This is my opinion, and no i dont whine because i cant win or get legend anymore. I have made legend every month since april this year, but lets be honoust, the questlines limit creativity and control archetypes that have the game continue until turn 10 and later.
SO...
Questlines ruined hearthstone wild. Especially the hunter, warrior and warlock questlines. Blizzard did something to prevent warlock to dominate wild, but has done nothing to hunter and warrior.
When the warrior questline is done and active as like the hunters, its usually game over unless you can rush them to death.
Now with the new upcomming hero cards and stuf, i am afraid that they will not be seen in Wild, because they will be just too slow. Unless there is some real quest disruption in the future i sincerely believe that wild-stone will have the questline decks dominate the wild meta and no notably new deck will be presented.
That being said, we need Blizzard to ban the questlines from wild, so that there will be a more variable in decks comming to wild.
What do you think and how do you think we can have Blizzard do that.
Rollback Post to RevisionRollBack
To live is to suffer, to survive is to find meaning in the suffer!
I agree wild is not fun anymore. Its easy to hit legend, but deck building is very limited and games are boring because of warrior and hunter questlines. I dont know if we can do something. Iam so pissed that Iam making deck that are made only to f**k with them. Like priest with Kobold monk and Robes of protection vs hunter and rogue with Gollaka crawlers and Lab recruiters vs warrior, but it wont stop them.
I think they should implement sets into a new game mode like they do in Arena: Imagine a game where 5-7 sets were in play and they rotated every update; There could be Un'Goro, WOTOGs, GvG, Naxrammas, Scholomance, Alterac included for example.
It would keep things fresh and stop the current ethos of Wild mode.
I just don't get why they're so afraid to make a ban list. They've shown that they can, but for some reason, they won't. If Wild had a ban list, it'd be so much more fun.
I dont think that hunter is that big of a problem because with massive healing you can hard-counter them (for example odd druid). Pirate warrior is another story, I dont think that there is a hard-counter to them in the format. They have very strong early game with infinite value in the late-game and that combination should be never allowed in any format.
But dont get me wrong, I would vote "yes" to ban all of the questlines from wild if I had the opportunity, I just dont think that Blizzard would ever do such a thing.
Not all questlines are toxic. But yes, Warrior and Hunters quests need to be dealt with. Warlock's is already banned in wild, so that DOES help. Now if we can get rid of Warrior's and Hunter's, it'd loosen the choked grip on wild a little bit more.
We still need to work out Sorcerer's Apprentice for mage too. Spells should NOT be costing zero and letting your opponent BOTH cycle through entire decks while killing you from full health +10 or more armor sometimes on top of it. She needs to be banned too.
The trouble with this topic is Blizzard cared so little about wild as is, since the design teams have started changing so much, interest in wild balance has dwindled even more. I'm still shocked we were able to get the Warlock quest banned at all.
I just don't get why they're so afraid to make a ban list. They've shown that they can, but for some reason, they won't. If Wild had a ban list, it'd be so much more fun.
This would help greatly. Just ban 20ish cards for a while and see what happens. They can literally ban 2-3 cards for each of the top dog decks. Remove apprentice for mage, stone giant for lock, questline (and a bunch of pirates for warrior), quest for hunter, kingsbane for rogue, archmage vargoth for druid and priest, that 5-6 mana summon from deck for res priest....
They should just admit they really messed up with quests draining the fun out of the game and remove them from standard like the genn/baku situation. They warp the game in a very unfun way - they're too powerful so they eliminate other decks from seeing play. They're strong in wild too but with appropriate nerfs to hunter/pirate (slow them down, make it require 3/3/3 pirates and 3/3/3 spells) it'd be fine.
And make apprentice not able to reduce spells below 1 mana cheers.
And make apprentice not able to reduce spells below 1 mana cheers.
This should be true for any cost reduction, be it spells or minions. We have a finite amount of mana for a reason.
I don't understand why they are so impotent at giving everything a minimum cost of 1, unless the card was specifically designed to cost 0.
They admitted that card balance is hard and really hard, yet they do NOTHING to move away from powercreeping. Why is it so damn hard to understand that it won't affect your stupid sales if you give balanced cards in expansions instead of overpowered ones????!!!
Blizzard, your revenue comes mostly from the SAME PEOPLE (whales), the cosmetics, and other random dudes that had an incling to buy something. Seriously, stop catering to the "very fast life" meme, or at least make BOTH ways viable. I and others like me won't pay for anything until can have fun, and having fun, for us, means STABLE AND PREDICTABLE card cycles in terms of balance.
