theoddone23's In-Depth Elemental
- Last updated May 4, 2017 (Un'Goro Launch)
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Wild
- 23 Minions
- 7 Spells
- Deck Type: Ranked Deck
- Deck Archetype: Elemental Shaman
- Crafting Cost: 5820
- Dust Needed: Loading Collection
- Created: 4/17/2017 (Un'Goro Launch)
- VeePlaysHS
- Registered User
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- 8
- 37
- 38
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Battle Tag:
N/A
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Region:
EU
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Total Deck Rating
720
Intro
Hello! My name is Ivona; I go by theoddone23. I am a multiple Legend Hearthstone player. I started playing Hearthstone in September 2015, and I first hit Legend in September 2016. Since then I have been entering Legend rank consistently, finishing in the top 1000 and reaching top 100 or top 200 throughout the month. My highest reached rank so far is #97, and I did it with Mid-Range Shaman. I am also a Hearthstone streamer; I stream multiple times per week with my colleague Zeronnix. You can find our stream on this link: https://www.twitch.tv/hswithtandz if you want to learn more about us and see what decks we play. Also, I invite you to like our Facebook page: https://www.facebook.com/HSwithTandZ where you can stay in touch with us and know all about when we will stream and what decks we will play.
Also, this is our YouTube channel, where you can see all our previous broadcasts: https://www.youtube.com/channel/UCPwKrNaz6ZP_ro-8d5JezbQ
Now, about this deck! This is my theorycrafted version of Elemental Shaman that is proving to be quite good in ladder. So far I've reached rank 2 with it, and I will update this deck with detailed winrate and Legend proof when I hit legend. I am currently at 67% winrate starting from rank 5, when I began playing this deck.
This is the video of KiwiiNbacon playing this deck (thanks!):
This is the video of Danielvitor7 playing the deck (thanks!):
General playstyle is to plan your Elemental turns carefully and to always have a back-up plan in case you can't fulfill your elemental condition because of the current board state. The goal is to overwhelm your opponent early with bug taunts and valuable Elementals while making good trades on board. The reason why this version of the deck does not include Jades is because they reduce the chance for good Elemental synergy and sometimes you are not able to plan your turns well enough. Overall it is a strong deck that performs quite well on ladder so far.
Also, if you like the deck, please upvote so more people can see it!
You can also check out my other decks from the past expansion (now they are WILD decks!):
http://www.hearthpwn.com/decks/708529-theoddone23s-legend-61-wr-in-depth-reno-priest
http://www.hearthpwn.com/decks/720226-theoddone23s-legend-67-wr-in-depth-wind-fire
Also, my Hydra Pirate Warrior (NEW!): http://www.hearthpwn.com/decks/817032-theoddone23s-legend-70-wr-in-depth-hydra-pirate
My Hybrid Hunter (NEW!): http://www.hearthpwn.com/decks/827339-theoddone23s-in-depth-hybrid-hunter
This is a broadcast video from a few hours ago where you can see me playing the deck on stream:
https://www.twitch.tv/videos/136084243
General Mulligan and playstyle
I am writing mulligans for popular classes at the moment - I will add the others if they start being played a lot, but I haven't met any of them mostly.
Warlock: (Zoolock)
- Fire Fly, Maelstrom Portal, Lightning Storm, Tar Creeper
- The mulligan is pretty much the same as against any other Zoo in the past expansions. If you have enough early game, you may keep one of the AOE removals (but noth both; pick one depending on your curve. It is very important to try to play Elemental (any 1 or 2-cost) into Tar Creeper, into Tol'Vir; rather than overloading with Lightning storm for board clear. Let the Zoo trade and then finish him off with removals spells and Thanlos. Zoo can't deal with the late game Elementals, and Kalimos (3 damage to opponent's minions) is another board clear that the Zoo can't really come back from. Your minions are much larger and represent awkward trades, so try to make it as weird as possible. Use Hex for Doomguard or adapted/buffed minions. Hot Spring Guardian is also really good for healing up your minions!!
Priest: (Elemental, Quest, One-Shot, Dragon, Control...)
