Hearthpwn

Pain Warlock can fairly consistently get a very strong board by turn 4-6 and can be too much for them to deal with. Make good decisions with the order you play things in and you can roll over paladin and druid. If you draw badly or mess up with what you play and when or they get really good early draw then they can take full control but it's such a fast, aggressive, value generating deck that they don't build up enough steam. 

I've played paladin less than druid so still need to see how it goes as part of a larger sample but it's gotten to the point where if I come up against druid then I'm pretty comfortable that they will lose. The ramp just kills them because it's too slow. 

Cheers for the input, OP. Really constructive points and feedback, I'll make sure the team get right on it. 

This thread seems to be a massive mess of assumptions and misinformation. Instead of just read the headline and then joining the crowd in complaining, try actually reading and digesting all the information. 

This isn't a leaked pass, it was a survey gauging consumer opinion/experience. There are likely a lot of different ones, some will include concepts that never go any further, others will chnage dramatically based on consumer feedback.

Literally tons of companies do this sort of thing. Stop freaking out about your gold, at least until anything official is communicated. They will more than likely take a concept, like a battle pass type idea and then gauge opinion on many different versions of that concept ranging from more consumer friendly options to more profit focused models. They will gather all sorts of information like reception to it, if people would be willing to pay based on that model etc etc. 

They absolutely need something more rewarding than the current system and they are far better engaging with their player base as part of that process than they are simply making one and dumping it. 

The pain warlock deck is pretty crazy and seems to really reward intelligent combo plays. Only played 7 so far but won 5 and won all by turn 6/7 which is fast enough for druid to be unable to do anything truly crazy. They seem to become torn between trying to remove what you have on board or ramping. When they ramp though it just let's you carry on building a bonkers board and they lack AoE to effectively deal with it. 

Tour guide on 1 followed by coin into Darkglare on 2, tap, Voidwalker, Flame Imp, Expired Merchant activating Hand of Gul'dan has only happened once so far but there seem to be a fair few interactions that combo out in a similar way. Tour Guide on 1 is amazing, especially if it dies by turn 3 and you can get Vulture on 4 with Raise Dead then Tour Guide, tap. Turn 3 if you have coin and bang, you have 4+ minions.

It will struggle vs decks that include a good few taunts or clears. Of the 2 games I lost, one was the first game with the deck vs a priest. Got them to 1 health and they just managed to stabilise with a taunt and I'd drawn my whole deck. Second loss was to a warrior who had coin. Bladestorm, a brawl and bad draw meant I couldn't put enough pressure on before a turn 7 commencement. 

All in all though, very fun and rewarding. Lots of decisions to make and a splash of RNG with the vulture. The soul fragments feel fantastic at times as well. You can cram a really good amount in if you get Jailer on 1 and he comes back a couple of times with Raise Dead. Then with all the draw you get you can go from 10 health back to 20+ pretty quickly. Flesh giants get discounted quickly and provide a great distraction for people to target and leave your vulture and/or Darkglare up. 

 Seen fireheart come out a couple of times and both times it found answers to what I had out, seems really strong and fun to boot. It's the only card I'm missing from this list, so I might give it a craft. Nice looking deck, OP. 

Quote from Gorda >>

I got to legend with my own control soulfragment warlock, played mostly against druids and paladins and my deck is strong against them.

 Aby chance you can post a list? I've been messing about with arou d 6 or 7 decks and a control style warlock is one I've just not been able to get working at all. I'm not really into quest and I prefer control over a zoo style. 

Quote from Hooghout >>

Analogies that describe the situation as it is are never unwise.

 Yet after 7 years you're still actively playing the game and on a dedicated forum? Says more about you than anything else to be honest.... 

I've seen quite a lot of decks, cards and various classes be reffered to as 'OP', broken and/or needing nerfs but this suggests to me that it seems fairly competitive at the moment. There are a couple of front runners, from what I've played against druid and paladin can be insane but several classes have answers to their swing turns.

Seems to me that you need to be a bit more resourceful than you did before. Anticipating those swing turns and saving removal or morph effects is really important, which should reward good anticipation and decision making. 

I've seen druid, paladin, mage, shaman and warrior all do crazy things. Devolving missiles is fantastic for mage and shaman, plague of murlocs is also very good. There are really large swings but lots of various tools across the classes to deal with them, so teching and making the right play at the right time are key. 

Quote from Tyk3 >>

I'm guessing you're a rogue main? Because I'm sure druid mains with OP win more cards like lightning bloom also think that card is the best designed card in the expansion. Just because a card a helps you win more games, doesn't mean it is good for the game as a whole.

 People also often forget that just because they don't like a particular card or find it frustrating, doesn't mean it is bad for the game as a whole. 

Quote from TallStranger >>

 I've been playing the beast version of this deck over the past day (mainly because I got both Shan'do Wildclaw and Speaker Gidra in my initial packs), and I agree it's got some powerful swings. (Running 2 copies of Teacher's Pet, Lake Thresher and Twilight Runner.) That said, it's hardly unbeatable.

First off, I've played about 30 games, and never gotten the insane early draw some of you guys are talking about (Lightning Bloom x 2 and Kael'thas Sunstrider and Guardian Animals). And having the summoned beasts both be Twilight Runner and drawing into spells that let you also play Survival of the Fittest is insanely lucky. That's practically a nuts draw and you're not going to beat it.