E.g.: why the hell should I pay for Alterac (which seems slower and MORE FUN for me), when i'm almost sure you'll fuck up the game again, the next year, with another "too fast" powercreep bullshit?!
The solution is NOT to alternate fast and slow metas to cater to both crowds, but to make them COEXIST, so that no one gets f-ed at the next card release date.
If you're afraid of the new cards not being interesting enough to be worth buying, there are better ways to do things instead of powercreeping:
- slow down the card release cycles! You must be paying your employees a fortune for the amount of work they have to do to come up with stuff this often.
- instead of some card releases, do events that last 30 days for example. Like diablo was in BGs. Yet, don't make them a powercreep variant! Push some bad archetypes with minor/temporary buffs, in these events (anything really, e.g. deathrattle druid) - like buffing each class in a certain way (e.g. holy cards in priest also summon a random 1-cost minion). There's so much you could do with this. Even some tavern brawl ideas could work here.
- fix the memory leaks and other stupid bugs! I'm sure more people will want to buy stuff if you started caring about the game's performance and other technical aspects instead of just shoving shop bundles in our faces. Unfortunately, the focus on this type of issues should've started long ago. The Blizzard that made Warcraft 3 would be gravely ashamed of what it has become...
- implement community card ideas, or allow them to be chosen in a different mode to play among friends.
- make people more inclined to become friends after a game, rather than fuck with each other's family in private chat. How? PLAY YOUR OWN GAME and see how frustrating certain archetypes or decks are to play against. Maybe that'll deter you from more powercreeping too.
Probably many other possible things to add, but i'm too tired to think about them. I'm sure a brainstorming session every week or so could provide excellent ideas (of course, if you also include more people in it, not just the design team or developers).
pirate warrior and quest hunter are not overpowered they are just good , easy to play, and very cheap on dust to craft
they are super popular and you hate them and lose to them just because you are bad player.... thats all
at moment in wild there are many decks as strong as them ( way more imho)
Rollback Post to RevisionRollBack
"because democracy basically means government by the people, of the people, for the people, but the people are retarded. So let us say: government by the retarded, for the retarded, of the retarded." - Osho Rajneesh
The most popular warrior wild deck sits at 71% winrate and the most popular hunter deck is at 64% (with a 68% better version just under in popularity). These winrates are absolutely crazy, higher than other non-bugged dominating wild decks have ever been in the past, and I'm amazed that nothing has been done about a 71% winrate deck.
As long as people buy f*** cosmetics for ridiculous prices, why would they even care about anything related to the quality of the game? it's just there to make money, not be a work of art like chess. Abandon all hope.
The most popular warrior wild deck sits at 71% winrate and the most popular hunter deck is at 64% (with a 68% better version just under in popularity). These winrates are absolutely crazy, higher than other non-bugged dominating wild decks have ever been in the past, and I'm amazed that nothing has been done about a 71% winrate deck.
just because they are all noobs who play on budget hunter/warrior vs other noobs who play against other budget hunter/warriors plz buy premium and check statistics for legend players
Rollback Post to RevisionRollBack
"because democracy basically means government by the people, of the people, for the people, but the people are retarded. So let us say: government by the retarded, for the retarded, of the retarded." - Osho Rajneesh
What they should do is make an algorithm... at the end of a month, they should look at the cards in that format and choose a couple of cards from the following categories and ban a few of them:
- most played card
- card that wins the game after being played
- cards in decks with over 65% winrate.
Rollback Post to RevisionRollBack
To live is to suffer, to survive is to find meaning in the suffer!
And make apprentice not able to reduce spells below 1 mana cheers.
The fire elemental deck is the most stupid deck ever since it's auto win turn 6 while doing nothing on board which is terrible game design (almost 100% of cards are collecting and the deck is so fast it doesn't need removal like OTK decks used to have) and because of the way it plays there are almost zero adjustments needed to the deck in any meta, ever, so that means from now on, the deck will always be there, which means that if you want to play a deck on ladder that has a chance to win, there will be zero incentive to ever invest in cards above 5 mana, which is sad since that also includes almost all upcoming hero cards. It might be wild, but it's still 10%? of the playerbase which means 10%? of their (hearthstone original game) revenue.
just because they are all noobs who play on budget hunter/warrior vs other noobs who play against other budget hunter/warriors plz buy premium and check statistics for legend players
Bronze through diamond are actual people who play the game too you know, it's not like their experience doesn't matter. I don't pay for anything HS related now but I can't imagine it being much different, given how legend is not hard at all to reach, just a time investment.