- Fire Fly, Fire Plume Harbinger, Hex, Tar Creeper
- Priest (of any kind) can be an awkward matchup because of their ability to remove things efficiently, and this deck mostly revolves around strong board presence. Try to plan the Elemental turns well and get value out of Servant of Kalimos with the Elemental discovers. It is a must to play those cards for value (damage, discovers etc). Hex the buffed targets (especially if it's a one-shot) or value cards like Lyra or a deathrattle that you don't want to come back with N'Zoth or the Bishop.b It can be a difficult matchup but you will win if you manage to plan the Elementals correctly and maybe even bloodlust!
Rogue: (Quest, Garden)
- Fire Fly, Maelstrom Portal, Glacial Shard, Tar Creeper, Hex, Fire Plume Harbinger
- If you are facing a quest Rogue, try to deny him the chance to do the quest as much as possible, With early Fire Plume, you are able to get a cheap hand, early Tar Creeper and the other big Elementals in order to RUSH as much as possible! Glacial Shard is really good for freezing their face on turn 2 when they dagger up, if you have some smaller minions on the board (also denies them to set up Fan of Knives). It is always a good idea to HEX the Igneous Elemental if you think that the 1/2 Elementals that come from deathrattle are the ones they are bouncing; also try to Hex the other bouncing minions that he doesn't put back into hand (if you deny them that time). Also, Rogue often discovers Shaman Overload cards so they often overload and give you a free turn. Take advantage of that! Tar Creeper, Tol'vir and other taunts are really valuable mid-game because Rogue has a hard time dealing with them. Also, before they play the quest, make sure you clear any of the remaining minions on board no matter what, so you deny them those 5/5's. When you feel like you're losing board control, freeze their minions with Glacial Shard, kill some 5/5's with Blazecaller and try to finish them off with Bloodlust or strong minions they need to deal with. They don't run Sap or taunts so it's good to have a large board and make life awkward for them! Against Miracle Rogue, it's the same - but the relief is that they don't run the quest. Hex/Blazecaller the Gadgetzan, Hex the sleepy plant and you'll be fine :)
Warrior: (Pirate / Quest)
- Against PIRATES: Fire Fly, Maelstrom Portal, Glacial Shard, Tar Creeper, Hot Spring Guardian, Lightning Storm
- As you know, the main goal is to fight off early game and survive long enough (turn 7-8) where you overwhelm them with Stone Sentinel, Heal / Boardclear from Kalimos etc. Use Glacial Shard wisely when you can't clear something ASAP or when the opponent has a large weapon and you're quite low on health. Maelstrom and Lightning storm are super important because you need to be able to fend off early pirates. Hex Naga Corsair, Frothing Berserker or even Bloodsail Cultist if you have to (you can't kill those with the Storm without spell damage). They usually can't deal with Tol'Vir and Tar Creeper (the dream is to play Tol'vir after Tar Creeper on turn 3)! Don't hesitate to use your Hot Spring Guardian as a self-heal or healing the taunts that are awkward for him. Blazecallers kills any minion a pirate warrior has. If you are struggling, maybe tech one of the new Glutinous Oooze's :)
- Against QUEST: Fire Fly, Fire Plume Harbinger, Hex, Tar Creeper, Tol'vir Stoneshaper
- Versus Quest Warrior, you will have a LOT of time to set everything up. One of your main win conditions is Bloodlust but don't be afraid to use it to clear a lot of awkward taunts if it will give you an edge! Also, Hexing scary taunts is recommended. Be aware of Brawl since you have a lot of valuable stuff. Once he plays the quest, you don't play around Brawl anymore and go as wide as possible because of the Rag Hero power. Don't be afraid to send Blazecallers, Kalimos etc. to face after he Quests because he doesn't armor up anymore. Also, it's okay to use your Hot Spring Guardian to heal your minions to prevent Sleep with the Fishes, and Execute. Try to save one Hex for Deathwing if you suspect he plays it (he's played Curator and pulled cards while already having played Primodial Drakes etc). Your Mana Tide totem is really valuable - try to get as many cards out of it as you can!
Mage: (Quest)
- Fire Fly, Fire Plume Harbinger, Hex, Tar Creeper, Tol'vir Stoneshaper
- Try to pressure Quest Mage enough to not do the quest fast enough. Your main win condition is to pop Ice Block as soon as possible. ALWAYS leave an empty space on the board if he freezes you and you need to proc ice block, so you can play Blazecaller, Kalimos, Fire Elemental etc! (Try to keep those minions for that!!). Save Hex for Doomsayer after he freezes you if you can't trade it otherwise. Apart from that it's mostly up to him (whether he manages to control your board or not). Watch out for Counterspell and test it with less important spells - also, make sure you track how many spells he has that he got from other sources so you can calculate the future quest progress!
