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SOME legendary cards are SOME of the best cards. There are class epics and rares that are just as good.
You keep harping that your only option is aggro if you don't have legedaries. That's been refuted multiple times, yet you ignore it. Here are some options.
Aggro
Zoolock
Hunter Rush
Mid-Range
Tempo Rogue
Control/Mid-Range Hybrid
Handlock
Poetic.
Card games can be frustrating, I understand OP's sentiment, I just hope I can get legend status before I feel the same way and quit.
Also anyone bringing up Trump as proof that you can be successful in f2p is completely missing the point, because trump is a top player who's job basically it is to play this game. The vast majority of people with real life jobs and school do not have the time (or inclination) to put the effort that trump puts into this game, and comparing anyone against trump is a false comparison (unless you are comparing him to kripp, reynad, garaa, ekop, etc). Comparing trump to any of us the rest of us mortals is like comparing a regular 9-5 worker who drives to work with a world-class F1 or NASCAR driver. It's just a totally different class of people.
You might need a lot of time, like Trump, to hit legendary, but you don't need a tonne of time to be a good player. Many casual players are quite competent with the game.
Poetic.
I don't really understand what you're complaining about or what your argument is. I guess it's a first world luxury your generation doesn't appreciate when you can play an excellent game for absolutely nothing. F2P never used to exist and it's always puzzling that people who play them now feel like they have any reason to whine about their experience, which was free.
Do you have an advantage if you buy packs? Of course. This is a sodding video game that costs money to produce, maintain and host. It would not exist otherwise without some form of financial system.
Go buy another disappointing COD game for $60 and bitch on their forums.
Holy shit that is alot of whining. What I see is a whining idiot who stumbled across the wrong game. You've spent hours and hours playing a FREE game with FREE cards and judging from your 1000 wins, a fun FREE experience. and now you're going nuts, refusing to play specific counters to these "pay2win" decks, or spend the hours to grind for these "pay2win" cards, or cough up the money and stop whining. paying players will get a headstart in this game. that's a fact. do you think blizzard is a charity or something? it's simple you have two options: you can either quit (and stop posting these threads nobody cares about) or actually pay for the fun you've had for the past months.
Uhh... that was exactly my argument. Thank you for confirming.
-Regarding this being Blizzard's generous gift to us and the ability to play for free should be cherished...
Blizzard is nobody's friends and their decisions revolve around profit. They're goal is to get you in the door then pay an arm and a leg if you want to actually stay. That model, while relatively new to video games, has been around for ever... see razor blades.
Free to play exists in games like LoL and Dota, yet they are cosmetic upgrades. They don't give you a gameplay advantage like you so nicely stated above and I provided a quote for. In Dota you can have a purple sword instead of a green one, in hearthstone you get an 8/8 creature that does an immediate charge burst attack for 8 more damage every single turn.
There is no gameplay advantage. All spending money does is give you a headstart. There are no cards that are available exclusively to paying customers (you could say golden Gelbin Mekkatorque, but regular Gelbin can be crafted by anyone, and the golden version offers no advantages). Every card in this game is available to everybody, whether you pay money or not.
It's not Pay-to-Win, it's Pay-to-Headstart. What this boils down to is that you're jealous that people can afford to get a headstart over you.
And Blizzard is my friend. We exchange emails and phone each other at Christmas.
It's becoming increasingly difficult to continue this conversation with you, without questioning your mental faculties. So I won't, because I'd rather not receive the warning. You can continue thinking that Blizzard owes you something, but they do not. If you want the cards quicker, then pony up some cash. Otherwise, continue grinding them out for free. Or quit. I don't care either way. There are lots of players playing Hearthstone, lots of competition. You will not be missed.
Poetic.
Just throwing some data/math......................If I start today (downloaded for my iPad or installed on my PC).
Of course I am assuming you will craft every card. If you feel I'm trying to fool you, consider the dust on crafting other cards as the price to get some early craftings for other decks. The "non legendary" cards are way cheaper, and this deck "only" has 5 Legendaries(8k dust).
My point is: you either pay and get a huge boost in your collection or Play before even really start playing your favorite decks/cards. Also, please,stop comparing this to other trading card games. They are not F2P(you need to purchase your cards).
By the way, I won't stop playing. As I said before(page 1 I believe) I have been playing some ocasional games each day. I just feel like this data (dust/pack, gold/week, grinding hours) can really improve the conversation
Edit: Can I call this Play to Play? I mean, you are playing before even having your time playing what you like. Unlike many games, this game doesn't "progress", you play match after match and you will keep the same deck until you can build your personal deck.
Just getting my achievement
Pay-to-Win is not a euphemism at all. It's a term thrown around at F2P games where you can get a clear advantage over other players by spending money, usually very poorly designed F2P games. In other words, you can only attain certain things by spending money on the game. There is nothing in Hearthstone that someone paying for packs can get that another person can not. I put 50 bucks into the game when I first got into the closed beta and I haven't put any money into it since then. In those packs I think I got two legendaries. I have crafted/obtained through packs by playing the game; Ragnaros, Ysera, Grommash, Cenarius, Leeroy, Bloodmage Thanos, Cairne, Alexstrasza, and Captain Greenskin. All of those obtained from crafting or free packs from gold/arena.
