Highlander cards are overtuned because they have a substantial deckbuilding restriction. Singleton decks are far less consistent. Problems arise when…
1) any deck can play a Highlander card due to excessive stalling or lots of card draw. This allows people to ignore the deckbuilding restriction while gaining access to a powerful card. It also reduces your opponents ability to anticipate a Highlander effect.
2) the counterplay to Highlander decks (shuffling stuff into their deck) is strong enough (or doesn’t have its own counterplay) to turn off Highlander cards with minimal effort. Old examples would be Bomb Warrior or Rogues ambush cards. Both of these can be “fixed” by the Highlander player by drawing cards, delaying the game plan while allowing the opponent to get further ahead. Steam cleaner is a decent tech card in situations like this. DK plagues are a much more egregious offender, as their perpetuality mean that there aren’t anyways on standard to reenable Highlander.
The change chooses to remove counterplay that was oppressive and prevented, rather than discouraged/slowed down, Highlander decks gameplans. While at the same time telling things like Wheellock that, if you want a powerful boardclear in Reno, you need to pay the same cost everyone else does.
not the most elegant solution, but I’m glad that I can play Highlander Paladin again without feeling like I autolose against every DK.
Edit: But yes, I feel that the most recent round of Highlander cards (with the exception of Reno Hero) really needed a boost given the presence of DK plagues, and this seems like an effective solution
I think Kodrantes did a good job outlining the problem.
What I'd like to ask people who feel the change should not have been made is this: How many ACTUAL highlander decks did you see that used Reno, vs how many decks did you see that used Reno without being a Highlander deck?
Cause I think most of the reason why people started to hate playing against Reno is due to the OTHER decks running him, not the intended ones. (cause there were very few of them good enough to make a dent in the Meta.)
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They could have made that change for Reno, and it would have been fine b/c Reno is a neutral.. The problem is, they made the change for all highlander cards...which includes Brann.
They did preemptively nerf the usual win conditions of Highlander Warrior, but i do fear this will need to be checked back and balanced often, as other overtuned decks will inevitably pop up.
What they did was trade one headache, that was decks who draw everhthing then drop highlander cards, for a more manageable one.
I don't think it makes the game less interactive, the only deck that actually turned off highlander cards was plauge dk, and i wouldnt call it fun or super interactive to have a deck that just basically auto wins against highlander decks, thats just a polarized/bad meta. If there was actually player 1-2 of tech cards like the snake oil seller, i could see you point, but for now i see tihs as a positive change.
Secondly this help make it so reno decks actually are highlander, and not just a deck with a lot of draws, though i am an enjoyer of the trump classic reno deck with a few duplicates, idealy with a tutor (2 umpires grasp+ 2 window shopper+ 1 off weapon tutor guy in reno dh is a recent example)
I think it is fine - Nothing feelsworse than to face a plague dk and know that you lost the game before it even startet. I don't like to play a deck that gets countered the moment you see who you are facing. I did manage to win by other means in my meme highlander priest deck - copying or even stealing Helya was a nice way to win against plague dk - especially when your deck has no draw and your opponent have drawn their deck before you are even close to get to the bottom of yours. Thanks for the plagues.
The only highlander deck that counts is Highlander Warrior and it needs to be nerfed for sure (it was actually buffed with recent change). Other than that, no need to worry about.
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"New: Battlecry effect if your deck had no duplicates at the start of the game."
Of course, you'd be happy if you are a Reno deck enjoyer but I think it makes the game less interactive.
The question is.. Was this change necessary? In other words, did no-duplicates effects really need this protection?
Developers' inability to balance is one thing; players choosing to abuse it is another.
Highlander cards are overtuned because they have a substantial deckbuilding restriction. Singleton decks are far less consistent. Problems arise when…
1) any deck can play a Highlander card due to excessive stalling or lots of card draw. This allows people to ignore the deckbuilding restriction while gaining access to a powerful card. It also reduces your opponents ability to anticipate a Highlander effect.
2) the counterplay to Highlander decks (shuffling stuff into their deck) is strong enough (or doesn’t have its own counterplay) to turn off Highlander cards with minimal effort. Old examples would be Bomb Warrior or Rogues ambush cards. Both of these can be “fixed” by the Highlander player by drawing cards, delaying the game plan while allowing the opponent to get further ahead. Steam cleaner is a decent tech card in situations like this. DK plagues are a much more egregious offender, as their perpetuality mean that there aren’t anyways on standard to reenable Highlander.
The change chooses to remove counterplay that was oppressive and prevented, rather than discouraged/slowed down, Highlander decks gameplans. While at the same time telling things like Wheellock that, if you want a powerful boardclear in Reno, you need to pay the same cost everyone else does.
not the most elegant solution, but I’m glad that I can play Highlander Paladin again without feeling like I autolose against every DK.
Edit: But yes, I feel that the most recent round of Highlander cards (with the exception of Reno Hero) really needed a boost given the presence of DK plagues, and this seems like an effective solution
I think Kodrantes did a good job outlining the problem.
What I'd like to ask people who feel the change should not have been made is this: How many ACTUAL highlander decks did you see that used Reno, vs how many decks did you see that used Reno without being a Highlander deck?
Cause I think most of the reason why people started to hate playing against Reno is due to the OTHER decks running him, not the intended ones. (cause there were very few of them good enough to make a dent in the Meta.)
If you see a bad post on the forum use the report function under it, so I or someone else of the moderation team can take care of it!
They could have made that change for Reno, and it would have been fine b/c Reno is a neutral.. The problem is, they made the change for all highlander cards...which includes Brann.
They did preemptively nerf the usual win conditions of Highlander Warrior, but i do fear this will need to be checked back and balanced often, as other overtuned decks will inevitably pop up.
What they did was trade one headache, that was decks who draw everhthing then drop highlander cards, for a more manageable one.
I don't think it makes the game less interactive, the only deck that actually turned off highlander cards was plauge dk, and i wouldnt call it fun or super interactive to have a deck that just basically auto wins against highlander decks, thats just a polarized/bad meta. If there was actually player 1-2 of tech cards like the snake oil seller, i could see you point, but for now i see tihs as a positive change.
Secondly this help make it so reno decks actually are highlander, and not just a deck with a lot of draws, though i am an enjoyer of the trump classic reno deck with a few duplicates, idealy with a tutor (2 umpires grasp+ 2 window shopper+ 1 off weapon tutor guy in reno dh is a recent example)
I think it is fine - Nothing feelsworse than to face a plague dk and know that you lost the game before it even startet. I don't like to play a deck that gets countered the moment you see who you are facing. I did manage to win by other means in my meme highlander priest deck - copying or even stealing Helya was a nice way to win against plague dk - especially when your deck has no draw and your opponent have drawn their deck before you are even close to get to the bottom of yours. Thanks for the plagues.
The only highlander deck that counts is Highlander Warrior and it needs to be nerfed for sure (it was actually buffed with recent change). Other than that, no need to worry about.