So, I'm sure this has come up in a lot of players minds before, especially if you've every played Magic. While I understand that nerfs to the immediate meta are necessary, why not just redo the base set annually? You can keep some cards in the HOF and Wild, but kick some base set cards down to Wild, and bring some more popular cards back up to Standard. Personally, I feel this would keep the game fresh. Now, the argument is, well that's why there's Wild in the first place. I understand. But for the current theme of "Screw Wild, Cause Standard" that Blizzard seems to be pushing, and the fact that their main reasoning for nerfing cards is because they're overpowered or overused, it would seem that rotating the cards in and out of standard would solve this issue. Not to mention, from a business perspective, more people would be inclined to purchase more "basic" packs with the "new" cards in them. I would think that it would be more fun for new players too. ...also with this, if you like the idea, which cards would you like to see rotated out, and which cards would you like to see back in standard?
I think a best idea would be rotate the classic set and bring a new core set with totally new card and keep it for, two standard rotations, then rotate that core set and make a new one, rinse and repeat. It worked for Magic for years.
They should first focus on making an interesting expansion with exciting cards.Last one was LoE. Death knights made it so obvious that the design team have no good ideas.imo
I think a best idea would be rotate the classic set and bring a new core set with totally new card and keep it for, two standard rotations, then rotate that core set and make a new one, rinse and repeat. It worked for Magic for years.
This is basically what I meant. I just made it annual. But I agree. It works. And like magic, most of the basic cards will still be in the core set. Plus it gives new players different cards, so it reduces the chance of the same decks being played all the time. I know it's a lot of programming to do something like this on a digital cards game as opposed to reprinting cards in Magic, but I think the payoff would be huge on both Blizzard's side and the players' side.
While I like the idea of rotating the entire classic set. That would make being a new or F2P player almost impossible. That's why the classic set has (and probably should) remained a staple.
I've been saying for a while that they shouldn't even nerf cards. They should just rotate a handful of classic cards in and out of the meta each month. This would force new decks every month so the meta should seem far less stale and would be constantly changing. It would also be a great reactionary tool for Blizzard as well when an OP deck takes over. Just rotate a particular card out the next season to make that particular deck less viable and force a new meta. It could also eliminate some of the whiners as an OP deck could be "nerfed" far easier and more quickly than having to nerf a card. Just my opinion though.
I’m not sure that all cards need to be rotated out, but I think that certain cards need to be replaced for various reasons. Some cards are/have become too weak or are too powerful.
Especially the weak epics and legendaries are extremely frustrating. People spend time and/or money and then after opening 30 packs they get Nat Pagle! I’m not asking for Tirion Fordring quality, but for cards that either have an effect that you want to build around or cards that are at least slightly better than playable commons.
I also want to say something about Fiery War Axe. It was a very strong card and I accept Blizzard’s view to nerf it. However, Warrior is THE weapons class, so it’s completely unacceptable that hunter has an almost identical weapon but which is undeniably better. From a design point of view AND in the classic set, I find this completely unacceptable.
While I like the idea of rotating the entire classic set. That would make being a new or F2P player almost impossible. That's why the classic set has (and probably should) remained a staple.
I'd probably argue the opposite, that it's one less set to collect and one of the larger sets in terms of dust/legendaries. The current state makes it way harder for a new player since they have to collect the classic set and 1-3 expansions to get current.
Having new classic or standard would eliminate a huge base set for a new player to have to collect. Especially since all current expansions are based on it.
I'd probably argue the opposite, that it's one less set to collect and one of the larger sets in terms of dust/legendaries. The current state makes it way harder for a new player since they have to collect the classic set and 1-3 expansions to get current.
Having new classic or standard would eliminate a huge base set for a new player to have to collect. Especially since all current expansions are based on it.
Exactly, you're eliminating a huge base set and replacing it with a 'smaller' base set? So a player that's been away for a while could get screwed as his core set is now gone, so he's starting from scratch. A new player that starts playing at the very beginning of the new base set release would be fine as everyone would be starting off that same point. But if a newer player joins towards the middle or end of a release they are also put in a bad spot as they might be wasting their time earning cards that are going to be gone in a few months. And if the new player is planning on being F2P, well, sorry I guess....
I have to reiterate though. I would like to see rotating base sets, it has a way better chance to keep the game fresh for more serious players. The best part of the game is the innovation of new decks IMO. So set rotations would be great. It's a tightrope walk for sure and I would like rotating sets as I do pay for packs in most cases, but it could very easily limit the player base. And a smaller player base usually means the end for most games.
I'd probably argue the opposite, that it's one less set to collect and one of the larger sets in terms of dust/legendaries. The current state makes it way harder for a new player since they have to collect the classic set and 1-3 expansions to get current.
