So I hit rank 5 a few days ago (it's now 5/17/17) and am going to try to push for legend. So far it's been brutal. I briefly made it to 2 stars, rank 4, then promptly lost 6 straight and went right back to no stars rank 5. I'm currently sitting at rank 5.
I'm looking for advice on a class or classes to use to try to push legend? This would be for standard format. Here are the solid decks I have:
Quest warrior, pirate warrior, murloc-aggro pally, murloc-mid pally, burn mage, secret mage, elemental/jade shaman and mid-hunter. Out of those, what are the recommendations.
My limitation is I'm a fairly casual player, meaning I don't have hours and hours to grind each day. I need a deck that's going to be fairly consistent. I understand I'm going to lose, but I'm hoping to avoid any more 5-6 game losing streaks. Any and all help and/or advice is appreciated.
If that's what you want, then play a deck with as few bad matchups as possible. Maybe Midrange Paladin. Between the shuffler and the matchmaker, you can at least minimize the matchmaking ups and downs that way.
I'd recommend one of the Paladins as well, since they are the most consistent decks out there at the moment. Which one depends on the types of classes that you're facing - try looking at the Tempostorm Meta Snapshot to use some data to get ahead. It feels a bit icky, but it does seem to work! And if you'd like someone to watch for a while, on the EU or NA servers, feel free to drop me a line :) I'm between school and work, so life is slow.
I recommend Control Jade Shaman (no elementals). Here is my list. It's exceptional against paladin because of 2x Devolve and 2x Volcano. Definitely has trouble against quest Rogue, but does fine or great against all other decks.
I made a post earlier today about the length of the rank 5 to legend grind at different likelihoods of winning with a particular deck and whatever your skill level happens to be. You might find it interesting.
Based on that result, I would say that you're probably best off picking a deck that is relatively strong in aggregate statistics and that you enjoy, like the tier 1 or 2 decks on vicioussyndicate.com, then sticking to it and playing just that one deck as long as you possibly can. Losing streaks that lose you two ranks are very normal features of the process for realistic likelihoods of winning games (i.e. in the 52-54% range.)
Be suspicious of anecdotal reports of 60+% win rates. Essentially, it's very difficult to distinguish skill from luck except for the rare players who can sustain such win rates over multiple seasons. Believe me, there are not many of those people, and there are a lot more who get lucky and just happen to achieve a 60% win rate on the way to Legend despite the fact that they'll later revert to a lower mean win rate over more games.
Play your best class that has a tier 1 or high tier 2 deck . It's not about always playing THE best deck but your best class with a good/consistent deck .
First of all you should avoid the decks with label like "Legend 85%, biggest meta killer!!!" here.
Time to time it's just bullshit. WR is counted on so small number of games etc... WR more that 60% is nearly impossible on higher ranks. Simply count even if you will have insane 65% winrate, it still means 125 games.
It doesn't matter so much which tier1/tier 2 deck you play, if you don't know how to play it and it's not about the guide, it takes hundred of games to adapt to the deck especially if it's a netdeck and you never play the similar one before.
So I would recommend you to play something your already familiar with and make a replacements based on your current match-ups. E.g. if you face a lot of pirates put tech cards like to counter them, same with murlocs. It should be at least top tier2 deck. If you reached rank 5 in causal mode, you for sure already have competitive deck for legend too. Take a breaks and concentrate on your game. That's it.
Anyway count that the way to the legend from rank5 will be still like 150 games, it's normal due to no win streak. Good luck
Assuming you have the skill and use a good deck, the grind to legend is a combo of luck and time. If you get lucky, you can pull off a hot streak and get there fairly quickly. If not, you can still get there, it will just take a long time.
If you're going to play casually, then you'll have to rely on getting lucky. Don't be disappointed if you don't make it this time around. If you're really set on making legendary, then I suggest putting your head down and putting in the extra play time. Then, you can still make it even if you get unlucky. I did it once, and once was enough for me. I was so jaded by the time I got it, I didn't even play a single game at legend level (even though I had a week left in the season). I just played casual and some lower-rank wild games.
Play your best class that has a tier 1 or high tier 2 deck . It's not about always playing THE best deck but your best class with a good/consistent deck .
