A person or animal that hunts animals for food or sport.
In World of Warcraft, the Hunter is essentially what the rogue is: crafty, sneaky and quick-witted, deploying traps to get an upper hand on their opponent. They would go as far as sacrificing their own companions to benefit the others, to take advantage of the situation. However, if you think of a hunter in Hearthstone, the first thing that comes to mind is "ME GO FACE, FACE IS PLACE, WIN". They have been Devolved into some primitive, basic creature, that has no real speciality. Hearthstone managed to capture the persona of the other characters pretty well, Mage and spells, Priest and healing, Warlock and sacrifices and demons, Warrior and defence. But hunters are supposed to be sly and tricky, always 2 steps ahead of their enemy, utilizing what they have to their utmost disposal. When I first came into Hearthstone after playing World of Warcraft, I expected cards like "Destroy a minion. Give adjacent ones +2 attack" or "Deal 2 damage to all minions, give those that survive +2 attack" or even "Deal 5 damage. Destroy a random friendly minion".
You see what I am getting at, Hunters don't care for the well-being of others when they can benefit from losing them. Or, they can force the player to act a certain way to avoid getting comebacked. So here's my proposal: either you can add on to this conversation, or you can design cards that could possibly make Hunter what it should be. This is probably my biggest complaint about Hearthstone, other than the cost.
the Hunter is essentially what the rogue is: crafty, sneaky and quick-witted, deploying traps to get an upper hand on their opponent.
You mean like Secrets, yes? Because there's a lot of them for Hunter. And they are called something like "Traps"...
That's not my point, I am trying to say that all Hunter secrets and traps either revolve around dealing damage (Explosive Trap is solely reliant on what type of minions the opponent plays, and can only be used in a situation where an early game board clear is required) or are, in general, rubbish (Snake Trap does not deserve to be an epic). I mean a card like Bear Trap, where it doesn't really matter what minion attacks first. I want a card that can turn the tables on your opponent, like Trap Cards in Yu Gi Oh. Maybe a card that summons any random beast to take the damage? Or, when a friendly minion dies, another friendly beast gains +2/+2. The traps that Hunter has are designed in such a way that they have almost minimal impact on the board state. I want more thinking cards, not just in Hunter, but in Hearthstone in general. Cards that make you go "What is the best possible way to play this card so that I can get the best outcome?" or "Is this a good target or this card?". What Hearthstone lacks are cards that are strong but have a drawback other than mana cost, because that is easily worked around. Cards like Unwilling Sacrifice (despite it being a Warlock Card) fit very well in the persona of Hunters in World of Warcraft.
the Hunter is essentially what the rogue is: crafty, sneaky and quick-witted, deploying traps to get an upper hand on their opponent.
You mean like Secrets, yes? Because there's a lot of them for Hunter. And they are called something like "Traps"...
That's not my point, I am trying to say that all Hunter secrets and traps either revolve around dealing damage (Explosive Trap is solely reliant on what type of minions the opponent plays, and can only be used in a situation where an early game board clear is required) or are, in general, rubbish (Snake Trap does not deserve to be an epic). I mean a card like Bear Trap, where it doesn't really matter what minion attacks first. I want a card that can turn the tables on your opponent, like Trap Cards in Yu Gi Oh. Maybe a card that summons any random beast to take the damage? Or, when a friendly minion dies, another friendly beast gains +2/+2. The traps that Hunter has are designed in such a way that they have almost minimal impact on the board state. I want more thinking cards, not just in Hunter, but in Hearthstone in general. Cards that make you go "What is the best possible way to play this card so that I can get the best outcome?" or "Is this a good target or this card?". What Hearthstone lacks are cards that are strong but have a drawback other than mana cost, because that is easily worked around. Cards like Unwilling Sacrifice (despite it being a Warlock Card) fit very well in the persona of Hunters in World of Warcraft.
Well no, hang on - your whole point (from what I read in your OP) was that you felt that Hunters were not being portayed as Hunters are depicted normally. Your example of this theory was in pointing out that Hunters should be "crafty, sneaky and quick-witted, deploying traps to get an upper hand on their opponent." So my response was in direct contradiction to this stated presumption. That Hunters do in fact play a very sneaky style of play, employing traps to outsmart their opponent.
Whether you happen to think these traps are any good is besides the point? Why does a trap have to be good? Most traps deal damage in real life (apart from a few more humane varieties. Try stepping on a bear trap and see if that stings a bit (Don't really...). You also complain that Snake Trap is an Epic. Why is that relevant to a Hunter having it as a card? What difference does the rarity of the card make to whether or not it is a suitable skill for a Hunter to employ?
Now rolling back here slightly, if the purpose of this thread was in fac to complain that Hunters don't have good enough Secrets (or skills generally), then ok - let's discuss that. But otherwise it seems a little odd to be complaining that Hunter Traps aren't good enough, when you were previously stating that Hunters in Hearthstone needed tobe using some (implying there weren't any).
the Hunter is essentially what the rogue is: crafty, sneaky and quick-witted, deploying traps to get an upper hand on their opponent.
