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    posted a message on Group therapy! Need to blow off steam? Mega salty? Here is the place! V2

    Eat a ****ing dick! This stupid game's RNG is beyond rigged. Of the last 23 times I have played Unidentified Maul, 18 of the boosts have been Taunt. Literally the only boost that doesn't win me the game on multiple occasions and I get it almost every time. 1/4 probability my a**.

    Posted in: General Discussion
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    posted a message on Card Nerf - Raza the Chained
    Quote from Broeck1 >>

    So now I face the decision of dusting my Golden Raza or not... (God I hate to see him go, loved playing it). He was the first Gadgetzan legendary and I pulled him in my third pack. Still 3200 dust vs an unplayable card, will be hard not to dust it.

     Dust it. No questions asked. You get a full refund. Hold onto the 3200 dust for a while and if Raza turns out to still be playable, just recraft it.
    Posted in: Card Discussion
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    posted a message on Progression of class strengths
    Quote from MvonTzeskagrad >>

    Keep in mind these are my opinions and counting standard when such mode exists (aka since WotOG):

    Vanilla: Rogue (leeroy miracle) > Hunter (midrange and face) > Warlock (zoo) > Warrior (control) > Shaman (midrange) and Druid (ramp and combo) > mage (freeze) > paladin and priest (?)

    Naxx: Hunter (huntertaker) and Warlock (zoo) >>>>>> Warrior (control) and rogue ( leeroy miracle) > Druid (ramp, token and combo), mage (freeze)  and shaman (midrange) > paladin and priest (?)

    GvG: Mage (mech) and Druid (combo) > Warlock (handlock), paladin (midrange) and warrior (control) > Hunter (face) > rogue (oil) > shaman (mech face) and priest (?)

    BRM: Warrior (combo patron) > druid (combo) and mage (tempo) > Warlock (handlock) and hunter (face) > rogue (malygos miracle and oil) > shaman (?), priest (?) and paladin (?).

    TGT: Paladin (secrets) and Druid (combo) > hunter (midrange) and mage (tempo) > warlock (handock), warrior (fatigue) and shaman (totem) > rogue (miracle and oil) > priest (?)

    LoE: Druid (combo) > paladin (secrets and anyfin), warlock (reno) and shaman (face) > rogue (miracle), warrior (fatigue and midrange patron) and priest (control) > mage (tempo) > hunter (midrange). However, all but hunter were quite powerful, at similar levels.

    WotOG: Druid (Yogg) and warrior (face and C'thun) > hunter (midrange) > Warlock (reno), shaman (face) and mage (tempo) > rogue and priest (?)

    Karazhan: Shaman (midrange) >>>>>> mage (tempo) > druid (Yogg) > warrior (fatigue) and hunter (midrange) > warlock (reno) > priest, rogue and paladin (?)

    Gadgetzan: Druid (jade), warlock (reno), rogue (piracle) and warrior (pirate) > priest (dragon) >>>> mage (reno an secrets) and shaman (jade) > paladin (goons) >  hunter (?)

    Un'Goro: Rogue (quest), shaman (evolve) and paladin (murloc and midrange) > druid (jade and aggro), priest (lyra and dragon), mage (quest and secrets) and warrior (quest and pirate) > hunter (midrange) > warlock (?)

    Frozen Throne: Druid (jade, taunt, aggro), rogue (keleseth), priest (razakus) > warlock (keleseth) and shaman (evolve) > hunter (midrange) > paladin (murloc) > mage (control and quest) > warrior (pirate)

    KaC: Warlock (cube), rogue (Keleseth), paladin (aggro) and priest (razakus) >> mage (aggro and otk) and druid (jade) > shaman (evolve) > hunter (midrange) > warrior (?)