Many people underestimate this, but playing a deck you know by heart can make all the difference. Also don't switch too often, stay focussed, don't tilt. Even when things don't go your way. It's a numbers game without the winstreaks, and as long as you only make the correct plays you will progress at some point.
Don't switch decks, exactly ! Use a tracker and track your winrates. Even if you lose 5 in a row, your deck still got that sweet 60% winrate, so dont give up on it !
Keep playing the same deck and the numer will come back in your favor !
The truth is there is simply no "Best deck". Currently I'm running a bit of a control/dragon priest brew and have pushed back up to Rank 2 after having gone to 3/6 stars in Rank 2 with Quest Warrior fairly easily and then plummeted to 2/6 stars in Rank 5 on a huge losing streak.
Really it's a factor of a few things: Match-up "luck", game draws/RNG, skill, and speed.
1) I can't emphasize enough that this meta in particular feels very match-up dependent. That's mostly because of Quest Rogue and Jade Druid absolutely demolishing certain decks and then being fantastically bad versus others. I'm doing well with my Priest deck right now because it obliterates Tempo Mage, Pirate Warrior, Murloc-Paladin, and Aggro-Druid which I've been seeing a LOT of. It tends to be favored against Control Paladin, Taunt Warrior, and Silence Priest. It's objectively bad versus Quest Rogue so long as the Rogue player isn't fully bad and doesn't just crap out on their draw. I've had games where I've cast two Dragonfire Potions and still had virtually no hope against it. My deck is unfavored against Jade, but I'm probably somewhere around 3/5 against Jade, but the games I lost I was pretty hopeless and the games I won I needed things like Lyra giving me the meme-combo and smashing face with like an 14/14 Lyra, or ripping Elise Un'Goro pack on turn 6 with some insanity, etc. I feel my 3/5 versus those decks is more based on my luck than anything.
2) Card draws (and really RNG in general). There have been a few games I felt I should've won, but just bricked out for like 3 turns straight. There was one game I was top decking versus a control Paladin and the cards left in my deck were 2x Shadow Visions, Potion of Madness, Acidic Swamp Ooze, Lyra, Elise. Opponent had 3 cards left and had already used Tirion, Tarim, 2x Stonehills, Rag Lightlord and his 2 Silverlights and my draw was actual Potion of Madness > Visions > Visions > Ooze > Elise. By the turn I drew Elise opponent had me exactly dead on board with recruits and a random Curator he got off Stonehill #2. That's not a by-product of me necessarily playing wrong, I basically ran my opponent out of gas and just needed basically that draw to be ANY other order and I'd have likely won, but that's the breaks of the game. The RNG is ulti,ately part of why I moved away from Quest Warrior because I felt like too many games were coming down to how the DIE INSECT rolled. I had a game where opponent had Aya, a 7/7 Jade, an 8/8 Jade, and 2 Health and I had a full-health Drake, a 3/6 Dino, and Acolyte of Pain in play and all I need was for that damn fireball to hit ANYTHING BUT the Aya....of course it kills her, pops out a 9/9 and he easily clears my board and then I didn't get a face shot on following turn and just lost.
3) Skill certainly comes into play. Some games swing based on the most innocuous of misplays or alternatively next level play. I know there are games I lost because of decision making, games I won because I made a smart play, or games my opponent lost/won based on their own decisions.
4) Speed - If you're just a grinder there is some truth to just going aggro, play the face and hope you carry anything better than a 50% win rate at which point you'll be gaining stars fast enough that even if you're winning 3 and dropping 2 you might be getting through those games faster than 2 games with a slow deck. You run the math on that and even if you're 2-0 versus 3-2 for same "Time", you're still only +1 star with the better deck, but if you drop a game (or worse, 2) with a slower deck, you're behind (possibly way behind) the 3-2 fast deck.
Thanks. Gonna give this deck a try. This was for Cluelesspug.
Thanks everyone else for all the constructive replies. I won't lie....it's been brutal since hitting rank 5. I've lost so many matches my head is spinning and I've been on tilt more than a few times. I'm going to try to take some of these suggestions, most specifically picking 1 or 2 decks to stick with and keep plugging. I think I've gotten so frustrated that I've swapped too many decks to the point I can't get any continuity going.
