The aggro deck has no late game. Blow their 2 boards and you win. The late game deck drops to aggro decks. You are not facing both decks at the same time.
The aggro deck has no late game. Blow their 2 boards and you win. The late game deck drops to aggro decks. You are not facing both decks at the same time.
According to Hearthpwn Druid is a Tier 0 broken unbeatable class with 20 mana and no weaknesses
At this point just start running Altar of Fire lmfao
yeah, low ranked players tend to hate druid... probably because you pass 50 turns and let the druid do whatever he wants. i don't have a 100% win rate vs druid either (although, it's highly above 50%). playing mutanus, theotar and/or voljin at appropriate times makes them concede easily. i'm mostly playing mage and priest and those are the classes, that people think, druid counters. the game has never had so much emphasis on strategy, instead of mindlessly dropping minions on board, like it was the case until this expansion... yet people complain.
The aggro deck has no late game. Blow their 2 boards and you win. The late game deck drops to aggro decks. You are not facing both decks at the same time.
"2 boards" is this a time traveling prank from 2014 ?
All modern aggro decks have late game, they have board until they have no card. I am not discussing druid power level here, just your comment about aggro decks that is full of shit. Also control/combo druid is the best at dealing with aggro compared to other combo/control classes because they have ramp and more armor than warriors. Then again I'm a Wild player so maybe I'm biased but you're still full of shit, you can't just dumb down the game design like this and call it a rule.
The reason why people hate druids is because they check every deck that isn't full meta, they have too many good tools against a wide variety of decks that aren't tier 1 or 2. You cannot have fun against druid, druid forces extremely competitive environment.
Also druid has good board removal now (scales, topior, etc), and this is complete heresy, and it does break balance in a way that is unfair for the other classes and forces stupid game design and powercreep to compensate.
If I could name one thing that has ruined Hearthstone in the long run, and that isn't Blizzard's greed, I would say Druid any day.
yeah, low ranked players tend to hate druid... probably because you pass 50 turns and let the druid do whatever he wants. i don't have a 100% win rate vs druid either (although, it's highly above 50%). playing mutanus, theotar and/or voljin at appropriate times makes them concede easily. i'm mostly playing mage and priest and those are the classes, that people think, druid counters. the game has never had so much emphasis on strategy, instead of mindlessly dropping minions on board, like it was the case until this expansion... yet people complain.
If you have to play mutanus, theotar or vol'jin to counter druid, you're kinda proving the point that druid is OP and unhealthy.
i'm mostly playing mage and priest and those are the classes, that people think, druid counters.
Said no one ever.
the game has never had so much emphasis on strategy
yeah, low ranked players tend to hate druid... probably because you pass 50 turns and let the druid do whatever he wants. i don't have a 100% win rate vs druid either (although, it's highly above 50%). playing mutanus, theotar and/or voljin at appropriate times makes them concede easily. i'm mostly playing mage and priest and those are the classes, that people think, druid counters. the game has never had so much emphasis on strategy, instead of mindlessly dropping minions on board, like it was the case until this expansion... yet people complain.
If you have to play mutanus, theotar or vol'jin to counter druid, you're kinda proving the point that druid is OP and unhealthy.
i'm mostly playing mage and priest and those are the classes, that people think, druid counters.
Said no one ever.
the game has never had so much emphasis on strategy
Said no one ever.
except that everyone is saying that druid is considered a strong matchup (counter) for mages. it's the main reason why druid is around. aggro decks counter druid. mage destroys aggro decks (and druids main counters). druid gets stronger because there aren't as many aggro decks. in a nutshell, mages deleting aggro from the game might be the single reason that's enabling all of this. by nerfing mage next patch, aggro and board heavy decks might become more popular and druid would get crushed by them.
If you have to play mutanus, theotar or vol'jin to counter druid, you're kinda proving the point that druid is OP and unhealthy.
it's not just druid, that's how most classes work this expansion. there's a clear win condition most decks play, which have to get sniped and countered in some way. for example, a rogue has edwin and drakka, with edwin being what sire denathrius is to druid. a quest priest relies on quest completion and losing the generated card instantly loses the game for priest. and so on...