Rollback Post to RevisionRollBack
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This is my opinion, and no i dont whine because i cant win or get legend anymore. I have made legend every month since april this year, but lets be honoust, the questlines limit creativity and control archetypes that have the game continue until turn 10 and later.
SO...
Questlines ruined hearthstone wild. Especially the hunter, warrior and warlock questlines. Blizzard did something to prevent warlock to dominate wild, but has done nothing to hunter and warrior.
When the warrior questline is done and active as like the hunters, its usually game over unless you can rush them to death.
Now with the new upcomming hero cards and stuf, i am afraid that they will not be seen in Wild, because they will be just too slow. Unless there is some real quest disruption in the future i sincerely believe that wild-stone will have the questline decks dominate the wild meta and no notably new deck will be presented.
That being said, we need Blizzard to ban the questlines from wild, so that there will be a more variable in decks comming to wild.
What do you think and how do you think we can have Blizzard do that.
To live is to suffer, to survive is to find meaning in the suffer!
I agree wild is not fun anymore. Its easy to hit legend, but deck building is very limited and games are boring because of warrior and hunter questlines. I dont know if we can do something. Iam so pissed that Iam making deck that are made only to f**k with them. Like priest with Kobold monk and Robes of protection vs hunter and rogue with Gollaka crawlers and Lab recruiters vs warrior, but it wont stop them.
I think they should implement sets into a new game mode like they do in Arena:
Imagine a game where 5-7 sets were in play and they rotated every update;
There could be Un'Goro, WOTOGs, GvG, Naxrammas, Scholomance, Alterac included for example.
It would keep things fresh and stop the current ethos of Wild mode.
I just don't get why they're so afraid to make a ban list. They've shown that they can, but for some reason, they won't. If Wild had a ban list, it'd be so much more fun.
I dont think that hunter is that big of a problem because with massive healing you can hard-counter them (for example odd druid). Pirate warrior is another story, I dont think that there is a hard-counter to them in the format. They have very strong early game with infinite value in the late-game and that combination should be never allowed in any format.
But dont get me wrong, I would vote "yes" to ban all of the questlines from wild if I had the opportunity, I just dont think that Blizzard would ever do such a thing.
We can summon Zeddy to help us.
Not all questlines are toxic. But yes, Warrior and Hunters quests need to be dealt with. Warlock's is already banned in wild, so that DOES help. Now if we can get rid of Warrior's and Hunter's, it'd loosen the choked grip on wild a little bit more.
We still need to work out Sorcerer's Apprentice for mage too. Spells should NOT be costing zero and letting your opponent BOTH cycle through entire decks while killing you from full health +10 or more armor sometimes on top of it. She needs to be banned too.
The trouble with this topic is Blizzard cared so little about wild as is, since the design teams have started changing so much, interest in wild balance has dwindled even more. I'm still shocked we were able to get the Warlock quest banned at all.
I miss the Demonseed in Wild... ._.
This would help greatly. Just ban 20ish cards for a while and see what happens. They can literally ban 2-3 cards for each of the top dog decks. Remove apprentice for mage, stone giant for lock, questline (and a bunch of pirates for warrior), quest for hunter, kingsbane for rogue, archmage vargoth for druid and priest, that 5-6 mana summon from deck for res priest....
Look at this game from Regis, this is what the game can be. so much fun https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=QZI0fmrx2b0
but we'll probably never see it
They should just admit they really messed up with quests draining the fun out of the game and remove them from standard like the genn/baku situation. They warp the game in a very unfun way - they're too powerful so they eliminate other decks from seeing play. They're strong in wild too but with appropriate nerfs to hunter/pirate (slow them down, make it require 3/3/3 pirates and 3/3/3 spells) it'd be fine.
And make apprentice not able to reduce spells below 1 mana cheers.
This should be true for any cost reduction, be it spells or minions. We have a finite amount of mana for a reason.
I don't understand why they are so impotent at giving everything a minimum cost of 1, unless the card was specifically designed to cost 0.
They admitted that card balance is hard and really hard, yet they do NOTHING to move away from powercreeping. Why is it so damn hard to understand that it won't affect your stupid sales if you give balanced cards in expansions instead of overpowered ones????!!!