My advice after just hitting legend for the first time this season just a few hours ago is, have a good understanding of the meta aka what everyone else is playing in their decks and what turns you should try to play around if you can (sometimes you can't and just have to risk it). Play one deck and play it well aka no mistakes, if you lose it should never be because you misplayed, this way if he gets lucky and you get unlucky or however the match plays out you did the best you could with what you had and wouldn't change any of your plays. You have time each turn, think about each play and each line and try to think ahead to how it will affect the next turn as well. Know what your counters are and my rule was if i hit 3 counters in a row i would take a break and come back later, the meta changes fast and when it gets full of aggro the control decks come out and farm them after a while and then quest rogues come out and farm the control decks then aggro farms quest, sometimes it's just not a good time to queue. After all that you just need to put in the time, it took me about 100 games to rank 5 and then about 140 games to legend. It may take you more or less, get the games in though, if you're having a stressful schedule i'd suggest picking up an aggro deck you like and learning it well. Aggro is the way to go for players with not much time. Good luck and happy grinding.
I used this deck. It's really solid and it has no weaknesses except for Jade Druid. Since that deck only takes up 2% out of all of my games, it's pretty much non-existant. Mulligan guide and reason for some tech cards inside.
Quote from Dudeman0311>>have a good understanding of the meta and what turns you should try to play around if you can (sometimes you can't and just have to risk it). Play one deck and play it well aka no mistakes, if you lose it should never be because you misplayed, this way if he gets lucky you did the best you could with what you had and wouldn't change any of your plays. You have time each turn, think about each play and each line and try to think ahead to how it will affect the next turn as well.
This is the gist of it. Learn and keep up with the current meta. Play around it. Know that you won't always win.
As an update, I'm still rank 5. This past 9 days have been the most brutal I've experienced in Hearthstone. I've lost so many games it's not even funny. I've tried so many different decks it's not funny. I've made it to rank 4 twice, but almost immediately lose 4-5 straight and fall right back to rank 5.
Is this normal? I knew I'd have losses, but man, I was not prepared to constantly lose 4 and 5 and 6 straight. As soon as I win 2-3 and feel like I'm starting to get rolling, blam, lose 4 in a row and drop all the way back to zero stars, rank 5. I feel like the last 9 days has been a waste since I have not made any progress at all.
When people say "read the meta" what does that really mean? How quick are you to change a deck? Do you change after 1 loss, or 2 losses or 3? Even when I've changed, I haven't found that I'm still facing the same decks, it seems whenever I change, the next opponent I face is a hard counter to whatever deck I changed to.
Do you just stick out the 1 or 2 decks you settled on and keep plugging? I'll be honest, I'm so frustrated and confused now that I don't know what to do. I don't even know what deck to play each time I log on at this point. Is this normal for others? I know I'm not a legend player, but I always felt I was pretty decent and right now I feel like I don't have any skill at all. :(
As an update, I'm still rank 5. This past 9 days have been the most brutal I've experienced in Hearthstone. I've lost so many games it's not even funny. I've tried so many different decks it's not funny. I've made it to rank 4 twice, but almost immediately lose 4-5 straight and fall right back to rank 5.
Is this normal? I knew I'd have losses, but man, I was not prepared to constantly lose 4 and 5 and 6 straight. As soon as I win 2-3 and feel like I'm starting to get rolling, blam, lose 4 in a row and drop all the way back to zero stars, rank 5. I feel like the last 9 days has been a waste since I have not made any progress at all.
When people say "read the meta" what does that really mean? How quick are you to change a deck? Do you change after 1 loss, or 2 losses or 3? Even when I've changed, I haven't found that I'm still facing the same decks, it seems whenever I change, the next opponent I face is a hard counter to whatever deck I changed to.
Do you just stick out the 1 or 2 decks you settled on and keep plugging? I'll be honest, I'm so frustrated and confused now that I don't know what to do. I don't even know what deck to play each time I log on at this point. Is this normal for others? I know I'm not a legend player, but I always felt I was pretty decent and right now I feel like I don't have any skill at all. :(
Look man, I totally get what you are saying. It's a grind everytime. For instance, I was rank 1 last night and dropped to rank 3, 3 stars because I refuse to change the deck that I'm currently playing. Today, I got back to rank 2 with a win streak. So, keep pushing. If not this month, do the same next month.
