I once was a very active player of this game and have been since early beta days. However, starting around TGT I noticed a severe shift in the games meta. It became more of who could do the most burst and more aggro than who could defeat the other in a clever way. By the time ONK was out, I started to just stop caring about the game because it was so far from my casual play style with a slower meta and it became less creative and more about cookie cutter decks.
If you really wanted to win you had to have X, Y, & Z in the deck and it had to be the aggro, rapid pace, burst and by turn 4-5 you either were going to win in those two turns, or you knew you had no chance. This only made me exasperated with MSG's arrival with rewarding this very play style and making it impossible for most control decks and players. The game seriously seems to have neglected a section of the player base. Has Blizzard even figured this out yet? Are they trying to change up the game with Un'goro to include people like me back into the game, or has it forever changed and if I want to get back into the game I have to just suck it up and play the aggro style cookie cutter decks? Seriously, what do y'all think?
This question has been asked about literally every expansion ever released. So far, the answer has been "nope" every single time so that's what I'm going with for this one too.
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I share your concerns, but rotation is almost upon us. It is unhealthy for a meta to have no aggro, so there will always be some. I feel that this set seems more mid-range orientated (By what we've seen so far) which in theory has a bad time with aggro. It's gonna depend on what tools aggro decks get.
No meta has no aggro. But aggro dominates Hearthstone to a degree that is unheard of in serious, competitive games.
Jade also killed every other Control deck, meaning aggro has favorable matchups against midrange, combo, and control, since Jade is the only serious control deck and it takes off around turn 5, which is when Pirate Warrior kills you.
Like someone already mentioned, we hear this every expansion and regardless of what is released people always find a way to keep aggro a thing, still more cards to be seen so hoping for at least some room for diversity.
No meta has no aggro. But aggro dominates Hearthstone to a degree that is unheard of in serious, competitive games.
Jade also killed every other Control deck, meaning aggro has favorable matchups against midrange, combo, and control, since Jade is the only serious control deck and it takes off around turn 5, which is when Pirate Warrior kills you.
Jade didn't kill control, it changed how control plays. Pirate Warrior didn't kill other aggro decks, and in Un'Goro, people will still play non Jade Druid control decks, as long as their win condition isn't fatigue or if Jade Druid isn't a dominant deck in the meta. Don't be such a pessimist.
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I don't want there to be absolutely no aggro, but its really pathetic that I have to only play aggro or create a deck to only counter a specific type of aggro decks if I want to seriously entertain the idea or moving up the ladder. It makes the game become so cookie cutter and really makes it difficult for people that want to experiment or just play casually but still compete.
No meta has no aggro. But aggro dominates Hearthstone to a degree that is unheard of in serious, competitive games.
Jade also killed every other Control deck, meaning aggro has favorable matchups against midrange, combo, and control, since Jade is the only serious control deck and it takes off around turn 5, which is when Pirate Warrior kills you.
Jade didn't kill control, it changed how control plays. Pirate Warrior didn't kill other aggro decks, and in Un'Goro, people will still play non Jade Druid control decks, as long as their win condition isn't fatigue or if Jade Druid isn't a dominant deck in the meta. Don't be such a pessimist.
No, it actually killed Control. The decks that are called "Control" these days, like Dragon Priest, are actually midrange. Pirate Warrior didn't kill other aggro decks because aggro is Hearthstone's favored archetype, so there are many good options (of which PW is the most efficient currently).
People have this misconception that Control started to go the Fatigue route because it wanted to. Control started to go Fatigue because aggro was so strong that Control's entire deck needed to be answers to not effectively lose on turn 5-6.
I mean, the only anti-aggro tool we've seen thus far this expansion is Lakkari Felhound. I don't see any other card shown so far, including Tortollan Shellraiser, being able to slow down let alone stop Pirate Warrior.
The cards revealed so far are good that they show several Taunt with high health minions and they don't support Aggro too much like powerful 1-drops, so it is a good sign... but let not put our hope up yet for a slow meta as we say it every time before the launch... Because the strong Aggro drops will be blended in at the last card dump to distract us all, we will overlook, and a new Aggro meta is born....
No meta has no aggro. But aggro dominates Hearthstone to a degree that is unheard of in serious, competitive games.
Jade also killed every other Control deck, meaning aggro has favorable matchups against midrange, combo, and control, since Jade is the only serious control deck and it takes off around turn 5, which is when Pirate Warrior kills you.