Said no one ever.
you're a typical complainer (and there are many more just like yourself), failing to search for a solution of a problem. you copy and paste decks and expect to win just by brainlessly playing cards. i mean, that works up to a point and struggling vs druid proves your poor game sense, crafting ability and thinking ability. when some problem presents itself, you give up. sure man, you do you - whatever gets you through life. basically every single time i reached legend, i did it with an off-meta deck. i hate games that limit my creativity and hearthstone wasn't allowing it for a long time and it's why i preferred more challenging or mentally difficult (card) games. the last 2 expansions were/are phenomenal in that department and devs really did a great job with them. oh and btw, i got to legend using my handcrafted dragon priest and i've only good things to say about it. anyway, have fun dude.
PetitMouche the wild player comes and tells standard players how the meta works and spices in insults. Hilarious and ironic. While it is not very simple and games boil down to early draw, aggro druid suffers from inability to reliably draw and inability to regain the board. So usually if you blow them twice as either board based deck or control deck with aoe, you win most of the time. As for ramp, other control deck have to run hand disruption to stop denathrius. You caomplain about thoae running that? What? And yeah druid is string but people only pointed out both archetypes are beatable. I hope you understand the standard meta a bit better now. It has no connection to wild at all.
The aggro deck has no late game. Blow their 2 boards and you win. The late game deck drops to aggro decks. You are not facing both decks at the same time.
"2 boards" is this a time traveling prank from 2014 ?
All modern aggro decks have late game, they have board until they have no card. I am not discussing druid power level here, just your comment about aggro decks that is full of shit. Also control/combo druid is the best at dealing with aggro compared to other combo/control classes because they have ramp and more armor than warriors. Then again I'm a Wild player so maybe I'm biased but you're still full of shit, you can't just dumb down the game design like this and call it a rule.
The reason why people hate druids is because they check every deck that isn't full meta, they have too many good tools against a wide variety of decks that aren't tier 1 or 2. You cannot have fun against druid, druid forces extremely competitive environment.
Also druid has good board removal now (scales, topior, etc), and this is complete heresy, and it does break balance in a way that is unfair for the other classes and forces stupid game design and powercreep to compensate.
If I could name one thing that has ruined Hearthstone in the long run, and that isn't Blizzard's greed, I would say Druid any day.
Honestly, I’ve never lost a game to aggro Druid if I could clear their board once. They have no way to draw cards if I clear the board around round 4 or 5. Then it’s smooth sailing, they’ll concede or try to regain board but by that time it’s turn 5 and 6 and usually can’t handle the counter offensive. I run Warlock, just draw cards until one of my aoe shows up, use and win. Their minions are low health and easy to dispatch. Because if it’s ramp Druid…
Then unless you can disrupt Denathtrius, it’s game over. The mechanic of Denathtrius is counter intuitive. It rewards the player from losing a lot of minions and essentially punishes the opponent for finding ways to clear the board, which is the foundation of Hearthstone. The comment about just stealing Denathtrius is myopic. I’d say Denathtrius is the most unhealthy card ever printed because of the design philosophy behind it. It doesn’t have much setup (just repeatedly use minions as fodder) and can end up dealing a huge amount of damage, essentially TKO+healing+having a 10/10 on board which you’d better be able to clear unless it’s even more healing after. It’s incredibly broken and harmful. You might argue than Quest Priest can win the game with a single card but at least it requires a lot of setup.
He’s next on the nerf block, has to be. What’s funny is that even if they removed the lifesteal (or the 10/10 stats) it would make no difference to Druid. The only way to possibly nerf this would be to cap the damage, or maybe have it start to 0 as opposed to 5 to delay it (without killing the card). A lesson to be learned that ‘infinite’ is seldom a good concept in a card game.
yeah, low ranked players tend to hate druid... probably because you pass 50 turns and let the druid do whatever he wants. i don't have a 100% win rate vs druid either (although, it's highly above 50%). playing mutanus, theotar and/or voljin at appropriate times makes them concede easily. i'm mostly playing mage and priest and those are the classes, that people think, druid counters. the game has never had so much emphasis on strategy, instead of mindlessly dropping minions on board, like it was the case until this expansion... yet people complain.
If you have to play mutanus, theotar or vol'jin to counter druid, you're kinda proving the point that druid is OP and unhealthy.
i'm mostly playing mage and priest and those are the classes, that people think, druid counters.
