I lost countless games where deck of lunacy was played turn 4 or 5
If their goal was to make a super RNG deck like Lunacy not Top Tier, this change will not do the trick, calling it now...
You should also consider that when they played Deck of Lunacy on turn 4 or 5, they had 2-4 extra mana to work with after playing it. Now they'll essentially have to make that a pass turn
I lost countless games where deck of lunacy was played turn 4 or 5
If their goal was to make a super RNG deck like Lunacy not Top Tier, this change will not do the trick, calling it now...
And I lost games where Gibberling was played on turn 10 so, nerf gibberling to 11 mana I guess.
What decks were you playing ? What was the board state ? Your statement in kinda irrelevant, also it was played on turn 4 or 5, but it didn't cost 4, they could do other things, at the very least use their hero power.
Their goal was to make Lunacy start snowballing in the mid game at best (most likely in the end game), instead of the early game, and be generally very weak against aggro to the point where you don't mulligan for it. And if you don't mulligan for a Keleseth-type card, then you might as well cut it from your deck. They succeeded, calling it now.
I liked that Watch Posts forced board-centric play, but now you can just Soul Shear or Drain Soul them, no problem. So... so much for that.
Jandice nerf is pretty lame. 6 mana is a lot more than 5 in terms of the mana curve. And really all because of it's synergy with Shadow Step.
The Pen Flinger nerf was expected, but that's still SUCH a light tap to the card. I imagine it'll at least make it less attractive to players.
The Secret Weapon nerf is very fair, and I think will impact the deck a lot. Libram Paladin is still going to be dominant, though. I can't believe this was the only paladin nerf.
The Deck of Lunacy nerf actually seems too minor to me. No Spring Water nerf, and honestly, the card gives you so much late game value. It probably won't see much play, but it REALLY feels like they're trying to preserve the deck.
Kargal is crying in a corner ... It would be fair to offer a refund for him as well since he's hit quite directly by the nerfs.
I really dislike the Watch Post nerfs ... Yes, these cards have been really good, but they're a new type of card (sort of) and make Hearthstone feel a little less linear. I liked them a lot. I really hoped Blizzard wouldn't nerf them, but here we are ... :(
Personally, I would bump Deck of Lunacy to 5 mana, just to be on the safe side. It feels like a 5 mana card, too.
I also have mixed about Sword of the Fallen. But I guess I had mixed feeling about Ancharr as well, and it turned out to be a good nerf, so I suppose it's only fair ... But somehow I feel that early secrets while oppressive were kinda fun and that the true frustration of playing against Paladin lies elsewhere (looking at you, Librams ...).
I have pulled Kargal as well... didn't make a deck yet but wanted to try one. Wish they would buff him a bit to summon 6/6 or give him taunt. But Blizz never do this so...
I've crafted him in Gold, just for Rally Pala. I'am actually extremely upset. But I'am not expecting any Refunds for Kargal.
I don't get it. These are the exact nerfs that most of the community predicted/wanted, and now these same people are saying that these nerfs aren't enough. Just be happy that Blizzard actually listens to the community and nerfs cards within the first week(s). It has not always been like that. And these are good nerfs btw. Yes, Paladin is still strong, and yes, so is Mage, and Lunacy may still be played. But the goal of nerfing cards is not to totally wreck them, but to slightly lower their wr such that other decks can find their way into the meta. And I think that these nerfs do exactly that. So please chill and enjoy the game thx :)
I liked that Watch Posts forced board-centric play, but now you can just Soul Shear or Drain Soul them, no problem. So... so much for that.
I don't see how watch posts forced board-centric plays. The 3 cost one litterally punishes you for playing minion, and the 2-cost one punishes decks with a low curve (generally much more minion-centric) way more than control decks with only removal. Also, it doesn't make the board relevant when the posts are overstated and can't be reasonably traded into by minions. I am glad they are nerfed, and would have nerfed them by 1 attack aswell personally.
