOO GIVING SOMEONE AN ADVANTAGE DOESN'T RIG THE GAME TOWARDS ANYONES FAVOR?!? THAT'S PREPOSTEROUS). Reducing a luck stat, and not letting anyone have a 100% win rate (in fact, basically forcing a ~50% win rate).
It's like you don't even know what you're trying to argue at this point. You can't refute any of the points I made other than saying "DURR U R WRONG CAUSE U DONT KNO" when picking and choosing the parts of a definition you want to listen to. I'm not insulting your precious wittle game dude. I'm stating facts that are literally discussed by the developers.
I enjoy the game, I play it nonstop, But that doesn't change the fact that it's rigged to some extent to keep you at a 50% win rate. (like the devs themselves have stated, but for some reason you're too far into denial to acknowledge.)
Even without the other two things, Just the fact that you can buy a statistically proven advantage is rigging.
I'd be interested to see your study on points 1 and 2, because all I saw so far from going through responses is that devs have apparently said its true. I wouldn't mind some citations there.
Hard agree on 3 though; anyone who says bgs isnt pay to win is wrong; with heroes mattering as much as they do, having two other options will increase your win rate in the long term.
Points 1 and 2 seem purely speculative to me, so I hope you can provide more information there. Also you unironically said 'mansplained' lol
3. Yeah I don't know how people can't say it's not when you're always going to choose one hero over another, they're definitely not balanced at all, and paying them money literally gives you 2 more heroes to choose from. Some guy even did the calculations for point 3 proving statistically you're twice as likely to win by buying the extra 2 hero choice. - Here
The luck stat, I was reading in some Q&A when they first released the mode, I'll go back and see if I can find it.
For 1. Though it was in one of the hearthstone panels at blizzcon, I think 2 years ago, but it might have been last years. Where they literally said that they basically rig it to make it so you're either matched up with people with a higher skill or lower skill to keep the win rate at around 50%. Which again there's no way to say that's not rigging the outcome of the game, because they literally say it is what happens. I'll go back and find both when I get back from Ocean City.
And to keep with replying backwards... I mean, he was kinda mansplaining. What I don't get is why they think I'm attacking the game and getting so defensive about it. I'm not saying it makes the game bad or any less fun. By all means, I love the game.
1: manipulated or controlled by deceptive or dishonest means
What is deceptive or dishonest about having a matchmaking system that looks for the player with the closest rating to you? Or having RNG elements in the game? Or even allowing double the hero options for a price?
Nothing. Nothing is deceptive, nothing is dishonest, nothing is rigged, at least not by the common definition of the word.
First off, it also means "arrange something to get the result they want or to give someone an unfair advantage." Don't have to mansplain what you think the definition is, but leave out the other half.
Secondly, you're saying forcing people to stay at around a 50% win rate isn't arranging the game to give someone an unfair advantage? You guys are getting so offended that someone is saying something THE DEVELOPERS OF THE GAME literally said at a blizzcon (THEY USED THE WORD RIGGED THEMSELVES "it is rigged in a way") because it has a negative connotation behind the word "rigging". But, that's simply how games like this work, it literally gives people an unfair advantage, or better put. You a disadvantage. Along with matching you with opponents that have a higher % of winning the game against you, or losing against you to keep you at that 50%.
Luck % changes how much you find the cards that have synergy to your card. I.E. You have 2 beasts, cards that effect beasts, and beasts are less likely to be drawn at the tavern.
If you're winning they place you against opponents that have a higher chance of beating you, if you're losing, they do the opposite.
You can buy a pack that gives you 2 extra hero choices. Literally a 50% chance of getting better heroes than people who didn't pay. Literally making the game in favor of those who pay.
Is it wrong of them? No, it's a standard practice to keep any sort of decent pvp game like this even. It's not like normal chess where you could play against some guy with a rating of 800, and then next game will place you randomly against a guy with a rating of 2100 and you'd have no way to win. This would put a 3500 up against a 6000, and the 3500 has an even chance of winning.
Is it dishonest? Not really aside from the fact that for some reason you people don't want to acknowledge that it's there. So obviously it's somehow deceptive in some way. But I think that's just a form of in-group biases based off of people thinking a game being rigged is an insult to their precious game. Which, their precious game can do no wrong, there's no possible way it's rigged.
Do other auto-battlers do it? Yes, every one of them does it.
Does that make it not rigging? No, it is definitely a form of rigging whether you want to admit it or not as the game forces players to stay around 50% wins. If it wasn't every player would have the chance to be at 100% wins. But they don't,
Unlike in chess, rocket league, DOTA, CS:GO. Someone that's a pro at this game couldn't just make a new account and be 100% wins out of ~10/20 games. Because the game would force them to lose. How is Forcing the outcome of a game to be against your favor not considered not "rigged, at least not by the common definition of the word"?
Your explanation sounds like all the fake media ...
And lets say i believe you and take your word for it, what you want us to do? ...
Man in the end what im trying to say is stop convincing others of your truth and reality every person is in their own buble and havr their own truth and beliefs and what not, just play the game or quit it, end of story.