I for instance climb with Midrange Paladin with some very slight modifications.
Its a grind every time, so much of a grind that I decided not to put up with it anymore after I hit legend the first time.
This season, however, I tried Aggro Druid on Rank 5 after memeing around with various decks, and I was rank 3 within 2 hours. I then decided to give it a try, and three days later I was legend.
Took me about 100 games from rank 5. Games are so fast and you win so many just by default with this deck, its not even funny.
I got to rank 5 at about 10th of may. Since that day its a horrible every day grind for me. Just bouncing back and forth. I think mistake i made was that on rank 3 i started to experiment with my decks so i dropped to rank 5 (no stars) terribly fast. Now i am on rank 4 (1 star) and i still hope to achieve legend within those 7 days of the season with my silence priest and evolve shaman. Do you guys have any tips being on this stage? Focus only on 1 deck or switch between 2 depending on Apprehension of the next rival?
So I hit rank 5 a few days ago (it's now 5/17/17) and am going to try to push for legend. So far it's been brutal. I briefly made it to 2 stars, rank 4, then promptly lost 6 straight and went right back to no stars rank 5. I'm currently sitting at rank 5.
I'm looking for advice on a class or classes to use to try to push legend? This would be for standard format. Here are the solid decks I have:
Quest warrior, pirate warrior, murloc-aggro pally, murloc-mid pally, burn mage, secret mage, elemental/jade shaman and mid-hunter. Out of those, what are the recommendations.
My limitation is I'm a fairly casual player, meaning I don't have hours and hours to grind each day. I need a deck that's going to be fairly consistent. I understand I'm going to lose, but I'm hoping to avoid any more 5-6 game losing streaks. Any and all help and/or advice is appreciated.
If that's what you want, then play a deck with as few bad matchups as possible. Maybe Midrange Paladin. Between the shuffler and the matchmaker, you can at least minimize the matchmaking ups and downs that way.
I'd recommend one of the Paladins as well, since they are the most consistent decks out there at the moment. Which one depends on the types of classes that you're facing - try looking at the Tempostorm Meta Snapshot to use some data to get ahead. It feels a bit icky, but it does seem to work! And if you'd like someone to watch for a while, on the EU or NA servers, feel free to drop me a line :) I'm between school and work, so life is slow.
I recommend Control Jade Shaman (no elementals). Here is my list. It's exceptional against paladin because of 2x Devolve and 2x Volcano. Definitely has trouble against quest Rogue, but does fine or great against all other decks.
@Grimlock22:
I made a post earlier today about the length of the rank 5 to legend grind at different likelihoods of winning with a particular deck and whatever your skill level happens to be. You might find it interesting.
Based on that result, I would say that you're probably best off picking a deck that is relatively strong in aggregate statistics and that you enjoy, like the tier 1 or 2 decks on vicioussyndicate.com, then sticking to it and playing just that one deck as long as you possibly can. Losing streaks that lose you two ranks are very normal features of the process for realistic likelihoods of winning games (i.e. in the 52-54% range.)
Be suspicious of anecdotal reports of 60+% win rates. Essentially, it's very difficult to distinguish skill from luck except for the rare players who can sustain such win rates over multiple seasons. Believe me, there are not many of those people, and there are a lot more who get lucky and just happen to achieve a 60% win rate on the way to Legend despite the fact that they'll later revert to a lower mean win rate over more games.
Play your best class that has a tier 1 or high tier 2 deck . It's not about always playing THE best deck but your best class with a good/consistent deck .
First of all you should avoid the decks with label like "Legend 85%, biggest meta killer!!!" here.
Time to time it's just bullshit. WR is counted on so small number of games etc... WR more that 60% is nearly impossible on higher ranks. Simply count even if you will have insane 65% winrate, it still means 125 games.
It doesn't matter so much which tier1/tier 2 deck you play, if you don't know how to play it and it's not about the guide, it takes hundred of games to adapt to the deck especially if it's a netdeck and you never play the similar one before.