     This is quite inaccurate, especially with regards to the older metas.
    Naxx: The gap between Huntertaker and Zoo was significantly larger than the gap between Zoo and the worst class in the game at the time (Paladin), Huntertaker was maintaining around 60% winrates across all levels of play, be it rank 20 or legend, and considering its playrate was something like 30%, it wasn't for lack of sample size. I'd also put control warrior in the Druid/Shaman tier, as Miracle was just a n objectively stronger deck, as evidenced by the fact that Miracle saw multiple hits during this time (Leeroy+Shadowstep combo, Gadgetzan to 6), while control warrior remained relatively untouched.
    GvG: Swap Midrange Paladin/Mech Mage, swap Handlock with Oil Rogue. Midrange Paladin was strong throughout and out of control near the end of GvG thanks to Shielded Minibot/Muster for Battle/Quartermaster preventing every other class from competing with them early-mid game. Paladin was the unquestioned best class during GvG, and remained near the top for Minibot/Muster's entire existence. Mech Mage was strong from the start, but quickly fizzled out thanks to control decks like Warrior/Priest adapting their builds and hating them out of the meta. Oil Rogue took a while to refine, but by the time it was refined, it was literally the only meta archetype to boast a winning matchup against Midrange Paladin. Handlock was the deck that was stuck in the awkward position that it could either tech to dominate control decks or tech to dominate aggro decks. It could not do both.
    BRM: Swap the Warlock/Hunter and Druid/Mage categories. Warlock not only had handlock doing well, but it also had Zoo back with a vengeance thanks to the release of Imp-Gang Boss, basically single handedly turning around the midrange paladin matchup. Shaman was by far the worst class in the game, like in a worse state than it is right now in Kobolds standard. That's what led to the flurry of buffs they'd receive the next year or so.
    TGT: Patron Warrior was most definitely still a thing post Warsong Commander nerf and one of the top 3 classes. The meta was dominated by a rock, paper scissors relationship between the trio of Patron Warrior, Secret Paladin, and Combo Druid (Pally>Druid>Warrior>Pally). Priest was actually strong for the first time in Hearthstone history, stronger than Mage/Hunter in fact thanks to Dragon Priest receiving fun toys like Twilight Guardian. Shaman, despite receiving a trio of very powerful cards in Totem Golem/Tuskarr Totemic/Thunder Bluff Valiant, was still the worst class in the game thanks to it's terrible matchups against the top 3 decks of TGT.
    LOE: Warrior and Warlock were definitely top dogs thanks to access to both a slow grindy deck and a more aggressive board oriented deck (Renolock/Zoo and Control/Patron respectively). Other than that, the meta was pretty balanced and you could pretty much rank classes 3-8 in any order, Priest however was back to it's usual spot of "one of the worst classes in the game".
    WOTOG: Shamanstone Totems of Warcraft was in full effect and the top class by a mile. You're right about Warrior being the second best class, but wrong archetypes. Dragon Warrior was what was carrying the class, though all of Pirate, Control, Tempo, and C'thun were viable at any point. The worst classes were Paladin and Priest, Paladin because it lost the Minibot/Muster combo and Priest because it's Priest. Yogg Druid and Yogg Mage were similar power level and probably the best classes after Shaman/Warrior.
    One Mistake in Karazhan: Shaman was by far the best class in the game and Priest was by far the worst. Everyone else was just trying to tech to adapt to Shaman's tech choices.
    Gadgetzan: Shaman was one of the top tier classes, especially early on. That's why they were hit with the nerfbat.
    Posted in: General Discussion
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    posted a message on What would you think about an exile mechanic in HS in 2018?

    If physical card games like Magic the Gathering and Yugioh can implement this mechanic, a digital game like Hearthstone would most definitely be able to sustain it. Just create a new keyword "banish" and have the banished cards be coded as if they were never in the deck to begin with. No Deathrattles. No revival. No "if you've played x card this game" effects. Just go poof. It might take some thought into how to balance the effect relative to mana cost (I'm thinking a 6 mana banish, and a 9 mana AoE banish, add restrictions like "banish a minion with 3 or less attack" or something), but that should be resolved with proper testing. *cough* Blizzard *cough*

    Posted in: General Discussion
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    posted a message on Battlecry : Gain Charge

    This would have been a nice and elegant nerf to Patches. Stonetusk Boar wasn't the problem. 0 mana Stonetusk Board that doesn't cost you a card was. This also helps deal with the issue of random otks coming out of spells or deathrattles.

    Posted in: Card Discussion
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    posted a message on Must-Have Shaman cards?
    Quote from Beezwax >>

    Here's a copy of my deck, since that seems to influence things. I'm relatively new, so I might have lots of strange choices when it comes to cards.  I'm going for an Overload+Giants deck.