I don't get it. These are the exact nerfs that most of the community predicted/wanted, and now these same people are saying that these nerfs aren't enough. Just be happy that Blizzard actually listens to the community and nerfs cards within the first week(s). It has not always been like that. And these are good nerfs btw. Yes, Paladin is still strong, and yes, so is Mage, and Lunacy may still be played. But the goal of nerfing cards is not to totally wreck them, but to slightly lower their wr such that other decks can find their way into the meta. And I think that these nerfs do exactly that. So please chill and enjoy the game thx :)
Towers got wrekt, and so got Kargal. Please, bro I do have HSreplay Premium.
here are current winrates of the cards:
Server: EU Rank: Diamond 4-1 Duration: Last 14 days
Dev Comment: Deck of Lunacy moves up to 4 mana, removing its ability to provide a game-warping effect on turn 1 or 2. When we create cards like Deck of Lunacy, we're aiming for an experience that lets you do wacky, over-the-top things at the cost of power. There's a large audience for that (Spell Mage's play-rate shows!), but Deck of Lunacy very clearly crosses the power threshold we set for these types of cards
Noticed the arguments to 'nerf' deck of lunacy they way it's done? Because there's 'a large audience for that' So nerfs are done based on popularity of an OP-card. It becomes clear why Tickatus wasn't nerfed. Apparently the 'unpopular' control crowd must be kept in check to give way to the cherished aggressive 'fast paced' burn crowd.
It shows that devs have a target audience. The favored sons.. and the other children... It hints the integrity problems card designers suffer.
I liked that Watch Posts forced board-centric play, but now you can just Soul Shear or Drain Soul them, no problem. So... so much for that.
I don't see how watch posts forced board-centric plays. The 3 cost one litterally punishes you for playing minion, and the 2-cost one punishes decks with a low curve (generally much more minion-centric) way more than control decks with only removal. Also, it doesn't make the board relevant when the posts are overstated and can't be reasonably traded into by minions. I am glad they are nerfed, and would have nerfed them by 1 attack aswell personally.
Because you couldn't just sit back and deal with them with cheap removal over a few turns, it was better to trade into them.
An attack nerf would have been MUCH better than a health nerf.
I don't get it. These are the exact nerfs that most of the community predicted/wanted, and now these same people are saying that these nerfs aren't enough. Just be happy that Blizzard actually listens to the community and nerfs cards within the first week(s). It has not always been like that. And these are good nerfs btw. Yes, Paladin is still strong, and yes, so is Mage, and Lunacy may still be played. But the goal of nerfing cards is not to totally wreck them, but to slightly lower their wr such that other decks can find their way into the meta. And I think that these nerfs do exactly that. So please chill and enjoy the game thx :)
For the record, I wanted to see more paladin nerfs (it would have been good enough if they changed the 5-mana Libram guy to a 3/5 or removed Taunt and change the secret synergy 3/4 to a 3/3 for 3-mana tbh). And I also never wanted DoL to go to 4. Nerf it to 3 but change the cost reduction to 2 ffs. But in general, people just like to complain.
I don't get it. These are the exact nerfs that most of the community predicted/wanted, and now these same people are saying that these nerfs aren't enough. Just be happy that Blizzard actually listens to the community and nerfs cards within the first week(s). It has not always been like that. And these are good nerfs btw. Yes, Paladin is still strong, and yes, so is Mage, and Lunacy may still be played. But the goal of nerfing cards is not to totally wreck them, but to slightly lower their wr such that other decks can find their way into the meta. And I think that these nerfs do exactly that. So please chill and enjoy the game thx :)
Towers got wrekt, and so got Kargal. Please, bro I do have HSreplay Premium.
here are current winrates of the cards:
Server: EU Rank: Diamond 4-1 Duration: Last 14 days
Blizzard clearly went Overkill with those particular Nerfs.
First of all, if you nerf DoL, you have to expect the 3-cost Watch Post to become A LOT better. Secondly, there are other formats than standard. Have you seen wild lately? Have you seen Arena lately, where (thank God) they got removed? I won like 50% of my arena games yesterday with a single 3-cost Watch Post in my tempo rogue list. The card summoned 9 tokens in one game, just because my opponent had no 2-drop. How is that even remotely balanced?
The nerfs are decent, but they don't go far enough, especially for paladin.
And Shadowstep should cost 1 or reduce only by 1 (rogue is one of my favourite classes, btw). And since we are at stupid mana cheating cards, f..k Lightning Bloom. Sorry, but these cards are just crappy card design. Why does Bloom even exist at all? No card should ramp 2 for 0, I thought we learned that when another certain 0-cost Druid spell got nerfed.
I lost countless games where deck of lunacy was played turn 4 or 5
If their goal was to make a super RNG deck like Lunacy not Top Tier, this change will not do the trick, calling it now...
Well at least you're honest. No, you obviously don't understand.