Shaman: (Elemental)
- Fire Fly, Fire Plume Harbinger, Hex, Tar Creeper
- In mirror, it's mostly about whether or not you hop on the Elemental train properly and what your opponent does. If he gets his Elementals and you don't open properly, there's not much you can do, like in every mirror. But you have Bloodlust and lots of discover so that gives you quite an edge! Also, Thalnos is really important for the spell damage for AOE spells.
Hunter: (Mid Range)
- Fire Fly, Maelstrom Portal, Glacial Shard, Tar Creeper, Hot Spring Guardian, Lightning Storm
- It is really important to stop early aggression and to prevent adapting the beasts on turn 2. Basically, you play like versus any other aggro deck and get value out of Tar Creeper, Tol'Vir and Hot Spring Guardian. Try NOT TO play minions/totems if you don't really need to before the 1st Unleash the Hounds, since you're giving him extra value. Hexing Savannah Highmane or buffed/adapted minions is a must. They don't really deal with Stone Sentinel either. Get either heal or clear out of Kalimos (or filling the board when you have bloodlust in hand and no minions!). Also, Glacial Shard is really valuable in early game since you are able to take over the board easily!
Druid: (Aggro)
- Fire Fly, Maelstrom Portal, Glacial Shard, Tar Creeper, Hot Spring Guardian, Lightning Storm
- Versus Aggro Druid, you basically need to deny them early board advantage. Tar Creeper into Tol'vir can do wonders - even though you may have lightning storm or some other AOE in hand, make sure you weaken his minions enough so they are clearable (if they are adapted to high stats). If you can clear them with lightning storm, though, do it - it will prevent them from pulling off Savage roar, Mark of the Lotus or something similar. Basically, don't let them have the board advantage and try to exhaust them. When they are out of cards (something that aggro Druid tends to do), you can go with Servant of Kalimos etc. and start the Elemental train. It's not a bad idea to Hex an awkward adapted/buffed minion. Also, make sure you count the Savage roar damage well. And be aware of the 5-cost minion he can get early in the game and play later! (Consider saving Hex!)
Paladin: (Control, Elemental)
- Fire Fly, Fire Plume Harbinger, Hex, Tar Creeper, Tol'vir Stoneshaper, Maelstrom Portal
- This can be a rather challenging matchup, where you need to keep a few things in mind.
- First of all, if you're playing vs Elemental Paladin, be aware of the existing synergies with Elementals (pretty much the same ones that you have). The way you fight thins is playing around the effect of a high cost Elemental (for example, don't give him good targets on turn 7 for the Blazecaller to hit for 5 damage). Try to stop them from developing an elemental if possible, by having an intimidating board that doesn't allow that luxury.
- If you are playing vs Control Paladin, you need to be a lot more careful. Basically you play your game until turn 7 or 8, where you need to make important decisions that will affect the rest of the game. First of all, you need to be aware of the Sunkeeper Tarim at all times. Try to clear his board whenever you can (especially the tokens) because the tokens, combined with Tarim, can kill your strongest minion. Totem up often if you have nothing to do and keep his board clear so you deny him some sick Tarim value. Regarding the Hex, it's okay to spend it on usual targets like Tirion and Rag, the Lightlord; but don't hesitate to spend it on a minion that has Spikeridged Steed on it. You will save a lot of your own stats on board. They, too, can often run Elementals so be aware of the synergies. The most devastating combo is Equality + Primodial Drake on turn 10: make sure you don't go all in on turn 10 if you suspect he's going to boardclear soon, since this is one of the more effective combos (even better than Pyro + Equality because you also get an amazing taunt). They all run Equality and Consecrate so don't go all in, make value trades and make it overall awkward for him to clear; and it should win you the game. Bloodlust is also a big asset if you have the board!
A few explanations... Card specifics!
- Kalimos, Primal Lord - the strongest card you could possibly have in the deck (or discover). This card doesn't really have a replacement. Its power is in its flexibility (previously described in the mulligan section). It is important to recognize what gives you the best value. Avoid playing it without battlecry at all costs. Requires planning ahead!