Said no one ever.
the game has never had so much emphasis on strategy
Said no one ever.
except that everyone is saying that druid is considered a strong matchup (counter) for mages. it's the main reason why druid is around. aggro decks counter druid. mage destroys aggro decks (and druids main counters). druid gets stronger because there aren't as many aggro decks. in a nutshell, mages deleting aggro from the game might be the single reason that's enabling all of this. by nerfing mage next patch, aggro and board heavy decks might become more popular and druid would get crushed by them.
If you have to play mutanus, theotar or vol'jin to counter druid, you're kinda proving the point that druid is OP and unhealthy.
it's not just druid, that's how most classes work this expansion. there's a clear win condition most decks play, which have to get sniped and countered in some way. for example, a rogue has edwin and drakka, with edwin being what sire denathrius is to druid. a quest priest relies on quest completion and losing the generated card instantly loses the game for priest. and so on...
Said no one ever.
you're a typical complainer (and there are many more just like yourself), failing to search for a solution of a problem. you copy and paste decks and expect to win just by brainlessly playing cards. i mean, that works up to a point and struggling vs druid proves your poor game sense, crafting ability and thinking ability. when some problem presents itself, you give up. sure man, you do you - whatever gets you through life. basically every single time i reached legend, i did it with an off-meta deck. i hate games that limit my creativity and hearthstone wasn't allowing it for a long time and it's why i preferred more challenging or mentally difficult (card) games. the last 2 expansions were/are phenomenal in that department and devs really did a great job with them. oh and btw, i got to legend using my handcrafted dragon priest and i've only good things to say about it. anyway, have fun dude.
you copy and paste decks and expect to win just by brainlessly playing cards
I can count on one hand the times I did that since I started playing the game in 2014 and I would beat you every day of the week in a deck building contest. Nice try though, but I will assume the rest of your post is as worthless as this statement of yours. By the way I only stated that druid is OP unhealthy and poorly designed compared to the rest of the classes, not that I personally have problems against druid.
You're making up stories about me to feel better and win unexisting arguments, that's kinda cute I'm glad to be such an important part of your life that you have to fantasize me.
it's not just druid, that's how most classes work this expansion. there's a clear win condition most decks play, which have to get sniped and countered in some way.
Or just get their health total to 0 you know. THAT's how most classes work in this and most other expansions. Never in the history of hearthstone was it required to disrupt your opponent's win condition to consistently win games. Except against druid.
PetitMouche the wild player comes and tells standard players how the meta works and spices in insults. Hilarious and ironic. While it is not very simple and games boil down to early draw, aggro druid suffers from inability to reliably draw and inability to regain the board. So usually if you blow them twice as either board based deck or control deck with aoe, you win most of the time. As for ramp, other control deck have to run hand disruption to stop denathrius. You caomplain about thoae running that? What? And yeah druid is string but people only pointed out both archetypes are beatable. I hope you understand the standard meta a bit better now. It has no connection to wild at all.
I play standard too you know. I stand by my statement, aggro decks can rebuild boards as long as they have cards and know how to play. What's hilarious and ironic is supporting the statement that aggro druid is dead after you clear 2 boards of them.
yeah, low ranked players tend to hate druid... probably because you pass 50 turns and let the druid do whatever he wants. i don't have a 100% win rate vs druid either (although, it's highly above 50%). playing mutanus, theotar and/or voljin at appropriate times makes them concede easily. i'm mostly playing mage and priest and those are the classes, that people think, druid counters. the game has never had so much emphasis on strategy, instead of mindlessly dropping minions on board, like it was the case until this expansion... yet people complain.
If you have to play mutanus, theotar or vol'jin to counter druid, you're kinda proving the point that druid is OP and unhealthy.
i'm mostly playing mage and priest and those are the classes, that people think, druid counters.
Said no one ever.
the game has never had so much emphasis on strategy
Said no one ever.
except that everyone is saying that druid is considered a strong matchup (counter) for mages. it's the main reason why druid is around. aggro decks counter druid. mage destroys aggro decks (and druids main counters). druid gets stronger because there aren't as many aggro decks. in a nutshell, mages deleting aggro from the game might be the single reason that's enabling all of this. by nerfing mage next patch, aggro and board heavy decks might become more popular and druid would get crushed by them.
If you have to play mutanus, theotar or vol'jin to counter druid, you're kinda proving the point that druid is OP and unhealthy.
it's not just druid, that's how most classes work this expansion. there's a clear win condition most decks play, which have to get sniped and countered in some way. for example, a rogue has edwin and drakka, with edwin being what sire denathrius is to druid. a quest priest relies on quest completion and losing the generated card instantly loses the game for priest. and so on...