Second, the deck (or at least my version of it) struggles against a broad board. I run Wrath x 2 and Swipe x 2, and that's it in terms of removal. Yes, if I can summon Lake Thresher from Guardian Animals, I have some effective removal. But playing Lake Thresher from hand is a disaster. I don't think I ever played him from hand and managed to attack anything: he was dead by my next turn.

Third, if I don't draw Kael'thas Sunstrider, I struggle. Just that simple.

I got utterly crushed by a pirate/ bomb warrior, a spell damage mage and several totem shaman. As in the game was basically over by turn 5.

I'm not saying a nerf isn't necessary, but I don't think 1 day of play is anywhere near enough time to judge that. And any nerf should probably be of Kael'thas Sunstrider, which has been problematic for a while now.

 Yeah it's funny, all yiu see is people complaining about wanting to experiment etc but then less than a day into a new expansion they decide they don't want to experiment at all. They want the decks they've chosen to miraculously be very good. This is the META solving stage, someone may well build something that absolutely wrecks druid which sees druid plummet in terms of play. 

If it can't be solved then it may be nerfed but seriously, at least give it a few days.....if your deck isn't amazing day 1 then tinker with it or look for decks created by better deck builders. Put a bit of time into trying to build a counter deck to whatever is smashing you in ladder. There seems to be way too many people who would only be happy if the deck they want to play is winning lots on ladder. They won't try different classes or whatever, they just want their particular deck or decks to be good, so they demand the game be changed around their wants. Problem with that is you get too many differing opinions because they tend to be so selfish that rather than want the game to be good for as many people as possible, they want it to be catered to them specifically. I don't just mean just now, it's the typical behaviour at any given time. Druid may need a nerf but give us some time to see if we can counter it. That's the point of this stage of the expansion is it not? 

Quote from GentilleMouche >>

Druid has literally 0 removal and board clears, or very unefficient ones that are not being played in current decks. I know druid seems unfair I've played a lot of it today (not the mountseller version though) and it felt OP at first but then I faced more optimized deck and truth is, a lot of decks can out tempo you long before you get your overgrowth / guardian animals turns. Once the tempo is lost there is no way for druid to recover, unless they have a god hand with kaelthas or mountseller + 2 survival of the fittest / 0 mana spells and you can't get through the big taunt.

Aggro can out tempo you, control has free win against you if you don't draw guardian animals/mountseller on curve.

Druid is fine

 Yeah they can do some crazy things and they may be a touch too crazy but certain things ruin them. Been playing Dekkster's ripper warrior and brawl and ramming speed are very useful, even bladestorm can be good when they have a couple of stupidly large bodies on because it will take out at least one of them and other times you can line it up to clear. It also cheats out a good amount of taunts which they just can't deal with. 

When I played vs druid with spell damage mage though, that's a different story haha. They generally rolled through me because mage doesn't have the early game to make up for their ramp. Though I did put devolving missiles in to try and help and that can come in handy if you've been able to draw it. 

Quote from Vladpetresq >>

Quote from Robin18 >>

Druid will get 100% get nerfed. Overgrowth breath of dreams or lighting bloom are getting nerfed.

Like the deck is very highrolly but when it highrolls there is litterly nothing the opponent can do.

Hunter: probaly will still be tier 1 like always

Rogue: Might be tier 1 or high tier 2

DH: might be tier 1 or high tier 2

Paladin: pure paladin seems strong we need to wait how strong it will be.

Warlock: Zoo seems strong it will probaly be tier 2

Mage: idk

Priest: priest is still annoying to face

 what about Warrior???

 Played a handful of games with a big, ripper style warrior and it's seemed good. You just need to get through the first 6 or so turns but once big stuff starts getting brought out it can be very difficult for them to deal with. 

Played against a priest yesterday and they just ran out of steam and removal. My rattlegore made it from a 9/9 with divine shield and taunt due to being pulled by commencement to eventually getting silenced at 7/7 and all the time rips and other removal got used. Ripper bringing out copies and not simply summoning is massive. Same with Reaver, gives the deck some great value.

Troublemaker feels great so far. If 2 get pulled with ripper it can end the game fairly quickly and I'm very surprised by rattlegore. Great card to use and has been really useful on a few occasions. Has a great intro effect as well and hearing him shout 'rattlegore' everytime he comes back is very satisfying. Just a really cool idea for a card. 

No idea if it will be competitive, I feel it may be a touch too slow but its fun to play, can snowball quickly and result in some big swings to come back from what looks like a certain loss.

Warrior, warlock and mage are my favourite classes. Had a blast with a casino style quest mage to begin with. Not tried warlock yet but I'll have a mess with it once I can drag myself away from warrior.

From what I've seen so far cards like this could be vital. A few classes have ways of cheating out some massive, scary minions. Paladin, druid and warrior can get some insane stats on the board around turn 8 and single target removal, silence or something that reduces attack and health all look to be really use. Devolving missiles has put in some great work but isn't available to all classes. There is limited silence available so cards like this coukd be key if the meta becomes about big, swing turns with huge minions. 

Quote from Gefest2141 >>

No, because of this I stopped playing this game, it's just not interesting

And yet you're not only active on the forum of a game you're not interested in but raising threads from the dead so you can have your little bit of attention seeking? How sad, are you not getting enough attention in games or on platforms that do interest you?