- Stone Sentinel - a great anti-aggro card. 4/4 is a strong body, especially awkward for Priest, plus it gives you Feral Spirit without battlecry :) Make sure you have enough room on the board when you summon it!
- Blazecaller - Amazing tempo swing and damage source. It is a highly pressuring card that requires answer even though it's not a taunt. The amount of damage it creates is just overpowering.
- Bloodlust - one of your main weapons against slower decks, also decks that don't have the luxury to clear your totems and small minions with spot removals (especially rogue and mage). Also it is quite unexpected damage and people don't want to play around it.
- Tol'vir Stoneshaper - one of the best cards against aggressive decks. Takes multiple minions to clear; avoid playing it without battlecry! Also, make sure you play an elemental on turn 3!
- Fire Plume Harbinger - an absolute must. A mini-Thaurissan for Shaman :) It's even good if you play it on turn 2 and have a few elementals in hand - I actually prefer playing it early because you need to take the board efficiently (later, you're able to play 1 Elemental per turn and that's it no matter what). It's quite nice to reduce the cost of 1-drops to 0, so you can play them without thinking about mana cost before an Elemental-requiring turn if you wanted to play something different the turn before. Definitely one of the best cards in the deck!
- WHY NO AL'AKIR? He's an elemental! The reason is simple - even though he is really strong, it's quite an overkill. You can always discover it from Servant of Kalimos, and Al'Akir isn't good in all the matchups. Sometimes you need something.. well, not better, but more situational. That's why you need to rely on your discovers a lot more.
That's it from me - for now at least! Please upvote if you like the deck, and also make sure you visit our stream and say hi :) https://www.twitch.tv/hswithtandz
Hey :) that's great news, climbing so efficiently! Maybe it's just a bad day for it, I really hope you continue climbing :D if you have any questions feel free to ask! :)
Calling bullshit on this deck.
It is up for at least 5 days now (25thof April), crafted it for fun, since i got the legendary elemental from a pack. I think that hearthpwn is constantly refreshing the time something is posted. I can understand that the guide gets updated daily (maybe) but same comments also?
Deck was maybe good few days ago, but now in this current meta it just does not work. Too many weaknesses for a mid range deck. Jack of all trades master of none would be a proper name for this deck (and all its variations).
Bloodlust never comes when you need it, out of at least 50 games played bloodlust won me the game once. Climbing rank with this is near impossible. Proper bullshit deck. Don't waste time on it. Priest/Warrior are better at what this is trying to do.
Useless bullshit deck, regret crafting it.
Hey. :) Thank you for your comment (even though it might not be what I think is proper behavior on any forum, but let's get over that :D).
Everyone has their own opinion and I highly respect that. I am, however, not annoyed by your comment, or even worried about the deck, since I am constantly receiving wonderful feedback - and the comments come every few hours, have been for the past few days including today as well. People are happy with it and I'm happy with it. If you played the deck so much and wanted it to work, I would suggest next time being polite and asking questions about it if you're interested enough to comment (and reading comments full of questions has been a pure joy to me so far :) ), rather than "calling bullshit".
You have the right to feel disappointed about any dust you spend and it doesn't work for you. But I just wanted to assure you that it sure does work. I am still at stable 60-62% winrate with it, people are reaching their desired ranks, and the ones who don't are full of questions that I am eager to answer.
So I won't be rude at all because that's not the way I am, I think at least :) and I will wish you a good day hoping your winrate improves, whichever deck you choose to rank with. :)
Sorry for lack of proper behaviour, especially if you are comfortable only with polite speech. It was not my intention to invade your safe space or cause you any discomfort, I was just disappointed in the deck. Good for you that you are the way you are and not resorting to rudeness.
Frustration comes from total lack of countrer play, options or anything that can be done against mages At least 1/3 of my games are against mages (quest ones) and that is almost impossible to win. And maybe you will say that I'm bad but even a blind chicken would still eventually hit a grain to eat. But this deck? No way.
I understand that you are emotionally invested in this deck, judging by your response. And the fact that you responded to my disappointment in the deck with that passive agressive response, you must understand this is not criticism of you or disappointment in you.
