I have an idea how to improve 'Oh My Yogg' - cast a spell 1 level higher than the original, targeting enemies (you obviously would target enemies 9/10). As it is, it is a 1-mana Counterspell. I play this deck sometimes and hate myself for it.
Librams remain a problem with pen flinger, also rogues ability to draw and cycle low cost cards with pen flinger really early in the game.
I'm not even sure its that OP honestly - it is just so goddam slow. It sucks to sit there doing nothing while being slowly tickled to death by flung pens - it's a gameplay issue.
Animated Broomstick is still a problem.
Deck of Lunacy has too much high roll potential for zero skill or decision making input.
In general there is too much high roll potential across nearly all classes - play a few rounds of classic then switch to standrard and it just feels absurd. Is this really the experience you want to pay extra for? Power levels need to come down across the board IMO, I would be happy to see many minor nerfs and adjustments aside from the obvious ones.
I think we should be careful when shouting for nerfs, for I'm afraid that then, other and even more solitaire decks would rise (lifesteal OTK DH, druid with celestial alignment, weapon rouge, etc.). That's also why I'm fine with Tickatus being a powerhouse (if Blizz decided to adjust Control Warlock, I hope they make Cascading Disaster 5 mana - that card haunts me!!!).
However, some cards still seem out of place: Deck of Lunacy (-> start by changing all numbers in the card to 2), the Pala secret weapon (-> 2 durability), Pen Flinger of course (-> 3 mana to deal 2 damage, just like head crack).
Watch posts seem fine, it would be a pity if cards like these were unplayable... Kazakus is just like old Keleseth: play on curve, increase winrate. It's designed to be like this, so it probably won't be nerfed, but I wouldn't mind if they changed the "summon a 2nd copy of the golem" to sth else (for example "return a minion back to it's owners hand").
Thanks team 5 once again it’s proof that Iksar and co don’t playtest at all. They don’t care about this product.
Out of interest, to people such as yourself, does leaving this sort of comment make you feel better? I'm genuinely interested. It clearly isn't true, criticise their competence if you like but this just seems like a completely pointless, throwaway dig based on absolutely nothing.
Did you get a buzz when you hit send or something?
In my option there are a few cards that need buffing and a few that need nerfing, here are some of my predictions on nerfs, changes and buffs we might see to better stabalize the meta.
Nerf Predictions:
Pen Flinger - Upped to 2 mana 3/1.
Animated Broom Up it to 2 mana with 2/1 body.
Crossroads Gossiper - upped from 3-4 mana.
Si7 Infiltrator replaced with eater of secrets. (Probably won't happen but this would actually see play unlike Si7 which doesnt)
Celestial Alignment upped from 7-8
Refreshing Spring Water - Upped from 4-5
Conviction Upped from 1-2 mana (It starts as a blessing of might and ends up a 1 mana bloodlust that can way to easily end games)
Oh My Yogg - Change to When your opponent casts a spell, they instead cast a random one of their class of the same cost. (currently it also randomly targets with the new spell it shouldn't it isn't worded that way).
Sword of the Fallen - Upped from 2-3 mana 2/2 Stats.
Hysteria - Change to Choose an enemy minion it takes turns attacking random minions on each side of the board until it dies. (For me this RNG seems heavily in favor of the caster normally clearing their opponents side before even hitting their own).
Tickatus - 7 mana 6/6 Battlecry Remove the top 3 cards from your deck. Corrupt Your Opponents deck instead.
As for Buffs and addtions here are my thoughts.
1. Add more types to minions and make it so players can build different archtypes why should competative murlocs only be viable for paladin or shaman, I understand that their are minion based spells to support the archtypes for these classes but back in classic days there wasn't and people could have fun playing a themed deck.
2. Rogue's either need some sort of AOE or Mass removal currently they have no way to deal with a large board such as what Clown Druid generates.
3. Even their single target removal is very outdated 4 mana destory a minion vs say Brittlebone Destroyer that not only destroys a minion but develops the board which is something else the rogue can struggle to do. (I get Brittlebone has a requirement but its one that is easily met and it is 1 of many cards of the same or lower costs I could point out that is vastly better than a 4 mana destory 1 minion)
Then Take Backstab I get its a combo activator but 2 damage to an undamaged minion isn't good enough when we have 3 health 1 drops and 4 health 2 drops as standard they need to Up its mana cost to 1 and make it deal 4 damage to an undamaged minion or leave it at 0 and make it deal 3.