So playing a 2 mana card on turn 5 and then having 3 mana left to.... Draw cards, remove a minion, freeze a minion, play a minion. It's pretty huge. If you play lunacy on 5 now, you can coin spring water and you're sitting at 4 mana with 2 newly drawn, discounted cards. There are tons of things you can on turn 5 with a 2 cost lunacy which help you regain the board, clear the board, freeze it, draw etc. Also, 2 mana do nothing on turn 2 is minimal in terms of tempo loss. Your opponent is probably only on 2 mana themselves or just had 2 mana and probably played their hero power or a weak minion. 4 mana do nothing is a much bigger commitment, plus the aforementioned chain cards can't also be played.
If you do that after the nerf, you play lunacy and basically do nothing. That's given your opponent two unanswered turns to board build, smack you in the face etc and is a massive loss in tempo.
A lot of people seem to be completely overlooking the fact that this doesn't just push lunacy back to a turn 4 play, it COSTS 4 as well.
yes and I cant see it anymore I HATE this deck. I dont understand why anybody wants to play it you basically play mirror matches the entire time, who the F likes that? Not to mention it is SOOO boring to play against
Play Minion Buff Minion Maybe attack with minion Repeat
yes and I cant see it anymore I HATE this deck. I dont understand why anybody wants to play it you basically play mirror matches the entire time, who the F likes that? Not to mention it is SOOO boring to play against
Play Minion Buff Minion Maybe attack with minion Repeat
yes and I cant see it anymore I HATE this deck. I dont understand why anybody wants to play it you basically play mirror matches the entire time, who the F likes that? Not to mention it is SOOO boring to play against
Play Minion Buff Minion Maybe attack with minion Repeat
ITS FRUSTRATING
I rather play vs a res. priest.
It's my counterpoint to the RNG complaints. Great; you have your nearly perfectly consistent, predictable deck and it's soul-crushing to play against. Are you happy? Because I'd rather lose to a handful of random spells than play out the exact same game for the 100th time.
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You should also consider that when they played Deck of Lunacy on turn 4 or 5, they had 2-4 extra mana to work with after playing it. Now they'll essentially have to make that a pass turn
And I lost games where Gibberling was played on turn 10 so, nerf gibberling to 11 mana I guess.
What decks were you playing ? What was the board state ? Your statement in kinda irrelevant, also it was played on turn 4 or 5, but it didn't cost 4, they could do other things, at the very least use their hero power.
Their goal was to make Lunacy start snowballing in the mid game at best (most likely in the end game), instead of the early game, and be generally very weak against aggro to the point where you don't mulligan for it. And if you don't mulligan for a Keleseth-type card, then you might as well cut it from your deck. They succeeded, calling it now.
God I don't like these nerfs.
I liked that Watch Posts forced board-centric play, but now you can just Soul Shear or Drain Soul them, no problem. So... so much for that.
Jandice nerf is pretty lame. 6 mana is a lot more than 5 in terms of the mana curve. And really all because of it's synergy with Shadow Step.
The Pen Flinger nerf was expected, but that's still SUCH a light tap to the card. I imagine it'll at least make it less attractive to players.
The Secret Weapon nerf is very fair, and I think will impact the deck a lot. Libram Paladin is still going to be dominant, though. I can't believe this was the only paladin nerf.
The Deck of Lunacy nerf actually seems too minor to me. No Spring Water nerf, and honestly, the card gives you so much late game value. It probably won't see much play, but it REALLY feels like they're trying to preserve the deck.
And you'll win many more now they cannot DoL on turn 1.
I've crafted him in Gold, just for Rally Pala. I'am actually extremely upset. But I'am not expecting any Refunds for Kargal.
I don't get it. These are the exact nerfs that most of the community predicted/wanted, and now these same people are saying that these nerfs aren't enough. Just be happy that Blizzard actually listens to the community and nerfs cards within the first week(s). It has not always been like that. And these are good nerfs btw. Yes, Paladin is still strong, and yes, so is Mage, and Lunacy may still be played. But the goal of nerfing cards is not to totally wreck them, but to slightly lower their wr such that other decks can find their way into the meta. And I think that these nerfs do exactly that. So please chill and enjoy the game thx :)
I don't see how watch posts forced board-centric plays. The 3 cost one litterally punishes you for playing minion, and the 2-cost one punishes decks with a low curve (generally much more minion-centric) way more than control decks with only removal. Also, it doesn't make the board relevant when the posts are overstated and can't be reasonably traded into by minions. I am glad they are nerfed, and would have nerfed them by 1 attack aswell personally.