Said no one ever.
you're a typical complainer (and there are many more just like yourself), failing to search for a solution of a problem. you copy and paste decks and expect to win just by brainlessly playing cards. i mean, that works up to a point and struggling vs druid proves your poor game sense, crafting ability and thinking ability. when some problem presents itself, you give up. sure man, you do you - whatever gets you through life. basically every single time i reached legend, i did it with an off-meta deck. i hate games that limit my creativity and hearthstone wasn't allowing it for a long time and it's why i preferred more challenging or mentally difficult (card) games. the last 2 expansions were/are phenomenal in that department and devs really did a great job with them. oh and btw, i got to legend using my handcrafted dragon priest and i've only good things to say about it. anyway, have fun dude.
you copy and paste decks and expect to win just by brainlessly playing cards
I can count on one hand the times I did that since I started playing the game in 2014 and I would beat you every day of the week in a deck building contest. Nice try though, but I will assume the rest of your post is as worthless as this statement of yours. By the way I only stated that druid is OP unhealthy and poorly designed compared to the rest of the classes, not that I personally have problems against druid.
You're making up stories about me to feel better and win unexisting arguments, that's kinda cute I'm glad to be such an important part of your life that you have to fantasize me.
it's not just druid, that's how most classes work this expansion. there's a clear win condition most decks play, which have to get sniped and countered in some way.
Or just get their health total to 0 you know. THAT's how most classes work in this and most other expansions. Never in the history of hearthstone was it required to disrupt your opponent's win condition to consistently win games. Except against druid.
and why is it that you only have to disrupt druid? is it because they all run a certain neutral card named sire denathrius? the druid by itself is not the problem, it's denathrius, to which everyone has access. druid just stacks him up better than other classes do and can find him more easily, due to having a lot of card draw and expanded mana pool (due to guff). by simply nerfing denathrius (for example, capping his battlecry to 20 or making it take 2 infuse per damage increase), the druid is no longer a threat to anyone. actually, that kind of nerf might even delete it from the game. they rely on a single card, which isn't even a class specific but a neutral card and you're talking about having to disrupt a druid and making it sound like it's really a class problem, instead of a neutral legendary problem. brann is also a huge culprit in this meta, which is also a neutral card. the only thing druid does better than the rest is finding those cards - which are neutral cards and not druid-specific. hopefully this clarifies it.
The main way aggro druid draws cards is peasant and tuskar. Take care of them and they qill be forced to all in. And they cannot come back easily after 2 clears, when they have 1-3 cards in hand. Often they are stuck with dead byff cards in hand too. Control has board clears, imp locks can fight for board and rogue can out-tempo with cheap removal and gnolls. I never said druid is bad, but there are ways to stop both decks, statement by which i will always stand. And the only way you lose to druid after 2 clears is if you play too passively. In which case try to review your gameplay.
yeah, low ranked players tend to hate druid... probably because you pass 50 turns and let the druid do whatever he wants. i don't have a 100% win rate vs druid either (although, it's highly above 50%). playing mutanus, theotar and/or voljin at appropriate times makes them concede easily. i'm mostly playing mage and priest and those are the classes, that people think, druid counters. the game has never had so much emphasis on strategy, instead of mindlessly dropping minions on board, like it was the case until this expansion... yet people complain.
If you have to play mutanus, theotar or vol'jin to counter druid, you're kinda proving the point that druid is OP and unhealthy.
i'm mostly playing mage and priest and those are the classes, that people think, druid counters.
Said no one ever.
the game has never had so much emphasis on strategy
Said no one ever.
except that everyone is saying that druid is considered a strong matchup (counter) for mages. it's the main reason why druid is around. aggro decks counter druid. mage destroys aggro decks (and druids main counters). druid gets stronger because there aren't as many aggro decks. in a nutshell, mages deleting aggro from the game might be the single reason that's enabling all of this. by nerfing mage next patch, aggro and board heavy decks might become more popular and druid would get crushed by them.
If you have to play mutanus, theotar or vol'jin to counter druid, you're kinda proving the point that druid is OP and unhealthy.
it's not just druid, that's how most classes work this expansion. there's a clear win condition most decks play, which have to get sniped and countered in some way. for example, a rogue has edwin and drakka, with edwin being what sire denathrius is to druid. a quest priest relies on quest completion and losing the generated card instantly loses the game for priest. and so on...
