Hearthpwn

mine is an open letter but it want to be an occasion to discuss between us

First of all this is not a complain or anything, i just want to share my feeling. I always played mtg and i love warcraft therefore hearthstone was perfect for me and i still like it a lot. 

I've seen a lot of vids/threads about nerf/new expansion and i had the time to understand what was my bad feeling about hearthstone. Especially this thread on here and this kripp's video. Hearthstone is a game that lost any cloak of mystery (this is not necessarily a bad thing) i.e. at the beginning you could actually encounter during competitions unseen decks/ synergies , there weren't any stats out there so the discussion was heat up and opinions had a weight opposed to now since you can't argue against pure math.

So let's come to my point: What is hearthstone? hearthstone is the game you can play at the city inn in wow and It's strictly related to the warcraft lore -captain obvious i know- hence the feeling that makes me twince: why would healing for example be incompatible with druid class identity? why armor (i mean... one could argue the bear form... but it's not pvp and even if one can agree on armor being legit why it has to be the ONLY heal mechanic)? Why paladin can't spell damage? why war has to be protection only (maybe they are making an effort on this with akali/new weapons...let's see)? Also classes have no sense at all anymore. This is what dazes me. In WoW the same argument about balance we make for decks (aggro > combo combo > control control > aggro) applies for classes and hearthstone always was like that as well. Classes lost sense and they might as well change the name and the characters and get rid of warcraft totally or do something like heroes of the storm.

I have the feeling that in order to remain competitive Hearthstone is distancing itself from the ties that following warcraft lore implies. This lead to the second point. Also what are those new cards? we are getting lvl 15 npc as key legendaries. one that haven't played blizz games at all might not feel the same way, i come from wacraft II then III then TFT then WoW (then real life interrupted the cycle lol) but i really feel sick when i open packs and you get a legendary and you read the name and be like *wat*. 

So what are your thoughts? hearthstone is going to get rid of identities in order to keep the game as balanced and competitive as possible? 

Awesome! I share more or less the same story and i came up doing a dragon armor rush warrior as well but it wasn't as good as your list. Can't wait to try it out today. Thank you man!

 i have cut one Doomguard for Zilliax you lose insane dk lethal but feelsgood 

Awesome list! used to play reinan23 hooktusk list before cold blod nerf so i was already kind of familiar with the cards. First game (rank 14) i managed to cast keleseth x4 on turn 5 lol i currently miss Edwin VanCleef , x1 Vilespine Slayer , x1 Southsea Captain , which i have replaced with Questing Adventurer Assassination and Myra Rotspring . Also i cut one Elven Minstrel for one Lifedrinker . What do you suggest as replacements?

coming back here bc i tried your precise to climb and damn it's awesome. So many finishers. Really good vs odd mage which i would have never said and generally you feel like every match-up is winnable. Do you think you will update the list since you said it in the edit?

Spellstone at 6 might seem a good nerf (and it is) while hunter's mark had to follow up execute (thus is still playable) but let's nail it down: 

decks that got impacted the most are: 

-odd rogue

- even paladin

- even shaman

I agree that 4-mana board clear (equality+pyromancer) is unfair as much as a kind of fungalmancer for 2 mana and i don't even want to argue about baku and glenn being the root of the problem, i just want to discuss with you about the consequences of this nerf.  What really will happen imo is that warriors will rise again (thankfully) but more important hunter got actually indirectly buffed nerfing decks that counter it on the same playground (face/tempo). 

What do you think about my analysis?

interesting list! Could you please add upgrades section? i would happily play this deck in those last days of the month

The rank where is most played is between 14 and 10 with an astonishing percentage of 1,77%. dragon warrior doesn't even make up 1% in any rank.

I dont know how good are bronze gatekeepers and skaterbot but i would problably cut bronze keepers for agents and a necrium vial for the second Southsea Captain (you definely need it), other than that looks a fun deck to me. =)

oh you also need more combo cards to take the best value from Cursed Castaway, SI:7 Agent and Vilespine Slayer are problably the best ones.