Honestly the rest of the classes other than the things I pointed out in Nerf predictions seem okay I've played plenty of games with them and not had any sort of issue but Rogue right now doesn't seem to be in a good place unless you run early game aggro with Pen Flinger which everyone hates and is more than likely going to get nerfed.
Take Weapon rogue Even running 4 weapons and poisons if you don't get your weapon on curve you just die because your running probably 1/3 if not more of your deck with poison and weapons then god help you if someone has removal pretty much GG right there if they are smart.
Then theres C'Thun with Tickatus being promonant C'thun is a pointless card as normally you don't have all 4 parts played by the time he gets played then 9/10 he burns 1 part rendering it mute as a win condition.
Steal/copy Rogue is a joke and is even less useful with spell types being added to the game.
Stealth Rogue isn't strong enough for the current meta and is easily countered by any aoe and most RNG effect e.g Devolving Missiles.
So when pen flinger is nerfed into an unplayable state what is rogue mean't to play and run as a win condition because currently I see them as the weakest class in standard. Infact looking at my tracker win rate out of 29 games I lost 2 vs Rogue and probably lost a good 50-100 games testing different archtypes over the last 3 days.
If you think Celestial Alignment is a bad card your playing it wrong, My Celestial Clown druid is at 14 wins with it because even if you Celestial before corrupting stuff if you run any sort of card generation you can easily still corrupt them and crush your opponents.
The hardest matchup for them is Warlock with double twisting but even that has limits.
Obviously this was a few days back I played it so it might not work aswell anymore but I wouldn't call the card bad as for why I am predicting its cost being increased because its going to limit what stuff blizzard can make for the next 2 years and from the moment it got revealed people have complained about it. Personally I don't think its game breaking or toxic like Penflinger and Tickitus are.
Is everyone playing meme decks against paladin??? I really dont know whats the problem, i havent lost a single game against secret paladin( yes against libram and because pen flinger is toxic af).
Mage is the problem here, it needs 0 skils to play it, just rng with the random spells
i mean i agree that request nerf is pretty well not needed but Secret paladin is actually a legit deck again. Its really strong and hard to play aout. it can just outtempo you and winning pretty fast.
Its not an specific card that need nerf but the whole game. They can't have a game with discover mechanic <-- this kill the game, you use 20+ extra cards outside your deck to put into play.. that's not cool...
If they want to change the game, what not a game mode with "card ban week rotation" into game ?
They could also include the community to upvote each card they want to ban in a week and the next week the banned cards are allowed again and others enter into rotation.
Thanks team 5 once again it’s proof that Iksar and co don’t playtest at all. They don’t care about this product.
Iksar stated, they hire designers, not players. Thats why they got no clue at all, iksar is a former restaurant consultant. DH release and the many nerfs following it, is the best example that they dont playtest. Iksar too busy playing World of Warcraft.
Libram : 4 mana so less opressive in the early game. In mid-late game it still free.
Spring Water : 6 mana
Tickakus : 8 mana
This is exactly what’s wrong with the community, and it mimics the WoW community as well. You don’t want things nerfed, you want things to be unplayable, which is just stupid.
The only two you were even close on was lunacy and spring water, as lunacy should probably be on 4 and water on 5.
But Jesus, the buff liberam is ANYTHING but op lol, it’s just a fine card.
Pen flinger on 2 kills it entirely. Tickatus on 8 lol? Soooo you can play jaraxxus, or some random 10 drop you shouldn’t be running to corrupt him? Again, kills the card.
“Balance” is a two way street. A card seeing no play is as unbalanced as a card seeing too much.
OP missed the point completely with those nerfs, if team5 is nerfing anything it should be this :
Deck of Lunacy - 5 mana and revert this nerf when the card pool is bigger , right now there's only (1) 9 mana spell - Libram of Hope , (2) 10 mana spells - Nagrand Slam and Survival of the Fittest , most 7 mana spells are insane, almost every 6 mana spell give you card draw and so on, this card is busted because the card pool is so limited that the 'average' is really really good, not because Refreshing Spring Water is 0 mana draw 2.
Oh man, there are so many cards that need adjustments that I just don't see them getting to them all. They would need to nuke this expansion and core set and try again later.
At this point the best we can hope for is to make another class or archetype viable, but holy crap do they have work to do here.