Said no one ever.
you're a typical complainer (and there are many more just like yourself), failing to search for a solution of a problem. you copy and paste decks and expect to win just by brainlessly playing cards. i mean, that works up to a point and struggling vs druid proves your poor game sense, crafting ability and thinking ability. when some problem presents itself, you give up. sure man, you do you - whatever gets you through life. basically every single time i reached legend, i did it with an off-meta deck. i hate games that limit my creativity and hearthstone wasn't allowing it for a long time and it's why i preferred more challenging or mentally difficult (card) games. the last 2 expansions were/are phenomenal in that department and devs really did a great job with them. oh and btw, i got to legend using my handcrafted dragon priest and i've only good things to say about it. anyway, have fun dude.
you copy and paste decks and expect to win just by brainlessly playing cards
I can count on one hand the times I did that since I started playing the game in 2014 and I would beat you every day of the week in a deck building contest. Nice try though, but I will assume the rest of your post is as worthless as this statement of yours. By the way I only stated that druid is OP unhealthy and poorly designed compared to the rest of the classes, not that I personally have problems against druid.
You're making up stories about me to feel better and win unexisting arguments, that's kinda cute I'm glad to be such an important part of your life that you have to fantasize me.
it's not just druid, that's how most classes work this expansion. there's a clear win condition most decks play, which have to get sniped and countered in some way.
Or just get their health total to 0 you know. THAT's how most classes work in this and most other expansions. Never in the history of hearthstone was it required to disrupt your opponent's win condition to consistently win games. Except against druid.
and why is it that you only have to disrupt druid? is it because they all run a certain neutral card named sire denathrius? the druid by itself is not the problem, it's denathrius, to which everyone has access. druid just stacks him up better than other classes do and can find him more easily, due to having a lot of card draw and expanded mana pool (due to guff). by simply nerfing denathrius (for example, capping his battlecry to 20 or making it take 2 infuse per damage increase), the druid is no longer a threat to anyone. actually, that kind of nerf might even delete it from the game. they rely on a single card, which isn't even a class specific but a neutral card and you're talking about having to disrupt a druid and making it sound like it's really a class problem, instead of a neutral legendary problem. brann is also a huge culprit in this meta, which is also a neutral card. the only thing druid does better than the rest is finding those cards - which are neutral cards and not druid-specific. hopefully this clarifies it.
I don't think denathrius is a problem in other classes, and it's nowhere near the core of druid's problem. Guff is more like it, or scale of onyxia, or celestial alignment (even post post nerf), or that epic weed man thing that ramps and draws and tempos at the same time.
But you point out exactly what I was talking about earlier, that because of druid, devs have to come up with weird fixes that seemingly fix the game for a moment, until another druid card breaks everything. Denathrius is a fine card, druid is not a fine class.
Brann is fine too. Brann and denathrius together are fine too, except where ? You guessed it, druid who can play them together easily. Just because the cards are the most played cards in the format doesn't make them bad for the game, quite the opposite if you ask me.
Druid's game design nowadays is basically "break the rules of hearthstone and call it a class identity".
I believe that scale of onyxia is the single worst mistake the devs have ever made in this game. And it will haunt the game for years to come, because it sets a bad precedent. Thank you for not insulting my ability to play the game or build decks anymore I appreciate it.
I agree man, this is the most fun I've had in standard in a while. The Quests were a terrible idea and burned me out. It was easy to hit Legend with Warrior Pirate Wild or Hunter Quest but man it was boring and like playing solitaire. Now, there is much more thought and analysis on when to play what and actual board control. As someone who enjoys Control decks, I'm really enjoying this standard meta. Is Guff a little OP? Possibly. As you mentioned later on, Denathrius is the main culprit on a lot of the issues currently in play. Good analysis on this and your later posts in this thread.
Regarding Aggro Druid in Standard, if you can survive early few turns to starfish/clear their board they run out of gas extremely quick. Pretty much by turn 4 or 5 the game is decided, not sure what cards Mouche guy thinks Aggro Druid has access to. There's no Hunter Quick Shot etc. Alas, to each their own but I'm highly enjoying the game right now!