    Hurricane
    Export to BBCode Export to Cockatrice Export to MarkDown Export to Html Clone this deck
    Minion (20) Ability (10)
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    I assume this is for standards? If you're going to go for Snowfury Giant. You want 2 of them and a lot more overload cards. Consistency is key. I personally don't like the card at all, but if you're interested in making it work, then you want to surround it with cards to make it successful.
    Cards I'd advise dropping: Leeroy Jenkins, Bittertide Hydra, and Flamewreathed Faceless are Aggro cards and if you're going for Snowfury Giant, you're going to want to tech your deck towards a more control-ish playstyle. Lightwarden and Acolyte of Pain just doesn't fit Shaman playstyle and should be reserved for classes like Priest. Dust Devil is one of the worst cards in the game. Spellbreaker shouldn't be used in the class with access to a vastly superior option in Hex. Rockbiter Weapon is just not the same post-nerf and the two Windfury cards are hella inconsistent as finishers. Crushing Hand is just too much of an early tempo loss and can potentially lock you out of AoE spells.
    Some cards to consider: if you want to keep your Elementals package, another copy of Hot Spring Guardian/Fire Elemental/Fire Fly for consistency, Kalimos Primal Lord and Blazecaller both do work as late game cards. There is absolutely no reason to ever run anything less than 2 Maelstrom Portals in a Shaman deck and it's our best spell by a light year. I'd also advise 2 Lightning Bolts. Hex is a better option than Spellbreaker for dealing with problematic effects and is far more flexible/powerful. Lightning Storm I believe to be an inferior option to Volcano for this kind of deck, as it allows you to clear the opponent's board much more effectively. Healing Rain is the best healing card ever printed and should be run at 2 for a control deck. If you're finding difficulty dealing with the opponent's early game, Jade Claws is one of the best anti-aggro tools out there, and adding in a package of 2x Claws, 2x Jade Lightning, and 1x Aya Blackpaw gives you a very powerful core. Shaman right now has issues with power, so a copy or two of Unstable Evolution for those "I'm being unfair and have decided I want to win right now" games might be worth it.
    Posted in: Shaman
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    posted a message on Must-Have Shaman cards?

    The following are my opinions and not necessarily accurate, but it should give you a good idea of which cards to prioritize. The only ones I don't believe are up for debate are the 4 cards I've listed as S Tier. They're on a completely different level than the rest of our cards. The controversial one, Ancestor's Call I believe is A tier, since it is one of the few cards we have that is virtually not possible to powercreep and should only get better with time.

    S Tier: Auto-include cards that warp the meta and provide Shaman with the majority of its power, these are the cards that define the class

    Tunnel Trogg, Totem Golem, Maelstrom Portal, Jade Claws

    A Tier: Staple cards that every Shaman deck should either include or consider, or have comparable power to S Tier cards but don't belong in all decks

    Evolve, Lightning Bolt, Whirling Zap-o-Matic, Unstable Evolution, Devolve, Crackle, Mana Tide Totem, Lightning Storm, Healing Rain, Jade Lightning, Ancestor's Call, Thunder Bluff Valiant, Thing from Below

    B Tier: Good cards that Shaman decks can make great use of depending on the archetype, but don't have the flexibility nor power that S Tier cards have

    Primalfin Totem, Reincarnate, Lava Shock, Ancestral Spirit, Ancestral Knowledge, Hot Spring Guardian, Powermace, Lava Burst, Feral Spirit, Healing Wave, Elemental Destruction, Flamewreathed Faceless, Jinyu Waterspeaker, White Eyes, Hallazeal the Ascended, Volcano, Hammer of Twilight, Doomhammer, Thrall Deathseer

    C Tier: Tech cards that serve niche roles

    Air Elemental, Earth Shock, Finders Keepers, Unite the Murlocs, Primal Fusion, Murmuring Elemental, Spirit Claws, Vitality Totem, Eternal Sentinel, Brrrloc, Ice Fishing, Crushing Hand, Unbound Elemental, Tuskarr Totemic, Spirit Echo, Far Sight, Wicked Witchdoctor, Slitfin Spiritwalker, Master of Evolution, Fireguard Destroyer, Call in the Finishers, Windshear Stormcaller, Voodoo Hexer, Earth Elemental, Grumble Worldshaker, Neptulon, Jade Chieftain, Lesser Sapphire Spellstone, Everyfin is Awesome, Kalimos Primal Lord, Al'Akir the Windlord

    D TIer: Pretend these don't exist

    Dust Devil, Forked Lightning, Kobold Hermit, Fire Plume Harbringer, Stormcrack, Cryostasis, Stormforged Axe, Drakkari Defender, Primal Talismans, Ice Breaker, Rumbling Elemental, Lotus Illusionist, Dunemaul Shaman, Dranei Totemcarver, Tidal Surge, Avalanche, Charged Hammer, Moorabi, the Mistcaller, Stone Sentinel, The Runespear, Snowfury Giant