In this new setting, this card is WAAAAAAY too busted.
Also, I am curious to see how long Blizzard will take to nerf paladin. It took them no time to nerf shaman every single time people were crying that it was out of control and in a way that put it completely out of play. Now I really want to see what happens. If it's a shaman special treatment or if it's the same for other classes. I doubt it tho I'm afraid
Dude, you want to nerf Avenge? Even now Avenge isn't that strong of a card. Sure, it's one of the better Paladin secrets, but it's not like you can't easily play around it if you know it's there. If you're facing secret Paladin, then there's a high likelihood that they'll be running Avenge.
Sorry but no. This specific secret is probably the only one that can’t be played around. Early game that 3/2 is busted and often very hard to counter. It means board control. I can outplay OhmyYogg a lot more easily by luring it out. It’s like a worse counterspell so I don’t see the big deal
Of course it can be played around. Destroy one minion in battle then use Hex/Devolving Missiles or other transformation or removal for the other.
This is definetly The worst meta of a card game I ever played, no hyperbole
I played quest rogue era, shudderwock, Jade Druid, neither of these decks had above 50% winrate overall, they had annoying polarizing matchups but they had it's counters at least that kept them from being spammed on ladder.
Right now Mage's biggest counter, Poison Rogue, a deck designed entirely to counter Mage at the cost of losing to any other deck, is barely keeping a 55% winrate against it. There is no answer, there is no deck you can pick if you hate Lunacy Mage and wants to punish them hard and farm them. You best bets will neat you a 50% winrate against it . For that reason, people are just spamming Mage , the class is close to 40% representation at Diamond 1 according to VS Data Reaper Live. The only reason why the winrate is not higher is because most matches are mirrors or the only other broken class at the moment, paladin, which is close to a coin toss also
These 2 classes represent more than 60% of the diamond ladder right now , meanwhile classes like warrior , priest, shaman, hunter are struggling to have 2% playrate.
Congratulations devs, you broke the game again. First few days of the expansion and the game feels completely unplayable if you are not one of these guys that find "fun" spamming RNG mage to climb easily on the back of a broken deck.
I see that Oh My Yogg! was mentioned here multiple times, but the sad fact is that its never gonna be nerfed. Why? Well they cant change the mana cost because its a secret. They also cant change the text, because the only way to nerf it to add more text on the card and it already has a long one. HS's main principle is to keep card texts as short as possible so Im 100% sure they wont add even more text to OMY. The only thing they can do is indirectly nerfing it by nerfing the synergy cards like the sword.
Just to touch on the Tickatus being nerfed to 8 mana I do think that would impact it being played quite a lot and 7 with 3 cards in my mind seems more fair.
But even at 8 it doesn't kill the Tickatus Entirely infact I made a deck the other day to proove how broken the card truely is to a friend. Running only 2 minions Tickatus and Rustwixs the rest were spells, Jaraxxus and the neutral weapon.
The design was simple keep clearing the board until you got Free Addmission or The Dark Portal to get a discounted Tick and Rust then Felosphy the tickatus and burn 10-15 cards at that point either Rustwix, Shadow Council, or Jaraxxus to finish off your opponent if they hadn't already conceeded.
Played 5 games won 5 games, In one of the games I played Dark Portal on turn 4 got Tickatus discounted to 1 mana then double felosphyed and corrupted them before even playing the 3rd the guy had conceeded because loosing half your deck before turn 10 is complete and utter BS.
Anyway if he was 7 or 8 yes he would be harder to corrupt but thats the issue 6 mana for an 8/8 that burns 1/6th of a deck that gets played multiple times is stupid.
Which is why I agree he needs nerfing that or they need to add a minion that shuffles all discarded cards back into your deck to give players a shot and coming back in addtion to reviving C'thun decks that are just pointless in that match up.
Just to touch on the Tickatus being nerfed to 8 mana I do think that would impact it being played quite a lot and 7 with 3 cards in my mind seems more fair.
But even at 8 it doesn't kill the Tickatus Entirely infact I made a deck the other day to proove how broken the card truely is to a friend. Running only 2 minions Tickatus and Rustwixs the rest were spells, Jaraxxus and the neutral weapon.
The design was simple keep clearing the board until you got Free Addmission or The Dark Portal to get a discounted Tick and Rust then Felosphy the tickatus and burn 10-15 cards at that point either Rustwix, Shadow Council, or Jaraxxus to finish off your opponent if they hadn't already conceeded.