Jade didn't kill control, it changed how control plays. Pirate Warrior didn't kill other aggro decks, and in Un'Goro, people will still play non Jade Druid control decks, as long as their win condition isn't fatigue or if Jade Druid isn't a dominant deck in the meta. Don't be such a pessimist.
No, it actually killed Control. The decks that are called "Control" these days, like Dragon Priest, are actually midrange. Pirate Warrior didn't kill other aggro decks because aggro is Hearthstone's favored archetype, so there are many good options (of which PW is the most efficient currently).
People have this misconception that Control started to go the Fatigue route because it wanted to. Control started to go Fatigue because aggro was so strong that Control's entire deck needed to be answers to not effectively lose on turn 5-6.
I think you are mistaken. Dragon Priest was never and is not now referred to as a control deck. It's just that when one player is clearly the aggressor, the other must by default play the control role until they regain the board. Jade Druid didn't kill control (if it did, why is Renolock tier 1 and not Jade Druid?)
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Life before death. Strength before weakness. Journey before destination.
No meta has no aggro. But aggro dominates Hearthstone to a degree that is unheard of in serious, competitive games.
Jade also killed every other Control deck, meaning aggro has favorable matchups against midrange, combo, and control, since Jade is the only serious control deck and it takes off around turn 5, which is when Pirate Warrior kills you.
Jade didn't kill control, it changed how control plays. Pirate Warrior didn't kill other aggro decks, and in Un'Goro, people will still play non Jade Druid control decks, as long as their win condition isn't fatigue or if Jade Druid isn't a dominant deck in the meta. Don't be such a pessimist.
No, it actually killed Control. The decks that are called "Control" these days, like Dragon Priest, are actually midrange. Pirate Warrior didn't kill other aggro decks because aggro is Hearthstone's favored archetype, so there are many good options (of which PW is the most efficient currently).
People have this misconception that Control started to go the Fatigue route because it wanted to. Control started to go Fatigue because aggro was so strong that Control's entire deck needed to be answers to not effectively lose on turn 5-6.
I think you are mistaken. Dragon Priest was never and is not now referred to as a control deck. It's just that when one player is clearly the aggressor, the other must by default play the control role until they regain the board. Jade Druid didn't kill control (if it did, why is Renolock tier 1 and not Jade Druid?)
Yoooo, let's not start on that "When Sligh and Suicide Black play each other, one has to be the beatdown and one has to be the control, so therefore Sligh is a control deck ^_~ ^_~ ^_~ !!!1!!" That's just two aggro decks with one playing defensively because it can't win a face race.
Renolock is also not a Control deck, it's a Combo deck that wins with 20+ face damage from hand in one turn. It's more comparable to Freeze Mage than something like Control Warrior or Control Priest.
The rotation and Un'Goro will certainly have effects on the game's meta right now. Tar Creeper, Golakka Crawler and Lakkari Felhound are going to give Pirate Warrior problems, and the major amount of strong Druid cards rotating out will most likely have an impact on Jade Druid. Right now, the closest thing to a solution to Jade Druid we have in Un'Goro cards is the new Paladin legendary, but I wouldn't be surprised if Blizzard tried to put out something to deal with the Jades as well. Besides, even with Jade decks around Control still has a shot at revival as long as they don't get stomped on by Aggro decks after this thing ends.
It's true that Jade Druid is losing some important tools in Azure Drake, Living Roots, Brann Bronzebeard, and Mulch. Those losses MIGHT slow it down enough to stay in the meta as a hard counter to control while losing to most fast decks.
If that happens, the skewing of the meta toward all-out aggro as a response to Jade Druid's mauling of the control archetype might relax slightly.
No meta has no aggro. But aggro dominates Hearthstone to a degree that is unheard of in serious, competitive games.
Jade also killed every other Control deck, meaning aggro has favorable matchups against midrange, combo, and control, since Jade is the only serious control deck and it takes off around turn 5, which is when Pirate Warrior kills you.
Jade didn't kill control, it changed how control plays. Pirate Warrior didn't kill other aggro decks, and in Un'Goro, people will still play non Jade Druid control decks, as long as their win condition isn't fatigue or if Jade Druid isn't a dominant deck in the meta. Don't be such a pessimist.
No, it actually killed Control. The decks that are called "Control" these days, like Dragon Priest, are actually midrange. Pirate Warrior didn't kill other aggro decks because aggro is Hearthstone's favored archetype, so there are many good options (of which PW is the most efficient currently).
People have this misconception that Control started to go the Fatigue route because it wanted to. Control started to go Fatigue because aggro was so strong that Control's entire deck needed to be answers to not effectively lose on turn 5-6.
