Hearthpwn

At least 2, as much as 14 -- your own minions won't die, due to the Commanding Shout.

Because the issue is Renew, not Wandmaker. The change you're suggesting would technically affect Priest's ability to get Renew from Wandmaker, but it would also affect every other deck that uses Wandmaker in classes where the pool of 1-mana spells aren't particularly problematic.

Wandmaker is the good sort of generation, if you ask me. It has enough constraints so that the pool it draws from is consistent without being reliable. You can't play a Wandmaker and KNOW that you'll get Devolving Missiles, for example, but you know that playing Wandmaker might get you that specific card, so you can try for it. The problem when Renew is in the pool is that Renew then generates even more resources -- maybe a Palm Reading, which generates even MORE resources. It can really get out of hand. If you're running Renew in your deck with that specific gameplan, fine. But being able to luck into it consistently (not reliably, but consistently) via Wandmaker is a problem of Renew, not a problem of Wandmaker.

They've correctly identified that the issue is "Renew does too much to be fair at the 1-mana slot," so "let's move it out of the 1-mana slot" is a perfectly good solution.

@Nidnam: The claim is that it is "disgusting," which is hyperbolic to say the least. C'thun isn't disgusting for a lot of the same reasons: It requires a bunch of setup and card sequencing and control in the meantime to pull off. The number of times I've actually seen C'thun played from C'thun decks is vanishingly small, and I suspect that "Double Backfire OTK" is even less statistically likely to happen. It's POSSIBLE to do a bunch of crazy stuff -- just watch any of MarkMcZ's videos. But this one doesn't exactly rise to the level of "disgusting" for previously-stated reasons.

Okay, sure, you can pull off an OTK combo after completing the questline and burning through your deck without using two of the most powerful engines to both draw/empty your deck and complete the questline, while also surviving long enough to do so and without burning those two cards with Altar of Fire along the way. This is not that big a deal, and certainly not "disgusting," because it isn't consistent and there's plenty of damage your opponent can contribute along the way to murder you before you get to the bottom of your deck.

It's such a silly approach that it's hard to understand why anyone would bring it up at all, let alone be concerned about it.

Quote from fjl93 >>

2 Backfire + Hero Power = 36 damage. Disgusting.

 That is not how math works at all. That's 8 damage total, which is 13 short of the 21 you need to get access to Tamsin, and even then, she only applies future damage taken to your opponent. You're fundamentally misunderstanding how these Questline cards work.

Quote from Pr1ncipe4i20 >>

Quote from fabjx >>

I have been wondering:

is this abomination of a card balanced?

 stop crying, there are tons of defensive cards in all classes to counter it. U can poly to not be revived, u can secret 8 armor, u can play warrior, u can use taunts, armor cards stuff that get u ahead of DH's Inquisitor face strategy.

I love how one of the "tons of defensive cards" this person suggests is Polymorph, a card that is not in Standard. But then, they also suggest "taunts" as if those do anything to stop an 8/8 with Rush.

Shaman aren't going to get straight-up card draw, because that's one of Shaman's weaknesses. So instead there's conditional card draw with some relatively minor deckbuilding constraints. Sure, if you play only this on curve, you might break an Elemental chain. But if you're willing to do that, it's probably because you didn't have an Elemental worth playing that turn anyway, so the chain was going to be broken regardless. This way you come out of it with a 2/3 body and a spell, and possibly an Elemental as well. That's pretty good for 3 mana.

Besides which, there's nothing saying you HAVE to play this on 3. You could play it on 4 alongside a Kindling Elemental (or a 2-cost Elemental that previously got discounted by a Kindling).

The card is a little situational, yeah. It isn't an auto-include, and it isn't an auto-play-on-3. That's fine. Even with those caveats, it's a good card.

Quote from Brigamir >>

I know it's a bad card design- in fact i thought Blizz had tried to nip mill decks before so it seemed weird they'd release this?vMaybe I'm wrong. Either way raging only invites trolls, I just wanted to add my angst to the list lol

There's a difference between the mechanic of "milling cards" and "mill decks." Certainly the latter employs the former to achieve its ends, but the problem lies in the truly excessive amount of mill from the deck, and not the comparatively tame amount produced by cards like Tickatus.