Blizzard, your revenue comes mostly from the SAME PEOPLE (whales), the cosmetics, and other random dudes that had an incling to buy something. Seriously, stop catering to the "very fast life" meme, or at least make BOTH ways viable. I and others like me won't pay for anything until can have fun, and having fun, for us, means STABLE AND PREDICTABLE card cycles in terms of balance.
E.g.: why the hell should I pay for Alterac (which seems slower and MORE FUN for me), when i'm almost sure you'll fuck up the game again, the next year, with another "too fast" powercreep bullshit?!
The solution is NOT to alternate fast and slow metas to cater to both crowds, but to make them COEXIST, so that no one gets f-ed at the next card release date.
If you're afraid of the new cards not being interesting enough to be worth buying, there are better ways to do things instead of powercreeping:
- slow down the card release cycles! You must be paying your employees a fortune for the amount of work they have to do to come up with stuff this often.
- instead of some card releases, do events that last 30 days for example. Like diablo was in BGs. Yet, don't make them a powercreep variant! Push some bad archetypes with minor/temporary buffs, in these events (anything really, e.g. deathrattle druid) - like buffing each class in a certain way (e.g. holy cards in priest also summon a random 1-cost minion). There's so much you could do with this. Even some tavern brawl ideas could work here.
- fix the memory leaks and other stupid bugs! I'm sure more people will want to buy stuff if you started caring about the game's performance and other technical aspects instead of just shoving shop bundles in our faces. Unfortunately, the focus on this type of issues should've started long ago. The Blizzard that made Warcraft 3 would be gravely ashamed of what it has become...
- implement community card ideas, or allow them to be chosen in a different mode to play among friends.
- make people more inclined to become friends after a game, rather than fuck with each other's family in private chat. How? PLAY YOUR OWN GAME and see how frustrating certain archetypes or decks are to play against. Maybe that'll deter you from more powercreeping too.
Probably many other possible things to add, but i'm too tired to think about them. I'm sure a brainstorming session every week or so could provide excellent ideas (of course, if you also include more people in it, not just the design team or developers).
pirate warrior and quest hunter are not overpowered they are just good , easy to play, and very cheap on dust to craft
they are super popular and you hate them and lose to them just because you are bad player.... thats all
at moment in wild there are many decks as strong as them ( way more imho)
"because democracy basically means government by the people, of the people, for the people, but the people are retarded. So let us say: government by the retarded, for the retarded, of the retarded." - Osho Rajneesh
Yeah no, statistics don't lie.
Warrior: Hearthstone Decks - HSReplay.net
Hunter: Hearthstone Decks - HSReplay.net
The most popular warrior wild deck sits at 71% winrate and the most popular hunter deck is at 64% (with a 68% better version just under in popularity). These winrates are absolutely crazy, higher than other non-bugged dominating wild decks have ever been in the past, and I'm amazed that nothing has been done about a 71% winrate deck.
Wait.. till some more new cards come out in future expansions..which might slow wild.
As long as people buy f*** cosmetics for ridiculous prices, why would they even care about anything related to the quality of the game? it's just there to make money, not be a work of art like chess. Abandon all hope.
Take a walk on the wild side...
just because they are all noobs who play on budget hunter/warrior vs other noobs who play against other budget hunter/warriors plz buy premium and check statistics for legend players
"because democracy basically means government by the people, of the people, for the people, but the people are retarded. So let us say: government by the retarded, for the retarded, of the retarded." - Osho Rajneesh
What they should do is make an algorithm... at the end of a month, they should look at the cards in that format and choose a couple of cards from the following categories and ban a few of them:
- most played card
- card that wins the game after being played
- cards in decks with over 65% winrate.
To live is to suffer, to survive is to find meaning in the suffer!
The fire elemental deck is the most stupid deck ever since it's auto win turn 6 while doing nothing on board which is terrible game design (almost 100% of cards are collecting and the deck is so fast it doesn't need removal like OTK decks used to have) and because of the way it plays there are almost zero adjustments needed to the deck in any meta, ever, so that means from now on, the deck will always be there, which means that if you want to play a deck on ladder that has a chance to win, there will be zero incentive to ever invest in cards above 5 mana, which is sad since that also includes almost all upcoming hero cards. It might be wild, but it's still 10%? of the playerbase which means 10%? of their (hearthstone original game) revenue.
Bronze through diamond are actual people who play the game too you know, it's not like their experience doesn't matter. I don't pay for anything HS related now but I can't imagine it being much different, given how legend is not hard at all to reach, just a time investment.