The main way aggro druid draws cards is peasant and tuskar. Take care of them and they qill be forced to all in. And they cannot come back easily after 2 clears, when they have 1-3 cards in hand. Often they are stuck with dead byff cards in hand too. Control has board clears, imp locks can fight for board and rogue can out-tempo with cheap removal and gnolls. I never said druid is bad, but there are ways to stop both decks, statement by which i will always stand. And the only way you lose to druid after 2 clears is if you play too passively. In which case try to review your gameplay.
There are ways to stop any deck, even truly OP decks that have been utterly destroyed by the devs like that Hysteria/Wretched tiller deck from years ago, or undertaker hunter from naxxramas era (a pretty easy deck to counter actually this one, yet it's still considered one of the most powerful and problematic decks of all time). It is not the point. Nothing is absolute in card games. But some things certainly are unhealthy and bad for the game's future. Druid forcing powercreep of other classes which in turn forces powercreep of druid in an endless cycle is one of them. God help me if people can't see a problem with druid cards that are printed nowadays.
It's like that old saying "warlocks get the worst cards because they have the best hero power" do you remember that ? The game was actually balanced properly (more than it is today anyway) when this was still a game design rule.
And the only way you lose to druid after 2 clears is if you play too passively. In which case try to review your gameplay.
That isn't a fair statement in a rock/paper/scissor game. If your deck is too slow or passive it isn't about how you play it it's just the way it is (and it's fine, not complaining, just saying your statement is a bit dumb and you should stop telling people to play better in a kids game where every one and their mother can get legend, there is hardly any skill in this game beyond knowing how to read, how to count up to 10 and how to install a deck tracker, you don't play better than anyone else, except your 4 years old niece maybe, and nobody plays better than you either, except maybe that one content creator who plays the game 18 hours a day). Some other decks just don't have clears at all and rely purely on mulligan card quality to determine the outcome of the game. Anyway I don't care about aggro druid is it well beyond the point of this discussion at this point in time, and I will give you guys the win that standard aggro druid is easily destroyed after 2 clears, because apparently it is a very shitty deck and people are not willing to add more card draw to it. I would not play any aggro deck that loses after 2 clears personally, be it standard or wild.
I have a board of 7 - 4/4’s on turn 4, I’m also the best late game class. Welcome to DruidStone. Cause when your here… your fucked.
The aggro deck has no late game. Blow their 2 boards and you win. The late game deck drops to aggro decks. You are not facing both decks at the same time.
According to Hearthpwn Druid is a Tier 0 broken unbeatable class with 20 mana and no weaknesses
At this point just start running Altar of Fire lmfao
And.... Then get wiped easilly by Ping/Skeletal Mage.
yeah, low ranked players tend to hate druid... probably because you pass 50 turns and let the druid do whatever he wants. i don't have a 100% win rate vs druid either (although, it's highly above 50%). playing mutanus, theotar and/or voljin at appropriate times makes them concede easily. i'm mostly playing mage and priest and those are the classes, that people think, druid counters. the game has never had so much emphasis on strategy, instead of mindlessly dropping minions on board, like it was the case until this expansion... yet people complain.
"2 boards" is this a time traveling prank from 2014 ?
All modern aggro decks have late game, they have board until they have no card. I am not discussing druid power level here, just your comment about aggro decks that is full of shit. Also control/combo druid is the best at dealing with aggro compared to other combo/control classes because they have ramp and more armor than warriors. Then again I'm a Wild player so maybe I'm biased but you're still full of shit, you can't just dumb down the game design like this and call it a rule.
The reason why people hate druids is because they check every deck that isn't full meta, they have too many good tools against a wide variety of decks that aren't tier 1 or 2. You cannot have fun against druid, druid forces extremely competitive environment.
Also druid has good board removal now (scales, topior, etc), and this is complete heresy, and it does break balance in a way that is unfair for the other classes and forces stupid game design and powercreep to compensate.
If I could name one thing that has ruined Hearthstone in the long run, and that isn't Blizzard's greed, I would say Druid any day.
If you have to play mutanus, theotar or vol'jin to counter druid, you're kinda proving the point that druid is OP and unhealthy.
Said no one ever.
