Hearthpwn

Right now, it's mostly the critical mass of powerful cards Shaman has received in recent expansions. In reality, Shaman's Basic/Classic cards are somewhat mediocre (as a whole - there are individually powerful cards, but many of them are quite weak), so they've received some compensation in a steady stream of powerful cards from expansions in order to keep it relevant. Currently, we've reached the tipping point. Shaman has so many insane cards at its disposal, that it has the capacity to build multiple decks and they'll have a good chance at being viable thanks to the raw power of its expansion cards.

Quote from Infirc >>

Try this list and tell me what you think, it was an easy winstreak for me, destroys Jade druid, blows a hole in Dragon priest's chest and has even match-ups against Mid-range shammans, plus can hold its ground against slower decks like control Warrior thanks to golem cards being annoyingly sticky. and it can also get tempo against pirate Warrior, the only bad match-ups are against hunters which are heavily unfavored, and tempo mage which are slightly unfavored.

 

i cutted all the slow things that do nothing by themselves like Shadowcaster or Brann and play it as a tempo deck.

edit: sorry for not posting it on hearthpwn, it was just way easier to screenshot it xD.

I agree. All the disappointment (and laughs, to be honest) from Shadow Rager, this card seems insanely good for Rogue players. It should revitalize Pirate Rogue lists, but honestly I can see this being tried in most lists.

I like that this card was printed. It definitely needs some more support than what's available currently, but seeing three Stealth minions in Rogue is a good sign that they're probably going to print more Stealth in the class going forward. The Houndmaster comparison is apt, though, we'll need an abundance of solid Stealth minions that are good enough on their own in order to really see the power of this card. I'm almost certain it will see play during its time in Standard, however.

Quote from Oshigawa >>

Quote from OzUnOo >>

Quote from Dxiled >>

I'm a Rogue secondary, but I'd like to join because I see Rogue's position.

Counterfeit Coin Innervate
Gadgetzan Ferryman Youthful Brewmaster
Jade Shuriken Jade Lightning

Rogue will have to rely heavily on Lotus Agents.

 The Jade Shuriken/Lightning comparison is false. Shuriken is actually quite good, enough so that it can replace SI7 Agent for golem and maybe even Malygos decks. Only the burgle meme decks will play Lotus Agents. I agree with the rest though.

No, it's a great comparison. Shaman has 4 damage summon a golem for 4 mana, rogue has 2 damage for 2 mana but you have TO COMBO IT. Why do i have to combo it for god's sake?! Just to say we have a combo card? I understand for it to be 1 mana two damage, combo summon a golem, but exactly the same thing except you have to use another card before is bollocks.

I think part of it stems from the devs wanting to explore different archetypes for Rogue, and while Kabal looks to have been a good fit for them, it likely would have resulted in more of the same style of play. I like that they're trying to give Rogues something besides Miracle shells to play, but it still feels like they're too afraid to push the envelope with the class - resulting in them being underwhelming.

Meh, we won't really know the result until all the cards are available to play with. it's pretty pointless to complain before you even see any of these cards in action.

I don't think we'll see any sort of Warrior nerfs. Warrior is incredibly versatile as a class, yes, but I don't really think any of its class cards really screams "overpowered." It's a great example of what they should strive to have the other classes be one day, but at the same time it seems to also be a case against Standard's perma-Classic set. I feel like if the dominance of Warrior continues well beyond this next release, the devs may strongly consider re-examining the Classic set - or possibly even looking into making a new "Core set" that never rotates and achieves better balance between the classes.

I'm happy with its place right now. It has a clear purpose in the format and does that job well, and as others have made mention it keeps the aggro - combo/midrange - control balance intact. Honestly, any issue with Rogue currently is more focused around the class growing stale. Non-Auctioneer shells are quite weak right now, so I feel like Rogue players are being shoehorned into said strategies. Then again, I love the style of Miracle, but I would like to see other decks get tools in order to increase the class diversity.

I'd just like to see cards that can help strengthen new/struggling archetypes. I play Rogue mostly, and while I do enjoy the Miracle shells I'd really like to see cards printed to make non-Gadgetzan shells better. It still boils down to the top wants on every Rogue's wishlist - strong weapons, some sort of heal/damage evasion, and a decent sweeper. If the next set brings at least one of those, I would be happy.

Quote from shibuyaya >>

what is the standard List for miracle rogue These days? i played miracle in the early days.... Until it got nerfed.

I think it will likely become a mainstay of this current format. The rotation of Loatheb and most of the sticky Deathrattle minions means that Rogue has an easier time cleaning up minions and little to stop the Gadgetzan engine. The lack of Silence has also helped push Van Cleef towards the top tier of threats in the meta. As of right now, Shaman - Freeze Mage and Patron, too, but neither has the sheer numbers as Shaman on ladder - is largely keeping Miracle from dominating, but Miracle still poses a very real threat in the face of that. My guess would be that we see some new tech cards in the next set that help interact with it, so things could change afterward. 

Quote from OsC >>

Quote from Nittany14 >>

It is actually one of the more favorable matchups. Zoo(lock) is what wins the most against N'Zoth Rogue.

I would look into The Black Knight if you're having trouble with those beefy taunts.

 I've actually done well against zoo.

 

My deathrattle rogue seems to do well against non c'thun decks but struggles against the many big high value c'thun minions

 

I only run 1 sap and 1 shadow strike though. IN GENERAL for legend level, is 1 or 2 saps needed?

I'm honestly not missing the board clearing capabilities too terribly much; FoK and Skulker have done a serviceable job, and Rogue has pretty much got single-target removal covered at this moment. Like what others have said, a better neutral heal option would be nice, but other classes were hurt by that, too. In any case, N'Zoth Rogue has been really solid for me since the set released, as it's proving to be a fantastic midrange deck with a lot of helpful tools at its disposal. Like other midrange decks, you unfortunately have to pick your battles - build yourself to beat aggro or control, not both - and as it stands now you're better off building to be a control-killer until the next set comes (and hopefully another strong tool for combating aggro decks).

Quote from Thyndd >>

Quote from TheMajinV >>

 It's because the vast majority of players in the community are total crybabies. They are trying to redefine the class, and I think most of these card do a good job of that. Losing BF sucks, but we will adapt and grow; this sort of thing takes time, but I'm confident that Rogue will evolve accordingly.

 Do you have any favorite class? Do you like to play control warrior, or maybe priest? Or maybe face hunter?

Imagine one day they don't allow you to play control warrior anymore, because dunno why they felt like pushing for a face warrior archetype instead. Not that the previous archetype was OP, they just wanted to kill it for no reason and now you can't play it anymore either in wild or standard. Wouldn't you babyrage too?