Because of the "positive" feel good resposes here there are no examples how to make this deck more viable in some matchups.No one is looking for a 100% but at least a fighting chance against some decks that are a problem for this one.
I enjoyed playing this deck, fun it is. But the frustration from the lack of options in some cases (NOT YOUR FAULT) because of game design, can lead someone to leave a comment warning other people that maybe some other more meta deck would be more worth spending their resources on.
Again, I'm DEEPLY sorry if you find even this comment rude or not polite. I do not wish to hurt your safe space, hope you enjoy a life of positivity and have a good day.
Hey :) I can't help but notice a note of sarcasm flowing through your post, but maybe it's just my bad judgement. :D
I didn't think your disappointment was pointed at me. My response was made so you could realize all you need to do is ask questions in order to improve your gameplay (which is something I've been doing for the past few days - even though I've been getting a lot of positive feedback, I got a lot of questions and I answered every single one of them with advice, tech choices and how to make a matchup better. You're welcome to read all of them to see that they're there :D since you wrote "there are no examples how to make this deck more viable in some matchups")-
But of course when someone asks something I don't point them to previous comments even if there was a similar question before because we are all different people :) Yes, a matchup against Freeze, Quest, Control or any kind of Mage can be extremely difficult. It is a matchup where you don't go for your usual win conditions of swarming the board. The main goal is to proc as early as possible - when your opponent is not yet ready. It is even recommended to use Bloodlust while he has ice block and you have a board to reduce him even to a few HP - since you will rarely have the opportunity to attack with your board because of the freezing effects. Also, you must never fill your board if you can proc next turn with Fire Elemental or Blazecaller - because he might freeze your board and you won't have enough room. You save Hex for Doomsayer, Antonidas, Alex and Medivh are kill ASAP targets. About Kalimos: 99% of the time you get Heal after Alextrasza - do not use if for tempo because it is your personal Reno Jackson and the only way you win after Alex. Only RARELY you will use it for 6 damage to hero, if you are already winning of course. And always leave room for Kalimos, make sure you have a small elemental trigger on every turn before you expect Alex since it is crucial for it to proc. And since you mentioned quest mage - I am not sure what rank you are stuck in but it is not a deck that appears too often in high ranks because of its pure randomness. I feel bad to say this but against this type of Mage you shouldn't really have a problem because of their slow game of doing that quest. In that case, you just need to speed up a little bit (and respect what I just told you about the freeze mage matchup).
As you could see, there is a lot you need to know about the matchup in order to win. It is winnable, but in order for that to happen you can't do random things hoping for a win - you can't be a blind chicken :) If you don't do some of these things I just wrote, you will lose. 99%. So if you were doing all these things correctly every single game against Mage, I would say you are extremely unlucky if you didn't happen to win at least once because your play style is very clear.
Also, I am sorry if you think that my online performance is passive aggressive in any sort of way. Of course I will not be super nice to someone who goes "aggressive", but I will stay polite, of course. :) And regardless of what your point was with your last post (I won't get into that at all because that's none of my business frankly) - what is my business and what is my JOB is to reply to questions regarding the deck, which is what I did, without ever trying to psychologically analyse someone through a post.
So that would be all from me, if you have any other deck-related questions you're welcome to ask :)
what card is a good alternative for bloodmage thalnos?
Loot Hoarder (if you are lacking draw) or Kobold (for additional spell damage), depending on what you feel you need the most :))
Hey! :)
I'm sorry to hear that you're kinda stuck with the deck :/ yes, Kalimos can make a big difference, and I think you find that out first time you discover it from Servant of Kalimos :D
I haven't seen any dissenchanting guides, and honestly I haven't thought about it, but if you only play Standard I would suggest going over Wild cards first. I wouldn't say Ozruk is always going to be useless (and I would be really sad if you DE'd him and after that you need him, and I'm the one who told you to do it, so you think back and say to yourself" I hate that silly girl who made me DE my cards" :D). But for now it is way too slow because in late game you only play 1, sometimes 2 elementals per turn and it still falls into spot removal - Hex, Polymorph etc. just as easily as it would if it has less health. If you don't want to play it, then maybe it's a good idea since it's kind of a bad legendary. But I would only craft Kalimos if I were you, if you actually want to play Shaman :D I was lucky enough to open it from a pack and I'm a really passionate Shaman player so I was pretty grateful for my RNG :D
I hope you open him or get enough dust to craft! :))
Thanks ;) will try :D
Hey!