Said no one ever.
except that everyone is saying that druid is considered a strong matchup (counter) for mages. it's the main reason why druid is around. aggro decks counter druid. mage destroys aggro decks (and druids main counters). druid gets stronger because there aren't as many aggro decks. in a nutshell, mages deleting aggro from the game might be the single reason that's enabling all of this. by nerfing mage next patch, aggro and board heavy decks might become more popular and druid would get crushed by them.
it's not just druid, that's how most classes work this expansion. there's a clear win condition most decks play, which have to get sniped and countered in some way. for example, a rogue has edwin and drakka, with edwin being what sire denathrius is to druid. a quest priest relies on quest completion and losing the generated card instantly loses the game for priest. and so on...
you're a typical complainer (and there are many more just like yourself), failing to search for a solution of a problem. you copy and paste decks and expect to win just by brainlessly playing cards. i mean, that works up to a point and struggling vs druid proves your poor game sense, crafting ability and thinking ability. when some problem presents itself, you give up. sure man, you do you - whatever gets you through life. basically every single time i reached legend, i did it with an off-meta deck. i hate games that limit my creativity and hearthstone wasn't allowing it for a long time and it's why i preferred more challenging or mentally difficult (card) games. the last 2 expansions were/are phenomenal in that department and devs really did a great job with them. oh and btw, i got to legend using my handcrafted dragon priest and i've only good things to say about it. anyway, have fun dude.
Just play Skeleton mage or Quest Priest and you have a pretty good chance against druid.
PetitMouche the wild player comes and tells standard players how the meta works and spices in insults. Hilarious and ironic. While it is not very simple and games boil down to early draw, aggro druid suffers from inability to reliably draw and inability to regain the board. So usually if you blow them twice as either board based deck or control deck with aoe, you win most of the time. As for ramp, other control deck have to run hand disruption to stop denathrius. You caomplain about thoae running that? What? And yeah druid is string but people only pointed out both archetypes are beatable. I hope you understand the standard meta a bit better now. It has no connection to wild at all.
Honestly, I’ve never lost a game to aggro Druid if I could clear their board once. They have no way to draw cards if I clear the board around round 4 or 5. Then it’s smooth sailing, they’ll concede or try to regain board but by that time it’s turn 5 and 6 and usually can’t handle the counter offensive. I run Warlock, just draw cards until one of my aoe shows up, use and win. Their minions are low health and easy to dispatch. Because if it’s ramp Druid…
Then unless you can disrupt Denathtrius, it’s game over. The mechanic of Denathtrius is counter intuitive. It rewards the player from losing a lot of minions and essentially punishes the opponent for finding ways to clear the board, which is the foundation of Hearthstone. The comment about just stealing Denathtrius is myopic. I’d say Denathtrius is the most unhealthy card ever printed because of the design philosophy behind it. It doesn’t have much setup (just repeatedly use minions as fodder) and can end up dealing a huge amount of damage, essentially TKO+healing+having a 10/10 on board which you’d better be able to clear unless it’s even more healing after. It’s incredibly broken and harmful. You might argue than Quest Priest can win the game with a single card but at least it requires a lot of setup.
He’s next on the nerf block, has to be. What’s funny is that even if they removed the lifesteal (or the 10/10 stats) it would make no difference to Druid. The only way to possibly nerf this would be to cap the damage, or maybe have it start to 0 as opposed to 5 to delay it (without killing the card). A lesson to be learned that ‘infinite’ is seldom a good concept in a card game.
I'm a druid player, and its not OP.
I can count on one hand the times I did that since I started playing the game in 2014 and I would beat you every day of the week in a deck building contest. Nice try though, but I will assume the rest of your post is as worthless as this statement of yours. By the way I only stated that druid is OP unhealthy and poorly designed compared to the rest of the classes, not that I personally have problems against druid.
You're making up stories about me to feel better and win unexisting arguments, that's kinda cute I'm glad to be such an important part of your life that you have to fantasize me.
Or just get their health total to 0 you know. THAT's how most classes work in this and most other expansions. Never in the history of hearthstone was it required to disrupt your opponent's win condition to consistently win games. Except against druid.
I play standard too you know. I stand by my statement, aggro decks can rebuild boards as long as they have cards and know how to play. What's hilarious and ironic is supporting the statement that aggro druid is dead after you clear 2 boards of them.
and why is it that you only have to disrupt druid? is it because they all run a certain neutral card named sire denathrius? the druid by itself is not the problem, it's denathrius, to which everyone has access. druid just stacks him up better than other classes do and can find him more easily, due to having a lot of card draw and expanded mana pool (due to guff). by simply nerfing denathrius (for example, capping his battlecry to 20 or making it take 2 infuse per damage increase), the druid is no longer a threat to anyone. actually, that kind of nerf might even delete it from the game. they rely on a single card, which isn't even a class specific but a neutral card and you're talking about having to disrupt a druid and making it sound like it's really a class problem, instead of a neutral legendary problem. brann is also a huge culprit in this meta, which is also a neutral card. the only thing druid does better than the rest is finding those cards - which are neutral cards and not druid-specific. hopefully this clarifies it.