You mean like Secrets, yes? Because there's a lot of them for Hunter. And they are called something like "Traps"...
That's not my point, I am trying to say that all Hunter secrets and traps either revolve around dealing damage (Explosive Trap is solely reliant on what type of minions the opponent plays, and can only be used in a situation where an early game board clear is required) or are, in general, rubbish (Snake Trap does not deserve to be an epic). I mean a card like Bear Trap, where it doesn't really matter what minion attacks first. I want a card that can turn the tables on your opponent, like Trap Cards in Yu Gi Oh. Maybe a card that summons any random beast to take the damage? Or, when a friendly minion dies, another friendly beast gains +2/+2. The traps that Hunter has are designed in such a way that they have almost minimal impact on the board state. I want more thinking cards, not just in Hunter, but in Hearthstone in general. Cards that make you go "What is the best possible way to play this card so that I can get the best outcome?" or "Is this a good target or this card?". What Hearthstone lacks are cards that are strong but have a drawback other than mana cost, because that is easily worked around. Cards like Unwilling Sacrifice (despite it being a Warlock Card) fit very well in the persona of Hunters in World of Warcraft.
Well no, hang on - your whole point (from what I read in your OP) was that you felt that Hunters were not being portayed as Hunters are depicted normally. Your example of this theory was in pointing out that Hunters should be "crafty, sneaky and quick-witted, deploying traps to get an upper hand on their opponent." So my response was in direct contradiction to this stated presumption. That Hunters do in fact play a very sneaky style of play, employing traps to outsmart their opponent.
Whether you happen to think these traps are any good is besides the point? Why does a trap have to be good? Most traps deal damage in real life (apart from a few more humane varieties. Try stepping on a bear trap and see if that stings a bit (Don't really...). You also complain that Snake Trap is an Epic. Why is that relevant to a Hunter having it as a card? What difference does the rarity of the card make to whether or not it is a suitable skill for a Hunter to employ?
Now rolling back here slightly, if the purpose of this thread was in fac to complain that Hunters don't have good enough Secrets (or skills generally), then ok - let's discuss that. But otherwise it seems a little odd to be complaining that Hunter Traps aren't good enough, when you were previously stating that Hunters in Hearthstone needed tobe using some (implying there weren't any).
That is what I meant, in the sense that I feel like a lot of Hunter cards aren't "skilled". I'm not saying people who play hunter are bad at the game, I'm saying that from MY perspective and experience, I think that skills that apply to a 'Hunter' aren't really present in my vision of a hunter.
In my opinion, a Hunter doesn't run in, guns blazing to shoot people in the face immediately. What I am saying is that many people have come to view Hunter as a class solely designed around cards to hit face. My personal vision of Hunter in Hearthstone would be deathrattle Hunter, utilizing his skills (that aren't really present in Hearthstone anyway) to gain the upper hand. It's kind of like how some of the Warlock spells work, disadvantaging your minions to either remove threats or give a bigger advantage to your other minions.
Hunters are what they are because Hearthstone, in their infinite wisdom, made them that way. "Face is the place" ... because that is all they got that actually works. Until Team 5 addresses the lack of board clear with hunters, all you will ever see in an actual competitive deck is pure aggro. Sad thing is, Hunters are one, maybe 2 cards away from being OP .... if we had a "Dragonfire" style spell "Deal 5 damage to all minions except beasts" ... it would be ON! Hell, make it a trap if it makes you feel better, but there is a reason hunters go face.
Rollback Post to RevisionRollBack
I wanna glide down, over Mulholland I wanna write her, name in the sky I wanna free fall, out into nothin' Gonna leave this, world for awhile
My main memory of hunters is back when one outrolled my ret pal in karazhan to get gorehowl. I think Huntard me go face or me ninja loot are both fairly apt labels.:P
*Edit*
Having thought about it I do agree about their class in Hearthstone. Just hard to forget that loot roll lol.
I play warrior in wow, I play hunter in hs. You need to separate your feelings from practicality. Each of the 8 classes in hs fill a role in the overall balance of the game (supposedly). Hunter has really never done that. Hunter's unique identity in this game is "find the win". It isn't strongly themed in anything other than beast synergy and it doesn't reflect the feel of the namesake class in wow like the other classes do. But what it does is turn every card in the deck into a chess piece and use them to get closer to winning every turn.
I'll explain. Most classes have the ability to build decks that play a "full game", essentially 15+ turns of back and forth mayhem until one side loses enough ground and somebody falls behind or dies to a combo. Hunter can't do that. It doesn't want to do that. It wants to use what it drew in the opener and the next 5 draws to set up a winning scenario. It doesn't draw many cards, so whatever you do draw you need to win with quickly. You want sly and sneaky? A real hunter player is always playing 5 turns ahead of his opponent. If I don't see the win coming 3-5 turns in front of me I concede because I know it isn't happening; something's gone wrong.
"ME GO FACE" is a BabyRage translation for "This hunter player had me from the first turn and I knew I couldn't win." Most people don't like losing to decks like that and don't want to spend time trying to beat them so Blizzard has started experimenting with alternative play styles for hunter. The result of that is a bunch of half baked decks and strategies that really don't match the class's core well.