I was just about to update the guide with the info: Devolve against quest rogue that actually WORKS has been a bug for several people now (confirmed on forums and such). But Devolve into 5/5's that remain like that is actually not a bug - unfortunately it is what is meant to happen according to Blizzard. It happened to me once that they turned back into 1/1's and when I tested it today, they remained 5/5's. I also know a few people who were in the same situation so maybe it was a hotfix or something :(
I'm really glad you like the deck though, I try very hard with my guides and I'm glad it's helping people :) also you're very welcome on stream too! :D
So after about a hundred games, I've got >50% winrate against all but Rogue and Priest... which are very common currently (for me anyhow). I've added a Devolve for Quest Rogue and it helps against Murloc Paladin and others so it's worthwhile imo.
Even still, I'm unsure what changes I can make to increase my odds against Rogue/Priest... I've tried adding a Bloodlust, using weapons, even a Knife Juggler - nothing seems to be enough. Just tough matchups I guess. When priest gets Medivh, the Guardian + Free From Amber, it's just game over, same with Rogue and that darn quest... *shrug*
Hey :) thank you for the feedback! Devolve is a very common (and good) replacement when you're facing the classes you do!
Every deck has its bad matchups; this deck is mostly made to beat aggro decks and can suffer from control decks like Priest, since it is after all a Midrange deck :) Bloodlust can sometimes finish the game early. But I wouldn't suggest teching for a bad matchup because you will lower your winrate on the good matchups and it's not certain that you improved the bad one, at least not with less than 100 games tested with that tech :D
I hope I helped!:D
Thanks for the reply. Currently at Rank 3 with the changes I've made to suit my playstyle.
-1 Fire Plume Harbinger, Lightning Storm, Glacial Shard, Tol'vir Stoneshaper
+1 Mana Tide Totem, Hammer of Twilight, Thing from Below, Fire Plume Phoenix
Reasons for changes and why they work for me: With three AOE cards plus spell damage, having a second Lightning Storm seemed kind of unnecessary (plus the overload hurts the curve). The Harbinger is great but I found it situational, and having two in the deck left me more often than not holding onto it forever and it being dead in the hand. The other two is similar, they are great, but one seems enough. But for the additions, the extra chance of picking up the totem and hence more cards really helps in the longer games, and it also allows for Thing From Below to be played easier, making it more viable than having two tol'virs that require a combo. The Hammer of Twilight is surprisingly great since it can deal with some otherwise annoying minions when you can't just blast them with the flame elementals, and the extra 4/2 dude helps out. The Fire Plume Phoenix is nice to gain back tempo after a bad start, and it's Elemental tag makes it a nice turn 4 into a Servant of Kalimos, which the Tol'vir can't do.
Aaaaaanyway, this decks been not only great on ladder but also just plain fun as well. When you get going and you've got answers for everything it just feels good. Glad I figured out a happy medium with the changes, I definitely learnt a few important things this season, one being there's no deck that doesn't have a weakness somewhere, and that small changes and not major ones were what I needed to make when tweaking your deck to suit my playstyle. Thanks dude!
Hey :) thank you for all the explanations! I really appreciate it and it sounds really good; I'm actually really eager to test it myself! I'm so happy to get these nice comments, especially from people working on the archetype even further. I wish you the best of luck on ladder with it :D
Update: Just hit legend with the changes. First time I've done so, so I'm pretty stoked. Proof: http://tinypic.com/r/6ia2gz/9
For people having issues, try switching out some cards for variants that suit your needs/the decks you're facing a lot. This deck works, and really well. Spend some time with it, I found I played significantly better after 100+ games because I knew the deck inside out, and also what decks I was facing (the mulligans are crucial), and could respond accordingly. Good luck out there!
Congrats!!! I am really glad you made it! :) And what you said is something people really have to learn how to do - just play a lot of games and you will improve. :D
what do you think about adding a jade claws somewhere
It can work if you're missing early board control :) maybe try swapping one of the Tol'vir or Glacial Shards :)
i highly suggest stormforged axe>jade claws for non-jade decks though
That's a great idea! I actually haven't thought of that :D