Honestly I don't give a shit if you guys stop playing. I enjoy the game mode whether or not it's programmed one way or another, in fact, I'm playing it right now with a deathrattle deck. I'm not saying the rigging is a bad thing at all. I'm just saying it's rigged, they themselves have literally discussed this multiple in the last what, 2? Blizzcons. You can go back and literally watch them talk about the luck and the keeping people at around a 50% win rate thing. It's just you can't say it's not there when they literally talk about it in something easily available for you to watch. It's a 100% completely normal thing for games like this, TFT, auto-chess kinds of games. But it's almost the definition of rigging.
In our country there is a hard lockdown as we speak. Because of that in combination with my vacation I played a shit ton of BG the last two weeks. The first few days i struggled to climb from 6700 to above 7000. Then began to understand the meta a bit better and currently i am 8500. The game is not rigged, you just need to learn the meta and use common sense.
As I said, Blizzard has already stated that they try to keep players at approx 50% winrate, So it means they definitely manipulate things, and definitely rig the games. There's no way other than "They make it so people stay around 50% win rate", other than to say they literally say they rig it.
The game's developers have indeed stated that they strive to keep people as close to 50% winrate as possible. They did so while discussing matchmaking and this is exactly what good matchmaking is supposed to do. It should be trying to find evenly matched opponents, and it is.
Luck does not mean "rigging the game", having unlockable perks does not mean "rigging the game", having proper matchmaking does not mean "rigging the game". Rigging the game means having hidden algorithms that choose to favour one player over the other for whatever reason and i have absolutely no reason to believe this to be true. I've spent exactly 0$ on this game and I've never felt there is an invisible wall preventing me from progressing.
You acknowledge blizzard strives to keep people at a 50% win rate, but that they're not manipulating things. There's no way to do that unless you Rig things in one persons favor even in finding "Evenly matched opponents" because that's not quite how it works, Blizzard match making always matches you against people known to be better or worse than you.
The card draw luck% is literally rigging the game. It literally serves one purpose, if you're winning too much, you'll see less of the majorly held card in the tavern. If you're not winning enough, you'll see more. Paying to unlock perks definitely is rigging the game when you have heroes that are much better than other heroes, paying gives a 50% better chance to get a better hero. How is that not rigging? The luck% are LITERALLY "algorithms that choose to favor one player over the other." There's no invisible wall to prevent you from progressing, but that doesn't mean there's no rigging. It's very little, it's definitely less noticeable with people that have some sort of adaptability. But just because you don't notice it, doesn't mean it's not there. It by all means isn't a bad thing. I can say I've won more than half my games, ~65% maybe 70%.
I think your definition of Rigging might be a bit askew and you don't understand that I'm not bashing the game. I very much so enjoy Hearthstone, and BG. But I can just acknowledge that there are measures and features in the game meant to keep people around a 50% win rate which is what rigging is.
What would be the point in rigging a game like battegrounds? There is no money involved, we're not talking about gambling here. The mode, like all of hearthstone is inherently full of RNG.
I mean, that's not true at all, there's definitely money involved. There's literally an option to spend money to buy an additional 2 heroes to choose from and "increased stats to let you perform better"
Anyone who has played above 10k consistently understands your claim and agrees with it. Anyone can watch a few streamers and spot it. We rationalize with phrases like "bad luck" or " seriously?", but we see it. When it goes in our favor, we get a shot of dopamine and smile. When it's not in our favor, we either blindly deny what is happening or get tilted.
I've played up to 12k for months and i call bullshit.
Whenever you think the game is rigged to stop you from getting higher it almost certainly means that you have just plateaued. You've reached the rating you deserve and the game does exactly what it should: it assigns you in games against opponents just as skilled as you. At this point, since skill is very similar, luck becomes a bigger factor and it's easy to convince yourself that it's not just good/bad luck but a rigged system.
The game is 100% rigged in one way or another, all these people who are spouting statistics really don't understand statistics. The whole game is programmed to keep you playing, climbing and falling in rating. If you just kept climbing that'd be too easy. If you kept fluctuating you'd be more inclined to buy the advanced stats and extra 2 heroes to choose from.
You can't tell me you never experienced the rounds where let's say you're the +1/+1 to mech hero, and the only mechs you EVER see are the first 3 rounds. You're completely full of shit if you haven't. The game literally has a Luck system in where it determines how much "Luck" it's going to give you any given game. If that's not considered rigging, I'm not sure what it is. Not saying it's a bad thing, or a shady thing. But :
Giving paying players the option to have 2 more characters to pick from gives them a 50% advantage to get a higher tier hero. - Rigging it in the favor of the people who paid
The games luck system definitely changes the outcome of the game based on if you have won more games recently than lost, vice versa. Rigging the game for you, or for other players.
Paying gives you at average a % higher of luck than people who hadn't.
The game is 90% skill, but if you deny the 5% pay, and 5% luck stat, you're blind and lying to yourself. Not to mention Blizzard has already stated that they try to keep players at approx 50% winrate, So it means they definitely manipulate things, and definitely rig the games.
And to the guy who said It's illegal for Casinos to be rigged, you need to do some more research on RTP and House Edge. Now you'd have to define rigged as you have a 0% chance to win if you want to consider casinos as "not being rigged" but at average house averages on slot machines are 4% i.e. at average, you're only going to get 96% of what you put in back. EVERY Casino game is made to give the Casino a mathematical advantage to take your money.