Feels like Hunter is all over the place right now, but if you really look for it you find the class identity in your ladder rank.
Hunter:
A person or animal that hunts animals for food or sport.
In World of Warcraft, the Hunter is essentially what the rogue is: crafty, sneaky and quick-witted, deploying traps to get an upper hand on their opponent. They would go as far as sacrificing their own companions to benefit the others, to take advantage of the situation. However, if you think of a hunter in Hearthstone, the first thing that comes to mind is "ME GO FACE, FACE IS PLACE, WIN". They have been Devolved into some primitive, basic creature, that has no real speciality. Hearthstone managed to capture the persona of the other characters pretty well, Mage and spells, Priest and healing, Warlock and sacrifices and demons, Warrior and defence. But hunters are supposed to be sly and tricky, always 2 steps ahead of their enemy, utilizing what they have to their utmost disposal. When I first came into Hearthstone after playing World of Warcraft, I expected cards like "Destroy a minion. Give adjacent ones +2 attack" or "Deal 2 damage to all minions, give those that survive +2 attack" or even "Deal 5 damage. Destroy a random friendly minion".
You see what I am getting at, Hunters don't care for the well-being of others when they can benefit from losing them. Or, they can force the player to act a certain way to avoid getting comebacked. So here's my proposal: either you can add on to this conversation, or you can design cards that could possibly make Hunter what it should be. This is probably my biggest complaint about Hearthstone, other than the cost.
So my response was in direct contradiction to this stated presumption. That Hunters do in fact play a very sneaky style of play, employing traps to outsmart their opponent.
Most traps deal damage in real life (apart from a few more humane varieties. Try stepping on a bear trap and see if that stings a bit (Don't really...).
You also complain that Snake Trap is an Epic. Why is that relevant to a Hunter having it as a card? What difference does the rarity of the card make to whether or not it is a suitable skill for a Hunter to employ?
I could sort of agree that hunter was devolved to FACE ONLY, but that's because HE HUNTS HIS PREY VERY EFFICIENTLY. That fits him as a hunter well.
I've NEVER thought of Huntards as "sly and sneaky". And yes I used to play WoW for years.
In my opinion, a Hunter doesn't run in, guns blazing to shoot people in the face immediately. What I am saying is that many people have come to view Hunter as a class solely designed around cards to hit face. My personal vision of Hunter in Hearthstone would be deathrattle Hunter, utilizing his skills (that aren't really present in Hearthstone anyway) to gain the upper hand. It's kind of like how some of the Warlock spells work, disadvantaging your minions to either remove threats or give a bigger advantage to your other minions.
Hunters are what they are because Hearthstone, in their infinite wisdom, made them that way. "Face is the place" ... because that is all they got that actually works. Until Team 5 addresses the lack of board clear with hunters, all you will ever see in an actual competitive deck is pure aggro. Sad thing is, Hunters are one, maybe 2 cards away from being OP .... if we had a "Dragonfire" style spell "Deal 5 damage to all minions except beasts" ... it would be ON! Hell, make it a trap if it makes you feel better, but there is a reason hunters go face.
I wanna glide down, over Mulholland
I wanna write her, name in the sky
I wanna free fall, out into nothin'
Gonna leave this, world for awhile
My main memory of hunters is back when one outrolled my ret pal in karazhan to get gorehowl. I think Huntard me go face or me ninja loot are both fairly apt labels.:P
*Edit*
Having thought about it I do agree about their class in Hearthstone. Just hard to forget that loot roll lol.
Sorry, couldn't resist. :P
I play warrior in wow, I play hunter in hs. You need to separate your feelings from practicality. Each of the 8 classes in hs fill a role in the overall balance of the game (supposedly). Hunter has really never done that. Hunter's unique identity in this game is "find the win". It isn't strongly themed in anything other than beast synergy and it doesn't reflect the feel of the namesake class in wow like the other classes do. But what it does is turn every card in the deck into a chess piece and use them to get closer to winning every turn.
I'll explain. Most classes have the ability to build decks that play a "full game", essentially 15+ turns of back and forth mayhem until one side loses enough ground and somebody falls behind or dies to a combo. Hunter can't do that. It doesn't want to do that. It wants to use what it drew in the opener and the next 5 draws to set up a winning scenario. It doesn't draw many cards, so whatever you do draw you need to win with quickly. You want sly and sneaky? A real hunter player is always playing 5 turns ahead of his opponent. If I don't see the win coming 3-5 turns in front of me I concede because I know it isn't happening; something's gone wrong.
"ME GO FACE" is a BabyRage translation for "This hunter player had me from the first turn and I knew I couldn't win." Most people don't like losing to decks like that and don't want to spend time trying to beat them so Blizzard has started experimenting with alternative play styles for hunter. The result of that is a bunch of half baked decks and strategies that really don't match the class's core well.
Feels like Hunter is all over the place right now, but if you really look for it you find the class identity in your ladder rank.