i disenchanted all my gvg and naxx cards cause i wasn't undestanding what was goin'on,just like kids,but when i grew up a bit and found my useless blacknight i decided to keep it.
People are not look past having the perfect curve AND hand.
This card will be trash tier most of the time as the most optimal time to play it would be turn 4 after an elemental is played. THAT IS A HUGE REQUIREMENT TO GET ITS EFFECT.
So far, there's at least 2 elementals that can be used in an elemental control deck that could be used in turn 3: Tar Creeper/card] (the most obvious curve) and [card]Fire Fly (since it fuels your hand with another elemental to activate even more "last turn"s effects).
If there's at least another card worth playing on turn 3, I'd say that this card will never be considered trash tier for it's consistency on activating the battlecry.
You are never going to have them in your hand 100% of the time, you'd be lucky to have them 30% of the time to play its effect on curve.
Its no good going 'OH but we have this specific card and this specific card to play to make it work!' Dragon synergy worked well due to only having to have them in your hand.
Elementals you MUST go out of your way to mulligan on curve elementals to be able to get a trash tier card a bonus effect to make it an above average card. After missing the turn to play that card you are now in a situation to play further behind in order to get a now subpar effect.
Its not about having a precise curve, but having a good amunt of cards that can be played on turn 3, or a turn before this guy get played. If there's 3+ cards there are actually good plays on early game, it becomes quite consistent.
Therefore, in a deck built around this theme, this card can activate most of the times. It wont be 100% effective, just like dragons aren't, but it can be considered an auto-include in a control elemental tribal, and maybe, just maybe, even a tempo-driven one.
Might be the new Sludge Belcher for one specific archetype, a way to defend yourself from aggro while playing on curve and tempo. Similar to the turtle guy priests get. Definitely a good direction.
Actually what I consider to be a trash tier card are stuff like boogeymonster, savagery, the nerfed arcane golem, the nerfed warsong commander, starving buzzard etc. Cards that are completely unusable no matter what the situation is. If you do not get the bonus on this card, at worst it is a 4 mana 3/5 which is still not that bad because it can trade with most two drops and not die. If you get the bonus off, it is amazing and you can even use this card in the late game because a 4 mana 3/5 with taunt and divine shield is still really good so you do not even have to automatically use this on turn 4 for this to be good and there are early elementals available in order to get the effect if you want to use it in the early game, I have played against many Jade decks and usually before turn 4 they have been able to cast at least 1 jade golem and there are still plenty of cards left to be revealed so we may get even more early game elementals for this to get activated on turn 4, but because of its ability, you can still play this late game and it will still be a solid card as a cheap 4 mana 3/5 with taunt and divine shield so your opponent has to still trade into it at least twice or waste spot removal on a card with a fairly low cost in the late game.
The problem that I have been seeing in this community is something I even saw in MTG at one point during the whole affinity era brokenness and the release of the kamigawa block which is player burn out. When player morale in the game is low and they have issues with the devs concerning the state of the meta, when a new expansion releases players tend to try and find any excuse to call a card trash and unusable even if it is a solid card. I have been really impressed with this expansion so far, there have been no trash level cards, however there is still quite of bit of hate from some players who almost try to find any excuse to call a card complete trash.
Tar Creeper into this is a nice run. But if you have to play off curve to get this effect, it becomes significantly worse because you had to give up tempo to play a card to try to get tempo back. If there is a 3-mana shaman elemental, this guy gets a lot better.
Also, with the Tar Creeper>Stoneshaper curve, you aren't actually applying much pressure if any. Your board is strong, but it's not scary. Your 5 drop will need to make up for it. Maybe that's fine. Who knows what the metagame will look like.
Honestly, the card is probably at it's best in the mid to late game when it's played to protect some bigger drop that was played the turn before with the 1 mana 1/2.
It's playable for sure, and is probably mandatory in an elemental deck. But I think there's some overhype here.
Tar Creeper into this is a nice run, but if you have to play off curve to get this effect, it becomes significantly worse because you had to give up tempo to play a card to try to get tempo back. If there is a 3-mana shaman elemental, this guy gets a lot better.
Also, with the Tar Creeper>Stoneshaper curve, you aren't actually applying much pressure if any. Your board is strong, but it's not scary. Your 5 drop will need to make up for it. Maybe that's fine. Who knows what the metagame will look like.
Honestly, the card is probably at it's best when it's played to protect some bigger drop that was played the turn before with the 1 mana 1/2.
It's playable for sure, and is probably mandatory in an elemental deck. But I think there's some overhype here.
Tar Creeper into this is a nice run, but if you have to play off curve to get this effect, it becomes significantly worse because you had to give up tempo to play a card to try to get tempo back. If there is a 3-mana shaman elemental, this guy gets a lot better.
Also, with the Tar Creeper>Stoneshaper curve, you aren't actually applying much pressure if any. Your board is strong, but it's not scary. Your 5 drop will need to make up for it. Maybe that's fine. Who knows what the metagame will look like.
Honestly, the card is probably at it's best when it's played to protect some bigger drop that was played the turn before with the 1 mana 1/2.
