Ever since old gods, i have been seeing silence effects less and less, yet, ive seen the transformation spells played more often. Are the bodies we are getting with abilites just too big to be caring about their effects, because just as a point, c'thuun silenced is only a 6/6, which could make a massive difference on how to remove it, but it's still big, or is it because silence effects are almost entirely single targeted? Im an old school shaman player, have been since beta, and im always wondering why i don't have at least 1 earth shock around. Most certainly against divine shield paladin, and several other often played cards, like trogg and silvanus, it just feels like we are ignoring it for numbers. Would this be acurate, and if so, what would make silence worth playing again?
To be honest im happy with silence played less. Its so annoying if u ply a Deathrattel Legendary or buff a card and it gets instantly silenced. Without Silence there are more ways to play special card and there are still tons of other removal :D
It think it just shows that the Ironbeak Owl nerf actually worked. Silence is still a powerful effect, but at 3 mana for a 2/1 Owl it just feels bad to tech one in when there's an abundance of other great 3-drops to play. You still see them and Spellbreakers in Reno lists though.
It think it just shows that the Ironbeak Owl nerf actually worked. Silence is still a powerful effect, but at 3 mana for a 2/1 Owl it just feels bad to tech one in when there's an abundance of other great 3-drops to play. You still see them and Spellbreakers in Reno lists though.
Happily there are less Reno lists being played too.
The reason why is because of Owl getting nerfed. This changed everything as far as silence value. Now more people play spellbreaker but even a 4/3 4 cost is not amazing compared to what owl used to be.
Either you want to remove an annoying deathrattle before killing the minion (prime targets e.g. Sylvanas Windrunner or Tirion Fordring), which also still costs mana. If you spend 3 mana for an Ironbeak Owl, you only have 3 Mana left to kill Sylvanas and that doesn't really win you much tempo. Spellbreaker has the same problem a little worse, even if his body value is better. Hex or Entomb mitigate this by already including the removal part.
The other case is that you want to silence a taunt to bypass it for lethal. Same story, the more mana you have to pay for the Silence, the less you will have for your actual combo.
Keeper of the Grove was played despite being 4 mana because it could also be used as a very efficient anti-aggro tool. Now with its body nerfed, it cannot fulfill that role anymore.
Earth Shock didn't get changed, but still fell out of favor. Partly to make room for Argent Squire and sometimes Evolve or Primal Fusion (historically Earth Shock always tended to be one of the first candidates to be subbed out, many decks pre-Standard already only ran 1 copy afaik), partly because a lot of good targets are gone or much less frequent. Prime example is Twilight Drake, but also a lot of 2-health minions that could be killed with Spellpower, like Mad Scientist, Haunted Creeper or Shielded Minibot. Even Piloted Shredder and Sludge Belcher kinda matter because they were small enough to be suboptimal Hex targets, but still alright to silence with an Earth Shock. So yeah, you are right, the minions that we want silenced are on average much more expensive now.
But I cannot see that people are running Hex or Entomb more often than before. It might only look that way because Midrange/Control Shamans used to be nearly extinct pre-Standard. And Aggro Shaman didn't and still does not run Hex.
To this point, I like priest's 0 mana Silence card as one of the better silences at this point in the game. It's great to not have to spend mana during your turn to use silence. It's a nice tool to have, but situational so only use one copy of it.
It seems like there are really two factors at play - (1) cheap, neutral silence (Ironbeak Owl) is gone and, perhaps more importantly, (2) there just aren't that many targets for it anymore. Of cards that are in heavy rotation, more or less the only ones left that you would rather silence than simply hard remove are Sylvanis and Cairne. Zoo, aggro shaman, and the tempo / aggro / dragon Warrior decks run essentially no viable silence targets.
If Pally were to come back into the meta in a meaningful way or new powerful deathrattles or minion buffs were introduced, there would be more incentive to carry a silence. As it stands, removal (or transformation if you're a Shaman or Mage) is just the much better meta choice, particularly since transform now costs more or less the same as silence.
Pretty much what i was coming to conclude. The game shifted, and after two years of silencing annoying deathrattles, i guess their removal meant i didnt need the silence anymore too, its a bit jarring, but getting to have interesting effects on the board defintely is a plus.
Earth shock is not worth playing because shaman has so many better cards that there is no room for it.
This. Why would you run Earth Shock when you could run another threat? Or a direct damage spell that you can point to your opponent's face and finish him off? Also, what minions does your opponent run that absolutely needs to be earthshocked instead of traded into by your mininos? Shaman has so many other good cards that earthshock became relatively subpar. And it's no longer needed in most situations.
Yeah, I think the current meta detoured the use of silence, but maybe after an expansion or two, the current price associated with silence will be more in line, thus making it more luring from a value standpoint.
The worst effects that you would normally silence are generally deathrattles (Cairne, Sylvanas, Tirion, Anub'arak). However, these can still come back through N'Zoth. If you transform them, they're gone for good. Similarly with C'Thun, if you transform him, he can't be returned with Doomcaller while silencing him still allows this.
Ever since old gods, i have been seeing silence effects less and less, yet, ive seen the transformation spells played more often. Are the bodies we are getting with abilites just too big to be caring about their effects, because just as a point, c'thuun silenced is only a 6/6, which could make a massive difference on how to remove it, but it's still big, or is it because silence effects are almost entirely single targeted? Im an old school shaman player, have been since beta, and im always wondering why i don't have at least 1 earth shock around. Most certainly against divine shield paladin, and several other often played cards, like trogg and silvanus, it just feels like we are ignoring it for numbers. Would this be acurate, and if so, what would make silence worth playing again?
Earth shock is not worth playing because shaman has so many better cards that there is no room for it.
To be honest im happy with silence played less. Its so annoying if u ply a Deathrattel Legendary or buff a card and it gets instantly silenced. Without Silence there are more ways to play special card and there are still tons of other removal :D
It think it just shows that the Ironbeak Owl nerf actually worked. Silence is still a powerful effect, but at 3 mana for a 2/1 Owl it just feels bad to tech one in when there's an abundance of other great 3-drops to play. You still see them and Spellbreakers in Reno lists though.
The reason why is because of Owl getting nerfed. This changed everything as far as silence value. Now more people play spellbreaker but even a 4/3 4 cost is not amazing compared to what owl used to be.
It seems like there are really two factors at play - (1) cheap, neutral silence (Ironbeak Owl) is gone and, perhaps more importantly, (2) there just aren't that many targets for it anymore. Of cards that are in heavy rotation, more or less the only ones left that you would rather silence than simply hard remove are Sylvanis and Cairne. Zoo, aggro shaman, and the tempo / aggro / dragon Warrior decks run essentially no viable silence targets.
If Pally were to come back into the meta in a meaningful way or new powerful deathrattles or minion buffs were introduced, there would be more incentive to carry a silence. As it stands, removal (or transformation if you're a Shaman or Mage) is just the much better meta choice, particularly since transform now costs more or less the same as silence.
Pretty much what i was coming to conclude. The game shifted, and after two years of silencing annoying deathrattles, i guess their removal meant i didnt need the silence anymore too, its a bit jarring, but getting to have interesting effects on the board defintely is a plus.
Bad players whine.
Good players adapt.
Yeah, I think the current meta detoured the use of silence, but maybe after an expansion or two, the current price associated with silence will be more in line, thus making it more luring from a value standpoint.
The worst effects that you would normally silence are generally deathrattles (Cairne, Sylvanas, Tirion, Anub'arak). However, these can still come back through N'Zoth. If you transform them, they're gone for good. Similarly with C'Thun, if you transform him, he can't be returned with Doomcaller while silencing him still allows this.