You are what I like to describe as a "Semantics Whore" as it relates to this argument. You take the phrase "Pay to Win" and create an absolute rigid definition of what it means to you. Then you take your ball and go home after convincing yourself you found a flaw in the logic.
Pay to win is a FUCKING euphemism. Would you rather I say "pay-for-advantage" or "pay-to-get-ahead" or "pay-to-put-the-odds-in-your-favor"? pick anything you like.
During all those MANY MANY hours of dailies and cap grinding(by the way your are talking HUNDREDS of hours over the course of a month) all along the way, game after game, you are running into Ysera/Rag/Baine/Black Knights... and losing. Why? because they bought the fucking cards giving them a MASSIVE fucking advantage.
Dont fucking tell me to play zoo then. Dont fucking tell me to play hunter then. Dont tell me i have to play agro and its my fault I am not playing agro. Those are not ANSWERS that address the problem of one player having an advantage(a huge advantage) over another. I am not looking for a work around or some goofy low mana gimick deck that if I am lucky I can win before they get their legendaries off because if they do THEY WILL WIN BECAUSE THEY HAVE AN ADVANTAGE CARD WITH INSANE EFFECTS... that they paid for.
It blows my fucking mind that you cant quite understand that obvious fact of the matter. How can you possibly argue that is not what is happening.
Yes... Months from now after spending 100's upon 100's of hours you will likely get enough cards and legendaries to be on even ground and yes you will not have spent any money(though the old adage of time is money and hundreds upon hundreds of hours grinding away with zoo could be argued more valuable then money).
Pay-to-Win is not a euphemism at all. It's a term thrown around at F2P games where you can get a clear advantage over other players by spending money, usually very poorly designed F2P games. In other words, you can only attain certain things by spending money on the game. There is nothing in Hearthstone that someone paying for packs can get that another person can not. I put 50 bucks into the game when I first got into the closed beta and I haven't put any money into it since then. In those packs I think I got two legendaries. I have crafted/obtained through packs by playing the game; Ragnaros, Ysera, Grommash, Cenarius, Leeroy, Bloodmage Thanos, Cairne, Alexstrasza, and Captain Greenskin. All of those obtained from crafting or free packs from gold/arena.
What do you even expect from this game? I'm very much starting to doubt your knowledge of the game and your claim that you have won 1000 games. It's already been stated numerous times in this thread on simple cards that deal with legendaries, but you refuse to even acknowledge these because there's that one time where you didn't have that card in your hand. Luck of the draw works both ways too, i've sat through games on my warrior with my opponent clinging to life and all I need was a Grommash charge to finish them and I never got it, and on the flip side of that. A senjin shieldmasta that was standing in the way of Grommash finishing off the opponent because it has taunt and I can't get to his face. Or it just get's hexed, poly'd, silenced, executed, assassinated. You even brought these up in your original post. But somehow these are bad ways of neutralizing the cards? Of course there will be times when you don't have the card in your hand, but that's just the nature of a card game.
It seems like you just want the game to be played the way YOU think it should be played. Perhaps it's just that you don't understand the game as well as you think you do.
And how would you get cards? Would you really get all the cards right from the start?
Why not? you are paying $35 for the game.
Just to put things in perspective here. Grand Theft Auto 5 was a MASSIVE undertaking that was developed by several studios working for Rockstar. They spent HUNDREDS of MILLIONS of dollars and YEARS creating the game and engine. They then went and hired the best writers and the top voice work talent and recorded thousands of lines of dialogue. After that they went and spent a ton of money on a massive soundtrack full of licensed songs. Finally, they created an online portion that is still supported well after launch with free patches and updated game modes for free.
For all of that they charged $60.
I am suggesting $35 for a game that could be played on a web browser using flash circa 2005. An electronic card game made by a very small team at Blizzard. Again, in addition, having a marketplace that will make them even more money on top of it selling customization.
People making comparisons to magic the gathering are not comparing apples to apples. Magic the gathering was selling PHYSICAL CARDS. Cards that you could potentially resell or trade and had value. There is no value in a digital version of ragnaros nor the ability to trade it. The only value is to that of the purchaser who is using it for advantage against someone who doesn't have it.