It's playable for sure, and is probably mandatory in an elemental deck. But I think there's some overhype here.
*Cough Unbound Elemental Cough*
Right...but you're going to play a naked 2/4 into this? In doing so, you are not playing off curve, you're not exactly playing a strong one. Unbound Elemental is no Brann. You aren't exactly scared of him. Unbound isn't even Trogg.
I guess maybe if your turn 5 is doomhammer, things look better? Seems like a lot of work to protect an unbound elemental which is a borderline-unplayable card.
Who knows, maybe it is a strong enough curve in world where we play less curvestone, this is a good curve.
People are not look past having the perfect curve AND hand.
This card will be trash tier most of the time as the most optimal time to play it would be turn 4 after an elemental is played. THAT IS A HUGE REQUIREMENT TO GET ITS EFFECT.
So far, there's at least 2 elementals that can be used in an elemental control deck that could be used in turn 3: Tar Creeper/card] (the most obvious curve) and [card]Fire Fly (since it fuels your hand with another elemental to activate even more "last turn"s effects).
If there's at least another card worth playing on turn 3, I'd say that this card will never be considered trash tier for it's consistency on activating the battlecry.
You are never going to have them in your hand 100% of the time, you'd be lucky to have them 30% of the time to play its effect on curve.
Its no good going 'OH but we have this specific card and this specific card to play to make it work!' Dragon synergy worked well due to only having to have them in your hand.
Elementals you MUST go out of your way to mulligan on curve elementals to be able to get a trash tier card a bonus effect to make it an above average card. After missing the turn to play that card you are now in a situation to play further behind in order to get a now subpar effect.
Its not about having a precise curve, but having a good amunt of cards that can be played on turn 3, or a turn before this guy get played. If there's 3+ cards there are actually good plays on early game, it becomes quite consistent.
Therefore, in a deck built around this theme, this card can activate most of the times. It wont be 100% effective, just like dragons aren't, but it can be considered an auto-include in a control elemental tribal.
I think this card can be good. But it really depends on how many acceptable elementals there will be.Presently I do not think that elementals will be better than Jade, for example
My problem with the elemental-trigger-requirement (i.e. "play an elemental the turn before") is that you sacrifice your flexibility. Dragons require a Dragon in hand. Once you have one, you can keep it to reliably trigger dragon cards. C'thun are always triggering as soon as the buff-treshold is reached. Jade are just getting bigger. But with elementals, you play one and the next turn you have the trigger ready. If you need to adjust to a new situation, you "wasted" your trigger window. Or let's say on your turn 6, you have 1 elemental in your hand but another better play, unless you get stone sentinel: Do you play the elementaö in case you topdeck Stone Sentinel ?
If the trigger would be "if the last minion you played was an elemental", then you could at least save a Fire Fly and play it and then the elemental. But as it is, it seems to me like advanced curvestone with with decreased flexibility. You play a minion now to prepare a planned play next turn. But if you must change your plan or brake your curve, you get into trouble.
The elemental trigger reminds me a little bit on the fate of joust. Joust minions were pretty good when the joust worked ( Master Jouster , Armored Warhorse , ...) but when it didn't, they were bad cards. Only the few with at least vanilla stats and a very good advantage saw constructive play. Therefore I am sceptical until I see that you can actually make a deck consisting almost completely out of elementals, to enable the trigger of elementals reliably almost every turn without making akward plays. If you have to plan your turns very carefully to not mess up your triggers, then I think the benefit from the present cards will not be enough.
Presumably, the card may see play in Mage and Shaman, and not in other classes. If there are playable 3-mana elementals in either class, the value of Tol'vir increases considerably - currently, there is only Tar Creeper, which probably isn't enough to make this card an auto-include, even in elemental decks. Although some people have mentioned Unbound Elemental in Shaman, that particular card has never been good enough to see play, as it is a vanilla 2/4 on curve. Having such a weak turn 3 would undermine a good portion of the value which Tol'vir represents on turn 4. Undoubtedly, the card has plenty of potential, but it seems premature to call it anything other than "potentially playable."
the only problem with this card is the fact that it isn't an elemental itself. Meaning if you play this on curve then if you have a 5 mana elemental with the "if you played an elemental last turn" effect then you are losing that. Otherwise it's a sen'jin shieldmasta with divine shield.
I suppose the question really is whether or not sen'jin shieldmasta with divine shield is good enough? In another way of thinking about it is that it's a psycho-tron with 1 less health and 1 less mana cost, but it also doesn't have any tribe synergy. Neither card is seen in constructed so is just adding on a divine shield good enough or is 1 less mana cost and health (and no tribe) good enough to make this competitive.
the only problem with this card is the fact that it isn't an elemental itself. Meaning if you play this on curve then if you have a 5 mana elemental with the "if you played an elemental last turn" effect then you are losing that. Otherwise it's a sen'jin shieldmasta with divine shield.
