Hearthpwn

hakuna matata

Quote from Gucciboi23 >>

Quote from Noctune >>

Quote from sparkisUS >>

Quote from Cogito_Ergo_Sum >>

Summary (Maybe, I dunno; it's hard to decipher the grammar):

• SAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAALT
• I AM A BETTER GAME DESIGNER HIRE ME YOU NOOB 
• I KNOW WHAT I AM TALKING ABOUT BECUZ I PLAY LOTS OF GAMEZ

 

 Thanks for editing but even you were tl;dr. Props for putting in the effort though.

 better?

 oh cmon mane, i am making solid points. I know the people are goofs on the internet but i am trying to improve something i am passionate about 

Quote from sparkisUS >>

Quote from Cogito_Ergo_Sum >>

Summary (Maybe, I dunno; it's hard to decipher the grammar):

• SAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAALT
• I AM A BETTER GAME DESIGNER HIRE ME YOU NOOB 
• I KNOW WHAT I AM TALKING ABOUT BECUZ I PLAY LOTS OF GAMEZ

 

 Thanks for editing but even you were tl;dr. Props for putting in the effort though.

Hey gaiz. Quest mage and quest warrior guy here. 

I find solace in making face deck sit there for 20 minutes and then friend them so they can tell me how busy their lives are and how they dont have time for a 20 minute game. 

I told them they could have quit

Quote from MrPerfect01 >>

No deck starting hand should be possibly good enough to complete a Quest AND Summon a 18/18 by turn 4.  It is similar to other card games where some decks can win on Turn 1 before the other player even takes a turn.  Yes, in both cases it obviously does not happen the majority of the time but is pretty destructive to the enjoyment of the game for the opponent.  Decks like this just up the RNG factor.

In card games players should win through superior plays, not because they drew an insane combination of cards at the beginning

I think the quests are overall successful.

some of the quest like the lock quest and hunter quest can be played in existing decktyoes like discard zoo or facehunter (although i think you can skip it in discard zoo)

others i felt created a new meta such as the warrior quest, mage quest, and rogue quest by introducing the idea of a deck you have to built around. I felt these three quest did what every fin and reno did by making new decks possible

others such as priest and druid and pally i felt still wait to be broken. And still has potential to grow and still can be tested over the next year. The priest quest could be consider in wild as a second reno in reno priest and definitely has better deathrattle to abuse it while pally in wild could run the valkyrie sister with dragonkin sorcerer as there are enough cheap buff and heals there)  the druid is interesting in wild since not only you get ungoro support but access to good 5 power minions in sylvannas and emperor as well  

 The shaman quest could introduce a shaman  murloc deck but i think it will nees something like neptulon and anyfin to make it work (i kinda wanna try it out in wild but i m doing deathrattle shaman) 

I personally felt ungoro set as a whole did well.  We get two to three new possible "dragon priest" in mage elemental, shaman elemental and possibly priest elemental, we get some new tools to bring facehunter deck back (with better counters) we have a new rogue legendary creature that improves miracle rogue and we also got some fun tools in egg druid with living mana and devilsaur egg and we also got lyra for both purify priest and divine spirit priest  

and hemet also helped out pally decks as well now that you can potentially holy wrath for 25

we are also seeing cards that dont normally see play coming into the meta like stonetusk boar in quest rogue, fire elemental in elemental shaman of course. 

So i think overall un goro is a pretty good sucess story. 

It will automatically disenchant anything you have more than two ofs

legendary will be disenchanted if you already have one. 

It will not disenchant stuff you dont want or gold cards automatically

I felt a lot of the cards listed is because you have bad experiences with them. Like grand crusader

Currently rolling reno priest in standard with amara standing in. Have to say its pretty funny when i drop kazakus after a bit. 

i have been playtesting twin emperor in my evolve shaman deck for the past few days.....

only problem is there is no c'thun and i play two disciple and 2 four drop divine shield minion that gives cthun +2/+2

so i have played a disciple on turn 3 and the 4/2 on four which was dealt with.... and of course, no c'thun showed up to the the +1/+1 animation......

it was pretty neck for neck till turn 7 came around.  i still have an unused coin.  

so i played twin emperor and it gives me two emperor to play with.  and then i play the coin and evolve both emperor into a ragnaros firelord and a ragnaros lightlord.

i dont think he was expecting that.....

Quote from Noctune >>

now that i m not in school and have time to think about this card, this card might not be bad.  its okay at most and its not broken.

and if you think about it, this card is a 6 mana sprint basically.  It puts 2 copies of itself in your hand which can potentially draw your more card and draw one more on its own, and it keep your fatigue meter under control.....

the problem with, when compare to sprint is that sprint draws you the cards immediately so you can get those options in your hand already while with tea is one at a time.  

however, this card can provide you a constant stream of combo setup and it's actually a yogg saron 'buff' since you can continuously cast spells to power off into one yogg saron RNGesus arena.