Blizzard has done a lot to disincentivize decks like Mill Rogue that forced you to draw cards at an absurdly accelerated rate (while often refilling their own deck, so as to not fall behind in fatigue). These decks are frustrating to play against from top to bottom, with no reasonable counterplay, and that usually warrants intervention from Blizzard.

Contrast this with Tickatus, who needs much more deck support and has much less replayability. Sure, Y'shaarj brings him back for another round, and that's annoying, but you can keep playing your deck in the meantime. In other words, Tickatus is a powerful card, but he's not an automatic death sentence. There are plenty of games that can weather Tickatus's shenanigans. This is not the case for Mill Decks in general, which rely on hyper-aggro as the only possible "counterplay," and that's not even reliable.

Quote from TheHiddenNinja7 >>

Quote from arneankann >>.

 By this logic Crossroads Gossiper shouldn't trigger when he's ressurected by Redemption since the card has already been played when he comes to life. Guess what, it does trigger. 

 I agree. Every other card I can think of doesn't trigger off of the effect that summoned it.

This specific one is because Crossroads Gossiper has an "after" timing trigger, and not a "when" timing trigger. You're right that it's a bit of an edge case, because there aren't many interactions like this. But part of Redemption's effect is to summon a minion. If that minion is Gossiper, then Gossiper is on the board before Redemption "finishes" casting. Then, since Gossiper is already there, it checks to see if any friendly Secrets have been revealed. Redemption has been revealed, hooray! It's buff time.

If Gossiper had a "when" or "whenever" trigger, its check would occur earlier in the sequence. Specifically because this is an "after" effect, Gossiper can gossip about themselves. ("Oh my Yogg, can you believe I died? For real. Totally dead, but I'm like, back now. Seriously.")

Quote from SlydE >>

I think we all know this by now. The way obtained deathrattles work is not intuitive either, but we know now that having obtained a deathrattle at some point is different from being a deathrattle card.

Also, don't pretend like the game is always consistant, and that every interaction makes sense:
I just tested playing Twilight Geomancer with C'Thun in my hand. C'Thun is now technically not a "taunt minion", but rather obtained taunt from another card before he was even played. Bulk Up, Into the Fray and Feat of Strength should not buff him, right? Guess what, they all do.

Secret Passage was actually patched so drawn and played Invoke cards would trigger Galakrond, the Nightmare. Then, I tested Secret Passage with C'Thun in hand, then drew and played some buffs like Disciple of C'Thun. Unlike Invoke, the buffers state specifically "wherever it is". When I got my C'Thun back in hand, it was NOT buffed, so being inside the Secret Passage does not count as "wherever"...

In this example, your specific C'Thun, at this time, IS a "taunt minion." It was granted the Taunt condition by an external force, yes, but it is both in your hand and has Taunt. It is, therefore, temporarily a Taunt minion, even if that condition is not intrinsic to the card. I'd be interested to see whether Hadronox would resummon him under these conditions. I would expect him to, because C'Thun, specifically, is an exception to a lot of Hearthstone's usual zonal rules. Since C'Thun's buffs are all worded as "wherever it is," those buffs are persistent in a way that Mok'Nathal Lion's is not.

Quote from Tyk3 >>

You can discuss word order and context until the cows come home, we all know that overloading a mana crystal regardless of how it happens should trigger unbound elemental. Anything else is just a level of nit-picking from team 5 that is not evident anywhere else in the game. Shamans have it hard enough without this bullshit.  

It is evident elsewhere in the game. See my previous comment describing the Corpsetaker/Crabrider interaction, or TheArcanist236's example using N'Zoth, the Corruptor and Unearthed Raptor.

Hearthstone does differentiate between "An X card" and "When Y occurs," and it has done so for years. True, there are a relatively small number of examples of these interactions, but they do exist, and they are meaningful distinctions.

I agree that Unbound Elemental ought to have its wording changed to function more like Tunnel Trogg (in activation condition, but not buffing for each crystal Overloaded), but as it currently stands, Unbound Elemental not triggering from Guidance is correct according to the wording.

Quote from arneankann >>

Guidance is in fact a card with overload, so by the wording Unbound Elemental should trigger. But that just one of M A N Y bad wordings and oversights from these useless developers :) 

In the same way that a Corrupt card is not the same as a Corrupted card, simply having the word "Overload" on a card does not mean that playing that card is "Playing an Overload card."