Talk about not comparing apples to apples, you're comparing Grand Theft Auto V to Hearthstone, and you fail to see the problem behind that? Lets compare Final Fantasy to Madden because they are both video games you don't see how ridiculous that is? OR how about this, you compare Hearthstone to MTG online, or infinity wars, both of which are card games played on a computer, and both of them charge you money for booster packs. Hearthstone is a collectible card game. Period. There is nothing to debate. If you take away one of the main reasons for playing the game you will lose more than half of your player base guaranteed. You pay 35 bucks for Hearthstone and it gives you all the cards right up front, what is my reason for playing the game now? All I can do is grind the ladder and that's it, with your model there is no reason to run arena other than boredom with the ladder, you have nothing to work for, collecting all the cards is a big draw for a lot of players. The next part is, players who are better at hearthstone will have an advantage no matter what, the cards do not matter. It is the person playing the card. Take a brand new player and hand them a deck that has reached the Legend rank and watch them fail miserably, they don't know how it works, they don't know how to play it. Games in Hearthstone are not won by just throwing every legendary into a deck and pressing the play button, I'm pretty sure Totalbiscuit has all but proven that on his Lord of Legendary's series. Some of the best cards in the game are basics and commons, and if you don't see that then you don't understand Hearthstone or any card game for that matter
How do you know you can play Hearthstone in a web browser? Are you a developer of the game? Do you have any inside knowledge on the subject of the creation of Hearthstone? I'm going to say no.
And I will end this by saying one last thing. Why do you care so much if you are quitting the game and are done. Your title for the thread suggests that you will never pick up hearthstone ever again, and yet you defend your point so adamantly. Is this thread just to stir up crap on the internet? I'm guessing that's what it is and in that case congratulations you have succeeded.
You bring up Leeroy, two E's in that by the way, and how insane Leeroy can be. Have you ever seen what a Knife Juggler can do to Leeroy? Go on youtube and look it up, there are loads of videos of the Knife Juggler knifing him before it can do anything.
Wow. Are you being serious?
Just so I can understand, your viable response to Leeroy using a basic deck is to preemptively have and play a knife juggler before Leeroy(sorry for offending you with the misspelling) is played?
Do you even realize how stupid you sound posting that?
1.Let's hope you have a knife juggler
2.Let's hope you have him drawn in your deck
3.Let's hope you play him and he doesn't get killed and can just sit on your board
4.Let's hope he has nothing else on his board to take knife shots
5.Lets hope 100% of a random attribute hits Leeroy both times and that each knife isn't a 50-50 chance to hit the enemy hero
CHECK IT OUT ON YOUTUBE THOUGH, IT WORKS.
p.s.- I actually am a unique snowflake, thank you very much.
I was just taking a play out of your playbook there. Trying to come up with a very obscure situation to deal with a card. But you know what do I know, Knife Juggler is only one of the most common cards out there, it's in a ton of decks, and it gets abused a lot. But hey you know everything there is to know about hearthstone right? I mean you won 1000 games, of course I have too but you obviously know so much more about this game than anybody else. Also considering you only created your Hearthpwn account TODAY, your argument holds almost no merit whatsoever. This isn't even an official Hearthstone forum anyway, so why are you ranting here? Afraid you might get banned if you post on the official Blizzard forums? Even so, you're quitting Hearthstone, you're done all together. So what do you care? But, hey you took a few sentences out of the paragraph that I wrote to respond to while ignoring the rest of it, but that's ok. Context doesn't matter that much anyway, and you think I sound stupid.
Why is this thread necessary? Congrats OP you won 1000 games, so have lots of other people. No one cares what you think of the game, you are not a unique snowflake. If its so hard and so unfair why did you stick around to win 1000 games? Simply to prove a point to yourself and to Blizzard that you are just plain better than their flawed system? You've given examples of why the game is flawed in a vacuum. You bring up hypothetical situations to support your flimsy argument. You bring up Leeroy, two E's in that by the way, and how insane Leeroy can be. Have you ever seen what a Knife Juggler can do to Leeroy? Go on youtube and look it up, there are loads of videos of the Knife Juggler knifing him before it can do anything. There are hard counters to everything in this game. If you're not smart enough to figure it out that's your own problem, if you're blowing Hex's and Polymorph's early that's your fault. If you don't realize that this is Warcraft: The Gathering, and if you expected anything less then you don't understand collectible card games.
Oh and can I have your stuff?
Rollback Post to RevisionRollBack
To post a comment, please login or register a new account.
⚙
Learn More
Cosmetics
Related Cards
Card Pools
✕
×
PopCard Settings
Click on the buttons to change the PopCard background.
Elements settings
Click on the button to hide or unhide popcard elements.
Seeing as how the OP has now insulted and talked down to a moderator. Can we just lock this thread now?
Pay-to-Win is not a euphemism at all. It's a term thrown around at F2P games where you can get a clear advantage over other players by spending money, usually very poorly designed F2P games. In other words, you can only attain certain things by spending money on the game. There is nothing in Hearthstone that someone paying for packs can get that another person can not. I put 50 bucks into the game when I first got into the closed beta and I haven't put any money into it since then. In those packs I think I got two legendaries. I have crafted/obtained through packs by playing the game; Ragnaros, Ysera, Grommash, Cenarius, Leeroy, Bloodmage Thanos, Cairne, Alexstrasza, and Captain Greenskin. All of those obtained from crafting or free packs from gold/arena.