I think you are mistaken. Dragon Priest was never and is not now referred to as a control deck. It's just that when one player is clearly the aggressor, the other must by default play the control role until they regain the board. Jade Druid didn't kill control (if it did, why is Renolock tier 1 and not Jade Druid?)
Yoooo, let's not start on that "When Sligh and Suicide Black play each other, one has to be the beatdown and one has to be the control, so therefore Sligh is a control deck ^_~ ^_~ ^_~ !!!1!!" That's just two aggro decks with one playing defensively because it can't win a face race.
Renolock is also not a Control deck, it's a Combo deck that wins with 20+ face damage from hand in one turn. It's more comparable to Freeze Mage than something like Control Warrior or Control Priest.
So renolock is a combo deck and dragon priest is a control deck. got it. is jade druid a mill deck and pirate warrior a midrange deck?
also why do you not want to talk about clearly defined roles? if you try to out aggro pirate warrior as dragon priest, you are going to lose, period. that doesn't mean that dragon priest is a control deck. similarly, because jade druid can go infinite doesn't mean its a fatigue deck.
No meta has no aggro. But aggro dominates Hearthstone to a degree that is unheard of in serious, competitive games.
Jade also killed every other Control deck, meaning aggro has favorable matchups against midrange, combo, and control, since Jade is the only serious control deck and it takes off around turn 5, which is when Pirate Warrior kills you.
Jade didn't kill control, it changed how control plays. Pirate Warrior didn't kill other aggro decks, and in Un'Goro, people will still play non Jade Druid control decks, as long as their win condition isn't fatigue or if Jade Druid isn't a dominant deck in the meta. Don't be such a pessimist.
No, it actually killed Control. The decks that are called "Control" these days, like Dragon Priest, are actually midrange. Pirate Warrior didn't kill other aggro decks because aggro is Hearthstone's favored archetype, so there are many good options (of which PW is the most efficient currently).
People have this misconception that Control started to go the Fatigue route because it wanted to. Control started to go Fatigue because aggro was so strong that Control's entire deck needed to be answers to not effectively lose on turn 5-6.
I think you are mistaken. Dragon Priest was never and is not now referred to as a control deck. It's just that when one player is clearly the aggressor, the other must by default play the control role until they regain the board. Jade Druid didn't kill control (if it did, why is Renolock tier 1 and not Jade Druid?)
Yoooo, let's not start on that "When Sligh and Suicide Black play each other, one has to be the beatdown and one has to be the control, so therefore Sligh is a control deck ^_~ ^_~ ^_~ !!!1!!" That's just two aggro decks with one playing defensively because it can't win a face race.
Renolock is also not a Control deck, it's a Combo deck that wins with 20+ face damage from hand in one turn. It's more comparable to Freeze Mage than something like Control Warrior or Control Priest.
So renolock is a combo deck and dragon priest is a control deck. got it. is jade druid a mill deck and pirate warrior a midrange deck?
also why do you not want to talk about clearly defined roles? if you try to out aggro pirate warrior as dragon priest, you are going to lose, period. that doesn't mean that dragon priest is a control deck. similarly, because jade druid can go infinite doesn't mean its a fatigue deck.
Renolock is Combo, Dragon Priest is Midrange.
An archetype is not the same as your role within a given matchup. For example, Water Rogue is forced to play the Pirate Warrior matchup defensively. This does not make Water Rogue a Control deck. I don't see what's so difficult about that concept. You're absolutely right about the Dragon Priest vs. Pirate Warrior example, so I think we actually agree on this. Dragon Priest is not Control and I never said it was.
Jade Druid isn't a Fatigue deck because the infinite cards that could let it be a Fatigue deck also generate infinite 10/10+ threats, so most decks that go to turn 10 or later with it auto-lose.
The early reveals make it seem like Team 5 is offering tools across classes to deal with Pirates.
If they succeed, then most likely aggro is dead and we are in for an even more Jade-heavy meta, since Pirates have been the biggest check on it.
If they partially succeed, then the classes with viable anti-Pirate tools will have to find a way to run them plus a win condition that can get through before Jades get rolling, which seems like a pretty narrow window.
Maybe the expansion will bring something that can deal with Jades, but otherwise I'm afraid we may be in for more of the same, especially if Druid gets an early removal tool to replace Roots.