 

 

My first advice: Take every advice with care from the forums. Most players using the forum are rank 5-rank 10 and most of their success are based on netdecks and inferiority of their opponents not by their own plays. Every advice should be taken with a big grain of salt. Most people I see around here don't really know what they are talking about. This of course does not include every person from this forum and thread. Just know that misinformation will pollute your knowledge of the game. There's nothing to be vary of, but be ready to replace the inferior advices when they seem to outlive their usefulness.

Now, my main advice is: Know that deckbuilding is a matter of strategy. Your deck needs to have a purpose and playstyle. This strategy can be simple (vomit your hand, hit face and win) or very complex (stall the game and outvalue opponents via complex tactical moves and combos). What matters is, it needs a purpose and 25-30 of cards in your deck need to serve that purpose. If your aim is to win the game as fast as possible, your main goal should be to pick cards like Flame Imp, Knife Juggler, Mana Wyrm opposed to high value cards Flamestrike. Even though flamestrike is a super good card, it costs 7 mana (too late), it doesn't put a threat upon the board for you to push enemy's life total, it answers the opponent. If you are an aggressor, you don't want to answer something but to be answered (or maybe not :D). The card does not suit your strategy. But flamestrike is such a good card that most mage decks tend to go a little slower and they include 1x Flamestrike, but not 2x ! Now, open a deck from front page to examine it in the light of this knowledge. I'll wait.

Back? Then the other thing you should know is, your strategy (also called win condition) does not have to be stable. Sometimes the same deck have different win conditions when faced with different decks. The general example is probably druid. Versus many decks, druid aims to cheat with mana to summon strong minions earlier than opponent and then to finish the game with a Savage Roar + Force of Nature. However, when you play midrange druid versus a face hunter, your win condition is to disrupt your enemy's win condition (which is to kill you directly) and beating the opponent down traditionally. This makes you maybe use a savage roar or force of nature to clear opponent's minions if the situation requires it (as opposed to saving it greedily). Also using Ancient of Lore to heal yourself as opposed to drawing cards. This win condition/strategy can also be re-considered and changed during a game. You need to find a good balance between tactical and strategical game plan to win the game. Sometimes tactical advantage becomes too good (like clearing a board with force of nature savage roar combo) that you need to play it and change your strategy during mid-game. It all comes to evaluating which play will give you a better chance to win.

Win condition/strategies are as follows: aggro (rushing down opponent), tempo (out-tempoing opponent), outvaluing (going into a battle of attrition and winning through card advantage), combo (stalling the game and killing the enemy in 1-3 turns), midrange (putting down threats until the opponent can't answer them). Your deck needs 1-3 of those strategies.

The other important thing is to know that your deck also needs to do well versus other popular decks. Remember that I said you need 25-30 cards to suit your strategy? If you include 25 cards to suit your strategy, then what are the left 5 for? Well first of all, you might want to run some cards to counter the strategy or key cards of other popular decks. An example is to add  big game hunter to your deck to assassinate the very popular dr. boom or a giant. Kezan Mystic is another example. It is great versus hunters and tempo mages, and brutal versus freeze mages. It is especially brutal against freez mage, because it uses ice block to stall the opponent when they prepare to kill enemy in a single turn. By stealing it, you not only weaken their defenses but also weaken their win condition greatly. If you face those classes a lot, use a kezan mystic. If not, don't run it.

Saboteur is a failed example of this, which was created to counter decks that are supposed to be based on hero power-inspire cards, which are non-existant in the first place. Another failed example was Exorcist, because it failed to answer what it was supposed to answer.

You also want most of your cards to be valuable by themselves. Hobgoblin can be great in ideal circumstances, but the card itself is very bad by itself. But the biggest problem is, for it to work; the rest of your deck needs to run standalone bad cards. The result is a highly synergistic but a trash-tier deck. Unless those cards bring something exceptional to the table, you want to run strong cards that offer good synergies. Equality is such a card.

Lastly but not leastly, there are some cards that are far too valuable not to run. 1x Flamestrike is an example of this. So are Piloted Shredder and Dr. Boom. You generally need to find a reason not to run these cards as they are such god tier cards. Freeze mage does run neither, but that is because freeze mage does not gain anything from them, and the deck is actually better without them.

So there are no rules in deck building, only guidelines. As for 1 or 2 offs, it's your decision. Generally you include cards that suit your purpose that you want to add not only 2, but maybe 10 of them. But there is an upper limit of 2, so you go with it. Sometimes you want to include a situational card that you only need to run 1 of in your toolkit, so you go with 1; like a Kezan Mystic or Harrison Jones or Equality or Flamestrike or Big Game Hunter. Again re-examine that deck from the front page with these in mind again.

Everyone is always talking about how hard it is to calculate the damage (Which it can be of course), but so few people seem to mention how difficult the decisions are in nuances such as how many of your combo cards you must sacrifice to survive (Whirlwind, Unstable Ghoul, etc.), and a lot of people completely ignore the importance of Armoring Up, which is a different call each turn, to the point that it is sometimes important to use the Coin to Armor Up on Turn 1 rather than saving it for the combo in some matchups, as you would otherwise not survive that long.