What do you even expect from this game? I'm very much starting to doubt your knowledge of the game and your claim that you have won 1000 games. It's already been stated numerous times in this thread on simple cards that deal with legendaries, but you refuse to even acknowledge these because there's that one time where you didn't have that card in your hand. Luck of the draw works both ways too, i've sat through games on my warrior with my opponent clinging to life and all I need was a Grommash charge to finish them and I never got it, and on the flip side of that. A senjin shieldmasta that was standing in the way of Grommash finishing off the opponent because it has taunt and I can't get to his face. Or it just get's hexed, poly'd, silenced, executed, assassinated. You even brought these up in your original post. But somehow these are bad ways of neutralizing the cards? Of course there will be times when you don't have the card in your hand, but that's just the nature of a card game.
It seems like you just want the game to be played the way YOU think it should be played. Perhaps it's just that you don't understand the game as well as you think you do.
Fantastic post and a great contribution to this thread.
I would only take issue with one point of data that was presented. The 70% win rate. That is astronomical for someone in a situation with no p2w cards. I don't think even Trumps Zoo is 70%.
So if you factor a more reasonable win rate of 50% you can see how the numbers you presented balloon even greater then what you already stated.
Either way, great post and it really helps put into perspective the absurd amount of time you would need to invest to really compete with the p2w crowd or to play the game the way you want.
There are no P2W cards in Hearthstone. Why do you refuse to acknowledge that? There are no cards available exclusively to paying customers.
Poetic.
you're wasting your time man. the guy is just venting in stupidity
Asking mod to take action against this clear personal attack.
Wondering if you could give me a number as to how many times you need to be told that "pay2win" is a euphemism.
Would you prefer pay for major advantage? does it make you feel better.
I have no legendaries and have beaten people with 4 in a deck many times. I have also been beaten by one single overpowered legendary a multiple of 10 times that. Because the first statement is true DOES NOT invalidate the gravity of the second. It is a matter of measure and relativity.
Okay look's like you're using LoL as a non pay2win comparison Hearthstone. Not to mention they're entirely different genres but w/e:
Let's say in LoL, Renekton is an overpowered, top of the meta 6300 IP champion. Let's say in Hearthstone, it's equivalent is Ragnaros, a 1600 Dust Legendary. Both require MAJOR grinding (to grind 6300 IP it takes ~a month according to a calc) and you have the data for the time it takes to gather 1600 dust right here in this thread. Because you don't have these expensive, powerful champions/cards you complain and call the game pay2win when in reality it's pay to SKIP THE GRIND. and don't give me ur euphemism bullshit. meanwhile during this grind for apparently gamebreaking champions/cards, you have the option of using 450 IP champions or zoo or hunter decks that are extremely cheap. Some of these champions and decks actually COUNTER the above mentioned expensive ones, yet you REFUSE to use them. Whose fault is that? Yours. Now because you believe blizzard should act as a charity you come here on the forums and to make this whiny thread. and that's the worst solution available in this case.
I don't know if my opinion here matters at all (sounds like a lot of opinions are being thrown around in here), but I have little problem facing a bunch of Ragnaroses or Leeroys or whatever. Yes, it is annoying, but you can deal with it. I've only read the past page, so I don't know if you don't like them because you play only cards that can't counter them (ie, not using polymorph/assassinate/hex/taunts/whatever else). Honestly, the one deck that aggravates me THE MOST is the Unleash the Hounds hunter deck, which is every single hunter deck lol.
I should also say, yes, I have paid a bit. I have spent $20 on packs, and every now and then I purchase an arena run, because I have more fun in arenas.
Edit: Just saw that you were the topic creator here, and that you have won 1000 games. Congratulations! However, this makes me wonder even more why you still think this is P2P.
All I'm trying to say is, sure, it's a tiny advantage. If you build a good enough deck consisting of solid blues and even some solid purples, you will do just fine. Ask someone for help building a decent deck instead of bitching here.
Twitch name: Anatak15
NA Legend Season 48, 49, 52, 53, 54, 74
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=xzpndHtdl9A
seriously though, Blizzard is a company and of course they want to make money with their games. Yet they they give you the opportunity to play this game without having to spend any money on it.
now you have 3 choices:
-you can either "pay to get ahead" as you put it.
-you can play for free, because you enjoy the challenge and have fun playing this game.
-you can just not play this game
I don't get why you are making such a fuss. If you don't think this is fair or you don't enjoy it, just stop playing ... ez
Everything you said is so broken.
No champion in LoL is "overpowered", they release patches every week to make sure that very thing is not the case. It would break the game to have a blatantly broken champion. Ragnoros on the other hand is blatantly broken as compared to other common mana costing basic cards. There is a clear and obvious advantage in using him compared to a corehound.
Second, I have mentioned about 4 times now an absolutely reasonable way for which this game could be made fair and profitable. I will mention it for a 5th time now because your reading and comprehension skills don't seem particularly acute.
Charge $35 for all the cards, open a marketplace on top of that that accepts in game earned gold as well as real money for a myriad of customizable features(card backs/Hero portraits/Voice Packs/Board Skins). I think one professional artist could create 20 card backs in a single day, it is a basic 4x6 jpeg and they could sell them at 600 gold a pop. Create separate ladders for arena and constructed.
That would be the fair and extremely profitable way of handling it, instead they choose the diablo 3 auction house type of gauging their customers and burying them in micro transactions. They got slammed and embarrassed for doing it in diablo, unfortunately I don't believe the casual card game crowd playing on Ipad is adept enough to realize the scam.
Well have fun with your theories, the facts are here. I haven't paid anything, never played aggro in ladder last season and yet reached rank 2. To be honest, at 1000 wins, I don't see why you couldn't do the same. Out of curiosity, how many of these wins were in arena?