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Hey all,
I once was a very active player of this game and have been since early beta days. However, starting around TGT I noticed a severe shift in the games meta. It became more of who could do the most burst and more aggro than who could defeat the other in a clever way. By the time ONK was out, I started to just stop caring about the game because it was so far from my casual play style with a slower meta and it became less creative and more about cookie cutter decks.
If you really wanted to win you had to have X, Y, & Z in the deck and it had to be the aggro, rapid pace, burst and by turn 4-5 you either were going to win in those two turns, or you knew you had no chance. This only made me exasperated with MSG's arrival with rewarding this very play style and making it impossible for most control decks and players. The game seriously seems to have neglected a section of the player base. Has Blizzard even figured this out yet? Are they trying to change up the game with Un'goro to include people like me back into the game, or has it forever changed and if I want to get back into the game I have to just suck it up and play the aggro style cookie cutter decks? Seriously, what do y'all think?
quest mechanic is too slow imo and will be good in wild only
This question has been asked about literally every expansion ever released. So far, the answer has been "nope" every single time so that's what I'm going with for this one too.
"Hello. Would you like to destroy some evil today?"
I share your concerns, but rotation is almost upon us. It is unhealthy for a meta to have no aggro, so there will always be some. I feel that this set seems more mid-range orientated (By what we've seen so far) which in theory has a bad time with aggro. It's gonna depend on what tools aggro decks get.
PS: Make hunter great again
Spitefull Priest to legend February 2019
time to do it again x d
That is not entirely true, when TGT came the game exploded with control decks (never forget 40 armor warrior everygame)
Garrosh did nothing wrong.
No meta has no aggro. But aggro dominates Hearthstone to a degree that is unheard of in serious, competitive games.
Jade also killed every other Control deck, meaning aggro has favorable matchups against midrange, combo, and control, since Jade is the only serious control deck and it takes off around turn 5, which is when Pirate Warrior kills you.
Like someone already mentioned, we hear this every expansion and regardless of what is released people always find a way to keep aggro a thing, still more cards to be seen so hoping for at least some room for diversity.
Kaladin's RoS Set Review
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I don't want there to be absolutely no aggro, but its really pathetic that I have to only play aggro or create a deck to only counter a specific type of aggro decks if I want to seriously entertain the idea or moving up the ladder. It makes the game become so cookie cutter and really makes it difficult for people that want to experiment or just play casually but still compete.
I mean, the only anti-aggro tool we've seen thus far this expansion is Lakkari Felhound. I don't see any other card shown so far, including Tortollan Shellraiser, being able to slow down let alone stop Pirate Warrior.
The cards revealed so far are good that they show several Taunt with high health minions and they don't support Aggro too much like powerful 1-drops, so it is a good sign... but let not put our hope up yet for a slow meta as we say it every time before the launch... Because the strong Aggro drops will be blended in at the last card dump to distract us all, we will overlook, and a new Aggro meta is born....
Aggro will always be a thing. The SMOrc always finds a way. It was hunter once, then shaman, then warrior.
They will probably always keep easy and fast decks around for those filthy casuals.
Kaladin's RoS Set Review
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The rotation and Un'Goro will certainly have effects on the game's meta right now. Tar Creeper, Golakka Crawler and Lakkari Felhound are going to give Pirate Warrior problems, and the major amount of strong Druid cards rotating out will most likely have an impact on Jade Druid. Right now, the closest thing to a solution to Jade Druid we have in Un'Goro cards is the new Paladin legendary, but I wouldn't be surprised if Blizzard tried to put out something to deal with the Jades as well. Besides, even with Jade decks around Control still has a shot at revival as long as they don't get stomped on by Aggro decks after this thing ends.
It's true that Jade Druid is losing some important tools in Azure Drake, Living Roots, Brann Bronzebeard, and Mulch. Those losses MIGHT slow it down enough to stay in the meta as a hard counter to control while losing to most fast decks.
If that happens, the skewing of the meta toward all-out aggro as a response to Jade Druid's mauling of the control archetype might relax slightly.
Kaladin's RoS Set Review
Join me at Out of Cards!
The early reveals make it seem like Team 5 is offering tools across classes to deal with Pirates.
If they succeed, then most likely aggro is dead and we are in for an even more Jade-heavy meta, since Pirates have been the biggest check on it.
If they partially succeed, then the classes with viable anti-Pirate tools will have to find a way to run them plus a win condition that can get through before Jades get rolling, which seems like a pretty narrow window.
Maybe the expansion will bring something that can deal with Jades, but otherwise I'm afraid we may be in for more of the same, especially if Druid gets an early removal tool to replace Roots.