Yes TGT failed from a competitive standpoint, but the more I think about it, the more it appears to me that Blizzard isn't aiming for that. Using myself as an example, I've been playing for 1.5 years since right upon the release and I've been up to date with the decks and meta for most of the time. I bought packs back then, and bought a few for GvG, but I had no reason to buy any packs for TGT. I had a lot of dust and a decent amount of gold that I could just craft the few cards I wanted. Even if more than 15% of TGT was playable I would have had enough dust to get what I wanted.

That's when it hit me that I am obviously not the customer that Blizzard was aiming for with TGT. If I had to take an educated guess, I'd say a large portion of Hearthstone's revenue comes from newer players that are getting into the game. Blizzard will try everything to attract those new players and hold onto them for a while without them being overwhelmed by a mountain of cards. Since almost all of the cards in TGT are trash, the newer players don't have to worry too much about it. They can buy their Classic packs and when they feel satisfied with their deck staples they will branch out to GvG and TGT. Blizzard loves it when a new player can look at a recent tournament and see the decks being played and say "Hey, I can build that!"

So I could easily see this trend continuing. Next expansions could being extremely underwhelming from a competitive perspective and I wouldn't be surprised at all. This all is just my opinion, fwiw.

There are no OP cards, mysterious challenger is mediocre at best since you fill your deck with garbage secrets for 1 mana. Look at all the pre-TGT player analysis of the cards, pretty much every one except maybe amaz and strife cro said Challenger was bad, the other 2 said it has potential. Paladin is not over pwoered and secret paladin doesn't need a nerf. Also factoring the deck has a high skill ceiling you'd only decimate the deck as it's struggling at the moment to compete in the meta. It's slightly on the strong side but paladin is far from overpowered.

There are no OP cards .... just good players ;)

Hi guys, first of all, sorry from my bad English. Im Spanish.

All time i read a thread that says "Mysterious Challenger is OP" or "Frothing Berserker is OP" , that says that they need a nerf, it makes me sad.

IMO Mysterious Challenger is a card that makes shine the poor secrects of the paladin. If you want to set 6, 8 or 10 slots of your deck with 1 mana spells, and you want that your topdecks will be so horrible is your decision. In exchange you will have a really good combo when you play the Mysterious Challenger. The problem is not the Mysterious Challenger, but, what's up when you have not a problem when you flood the board with low cost cards because you have Divine Favor?

Thats my point. The problem with that deck is Divine Favor. I know that not all list run 1 or 2 Divine Favor. The midranges versions not run but, that versions are slow and you can pick your responses 1 or 2 turns later, and you are not dead like when you face and agro version of the deck. IMO the problem with secret paly isnt theMysterious Challenger, is the Divine Favor.

Same with Frothing Berserker, is a really good card, and well balanced, the problem is the Warsong Commander, that gives charge to it, and then makes it able to oneshot 30 hp.

After that, what do you guys think about nerf that type of "OP" cards? i think that if they change the Divine Favor, we meaby stop seeing 2/3 games a aggro secret pala flooding the board and refilling his hand.

Thanks to all! GatthePekerd

Quote from 2pac jump

Aviana is useless because druid wins on turn 9

FoN+Roar fanboy, pls.

Nice one, but in my opinion [card]Loot Hoarder[/card]  is useless with Warlock, maybe you need to replace with Abusive Sergeant

Hi, looks like an effective deck. Can I ask why you only run two secrets with two scientists? I've played different versions of hunter over the last few months and anytime I see a list with that 2- 2 ratio more often than not I'll draw at least one of the secrets before I get the second scientist. I've seen this in some lists on here and frankly it turns the scientist into a 2/2 for 2 which is a mediocre bluff at best, sometimes you can get some damage in or trade because they don't want to give you the secret. So right off the bat I'd add another trap/secret or drop a scientist, that's my personal view whether that is a *pro* choice or a hearthpwn forum scrub noob move I don't know. (I see a lot of followers / naysayers on these forums and few critical thinkers / innovators)

Playing with challenger paladin at the end of last season to push from rank 11 - 5 I ran into some hunters running at least one flare, now this begs my second question, any reason for not including a flare? My assumption is your design does not need it to beat the main versions of secret paladin.

Thanks for posting the list I'll update my aggro/face/cancer hunter slot with your list and see where it leads I like the use of the tgt cards and am curious to see how it plays out. I prefer midrange but face can be effective and faster games win lose or rage.

One last point, in regards to playing a deck archetype on ladder or otherwise. There is a trend to call any deck that is available to people that don't make massive investment into HS (money time or more often both) low skill or cancer or scrub decks etc. As a magic player for many years I just see this as entitlement. Blizzard / Wizards etc makes the rules and the cards, if it's in the game it's viable. I think in HS people like to think they are in a higher class with their collection of power cards, that realistically you end up having to craft one at a time like boom etc. even if you pay it is super lousy drop rates. For instance my $50 got me a cap'n kragg, and a gold dreadsteed, neither of which I wanted. That being said while HS is a game with a lot of depth and some skill, you have to be honest with yourselves and realize there are not a lot of player interactions and secrets at this point still don't remedy that. It's a game of you go I go and always a best one of one, no sideboard just one offs, bad draws / match ups and all. So keep that in mind when you're on your entitled high horse or you're cancer butt hurt.