What do you even expect from this game? I'm very much starting to doubt your knowledge of the game and your claim that you have won 1000 games. It's already been stated numerous times in this thread on simple cards that deal with legendaries, but you refuse to even acknowledge these because there's that one time where you didn't have that card in your hand. Luck of the draw works both ways too, i've sat through games on my warrior with my opponent clinging to life and all I need was a Grommash charge to finish them and I never got it, and on the flip side of that. A senjin shieldmasta that was standing in the way of Grommash finishing off the opponent because it has taunt and I can't get to his face. Or it just get's hexed, poly'd, silenced, executed, assassinated. You even brought these up in your original post. But somehow these are bad ways of neutralizing the cards? Of course there will be times when you don't have the card in your hand, but that's just the nature of a card game.
It seems like you just want the game to be played the way YOU think it should be played. Perhaps it's just that you don't understand the game as well as you think you do.
Talk about not comparing apples to apples, you're comparing Grand Theft Auto V to Hearthstone, and you fail to see the problem behind that? Lets compare Final Fantasy to Madden because they are both video games you don't see how ridiculous that is? OR how about this, you compare Hearthstone to MTG online, or infinity wars, both of which are card games played on a computer, and both of them charge you money for booster packs. Hearthstone is a collectible card game. Period. There is nothing to debate. If you take away one of the main reasons for playing the game you will lose more than half of your player base guaranteed. You pay 35 bucks for Hearthstone and it gives you all the cards right up front, what is my reason for playing the game now? All I can do is grind the ladder and that's it, with your model there is no reason to run arena other than boredom with the ladder, you have nothing to work for, collecting all the cards is a big draw for a lot of players. The next part is, players who are better at hearthstone will have an advantage no matter what, the cards do not matter. It is the person playing the card. Take a brand new player and hand them a deck that has reached the Legend rank and watch them fail miserably, they don't know how it works, they don't know how to play it. Games in Hearthstone are not won by just throwing every legendary into a deck and pressing the play button, I'm pretty sure Totalbiscuit has all but proven that on his Lord of Legendary's series. Some of the best cards in the game are basics and commons, and if you don't see that then you don't understand Hearthstone or any card game for that matter
How do you know you can play Hearthstone in a web browser? Are you a developer of the game? Do you have any inside knowledge on the subject of the creation of Hearthstone? I'm going to say no.
And I will end this by saying one last thing. Why do you care so much if you are quitting the game and are done. Your title for the thread suggests that you will never pick up hearthstone ever again, and yet you defend your point so adamantly. Is this thread just to stir up crap on the internet? I'm guessing that's what it is and in that case congratulations you have succeeded.
In other words people, don't feed the troll.
P.S. I'm still interested in your stuff
I was just taking a play out of your playbook there. Trying to come up with a very obscure situation to deal with a card. But you know what do I know, Knife Juggler is only one of the most common cards out there, it's in a ton of decks, and it gets abused a lot. But hey you know everything there is to know about hearthstone right? I mean you won 1000 games, of course I have too but you obviously know so much more about this game than anybody else. Also considering you only created your Hearthpwn account TODAY, your argument holds almost no merit whatsoever. This isn't even an official Hearthstone forum anyway, so why are you ranting here? Afraid you might get banned if you post on the official Blizzard forums? Even so, you're quitting Hearthstone, you're done all together. So what do you care? But, hey you took a few sentences out of the paragraph that I wrote to respond to while ignoring the rest of it, but that's ok. Context doesn't matter that much anyway, and you think I sound stupid.
But really, can I have your stuff?
Why is this thread necessary? Congrats OP you won 1000 games, so have lots of other people. No one cares what you think of the game, you are not a unique snowflake. If its so hard and so unfair why did you stick around to win 1000 games? Simply to prove a point to yourself and to Blizzard that you are just plain better than their flawed system? You've given examples of why the game is flawed in a vacuum. You bring up hypothetical situations to support your flimsy argument. You bring up Leeroy, two E's in that by the way, and how insane Leeroy can be. Have you ever seen what a Knife Juggler can do to Leeroy? Go on youtube and look it up, there are loads of videos of the Knife Juggler knifing him before it can do anything. There are hard counters to everything in this game. If you're not smart enough to figure it out that's your own problem, if you're blowing Hex's and Polymorph's early that's your fault. If you don't realize that this is Warcraft: The Gathering, and if you expected anything less then you don't understand collectible card games.
Oh and can I have your stuff?