Dean Ayala on Shudderwock: Revisiting the Topic Early Next Week
Dean Ayala tweeted this evening that the team is going to be looking into Shudderwock feedback early next week.
How do you feel about Shudderwock? I can definitely agree with the animations being a bit on the long side and would definitely at least appreciate a less excruciating death.
Quote from Dean AyalaWe’ll be reading more feedback over the weekend and will revisit the Shudderwock topic early next week. Checking out both animation timings and feedback on the deck playstyle itself. Let us know what you think and enjoy Witchwood!
I played this deck for quite a bit. From my experience cubelocks are a huge problem, almost impossible to beat. Also, the combo takes ridiculously long to set up, often one of the combo pieces are in the last 3 cards of the deck. And shaman isn't the best class in terms of board control and draws.
Lol are you kidding me, any type of warlock that is at least a bit slower than zoo is totally annihilated by Shudderwock. I love this matchup! The worst one is face Baku hunter though.
it get's destroyed by cubelock. and control warlock is the greediest control deck with way less counters than shudderwock. much easier to get to guldan and just win than to get to shudderwock and just win. decks need to exist that hard counter the greediest control decks. shudderwock is much slower and has much less stall than control killers like quest mage and quest rogue, it's much easier to beat than both those unless you're using overly greedy decks that need kept in check anyways.
Shudderwock OTK deck should have never existed. Here i read some posts like: "it is a necessary evil to keep controle and cubelock at bay" or "look at his win rate - it is so low" or "it is like all other combo decks, exodia mage for example" or "just race face". People who say it are weather blind braindead users of this deck or just inexperienced low rank players.
First of all u need to understand that this deck is OKT but in no way combo, or u can say it is 1 card OTK combo deck. All combo decks have to keep their combo pieces in hand before the actual one (or two) turn kill. It is a huge disadvantage compared to other archetypes. Mage has to keep 6 cards in hand ( 4 cards to get 4 Sorcerer's Apprentice, Archmage Antonidas, Time Warp), so u are left with only 4 free places for reactive cards in hand to keep u alive, exodia paladin had to keep 4 cards in hand, OTK worgen and OTK maly druid with aviana had to keep practicaly the whole hand of combo peices. And what does shudderwock shaman have to keep in hand - ONLY Shudderwock, all the other cards for combo u play just when u draw them and have enough mana.
And even more than that: look at those "combo pieces": premium stated 4 drops Saronite Chain Gang (with taunt to help u survive) and Lifedrinker (which helps u survive too), premium stated 6 drop Grumble, Worldshaker which can also sometimes give u more 1 mana Saronite Chain Gang. U not only DONT HAVE A DOWNSIDE playing this combo, u even gain value and dont lose tempo.
But even this is not the main issue with this deck. The main ussue with it is - U DONT HAVE A WAY TO COUNTER IT AT ALL. "Race face" is not an option as not all the decks can do it. All the previous OTK decks were vulnerable to "face race" but there where always some other ways to counter them: armor gain, mill, Dirty Rat, Ice Block. Now in standard we are left with only armor gain option but it doesnt work against shudderwock shaman.
Many people complane that if not for this deck then there wont be any counter to cubelock, but they dont realize that cubelock is not a broken deck - it is sure owerpowered for standard and it has just too much resources but it still has many ways to be countered even thogh it is hard (not just face race). The problem with cube lock is that this deck lost the least after the new year rotation. The deck itself is preaty fair but for the end of the year - not for the begining. Shudderwock shaman is just broken. It is on a level of razakus before the nerf or naga-giants from wild.
Now is only the first week of the expantion and this deck is not fully refined and as it is a new deck - not everyone can pilot it good enough but with some time for tuning and gaining experience, community will find the best way to play it and that is when this deck will have insane winrate. Thre are enough tools now in constracted to make this deck strong enough against aggro and as it has surehit combo against slower decks it can preaty much make its way to tier S deck (the broken bullshit tier).
I think the main problem is Shudderwock itself. Sure blizz can change Saronite Chain Gang or Grumble, Worldshaker, but it will still leave possibility to create some potential broken combos with Shadderwock in next expantions. The card itself limits desing space for devs as they need to always think about this card when printing new battlecry effects.
The best solution for this card i think is to change its mana to 8 and wording to "Repeat all other battlecries from cards you played the previous turn". This way u will have to think more and plan your turns. This card will still see a lot of play as u can repeat some valueble battlecries and combo him with Murmuring Elemental. Its role would change from some bullshit broken infinite value OTK to gaining more resourses (like n'zoth but more flexible - u can not only fill your board but draw cards / clear bord / heal / deal dmg to opponent's face).
Fantastic post, mate - summed up a lot of my thoughts.
"Repeat all other battlecries from cards you played the previous turn". Brilliant. Best suggestion so far.
Maybe nerf it if it ever becomes oppressive ?
I think Shudderwock is being abused and is too high power level for the health of the game. Basically, it should never be able to create copies of itself or bounce itself. The chaos it can make is great but it is not fun to play against a deck focused on the otk. Rather, what is a bunch of fun is the control shaman kolento created where Hagatha was the centerpiece of the deck and Shudderwock only served as a late game powerhouse. I like Shudderwock, I don't like the Shudderwock otk. We need more Hagatha focused shaman and less cheese shaman.
Keeping in theme with the lore, might I suggest...
One, two! One, two! And through and through
The vorpal blade went snicker-snack!
He left it dead, and with its head
He went galumphing back.
make MORE battlecry minions that don't target a pacific target
Ah yes, make them target atlantic minions instead
I sea what you did there.
teyzen you read my mind
Those minions had it coming...they know what they did....swimming around all nimbly bimbly....
I honestly don’t see the backlash.. it’s not that powerful of a deck, and if you don’t like the animation, just co concede.. you’ve already lost anyway
Shudderwock doesn't make the game feel like you're actually playing a game for your own fun, it rather feels like watching a commercial showcasing a mediocre set of cards I don't get excited about, which was funny to watch like 1-2 times and then got super-annoying and it keeps coming back in like every freaking commercial block. I despise commercials and I only reluctantly tolerate them to see the content I came for.
This card could break the game, not in a power-level kind of way, but in a "Aw forget it, this game has too much annoying advertising of crap I don't need in my life to keep worth playing." kind of way. A bad way to start the first weekend of a new expansion of a game I love playing from GvG on.
Fixing 15 min animation would be nice :) I dont have nothing against Shudderwock, fun card brought joy in this game.
secret mage is so boring, please nerf Fiery War Axe !!
hahaahha can't believe your stupid arguments. Your IQ should be under 60
It's easy to counter it with aggro, but for pleople who like to play control, there is nothing to do ...