Having new classic or standard would eliminate a huge base set for a new player to have to collect. Especially since all current expansions are based on it.
Exactly, you're eliminating a huge base set and replacing it with a 'smaller' base set? So a player that's been away for a while could get screwed as his core set is now gone, so he's starting from scratch. A new player that starts playing at the very beginning of the new base set release would be fine as everyone would be starting off that same point. But if a newer player joins towards the middle or end of a release they are also put in a bad spot as they might be wasting their time earning cards that are going to be gone in a few months. And if the new player is planning on being F2P, well, sorry I guess....
I have to reiterate though. I would like to see rotating base sets, it has a way better chance to keep the game fresh for more serious players. The best part of the game is the innovation of new decks IMO. So set rotations would be great. It's a tightrope walk for sure and I would like rotating sets as I do pay for packs in most cases, but it could very easily limit the player base. And a smaller player base usually means the end for most games.
They may not play in standard, but there's always the wild mode, I don't understand what would be the problem of playing there. I mean, right now there are broken interactions between vanilla/classic cards and the newer expansions that make the game not fun and highly not interactive. This has to change eventually. Blizzard should just adjust the matchmaking for those who start from scratches.
I think a best idea would be rotate the classic set and bring a new core set with totally new card and keep it for, two standard rotations, then rotate that core set and make a new one, rinse and repeat. It worked for Magic for years.
Yes, make the game a buttload more expensive, yet again (how does this get upvoted?)
I'm surprised they haven't already done this, but the second they do, I'm out. The only way I'd accept this idea is if they built the core set from a mix of cards from already released expansions,...so for a while we'd be rotating some GvG, TGT, nax etc card back in and we wouldn't be starting from scratch.
I think a best idea would be rotate the classic set and bring a new core set with totally new card and keep it for, two standard rotations, then rotate that core set and make a new one, rinse and repeat. It worked for Magic for years.
Yes, make the game a buttload more expensive, yet again (how does this get upvoted?)
I'm surprised they haven't already done this, but the second they do, I'm out. The only way I'd accept this idea is if they built the core set from a mix of cards from already released expansions,...so for a while we'd be rotating some GvG, TGT, nax etc card back in and we wouldn't be starting from scratch.
That's what we mean. It wouldn't be a totally new set, it'd be basic,minus a few cards, plus a few cards from all the expansions and hopefully some back from the HOF. The only new cards would come from new expansions. They'd be separate from the core set.
As an added thought, this might also solve the nerfing/dusting basic set cards issue. It's not that big of a deal, and I understand Blizzard doesn't want new players dusting their entire set all the time, but in this case I think you could allow dusting core cards. I dunno if it'll work, but it's an idea.
I think a best idea would be rotate the classic set and bring a new core set with totally new card and keep it for, two standard rotations, then rotate that core set and make a new one, rinse and repeat. It worked for Magic for years.
Yes, make the game a buttload more expensive, yet again (how does this get upvoted?)
I'm surprised they haven't already done this, but the second they do, I'm out. The only way I'd accept this idea is if they built the core set from a mix of cards from already released expansions,...so for a while we'd be rotating some GvG, TGT, nax etc card back in and we wouldn't be starting from scratch.
I share your opinion to 99%! I think the classic set, should rotate to 33% every year and get filled up with already rotated cards from the past like GvG, Naxx, GT, BRM, LoE and upcomming OG, Kara and MoG. This way every archetype has his time to go and maybe to comeback if not too overpowered.
That way the rotated cards would be merged into the "wild" set and the classic set would become the standard 2018, 2019 etc. set. That would also give HoF Cards the oppotunity to come back and shine a second time.
And to be honest, a few months ago i already made a concept of such a new "coreset" for 2018, but the outcry of loosing many beloved cards like Tirion or Ice Block would be huge, even they get replaced directly.
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Want to discuss my predictions or suggestions with me personaly?
I think a best idea would be rotate the classic set and bring a new core set with totally new card and keep it for, two standard rotations, then rotate that core set and make a new one, rinse and repeat. It worked for Magic for years.
Yes, make the game a buttload more expensive, yet again (how does this get upvoted?)
I'm surprised they haven't already done this, but the second they do, I'm out. The only way I'd accept this idea is if they built the core set from a mix of cards from already released expansions,...so for a while we'd be rotating some GvG, TGT, nax etc card back in and we wouldn't be starting from scratch.
That's what we mean. It wouldn't be a totally new set, it'd be basic,minus a few cards, plus a few cards from all the expansions and hopefully some back from the HOF. The only new cards would come from new expansions. They'd be separate from the core set.
As an added thought, this might also solve the nerfing/dusting basic set cards issue. It's not that big of a deal, and I understand Blizzard doesn't want new players dusting their entire set all the time, but in this case I think you could allow dusting core cards. I dunno if it'll work, but it's an idea.