To use a different example, Crabrider now gains Windfury from a Battlecry. So it is a Rush card (so it will continue to gain buffs from Parade Leader and be in the pool for Athletic Studies and Stage Dive), and it is now a Battlecry card (so it can be discovered from Blazing Invocation). But, despite having the word Windfury printed on it, it is no longer a Windfury card, so it won't contribute Windfury to Corpsetaker.

Quote from Hooghout >>

 

2. Then Hystera. This is one of the few cards or maybe the ony card that has undergone player engagement changes twice within the same expansion. The first one was 'silently' done. The beloved aggro-burn crowd complained combo with big friendly minions which created a major board clear. The second change is more interesting and has to do with the meta. First let's review the arguments:

[1] Dev Comment: At 3 mana, Hysteria becomes an option before opponents really have the opportunity to consider how to best interact with it.

[2] Pushing Hysteria to 4 mana gives more space for those board-committal decisions to occur and also allows cheaper removal in Priest/Warlock to have a more distinct purpose.

Argument [1]  A wierd argument. It might be possible that I don't understand what is meant here, but it beats me. Does the opponent get the 'opportunity to consider how to best ineract with it' at 4 manna? Why then does opportunity arise at 4 manna? Why not 5 or 6 manna? How can you interact with a card that isn't played yet? It's a spell not a minion.

Argument [2]  Is more understandable. I reason at the request from the aggro-burn target audience that is destined to rule the meta (Paladin Mage).

 

Regarding your response to Argument 1 ("How can you interact with a card that isn't played yet?"), this is what's called "playing around" a card. If you're facing a Warlock or Priest in the current meta, you know that it's possible -- even likely -- that they have Hysteria in their deck, if not their hand. So you know that it can turn your minions against each other. This affects your decisions of which minions to play, and even the decision of whether to play a minion at all. 

If the board is completely empty, playing one minion isn't much of a problem. Hysteria can't affect it without another minion to knock it into. And that's where the mana costs come into play. If I know my opponent has to pay 3 mana for their Hysteria, then I know which of my minions might be susceptible to any minions they might play on their turn to crash my guy into. If the opponent has a coin, then I should be avoiding playing 1- or 2-health minions, because they could coin out a 2-attack 1-drop and Hysteria my minion into it. If no coin, then I should be safe with 2+ health minions, because what are they going to do, Murloc Tinyfin me? I'll take my chances.

But it also means that I have to be wary of committing two minions of my own. If I play a 1/4 and a 2/2 against a Priest who will have max 3 mana next turn, I'm just handing my opponent a Hysteria-able board. Easy clear, no problem. I just wasted two minions. But if I know that Hysteria costs 4, then I'm safe to play those two minions this turn, because I know Hysteria isn't coming for at least another turn (mana-reduction shenanigans aside).

It's the same math you always have to do against removal. In the olden times, playing 4-health minions into Mage's 7-mana turn was a risky move. You could easily get Flamestrike-d (now you need 6-health minions to survive that). Playing high-attack or equal-stat minions into Priest's 7-mana turn means there's a good chance you could get Soul Mirror'd in response. Good players will evaluate these possibilities, and play their turn accordingly. Maybe you bait out the removal without fully committing stuff you could have played. Maybe you prioritize playing a single minion that could survive the opponent's "clear" cards, whether through high health or a deathrattle that leaves a minion behind for you. But if you just plow forward with your gameplan, heedless of how the opponent might respond, that's pretty naive.

TL;DR: You've always been able to play around removal before the spell is actually cast, and Hysteria is no exception to this fundamental Hearthstone skill.

I love how everyone's acting like you can't have Kazakus and Hysteria in the same deck anymore. With the sheer amount of spell-generation in Priest, there are plenty of bites at the Hysteria-apple even if you don't run it in your decklist (to satisfy Kazakus's deck-building condition).

You've got Renew, you have Palm Reading, there's Venomous Scorpid (who can also take out a minion or two on the way), not to mention Sethekk Veilweaver.

Sure, it won't be as reliable, but it's not "goodbye forever," it's "see you around."

 I seen the changes, but I don't know.