Hello, longtime reader here, but it's my first time posting :)
I've been playing Shaman for a few days (I enjoy playing sub-optimal classes and trying to figure out how to be consistent with them)... And in almost all of my games, I struggled to make clean trades against most of the most-played 3 drops because.... they have 4 health points !
I feel like the major issue with the class right now is the fact that most of Shaman early spells don't deal more than 3 damages (I'm not saying there is none though whereas 3/4 + effect minions are now the new standard for 3 mana.. Where is the list of 1-3 mana spells, and the damages they deal :
(And I'm not even mentioning that some of them overloads you, and so creating an awkward next turn.)
To the point I started to think about running early +1 spell damage minions and weapon (Rune Dagger) just to try to be ready when the 3rd turn is coming.
This lack of 4 damage removal is probably why they lower the mana cost of Tidal Surge, but I feel shaman would also benefit for having the infamous Wrath of Air Totem come back in the totem pool...
as a shaman you need to keep a tempo, you are gonna win the value game with what value card? (there is no shaman value card) this is why we pretty much forced to play doomhammer and it is suboptimal at best as you say and if people start to use weapon removal in their decks for whatever reason it is even worse than that.. shaman is just in a really bad spot right now... said as a guy who plays mainly shaman with over 6k shaman wins and multiple legend with only shaman (including 3 times this meta) would have been way easier with any other class
I've been playing Shaman recently too and I must say, the substance is there. He has many good cards (Cagematch Custodian into Whack-A-Gnoll Hammer or Menacing Nimbus into Arid Stormer is super strong opening) and If he draws them right, he can be really frightening (I'm not gonna lie, bursting down Priest on turn 5 or OTK Demon Hunter on turn 6 is crazy satisfying). But ye, he still lacks reliable draw and consistency.
I'm sure, that at some point he'll get them (because Team 5 will realize that you need SOME card draw in a card game...) and then he most likely will become OP. I can imagine him with all this tempo and burst cards being consistent and reliable, that's really scary. Still, I think he needs them nonetheless, maybe alongside some small nerfs to his early tempo.
Well Shaman had the worst hero power. And they made i worse. Shaman is all over the place with cards for every game plan you can think of, but none of them are good.
Hearthstone had become more and more spell heavy through the years because spells are often better, but Shaman consistently don't get any good cards.
Its not just about the card draw. It's not just about the hero power. It's not just about the spells or the core set being bad. It's just about Shaman not having a direction, and there end up with multiple good 20 card decks but no good 30 card decks. In the end if we get 2 sets in a row with one direction for Shaman it will be decent
The one thing I'll ask for in a new shaman meta class is not to revolve around evolution stuff. It's been ages since we had anything besides that, not counting wild and its big shaman thing of course.
You can find ways to deal with 4 health minions, but it requires setup. Novice Zapper + Landslide is a 4 damage AOE. The problem is, you have to have both cards, and it's 3 mana. Novice Zapper + Lightning Bolt gives you the target removal, but ultimately costs you 4 mana, and again requires both cards. I would assume the purpose of Devolving Missiles and Revolve is to help with the issue, but leaves a body still on the board. Sometimes you just need the body removed, and not to deal with a lesser one.
You can list Shaman's weaknesses for day, but the REAL problem is that every time they give Shaman tools that remove any of those weaknesses, the class becomes Tier 0, oppressive, and wildly popular.
So it's not hard to understand why Team 5 would be very careful about how they handle the class. I'm not saying it's right to leave Shaman in the dumpster; I'm just explaining how it happens.
Last year they talked about making fundamental changes to certain classes, and I think their direction with Priest and Warrior has succeeded. I suspect Shaman was also on their list, but they wanted to see how the totem thing worked out before messing too much with the strengths and weaknesses of the class cards. Here's hoping the mini-expansion has something good in it.
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Hello, longtime reader here, but it's my first time posting :)
I've been playing Shaman for a few days (I enjoy playing sub-optimal classes and trying to figure out how to be consistent with them)... And in almost all of my games, I struggled to make clean trades against most of the most-played 3 drops because.... they have 4 health points !