    Posted in: Shaman
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    posted a message on Why Does King Togwaggle Exist?
    Quote from Gorillatron >>

    I never do this like never ever,but first of all proving a point making someone fun for his english is sad,especially when I have hit legend several time in the past and guess what completed the dungeon run with all 9 classes in some hours so to try with your way of talking I will answer

    hahaha cry more from losing from an al you noob

    Your ability to argue a point is directly equivalent to your language skills, in which you're clearly lacking. Also I have hit legend multiple times and beaten the dungeon run with all 9 classes as well too, as have many other players. Not exactly something unique to you, unless you want to reveal yourself as a top end Hearthstone pro or something it doesn't put you on a pedestal.
    Posted in: Dungeon Run
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    posted a message on Why Does King Togwaggle Exist?
    Quote from AngryShuckie >>

    It doesn't really matter does it? There is no reward for winning dungeon runs nor a penalty for losing. With that in mind, he is there for the flavour of 'what would it be like if I had all these treasures?'

    Plus, the design isn't as lazy as you say. Yes the variance is extremely high, but they only included a subset of the treasures to prevent him from directly disrupting your gameplan: he cannot discard or take cards from your hand. Nor does he ever shuffle your two decks together, get a 2-mana mind control, get Wish or get Rod of Roasting. 

     Just because there's no reward/penalty doesn't make the inclusion of something in a game to be okay. For example "you don't have to beat Emerald Weapon, therefore it's okay for the boss to randomly delete a member of your party permanently at the start of the fight". That would instantly turn Emerald Weapon from "one of the most iconic superbosses in one of the most beloved games in history" to "this boss is why we all hate FF7".
    Posted in: Dungeon Run
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    posted a message on Why Does King Togwaggle Exist?
    Quote from TanookiJack >>

    All the final bosses are designed to fight toe-to-toe with the ridiculously overpowered decks you draft as you rank up. The special abilities, cards, and minions you gather need to combine into something more powerful than the final boss to win. Togwaggle is a challenge in this regard.

    You use RNG to defeat everything in this game. What you draw, what cards you have, what you put in your collections, what you discover, and even more. Card games are about winning the strategy first and the execution second. There is no real tactical skill in playing cards as long as the order is correct and your strategy leads you to the best possible play with the cards available on your turn. To this end, there is nothing about Toggwaggle that needs to be changed or addressed. He is in many ways the same as the deck the player will draft.

    The only conclusion is that you're OK with RNG high rolls as long as they're yours more often than your opponent's.

     Did I say you don't need RNG to defeat the other bosses? In fact I specifically stated that you draft to increase your chances of winning, not for a surefire win. There is plenty of tactical skill involved in defeating the Darkness, Vustraz, Azari etc, and the same goes for some of the other high end bosses. Not drafting enough large minions and getting slaughtered by Hamm, or drafting too many spells and getting annihilated by Gutmook are issues with the player's strategy. Knowing how many hits you can take from Darkness tokens and how to navigate the board clears is a skill. Knowing what cards to keep vs Azari and how to pace yourself into lategame is a skill. There is no strategy whatsoever into building a deck vs King Togwaggle, and there is most definitely no skill/tactics involved.
    Darkness/Vustraz/Azari etc have plenty of RNG high rolls. And they happen quite a bit more frequently than that of the player. Yet I'm okay with that happening because there are ways to improve these lopsided odds into something manageable in your favour. That is not possible with King Togwaggle.
    The only conclusion is that you are using a strawman and framing your post with an argument I never made.
    Posted in: Dungeon Run
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    posted a message on Legendary Tier List & Crafting Guide
    Quote from teachu2die >>

    ok, question time. do i craft:

    aviana + kun for malydruid (have ixlid, malygos, malfurion, etc)

    orrrr

    dk guldan + malganis + voidlords

    i've been avoiding crafting the warlock cards...but might need to now....

