Totally agree with original post. The less ambiguities, the better. I've seen many players attempt to silence a faceless manipulator clone, Druid of the Claw in taunt form, etc. Sylvanis deathrattle effect order has gotten me a few times.
yeah... why can Fire Elemental's be killed by Fireballs? They should be immune, like Pikachu is resistant to electrical attacks. JK...
Never realised Faceless Manipulator before tbh, but yeah, it seems silly why it wouldn't be: 'Battlecry: Choose a minion and Transform into a copy of it.'
Agreed. One day they might make a card that cares about other cards transforming, and then this will become important. Likewise, Druid of the Claw would then also need the word transform to be explicit. For example, I'm imagining a card like Undertaker that gets +1/+1 whenever a minion transforms.
Take, for example, Druid of the Claw and Ancient of War. Both of these cards have identical verbiage, yet the cards behave very differently. Druid of the Claw is a transform, thus a 4/6 taunted Druid of the Claw remains that way, even if silenced. That is how the transform mechanic works, it cannot be silenced. Yet, the card itself gives no indication that the transform mechanic is being used. On the other hand, Ancient of War uses the buff mechanic, thus a 5/10 taunted Ancient of War can be silenced and it will revert to the original 5/5 minion. Again, Ancient of War gives no indication whether it is using the buff or transform mechanic.
Why don't the Hearthstone developers simply state that transform is the mechanic in use on Druid of the Claw? Instead of "Choose one ...", why not "Choose one to transform into ..."? There would be no need to even use the word buff on Ancient of War, since the lack of a stated transform mechanic would assume the buffed mechanic.
actually there is a difference DOTC has transform in the text AOW does not...
Something came up in a recent tournament - a misdirected Water Elemental hit its owner and did not freeze it. Can anyone confirm if Water Elemental only freezes enemy minions? That is not explicitly stated.
interesting, when u play Betray on water ele, u force him to attack minions next to him and they get frozen ... or am i misstaken? it is a long time since it happened to me but i think it was like this. same with cobra.
Something came up in a recent tournament - a misdirected Water Elemental hit its owner and did not freeze it. Can anyone confirm if Water Elemental only freezes enemy minions? That is not explicitly stated.
Do you have a link to the match? That's an issue that should probably be sent to Ben Brode, so he can see the bug in action.
Speaking of Betrayal, it is a rather misleading card in itself: 'Force an enemy minion to deal it's damage to the minions next to it.'
What it actually does is deal it's damage and it's effect if it has one, which isn't easy to glean from just reading the card text, it also is not boosted by spell damage enhancements*, so casting Betrayal on a Water Elemental with Bloodmage Thalnos on the board will still only deal 3 damage to the minions either side of it, but also freeze them.
*The reasoning behind this is that the damage is dealt by the minion and not the spell, but it's easy to miss this due to the unique nature of the card.
IMO that's clear enough from the text of the card already. Betrayal explicitly says that the minion deals the damage.
Speaking of Betrayal, it is a rather misleading card in itself: 'Force an enemy minion to deal it's damage to the minions next to it.'
What it actually does is deal it's damage and it's effect if it has one, which isn't easy to glean from just reading the card text, it also is not boosted by spell damage enhancements*, so casting Betrayal on a Water Elemental with Bloodmage Thalnos on the board will still only deal 3 damage to the minions either side of it, but also freeze them.
*The reasoning behind this is that the damage is dealt by the minion and not the spell, but it's easy to miss this due to the unique nature of the card.
IMO that's clear enough from the text of the card already. Betrayal explicitly says that the minion deals the damage.
to be honest for a new player that might not be so clear. when u encounter that card and see it in action u dont think about at all after couple times, but when u would first use it on water ele/cobra and see that effect of minions attack will proc too u might be surprised and even possibly (probably not) would use that card differently if u knew this would happen. im not sayin wording is wrong but its not crystal clear ... but then again its HS and u can squeeze only so much "meaningfull" text on a card :)
Speaking of Betrayal, it is a rather misleading card in itself: 'Force an enemy minion to deal it's damage to the minions next to it.'
What it actually does is deal it's damage and it's effect if it has one, which isn't easy to glean from just reading the card text, it also is not boosted by spell damage enhancements*, so casting Betrayal on a Water Elemental with Bloodmage Thalnos on the board will still only deal 3 damage to the minions either side of it, but also freeze them.
*The reasoning behind this is that the damage is dealt by the minion and not the spell, but it's easy to miss this due to the unique nature of the card.
IMO that's clear enough from the text of the card already. Betrayal explicitly says that the minion deals the damage.
to be honest for a new player that might not be so clear. when u encounter that card and see it in action u dont think about at all after couple times, but when u would first use it on water ele/cobra and see that effect of minions attack will proc too u might be surprised and even possibly (probably not) would use that card differently if u knew this would happen. im not sayin wording is wrong but its not crystal clear ... but then again its HS and u can squeeze only so much "meaningfull" text on a card :)
In this very example the Water Elemental even says "Freeze any character character damagedby this minion." While Betrayal says "Force an enemy minion to deal its damage to the minions next to it". I dont think it could be any clearer without being much more confusing to new players.
Why can you freeze a fire elemental? Shouldnt it just be put out and die?
Totally agree with original post. The less ambiguities, the better. I've seen many players attempt to silence a faceless manipulator clone, Druid of the Claw in taunt form, etc. Sylvanis deathrattle effect order has gotten me a few times.
yeah... why can Fire Elemental's be killed by Fireballs? They should be immune, like Pikachu is resistant to electrical attacks. JK...
I played Hunter before it was cool.
Agreed. One day they might make a card that cares about other cards transforming, and then this will become important. Likewise, Druid of the Claw would then also need the word transform to be explicit. For example, I'm imagining a card like Undertaker that gets +1/+1 whenever a minion transforms.
actually there is a difference DOTC has transform in the text AOW does not...
This is statement is false.
Check the text again. Druid of the Claw doesn't say transform. (It should, because that's clearly what's happening, but it doesn't.)
interesting, when u play Betray on water ele, u force him to attack minions next to him and they get frozen ... or am i misstaken? it is a long time since it happened to me but i think it was like this. same with cobra.
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Do you have a link to the match? That's an issue that should probably be sent to Ben Brode, so he can see the bug in action.
Poetic.
IMO that's clear enough from the text of the card already. Betrayal explicitly says that the minion deals the damage.
to be honest for a new player that might not be so clear. when u encounter that card and see it in action u dont think about at all after couple times, but when u would first use it on water ele/cobra and see that effect of minions attack will proc too u might be surprised and even possibly (probably not) would use that card differently if u knew this would happen. im not sayin wording is wrong but its not crystal clear ... but then again its HS and u can squeeze only so much "meaningfull" text on a card :)
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In this very example the Water Elemental even says "Freeze any character character damaged by this minion." While Betrayal says "Force an enemy minion to deal its damage to the minions next to it". I dont think it could be any clearer without being much more confusing to new players.