The main way aggro druid draws cards is peasant and tuskar. Take care of them and they qill be forced to all in. And they cannot come back easily after 2 clears, when they have 1-3 cards in hand. Often they are stuck with dead byff cards in hand too. Control has board clears, imp locks can fight for board and rogue can out-tempo with cheap removal and gnolls. I never said druid is bad, but there are ways to stop both decks, statement by which i will always stand. And the only way you lose to druid after 2 clears is if you play too passively. In which case try to review your gameplay.
I don't think denathrius is a problem in other classes, and it's nowhere near the core of druid's problem. Guff is more like it, or scale of onyxia, or celestial alignment (even post post nerf), or that epic weed man thing that ramps and draws and tempos at the same time.
But you point out exactly what I was talking about earlier, that because of druid, devs have to come up with weird fixes that seemingly fix the game for a moment, until another druid card breaks everything. Denathrius is a fine card, druid is not a fine class.
Brann is fine too. Brann and denathrius together are fine too, except where ? You guessed it, druid who can play them together easily. Just because the cards are the most played cards in the format doesn't make them bad for the game, quite the opposite if you ask me.
Druid's game design nowadays is basically "break the rules of hearthstone and call it a class identity".
I believe that scale of onyxia is the single worst mistake the devs have ever made in this game. And it will haunt the game for years to come, because it sets a bad precedent. Thank you for not insulting my ability to play the game or build decks anymore I appreciate it.
I agree man, this is the most fun I've had in standard in a while. The Quests were a terrible idea and burned me out. It was easy to hit Legend with Warrior Pirate Wild or Hunter Quest but man it was boring and like playing solitaire. Now, there is much more thought and analysis on when to play what and actual board control. As someone who enjoys Control decks, I'm really enjoying this standard meta. Is Guff a little OP? Possibly. As you mentioned later on, Denathrius is the main culprit on a lot of the issues currently in play. Good analysis on this and your later posts in this thread.
Regarding Aggro Druid in Standard, if you can survive early few turns to starfish/clear their board they run out of gas extremely quick. Pretty much by turn 4 or 5 the game is decided, not sure what cards Mouche guy thinks Aggro Druid has access to. There's no Hunter Quick Shot etc. Alas, to each their own but I'm highly enjoying the game right now!
There are ways to stop any deck, even truly OP decks that have been utterly destroyed by the devs like that Hysteria/Wretched tiller deck from years ago, or undertaker hunter from naxxramas era (a pretty easy deck to counter actually this one, yet it's still considered one of the most powerful and problematic decks of all time). It is not the point. Nothing is absolute in card games. But some things certainly are unhealthy and bad for the game's future. Druid forcing powercreep of other classes which in turn forces powercreep of druid in an endless cycle is one of them. God help me if people can't see a problem with druid cards that are printed nowadays.
It's like that old saying "warlocks get the worst cards because they have the best hero power" do you remember that ? The game was actually balanced properly (more than it is today anyway) when this was still a game design rule.
That isn't a fair statement in a rock/paper/scissor game. If your deck is too slow or passive it isn't about how you play it it's just the way it is (and it's fine, not complaining, just saying your statement is a bit dumb and you should stop telling people to play better in a kids game where every one and their mother can get legend, there is hardly any skill in this game beyond knowing how to read, how to count up to 10 and how to install a deck tracker, you don't play better than anyone else, except your 4 years old niece maybe, and nobody plays better than you either, except maybe that one content creator who plays the game 18 hours a day). Some other decks just don't have clears at all and rely purely on mulligan card quality to determine the outcome of the game. Anyway I don't care about aggro druid is it well beyond the point of this discussion at this point in time, and I will give you guys the win that standard aggro druid is easily destroyed after 2 clears, because apparently it is a very shitty deck and people are not willing to add more card draw to it. I would not play any aggro deck that loses after 2 clears personally, be it standard or wild.
You know how you recognise a bad player? He/she is claiming there is no skill involved in the game