Alright, i'll problably play it like that pep1: 

### Mechs!
# Class: Rogue
# Format: Standard
# Year of the Raven
#
# 2x (0) Backstab
# 2x (0) Shadowstep
# 2x (1) Fire Fly
# 2x (1) Mecharoo
# 1x (2) Prince Keleseth
# 2x (3) Hench-Clan Thug
# 2x (3) Nightmare Amalgam
# 2x (3) SI:7 Agent
# 2x (3) Southsea Captain
# 1x (4) Spellbreaker
# 2x (4) Ticket Scalper
# 2x (5) Fungalmancer
# 1x (5) Leeroy Jenkins
# 2x (5) Vilespine Slayer
# 1x (5) Wargear
# 1x (5) Zilliax
# 2x (6) Cursed Castaway
# 1x (8) Captain Hooktusk
#
AAECAYO6AgavBPIFnOICoIADzIED1owDDLQB7QKoBd0IgcIC68IC0eECpu8C3+8C9v0Cqv8C3oIDAA==
#
# To use this deck, copy it to your clipboard and create a new deck in Hearthstone

Basically i put the mech package and the pirate package together with core Tempo Rogue cards, sounds fun to me :)

Yeah Zola could work.  I think Spirit at 4 mana is a little expensive to want many copies in your hand but zola could work with any valuable battlecry minion.  Try it and let us know how it is working and what list you used if it's successful.  I see about 52% WR on HSreplay for my list right now, hopefully going up soon or with better changes.  

So if I want to climb the ladder I should play Tier 1 decks and not janky homebrews... Thanks for dropping that knowledge bomb.

You sure must have it hard for getting 1-2 cards nerfed that constantly saw play in EVERY SINGLE deck or ARCHETYPE of the mentioned classes. When they'll give me back my Ice Lance and Ice Block OR find a better replacement in classic than the RNG spell generator no one is using - we can talk then.

I don't really sympathise that much with the other HoFed classes (Conceal for Rogue and Power Overwhelming for Warlock) but they sure as hell also felt it - especially all zoo/aggro warlocks with the loss of PO.

Did the Fiery War Axe and Wild Growth + Nourish nerfs were clean? Certainly not.

Were they not overkills of the cards? Certainly not and with both of those I sympathise.

But

If the cards are both UNIVERSALLY STRONG IN EVERY SITUATION, go into EVERY DECK and SEVERLY cripple other archetypes/classes or their means to response then the cards either need to get changed (the latest nerfs) or HOFed (Ice block, PO).

Pity that Blizzard as always made sure to nerf/destroy a full class (Druid) + most of the tier 2/counters offending decks and leave one full class of 4 archetypes without any meanigful nerfs/adjustments (Hunter)

I'm tired of Blizzards policy to have a cycle of "this is a X class expansion". This game will never be fun or "fair" for others if Blizzards answer to balance and having 9 classes is basically make 2-3 unusuable/garbage (example Druid, Shaman) 2-3 mediocre to niche/counter classes (example Mage, Warrior) and 2-3 OP/tier one warping the meta around them (example Hunter).

Why can they never think over the expansions and act ACCORDINGLY? I get it. It's hard and unpredictable. But that's what 2-3 nerf cycles should be for - to tone down the main offenders (all at once while having thought it over) and correct a second time making sure it is at least "somehow" balanced. The third cycle should be trying to bump counters and or decks that are "so so"/almost there.

Warrior struggles a little because it is impossible to outvalue your opponents most of the time (which was core to the archetype). You either get infinite value nowadays or can't compete, also there are very strong otk decks that don't rely on 30 damage, like old freeze Mage, which warrior prayed upon.

Ironically the warrior DK is the only one that gives you 0 value, and Dr boom is fun but it's a little unreliable.

Basically you either:

Face rexxar, and deathstalker rexxar grinds all your removal and overwhelms you

Face Jaina, and she out values you with infinite elementals

Face Gul Dan, and he blows up your deck

Face one of the current combo decks and lose  pretty much against any iteration because you can't apply pressure. 

Odd warrior was good last expansion because odd rogue was very prevalent in the meta, now people are experimenting with dragon warrior (which seems pretty fun but haven't tested it).

On the bright side once rotation hits warrior keeps supercolliders, and all the DKs and most combo decks die out, so you can start again playing a classic value game (unless they add some bullshit) on which warrior would thrive. 

Golden warlock here, I tend to tap last cuz I am dumb, flies away!