     

    Two of the warlock cards will be useable in both standard and wild if you plan to play both formats and wont be rotating anytime soon. If you play standard it would definitely be the better long-term investment. DK Gul'dan sees play in every warlock archetype in every format, including freaking Zoo and will absolutely give you full value for your dust. Kun is a strong card, but not essential in many druid archetypes and really needs some combo pieces to bookend it for maximum value. If you play wild and refuse to touch standard, however, I believe the Aviana Kun combo will remain potent for a while and would be a worthwhile investment. The Warlock package, however, is equally powerful in wild and is seeing some of its worst matchups take a hit via the Raza/Patches nerfs. Cubelock being top dog in both standard and while is a very real possibility.
    TLDR: if you play standard+wild: warlock for sure, if you play only wild: either works but warlock is slightly better
    Posted in: Card Discussion
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    posted a message on Why Does King Togwaggle Exist?
    Quote from Gorillatron >>

    wow,take a brake and think why are you getting so angry for a boss at Hearthstone's dungeon

    Because King Togwaggle represents everything that should not exist as a boss of any game (RNG fest, no skill dependence, no strategy dependence). I don't mind losing to other difficult bosses if I made mistakes with drafting, got unlucky with mulligans, misplayed, used an incorrect approach etc. King Togwaggle is the one boss I do have a problem with losing to simply because it should never have gotten through testing (Do you see anything like this for a WoW Raid boss for instance? Do you see anything like this in any strategy related game?). Someone who has difficulty spelling the word "break" or using proper punctuation has a similar chance of beating King Togwaggle as a ThijsNL or Pavel. That's a problem.
    Posted in: Dungeon Run
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    posted a message on First time legend after switching formats :))
    Quote from Saber_L >>

    did not have my tracker on so i'm not really sure but i think it was 17-20 games from 25 to rank 5 and then about 30-35 games

     This is literally not possible.
    Posted in: General Discussion
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    posted a message on Why Does King Togwaggle Exist?

    Yes this is a salt post. But seriously there is not a single boss I despise more than this awfully designed piece of crap. Was the person who designed this on drugs or something? A masochist? Or simply just too lazy to design an actual intelligent boss that requires strategy. I don't mind the final bosses being a terror to navigate around and require you to draft with them in mind from the very start like the Darkness. When you lose to those kinds of bosses, it feels bad, but you can always point to a play or a pick where you can go "if I had done that differently, it might've turned out better". With King Togwaggle, you can literally play perfectly and get bullshitted by him RNGing the perfect treasure response. There is absolutely no way you can play around him, and there is absolutely no way you can draft to improve your deck's winrate against him. This is the only boss that can beat you even if you drafted a godlike deck and got the dream opening hand, simply because it has a built-in Yogg-Saron like ability to get out of any situation. There are plenty of oppressive bosses in the Dungeon Run, Candlebeard, Sturmi, Blackseed, and the other 4 final bosses can all annihilate you if you're unprepared. But still, you can prepare for them, and when they do rear their ugly heads, you at least know what win conditions you have against them and what strategy you'll need to employ to beat them. You literally cannot do that for King Toggwaggle. The worst part about it is that unlike some of the other oppressive bosses, he's not even fun or interesting. Getting owned by Boots of Haste, Portable Ice Wall, Wand of Disintegration etc just feels awful and doesn't even do anything "cool".

    This boss should just be deleted. Dungeon runs are plenty hard with the other 4 potential opponents, and at least those are skill dependent matchups.

    Posted in: Dungeon Run
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    posted a message on ok we will have nerfs... SO WHAT?

    Having a most dominant deck doesn't necessarily mean that a meta is cancerous, nor does having a bunch of good decks make for a healthy meta. It's okay to have one deck being the best if there's multiple decks in the meta that can counter it and a huge variety of strategies and archetypes available. The Un'Goro meta, which many people consider the most balanced meta in Hearthstone, had Pirate Warrior as the clear king. You can make Pirate Warrior=cancer jokes all you want, you could easily tech your decks to beat pirate warrior, and all of control, midrange, aggro, and combo were viable, often with multiple strategies open for a single class. Heck even Warrior had a nice control deck going via Taunt Warrior to combat Pirate Warrior. There were very few nerfs necessary because the top classes didn't stifle a plethora of playstyles. Then you have a meta like TgT where the triad of Patron Warrior, Secret Paladin, and Midrange Druid reigned supreme. However, these decks were so oppressive that you either played one of these classes or a class to counter one of them (and get crushed by the others), and led to a very stale meta. As such, all 3 were hit with multiple nerfs to keep them in line and eventually led to the creation of standard to get rid of the problematic cards.

    Posted in: Card Discussion
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