If you played a Tar Creeper on 3, there's a very good chance that it is still around on 4. So maybe you can plan to play some other elemental on 4, then drop Tol'vir Stoneshaper + Fire Fly (or Flame Elemental) on turn 5?
On the other hand, maybe it's actually better design if they don't just hand you a perfect curve the way they did with C'Thun. People did (and still do) find that a little boring and predictable.
people are saying "anti-aggro tool" but this is more than that... this is piloted shredder with taunt. its basically a 3/1 taunt deathrattle summon a 3/5 taunt. this card is going to be an absolute monster for tempo/value and it will probably extinguish any midrange deck that dosent also play this card because of its power level.
i disenchanted all my gvg and naxx cards cause i wasn't undestanding what was goin'on,just like kids,but when i grew up a bit and found my useless blacknight i decided to keep it.
time to shine! :)
Might be the new Sludge Belcher for one specific archetype, a way to defend yourself from aggro while playing on curve and tempo. Similar to the turtle guy priests get. Definitely a good direction.
We're probably going to need some more silence...
Actually what I consider to be a trash tier card are stuff like boogeymonster, savagery, the nerfed arcane golem, the nerfed warsong commander, starving buzzard etc. Cards that are completely unusable no matter what the situation is. If you do not get the bonus on this card, at worst it is a 4 mana 3/5 which is still not that bad because it can trade with most two drops and not die. If you get the bonus off, it is amazing and you can even use this card in the late game because a 4 mana 3/5 with taunt and divine shield is still really good so you do not even have to automatically use this on turn 4 for this to be good and there are early elementals available in order to get the effect if you want to use it in the early game, I have played against many Jade decks and usually before turn 4 they have been able to cast at least 1 jade golem and there are still plenty of cards left to be revealed so we may get even more early game elementals for this to get activated on turn 4, but because of its ability, you can still play this late game and it will still be a solid card as a cheap 4 mana 3/5 with taunt and divine shield so your opponent has to still trade into it at least twice or waste spot removal on a card with a fairly low cost in the late game.
The problem that I have been seeing in this community is something I even saw in MTG at one point during the whole affinity era brokenness and the release of the kamigawa block which is player burn out. When player morale in the game is low and they have issues with the devs concerning the state of the meta, when a new expansion releases players tend to try and find any excuse to call a card trash and unusable even if it is a solid card. I have been really impressed with this expansion so far, there have been no trash level cards, however there is still quite of bit of hate from some players who almost try to find any excuse to call a card complete trash.
Tar Creeper into this is a nice run. But if you have to play off curve to get this effect, it becomes significantly worse because you had to give up tempo to play a card to try to get tempo back. If there is a 3-mana shaman elemental, this guy gets a lot better.
Also, with the Tar Creeper>Stoneshaper curve, you aren't actually applying much pressure if any. Your board is strong, but it's not scary. Your 5 drop will need to make up for it. Maybe that's fine. Who knows what the metagame will look like.
Honestly, the card is probably at it's best in the mid to late game when it's played to protect some bigger drop that was played the turn before with the 1 mana 1/2.
It's playable for sure, and is probably mandatory in an elemental deck. But I think there's some overhype here.
Most overrated card so far.
Presumably, the card may see play in Mage and Shaman, and not in other classes. If there are playable 3-mana elementals in either class, the value of Tol'vir increases considerably - currently, there is only Tar Creeper, which probably isn't enough to make this card an auto-include, even in elemental decks. Although some people have mentioned Unbound Elemental in Shaman, that particular card has never been good enough to see play, as it is a vanilla 2/4 on curve. Having such a weak turn 3 would undermine a good portion of the value which Tol'vir represents on turn 4. Undoubtedly, the card has plenty of potential, but it seems premature to call it anything other than "potentially playable."
Best card revealed so far. Piloted shredder levels of op. I cry for the no ping classes.
the only problem with this card is the fact that it isn't an elemental itself. Meaning if you play this on curve then if you have a 5 mana elemental with the "if you played an elemental last turn" effect then you are losing that. Otherwise it's a sen'jin shieldmasta with divine shield.
I suppose the question really is whether or not sen'jin shieldmasta with divine shield is good enough? In another way of thinking about it is that it's a psycho-tron with 1 less health and 1 less mana cost, but it also doesn't have any tribe synergy. Neither card is seen in constructed so is just adding on a divine shield good enough or is 1 less mana cost and health (and no tribe) good enough to make this competitive.
Very nice. We need more divine taunters.
Nice anti-aggro tool.
Just like 0 mana 5/5 with taunt
"Why, you never expected justice from a company, did you? They have neither a soul to lose nor a body to kick." -- Lady Saba Holland
people are saying "anti-aggro tool" but this is more than that... this is piloted shredder with taunt. its basically a 3/1 taunt deathrattle summon a 3/5 taunt. this card is going to be an absolute monster for tempo/value and it will probably extinguish any midrange deck that dosent also play this card because of its power level.Blizzard is really struggling to wipe out the aggro decks :o
Sen'jin Shieldmasta
power creep
Tol'vir Stoneshaper
Looks that way, it's the best elemental synergy card so far, so it's frustrating.