I'd probably argue the opposite, that it's one less set to collect and one of the larger sets in terms of dust/legendaries. The current state makes it way harder for a new player since they have to collect the classic set and 1-3 expansions to get current.
Having new classic or standard would eliminate a huge base set for a new player to have to collect. Especially since all current expansions are based on it.
Exactly, you're eliminating a huge base set and replacing it with a 'smaller' base set? So a player that's been away for a while could get screwed as his core set is now gone, so he's starting from scratch. A new player that starts playing at the very beginning of the new base set release would be fine as everyone would be starting off that same point. But if a newer player joins towards the middle or end of a release they are also put in a bad spot as they might be wasting their time earning cards that are going to be gone in a few months. And if the new player is planning on being F2P, well, sorry I guess....
I have to reiterate though. I would like to see rotating base sets, it has a way better chance to keep the game fresh for more serious players. The best part of the game is the innovation of new decks IMO. So set rotations would be great. It's a tightrope walk for sure and I would like rotating sets as I do pay for packs in most cases, but it could very easily limit the player base. And a smaller player base usually means the end for most games.
They may not play in standard, but there's always the wild mode, I don't understand what would be the problem of playing there. I mean, right now there are broken interactions between vanilla/classic cards and the newer expansions that make the game not fun and highly not interactive. This has to change eventually. Blizzard should just adjust the matchmaking for those who start from scratches.
Because for a new player to play in Wildness instead of standard they go from needing up to 7 sets of cards to needding 15 plus.
Wild is good for a player that has a lot of older cards. But standard really helps a new player coming into the game (or who never filled out earlier sets) and not wanting to spend a ton of money.
They could HoF a lot of the shitty cards from Classic, so that new players who gravitate more towards Standard will not have to open so much shit when starting this game. Later down the road, if anyone wants to collect them, craft them. They think Lorewalker Cho and stuff are "fun" or whatever cards, but they are really a deterrent (and somewhat of a trap) for new players, and kind of a slap in the face for all players who pull them from packs. I realize the whole set can't be full of really good stuff, but it shouldn't be this bad when this is your introductory set for new and f2p players.
I also like the idea of rotating in and out the stronger/overplayed cards on a season-by-season (or even exp-by-exp) basis, and I've been barking up that tree for a while. For instance, once Barnes and Eternal Servitude are out of the meta, I don't see any reason why Sylvanas couldn't come back eventually. I doubt she would be as highly played as she was in previous metas (she barely shows up in Wild, compared to old times). Largely dependent on new cards released ofc, but still they should be open to be more responsive on HoF'ing cards, as long as they are open to potentially bringing them back.
Really great idea, people who are familiar with League of Legend are so used to redoing old champions and give them a suitable new kit! For Blizzard it always been different. Just why in the world would Blizzard do that?! it's just more unpaid labor for them, and beside that, the moment they manage to create a new set or as you called it "redo the basic set", all they would do next is give it a theme and push it as a brand new expansion ;) We've seen multiple times that Blizzard never put enough effort into fixing the actual game stat, let alone redoing the basic set, all they do is nerf cards to un-playability, cuz it really doesn't require much testing if I may say, and realease content that overshadows the previous ones...
Rotating the base set goes completely against the reason for having a base set.
Basic cards are the sucky cards everyone gets for free. You're not supposed to have to buy them. They are not supposed to be great cards. You are meant to feel good about growing out of them as you get better cards.
That's why it's OK if they get nerfed into oblivion. If you are using certain Basic cards in every deck, there's a good chance they are too powerful to be Basic cards.
It's true that there are still some Basic cards that are quite powerful, but power level isn't the same as ubiquity. If you take a close look at all the archetypes, you'll find that surprisingly few Basic cards are autoincludes in every single deck.
So, I'm sure this has come up in a lot of players minds before, especially if you've every played Magic. While I understand that nerfs to the immediate meta are necessary, why not just redo the base set annually? You can keep some cards in the HOF and Wild, but kick some base set cards down to Wild, and bring some more popular cards back up to Standard. Personally, I feel this would keep the game fresh. Now, the argument is, well that's why there's Wild in the first place. I understand. But for the current theme of "Screw Wild, Cause Standard" that Blizzard seems to be pushing, and the fact that their main reasoning for nerfing cards is because they're overpowered or overused, it would seem that rotating the cards in and out of standard would solve this issue. Not to mention, from a business perspective, more people would be inclined to purchase more "basic" packs with the "new" cards in them. I would think that it would be more fun for new players too. ...also with this, if you like the idea, which cards would you like to see rotated out, and which cards would you like to see back in standard?
I... I love him.