So I would recommend you to play something your already familiar with and make a replacements based on your current match-ups. E.g. if you face a lot of pirates put tech cards like to counter them, same with murlocs. It should be at least top tier2 deck. If you reached rank 5 in causal mode, you for sure already have competitive deck for legend too. Take a breaks and concentrate on your game. That's it.
Anyway count that the way to the legend from rank5 will be still like 150 games, it's normal due to no win streak. Good luck
Assuming you have the skill and use a good deck, the grind to legend is a combo of luck and time. If you get lucky, you can pull off a hot streak and get there fairly quickly. If not, you can still get there, it will just take a long time.
If you're going to play casually, then you'll have to rely on getting lucky. Don't be disappointed if you don't make it this time around. If you're really set on making legendary, then I suggest putting your head down and putting in the extra play time. Then, you can still make it even if you get unlucky. I did it once, and once was enough for me. I was so jaded by the time I got it, I didn't even play a single game at legend level (even though I had a week left in the season). I just played casual and some lower-rank wild games.
The truth is there is simply no "Best deck". Currently I'm running a bit of a control/dragon priest brew and have pushed back up to Rank 2 after having gone to 3/6 stars in Rank 2 with Quest Warrior fairly easily and then plummeted to 2/6 stars in Rank 5 on a huge losing streak.
Really it's a factor of a few things: Match-up "luck", game draws/RNG, skill, and speed.
1) I can't emphasize enough that this meta in particular feels very match-up dependent. That's mostly because of Quest Rogue and Jade Druid absolutely demolishing certain decks and then being fantastically bad versus others. I'm doing well with my Priest deck right now because it obliterates Tempo Mage, Pirate Warrior, Murloc-Paladin, and Aggro-Druid which I've been seeing a LOT of. It tends to be favored against Control Paladin, Taunt Warrior, and Silence Priest. It's objectively bad versus Quest Rogue so long as the Rogue player isn't fully bad and doesn't just crap out on their draw. I've had games where I've cast two Dragonfire Potions and still had virtually no hope against it. My deck is unfavored against Jade, but I'm probably somewhere around 3/5 against Jade, but the games I lost I was pretty hopeless and the games I won I needed things like Lyra giving me the meme-combo and smashing face with like an 14/14 Lyra, or ripping Elise Un'Goro pack on turn 6 with some insanity, etc. I feel my 3/5 versus those decks is more based on my luck than anything.
2) Card draws (and really RNG in general). There have been a few games I felt I should've won, but just bricked out for like 3 turns straight. There was one game I was top decking versus a control Paladin and the cards left in my deck were 2x Shadow Visions, Potion of Madness, Acidic Swamp Ooze, Lyra, Elise. Opponent had 3 cards left and had already used Tirion, Tarim, 2x Stonehills, Rag Lightlord and his 2 Silverlights and my draw was actual Potion of Madness > Visions > Visions > Ooze > Elise. By the turn I drew Elise opponent had me exactly dead on board with recruits and a random Curator he got off Stonehill #2. That's not a by-product of me necessarily playing wrong, I basically ran my opponent out of gas and just needed basically that draw to be ANY other order and I'd have likely won, but that's the breaks of the game. The RNG is ulti,ately part of why I moved away from Quest Warrior because I felt like too many games were coming down to how the DIE INSECT rolled. I had a game where opponent had Aya, a 7/7 Jade, an 8/8 Jade, and 2 Health and I had a full-health Drake, a 3/6 Dino, and Acolyte of Pain in play and all I need was for that damn fireball to hit ANYTHING BUT the Aya....of course it kills her, pops out a 9/9 and he easily clears my board and then I didn't get a face shot on following turn and just lost.
3) Skill certainly comes into play. Some games swing based on the most innocuous of misplays or alternatively next level play. I know there are games I lost because of decision making, games I won because I made a smart play, or games my opponent lost/won based on their own decisions.
4) Speed - If you're just a grinder there is some truth to just going aggro, play the face and hope you carry anything better than a 50% win rate at which point you'll be gaining stars fast enough that even if you're winning 3 and dropping 2 you might be getting through those games faster than 2 games with a slow deck. You run the math on that and even if you're 2-0 versus 3-2 for same "Time", you're still only +1 star with the better deck, but if you drop a game (or worse, 2) with a slower deck, you're behind (possibly way behind) the 3-2 fast deck.