Towers got wrekt, and so got Kargal. Please, bro I do have HSreplay Premium.
here are current winrates of the cards:
Server: EU Rank: Diamond 4-1 Duration: Last 14 days
https://ibb.co/wKLrVM5
As we can see Mor'shan Watch Post and Kargal Battlescar are barely playable right now, while only Far Watch Post can be considered strong
Blizzard clearly went Overkill with those particular Nerfs.
Noticed the arguments to 'nerf' deck of lunacy they way it's done? Because there's 'a large audience for that' So nerfs are done based on popularity of an OP-card. It becomes clear why Tickatus wasn't nerfed. Apparently the 'unpopular' control crowd must be kept in check to give way to the cherished aggressive 'fast paced' burn crowd.
It shows that devs have a target audience. The favored sons.. and the other children... It hints the integrity problems card designers suffer.
We make our world significant through the courage of our questions and the depth of our answers.
Strongest deck prior to nerfs: Libram Paladin
Strongest deck last meta: Libram Paladin
Strongest deck post-nerf: take a guess
Because you couldn't just sit back and deal with them with cheap removal over a few turns, it was better to trade into them.
An attack nerf would have been MUCH better than a health nerf.
I hated the watch posts too but honestly that the was the only weapon to slow down warlock a bit :s
Lunacy at 4 changes nothing. With Springs allowing draw 2 for free, playing Lunacy on 4 is no big deal. Still game breaking.
Jandice, watchposts and pen...
Hum...
It is only me thinking rogue was the real target of this nerfs? Paladin and mage barely will be affected.
For the record, I wanted to see more paladin nerfs (it would have been good enough if they changed the 5-mana Libram guy to a 3/5 or removed Taunt and change the secret synergy 3/4 to a 3/3 for 3-mana tbh). And I also never wanted DoL to go to 4. Nerf it to 3 but change the cost reduction to 2 ffs. But in general, people just like to complain.
First of all, if you nerf DoL, you have to expect the 3-cost Watch Post to become A LOT better. Secondly, there are other formats than standard. Have you seen wild lately? Have you seen Arena lately, where (thank God) they got removed? I won like 50% of my arena games yesterday with a single 3-cost Watch Post in my tempo rogue list. The card summoned 9 tokens in one game, just because my opponent had no 2-drop. How is that even remotely balanced?
The nerfs are decent, but they don't go far enough, especially for paladin.
And Shadowstep should cost 1 or reduce only by 1 (rogue is one of my favourite classes, btw). And since we are at stupid mana cheating cards, f..k Lightning Bloom. Sorry, but these cards are just crappy card design. Why does Bloom even exist at all? No card should ramp 2 for 0, I thought we learned that when another certain 0-cost Druid spell got nerfed.
Well at least you're honest. No, you obviously don't understand.
So playing a 2 mana card on turn 5 and then having 3 mana left to.... Draw cards, remove a minion, freeze a minion, play a minion. It's pretty huge. If you play lunacy on 5 now, you can coin spring water and you're sitting at 4 mana with 2 newly drawn, discounted cards. There are tons of things you can on turn 5 with a 2 cost lunacy which help you regain the board, clear the board, freeze it, draw etc. Also, 2 mana do nothing on turn 2 is minimal in terms of tempo loss. Your opponent is probably only on 2 mana themselves or just had 2 mana and probably played their hero power or a weak minion. 4 mana do nothing is a much bigger commitment, plus the aforementioned chain cards can't also be played.
If you do that after the nerf, you play lunacy and basically do nothing. That's given your opponent two unanswered turns to board build, smack you in the face etc and is a massive loss in tempo.
A lot of people seem to be completely overlooking the fact that this doesn't just push lunacy back to a turn 4 play, it COSTS 4 as well.
People complaining about nerfs for 2 weeks and now that they are here, guess what? Yeah, not good enough. The HS community ladies and gents.
yes and I cant see it anymore I HATE this deck. I dont understand why anybody wants to play it you basically play mirror matches the entire time, who the F likes that?
Not to mention it is SOOO boring to play against
Play Minion
Buff Minion
Maybe attack with minion
Repeat
ITS FRUSTRATING
I rather play vs a res. priest.
It's my counterpoint to the RNG complaints. Great; you have your nearly perfectly consistent, predictable deck and it's soul-crushing to play against. Are you happy? Because I'd rather lose to a handful of random spells than play out the exact same game for the 100th time.