I feel like the major issue with the class right now is the fact that most of Shaman early spells don't deal more than 3 damages (I'm not saying there is none though whereas 3/4 + effect minions are now the new standard for 3 mana.. Where is the list of 1-3 mana spells, and the damages they deal :
- Lightning Bolt : 3
- Chain Lightening : 2 (mult)
- Landslide : 1+1 (mult)
- Deathmatch Pavilion : summon a 3/2 (+ a 3/2)
- Rockbitter Weapon : 3
- Lightning Storm : 3 (mult)
- Molten Blast : 2
- Stormstrike : 3 (+3 atk)
+ Tidal surge : 4
+ Torrent : 8 (but needs setup + it feels bad to use it on early minions)
~ Revolve : transform (but leave something + can wiff)
~ Devolving missiles : transform (but leave something + can wiff)
(And I'm not even mentioning that some of them overloads you, and so creating an awkward next turn.)
To the point I started to think about running early +1 spell damage minions and weapon (Rune Dagger) just to try to be ready when the 3rd turn is coming.
This lack of 4 damage removal is probably why they lower the mana cost of Tidal Surge, but I feel shaman would also benefit for having the infamous Wrath of Air Totem come back in the totem pool...
Do you feel the same ?
Just run a proactive minion heavy element package with just a few good spells, such as lightning storm. Bad spells aren't worth running over minions.
as a shaman you need to keep a tempo, you are gonna win the value game with what value card? (there is no shaman value card) this is why we pretty much forced to play doomhammer and it is suboptimal at best as you say and if people start to use weapon removal in their decks for whatever reason it is even worse than that.. shaman is just in a really bad spot right now... said as a guy who plays mainly shaman with over 6k shaman wins and multiple legend with only shaman (including 3 times this meta) would have been way easier with any other class
I've been playing Shaman recently too and I must say, the substance is there. He has many good cards (Cagematch Custodian into Whack-A-Gnoll Hammer or Menacing Nimbus into Arid Stormer is super strong opening) and If he draws them right, he can be really frightening (I'm not gonna lie, bursting down Priest on turn 5 or OTK Demon Hunter on turn 6 is crazy satisfying). But ye, he still lacks reliable draw and consistency.
I'm sure, that at some point he'll get them (because Team 5 will realize that you need SOME card draw in a card game...) and then he most likely will become OP. I can imagine him with all this tempo and burst cards being consistent and reliable, that's really scary. Still, I think he needs them nonetheless, maybe alongside some small nerfs to his early tempo.
I mean Landslide is supposed to be played with spell damage, it's a 4 damage board clear.
Yes, all true shaman players feel the same
Well Shaman had the worst hero power. And they made i worse. Shaman is all over the place with cards for every game plan you can think of, but none of them are good.
Hearthstone had become more and more spell heavy through the years because spells are often better, but Shaman consistently don't get any good cards.
Its not just about the card draw. It's not just about the hero power. It's not just about the spells or the core set being bad. It's just about Shaman not having a direction, and there end up with multiple good 20 card decks but no good 30 card decks. In the end if we get 2 sets in a row with one direction for Shaman it will be decent
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The one thing I'll ask for in a new shaman meta class is not to revolve around evolution stuff. It's been ages since we had anything besides that, not counting wild and its big shaman thing of course.
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You can find ways to deal with 4 health minions, but it requires setup. Novice Zapper + Landslide is a 4 damage AOE. The problem is, you have to have both cards, and it's 3 mana. Novice Zapper + Lightning Bolt gives you the target removal, but ultimately costs you 4 mana, and again requires both cards. I would assume the purpose of Devolving Missiles and Revolve is to help with the issue, but leaves a body still on the board. Sometimes you just need the body removed, and not to deal with a lesser one.
Shamans have many issues.
4-mana drops seem to be the least of their problems.
Blizzard has an ongoing hate-boner for Shaman.
You can list Shaman's weaknesses for day, but the REAL problem is that every time they give Shaman tools that remove any of those weaknesses, the class becomes Tier 0, oppressive, and wildly popular.
So it's not hard to understand why Team 5 would be very careful about how they handle the class. I'm not saying it's right to leave Shaman in the dumpster; I'm just explaining how it happens.
Last year they talked about making fundamental changes to certain classes, and I think their direction with Priest and Warrior has succeeded. I suspect Shaman was also on their list, but they wanted to see how the totem thing worked out before messing too much with the strengths and weaknesses of the class cards. Here's hoping the mini-expansion has something good in it.
"Why, you never expected justice from a company, did you? They have neither a soul to lose nor a body to kick." -- Lady Saba Holland