Balancing busted cards version 1.0.
Thanks. Gonna give this deck a try. This was for Cluelesspug.
Thanks everyone else for all the constructive replies. I won't lie....it's been brutal since hitting rank 5. I've lost so many matches my head is spinning and I've been on tilt more than a few times. I'm going to try to take some of these suggestions, most specifically picking 1 or 2 decks to stick with and keep plugging. I think I've gotten so frustrated that I've swapped too many decks to the point I can't get any continuity going.
My advice after just hitting legend for the first time this season just a few hours ago is, have a good understanding of the meta aka what everyone else is playing in their decks and what turns you should try to play around if you can (sometimes you can't and just have to risk it). Play one deck and play it well aka no mistakes, if you lose it should never be because you misplayed, this way if he gets lucky and you get unlucky or however the match plays out you did the best you could with what you had and wouldn't change any of your plays. You have time each turn, think about each play and each line and try to think ahead to how it will affect the next turn as well. Know what your counters are and my rule was if i hit 3 counters in a row i would take a break and come back later, the meta changes fast and when it gets full of aggro the control decks come out and farm them after a while and then quest rogues come out and farm the control decks then aggro farms quest, sometimes it's just not a good time to queue. After all that you just need to put in the time, it took me about 100 games to rank 5 and then about 140 games to legend. It may take you more or less, get the games in though, if you're having a stressful schedule i'd suggest picking up an aggro deck you like and learning it well. Aggro is the way to go for players with not much time. Good luck and happy grinding.
speed, momentum, violence
I used this deck. It's really solid and it has no weaknesses except for Jade Druid. Since that deck only takes up 2% out of all of my games, it's pretty much non-existant. Mulligan guide and reason for some tech cards inside.
As an update, I'm still rank 5. This past 9 days have been the most brutal I've experienced in Hearthstone. I've lost so many games it's not even funny. I've tried so many different decks it's not funny. I've made it to rank 4 twice, but almost immediately lose 4-5 straight and fall right back to rank 5.
Is this normal? I knew I'd have losses, but man, I was not prepared to constantly lose 4 and 5 and 6 straight. As soon as I win 2-3 and feel like I'm starting to get rolling, blam, lose 4 in a row and drop all the way back to zero stars, rank 5. I feel like the last 9 days has been a waste since I have not made any progress at all.
When people say "read the meta" what does that really mean? How quick are you to change a deck? Do you change after 1 loss, or 2 losses or 3? Even when I've changed, I haven't found that I'm still facing the same decks, it seems whenever I change, the next opponent I face is a hard counter to whatever deck I changed to.
Do you just stick out the 1 or 2 decks you settled on and keep plugging? I'll be honest, I'm so frustrated and confused now that I don't know what to do. I don't even know what deck to play each time I log on at this point. Is this normal for others? I know I'm not a legend player, but I always felt I was pretty decent and right now I feel like I don't have any skill at all. :(
I went straight from 6 to 9 yesterday so I don't give advice.
Its a grind every time, so much of a grind that I decided not to put up with it anymore after I hit legend the first time.
This season, however, I tried Aggro Druid on Rank 5 after memeing around with various decks, and I was rank 3 within 2 hours. I then decided to give it a try, and three days later I was legend.
Took me about 100 games from rank 5. Games are so fast and you win so many just by default with this deck, its not even funny.
Play a cancer deck. Done. Next question? :D
Dont even think about trying your own deck whatever ya do. its a massive letdown as you get run over by every tier 1/2 deck all day long. Sucks.
I win due to skill and lose due to bad RNG. :D
I got to rank 5 at about 10th of may. Since that day its a horrible every day grind for me. Just bouncing back and forth. I think mistake i made was that on rank 3 i started to experiment with my decks so i dropped to rank 5 (no stars) terribly fast. Now i am on rank 4 (1 star) and i still hope to achieve legend within those 7 days of the season with my silence priest and evolve shaman. Do you guys have any tips being on this stage? Focus only on 1 deck or switch between 2 depending on Apprehension of the next rival?