I think a best idea would be rotate the classic set and bring a new core set with totally new card and keep it for, two standard rotations, then rotate that core set and make a new one, rinse and repeat. It worked for Magic for years.
They should first focus on making an interesting expansion with exciting cards.Last one was LoE. Death knights made it so obvious that the design team have no good ideas.imo
I... I love him.
While I like the idea of rotating the entire classic set. That would make being a new or F2P player almost impossible. That's why the classic set has (and probably should) remained a staple.
I've been saying for a while that they shouldn't even nerf cards. They should just rotate a handful of classic cards in and out of the meta each month. This would force new decks every month so the meta should seem far less stale and would be constantly changing. It would also be a great reactionary tool for Blizzard as well when an OP deck takes over. Just rotate a particular card out the next season to make that particular deck less viable and force a new meta. It could also eliminate some of the whiners as an OP deck could be "nerfed" far easier and more quickly than having to nerf a card. Just my opinion though.
I’m not sure that all cards need to be rotated out, but I think that certain cards need to be replaced for various reasons. Some cards are/have become too weak or are too powerful.
Especially the weak epics and legendaries are extremely frustrating. People spend time and/or money and then after opening 30 packs they get Nat Pagle! I’m not asking for Tirion Fordring quality, but for cards that either have an effect that you want to build around or cards that are at least slightly better than playable commons.
I also want to say something about Fiery War Axe. It was a very strong card and I accept Blizzard’s view to nerf it. However, Warrior is THE weapons class, so it’s completely unacceptable that hunter has an almost identical weapon but which is undeniably better. From a design point of view AND in the classic set, I find this completely unacceptable.
Why not make a new base set consisting from cards chosen from ones currently in the game, and keeping that one permanently?
Yeah rotate anything and fuck wild right?There are people playing there too you know...
Just Another Legend Player#Kappa
Here's the funny thing about that. Wild uses all the cards. So it won't effect Wild, just Standard. Wild will still be Wild.
I... I love him.
I... I love him.
I share your opinion to 99%! I think the classic set, should rotate to 33% every year and get filled up with already rotated cards from the past like GvG, Naxx, GT, BRM, LoE and upcomming OG, Kara and MoG. This way every archetype has his time to go and maybe to comeback if not too overpowered.
That way the rotated cards would be merged into the "wild" set and the classic set would become the standard 2018, 2019 etc. set. That would also give HoF Cards the oppotunity to come back and shine a second time.
And to be honest, a few months ago i already made a concept of such a new "coreset" for 2018, but the outcry of loosing many beloved cards like Tirion or Ice Block would be huge, even they get replaced directly.
Want to discuss my predictions or suggestions with me personaly?
Contact me via battletag: Athanor#1658 [EU]
They could HoF a lot of the shitty cards from Classic, so that new players who gravitate more towards Standard will not have to open so much shit when starting this game. Later down the road, if anyone wants to collect them, craft them. They think Lorewalker Cho and stuff are "fun" or whatever cards, but they are really a deterrent (and somewhat of a trap) for new players, and kind of a slap in the face for all players who pull them from packs. I realize the whole set can't be full of really good stuff, but it shouldn't be this bad when this is your introductory set for new and f2p players.
I also like the idea of rotating in and out the stronger/overplayed cards on a season-by-season (or even exp-by-exp) basis, and I've been barking up that tree for a while. For instance, once Barnes and Eternal Servitude are out of the meta, I don't see any reason why Sylvanas couldn't come back eventually. I doubt she would be as highly played as she was in previous metas (she barely shows up in Wild, compared to old times). Largely dependent on new cards released ofc, but still they should be open to be more responsive on HoF'ing cards, as long as they are open to potentially bringing them back.
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Really great idea, people who are familiar with League of Legend are so used to redoing old champions and give them a suitable new kit! For Blizzard it always been different. Just why in the world would Blizzard do that?! it's just more unpaid labor for them, and beside that, the moment they manage to create a new set or as you called it "redo the basic set", all they would do next is give it a theme and push it as a brand new expansion ;)
We've seen multiple times that Blizzard never put enough effort into fixing the actual game stat, let alone redoing the basic set, all they do is nerf cards to un-playability, cuz it really doesn't require much testing if I may say, and realease content that overshadows the previous ones...
Rotating the base set goes completely against the reason for having a base set.
Basic cards are the sucky cards everyone gets for free. You're not supposed to have to buy them. They are not supposed to be great cards. You are meant to feel good about growing out of them as you get better cards.
That's why it's OK if they get nerfed into oblivion. If you are using certain Basic cards in every deck, there's a good chance they are too powerful to be Basic cards.
It's true that there are still some Basic cards that are quite powerful, but power level isn't the same as ubiquity. If you take a close look at all the archetypes, you'll find that surprisingly few Basic cards are autoincludes in every single deck.
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