Played 5 games won 5 games, In one of the games I played Dark Portal on turn 4 got Tickatus discounted to 1 mana then double felosphyed and corrupted them before even playing the 3rd the guy had conceeded because loosing half your deck before turn 10 is complete and utter BS.
Anyway if he was 7 or 8 yes he would be harder to corrupt but thats the issue 6 mana for an 8/8 that burns 1/6th of a deck that gets played multiple times is stupid.
Which is why I agree he needs nerfing that or they need to add a minion that shuffles all discarded cards back into your deck to give players a shot and coming back in addtion to reviving C'thun decks that are just pointless in that match up.
Or removing the demon part of him could help (no more discounting/copping)
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I have an idea how to improve 'Oh My Yogg' - cast a spell 1 level higher than the original, targeting enemies (you obviously would target enemies 9/10). As it is, it is a 1-mana Counterspell. I play this deck sometimes and hate myself for it.
Librams remain a problem with pen flinger, also rogues ability to draw and cycle low cost cards with pen flinger really early in the game.
I'm not even sure its that OP honestly - it is just so goddam slow. It sucks to sit there doing nothing while being slowly tickled to death by flung pens - it's a gameplay issue.
Animated Broomstick is still a problem.
Deck of Lunacy has too much high roll potential for zero skill or decision making input.
In general there is too much high roll potential across nearly all classes - play a few rounds of classic then switch to standrard and it just feels absurd. Is this really the experience you want to pay extra for? Power levels need to come down across the board IMO, I would be happy to see many minor nerfs and adjustments aside from the obvious ones.
I think we should be careful when shouting for nerfs, for I'm afraid that then, other and even more solitaire decks would rise (lifesteal OTK DH, druid with celestial alignment, weapon rouge, etc.). That's also why I'm fine with Tickatus being a powerhouse (if Blizz decided to adjust Control Warlock, I hope they make Cascading Disaster 5 mana - that card haunts me!!!).
However, some cards still seem out of place: Deck of Lunacy (-> start by changing all numbers in the card to 2), the Pala secret weapon (-> 2 durability), Pen Flinger of course (-> 3 mana to deal 2 damage, just like head crack).
Watch posts seem fine, it would be a pity if cards like these were unplayable... Kazakus is just like old Keleseth: play on curve, increase winrate. It's designed to be like this, so it probably won't be nerfed, but I wouldn't mind if they changed the "summon a 2nd copy of the golem" to sth else (for example "return a minion back to it's owners hand").
Out of interest, to people such as yourself, does leaving this sort of comment make you feel better? I'm genuinely interested. It clearly isn't true, criticise their competence if you like but this just seems like a completely pointless, throwaway dig based on absolutely nothing.
Did you get a buzz when you hit send or something?
In my option there are a few cards that need buffing and a few that need nerfing, here are some of my predictions on nerfs, changes and buffs we might see to better stabalize the meta.
Nerf Predictions:
Pen Flinger - Upped to 2 mana 3/1.
Animated Broom Up it to 2 mana with 2/1 body.
Crossroads Gossiper - upped from 3-4 mana.
Si7 Infiltrator replaced with eater of secrets. (Probably won't happen but this would actually see play unlike Si7 which doesnt)
Celestial Alignment upped from 7-8
Refreshing Spring Water - Upped from 4-5
Conviction Upped from 1-2 mana (It starts as a blessing of might and ends up a 1 mana bloodlust that can way to easily end games)
Oh My Yogg - Change to When your opponent casts a spell, they instead cast a random one of their class of the same cost. (currently it also randomly targets with the new spell it shouldn't it isn't worded that way).
Sword of the Fallen - Upped from 2-3 mana 2/2 Stats.
Hysteria - Change to Choose an enemy minion it takes turns attacking random minions on each side of the board until it dies. (For me this RNG seems heavily in favor of the caster normally clearing their opponents side before even hitting their own).
Tickatus - 7 mana 6/6 Battlecry Remove the top 3 cards from your deck. Corrupt Your Opponents deck instead.
As for Buffs and addtions here are my thoughts.
1. Add more types to minions and make it so players can build different archtypes why should competative murlocs only be viable for paladin or shaman, I understand that their are minion based spells to support the archtypes for these classes but back in classic days there wasn't and people could have fun playing a themed deck.
2. Rogue's either need some sort of AOE or Mass removal currently they have no way to deal with a large board such as what Clown Druid generates.
3. Even their single target removal is very outdated 4 mana destory a minion vs say Brittlebone Destroyer that not only destroys a minion but develops the board which is something else the rogue can struggle to do. (I get Brittlebone has a requirement but its one that is easily met and it is 1 of many cards of the same or lower costs I could point out that is vastly better than a 4 mana destory 1 minion)
Then Take Backstab I get its a combo activator but 2 damage to an undamaged minion isn't good enough when we have 3 health 1 drops and 4 health 2 drops as standard they need to Up its mana cost to 1 and make it deal 4 damage to an undamaged minion or leave it at 0 and make it deal 3.
Honestly the rest of the classes other than the things I pointed out in Nerf predictions seem okay I've played plenty of games with them and not had any sort of issue but Rogue right now doesn't seem to be in a good place unless you run early game aggro with Pen Flinger which everyone hates and is more than likely going to get nerfed.
Take Weapon rogue Even running 4 weapons and poisons if you don't get your weapon on curve you just die because your running probably 1/3 if not more of your deck with poison and weapons then god help you if someone has removal pretty much GG right there if they are smart.
Then theres C'Thun with Tickatus being promonant C'thun is a pointless card as normally you don't have all 4 parts played by the time he gets played then 9/10 he burns 1 part rendering it mute as a win condition.
Steal/copy Rogue is a joke and is even less useful with spell types being added to the game.
Stealth Rogue isn't strong enough for the current meta and is easily countered by any aoe and most RNG effect e.g Devolving Missiles.
So when pen flinger is nerfed into an unplayable state what is rogue mean't to play and run as a win condition because currently I see them as the weakest class in standard. Infact looking at my tracker win rate out of 29 games I lost 2 vs Rogue and probably lost a good 50-100 games testing different archtypes over the last 3 days.
Why should nerf this shitty card??? 7 mana do nothing and give advantage to your opponent
If you think Celestial Alignment is a bad card your playing it wrong, My Celestial Clown druid is at 14 wins with it because even if you Celestial before corrupting stuff if you run any sort of card generation you can easily still corrupt them and crush your opponents.
The hardest matchup for them is Warlock with double twisting but even that has limits.
Obviously this was a few days back I played it so it might not work aswell anymore but I wouldn't call the card bad as for why I am predicting its cost being increased because its going to limit what stuff blizzard can make for the next 2 years and from the moment it got revealed people have complained about it. Personally I don't think its game breaking or toxic like Penflinger and Tickitus are.
i mean i agree that request nerf is pretty well not needed but Secret paladin is actually a legit deck again. Its really strong and hard to play aout. it can just outtempo you and winning pretty fast.
Its not an specific card that need nerf but the whole game. They can't have a game with discover mechanic <-- this kill the game, you use 20+ extra cards outside your deck to put into play.. that's not cool...
If they want to change the game, what not a game mode with "card ban week rotation" into game ?
Example: From 03/04/2021 until 10/04/2021, Tickatus Refreshing Spring Water are not available into competitive mode.
They could also include the community to upvote each card they want to ban in a week and the next week the banned cards are allowed again and others enter into rotation.
Iksar stated, they hire designers, not players. Thats why they got no clue at all, iksar is a former restaurant consultant. DH release and the many nerfs following it, is the best example that they dont playtest. Iksar too busy playing World of Warcraft.
This is exactly what’s wrong with the community, and it mimics the WoW community as well. You don’t want things nerfed, you want things to be unplayable, which is just stupid.
The only two you were even close on was lunacy and spring water, as lunacy should probably be on 4 and water on 5.
But Jesus, the buff liberam is ANYTHING but op lol, it’s just a fine card.
Pen flinger on 2 kills it entirely. Tickatus on 8 lol? Soooo you can play jaraxxus, or some random 10 drop you shouldn’t be running to corrupt him? Again, kills the card.
“Balance” is a two way street. A card seeing no play is as unbalanced as a card seeing too much.
I hope nerfs will be something like:
Deck of Lunacy: Cost increased from 2 to 4.
Sword of the Fallen: Durability decreased from 3 to 2 OR cost increased from 2 to 3.
Libram of Justice: Cost increased from 5 to 6.
Libram of Hope: Cost increased from 9 to 10.
Pen Flinger: Cost increased from 1 to 2 OR make it target only minions.
OP missed the point completely with those nerfs, if team5 is nerfing anything it should be this :
Deck of Lunacy - 5 mana and revert this nerf when the card pool is bigger , right now there's only (1) 9 mana spell - Libram of Hope , (2) 10 mana spells - Nagrand Slam and Survival of the Fittest , most 7 mana spells are insane, almost every 6 mana spell give you card draw and so on, this card is busted because the card pool is so limited that the 'average' is really really good, not because Refreshing Spring Water is 0 mana draw 2.
Far Watch Post- 3 mana and reduce the health to 3
Sword of the Fallen - 3 mana with 2 charges
Pen Flinger- 2 mana , same effect
Oh man, there are so many cards that need adjustments that I just don't see them getting to them all. They would need to nuke this expansion and core set and try again later.
At this point the best we can hope for is to make another class or archetype viable, but holy crap do they have work to do here.
Of course it can be played around. Destroy one minion in battle then use Hex/Devolving Missiles or other transformation or removal for the other.
Pen Flinger - Just idiotic that you have to wait 1,5 minutes every turn watching opponent replay it over and over
Deck of lunacy - problem of this is that they have removed all the bad spells
Jandice Barov - same problem. They have removed bad minions on 5. You always get extreme highroll
That will be a good start, then they could wait 2 weeks to see if more nerfs are needed
This is definetly The worst meta of a card game I ever played, no hyperbole
I played quest rogue era, shudderwock, Jade Druid, neither of these decks had above 50% winrate overall, they had annoying polarizing matchups but they had it's counters at least that kept them from being spammed on ladder.
Right now Mage's biggest counter, Poison Rogue, a deck designed entirely to counter Mage at the cost of losing to any other deck, is barely keeping a 55% winrate against it. There is no answer, there is no deck you can pick if you hate Lunacy Mage and wants to punish them hard and farm them. You best bets will neat you a 50% winrate against it . For that reason, people are just spamming Mage , the class is close to 40% representation at Diamond 1 according to VS Data Reaper Live. The only reason why the winrate is not higher is because most matches are mirrors or the only other broken class at the moment, paladin, which is close to a coin toss also
These 2 classes represent more than 60% of the diamond ladder right now , meanwhile classes like warrior , priest, shaman, hunter are struggling to have 2% playrate.
Congratulations devs, you broke the game again. First few days of the expansion and the game feels completely unplayable if you are not one of these guys that find "fun" spamming RNG mage to climb easily on the back of a broken deck.
I see that Oh My Yogg! was mentioned here multiple times, but the sad fact is that its never gonna be nerfed. Why? Well they cant change the mana cost because its a secret. They also cant change the text, because the only way to nerf it to add more text on the card and it already has a long one. HS's main principle is to keep card texts as short as possible so Im 100% sure they wont add even more text to OMY. The only thing they can do is indirectly nerfing it by nerfing the synergy cards like the sword.
Just to touch on the Tickatus being nerfed to 8 mana I do think that would impact it being played quite a lot and 7 with 3 cards in my mind seems more fair.
But even at 8 it doesn't kill the Tickatus Entirely infact I made a deck the other day to proove how broken the card truely is to a friend. Running only 2 minions Tickatus and Rustwixs the rest were spells, Jaraxxus and the neutral weapon.
The design was simple keep clearing the board until you got Free Addmission or The Dark Portal to get a discounted Tick and Rust then Felosphy the tickatus and burn 10-15 cards at that point either Rustwix, Shadow Council, or Jaraxxus to finish off your opponent if they hadn't already conceeded.
Played 5 games won 5 games, In one of the games I played Dark Portal on turn 4 got Tickatus discounted to 1 mana then double felosphyed and corrupted them before even playing the 3rd the guy had conceeded because loosing half your deck before turn 10 is complete and utter BS.
Anyway if he was 7 or 8 yes he would be harder to corrupt but thats the issue 6 mana for an 8/8 that burns 1/6th of a deck that gets played multiple times is stupid.
Which is why I agree he needs nerfing that or they need to add a minion that shuffles all discarded cards back into your deck to give players a shot and coming back in addtion to reviving C'thun decks that are just pointless in that match up.
Or removing the demon part of him could help (no more discounting/copping)