I believe it's been announced on Twitter that there will in fact (somewhat incredibly) be a dust refund for Ysera? Blizzard's inconsistency when it comes to handing out dust for some changes and not others with no semblance of continuity is remarkable, but hey... Blizzard. :-)
I don't see any inconsistency. They nerfed the cards generated by Ysera; the closest prior nerf that was similar that didn't give a refund is Thermaplugg with the leper gnome nerf, which was a long time ago now, and paradigms have changed. If the Wondrous wand reduced the cards to 1 mana, not 0, then I'd expect a Togwaggle refund, too.
To clarify - this is not for Ysera rotating. The refund is because the dream cards are getting changed, and most of those changes are nerfs.
Yes, I am aware of the reason for the refund. The inconsistency is in the fact that some cards getting pseudo-nerfed get refunded, whereas others don't. And then there's art changes that have long been debated as nerfs to cards visually which also don't get refunded. So like I say, inconsistency = Blizzard. :-)
I wonder if Deathwing's nerf gets a refund too, actually. Original Deathwing was a core component of Maca'thun Warlock. By nerfing Deathwing, it also has a detrimental effect on Meca'thun meaning the card is not as strong. Since this is exactly the same effect as nerfing the Dream cards for Ysera (when ysera wasn't directly nerfed herself), we should expect a full refund for Meca'thun, otherwise inconsistency once again. I think we know whether that's going to happen or not. :-)
Deathwing nerf? Old deathwing is still going to be around and usable in Wild, hence the new one has a different name; same with Ysera/Maly et al.. Is there a change to original deathwing that's not been reported? Only those cards with the same name (and possibly same type, we'll see what happens with Jaraxxus) are getting flat-out replaced. There will be no change to mech'athun lock.
I believe it's been announced on Twitter that there will in fact (somewhat incredibly) be a dust refund for Ysera? Blizzard's inconsistency when it comes to handing out dust for some changes and not others with no semblance of continuity is remarkable, but hey... Blizzard. :-)
I don't see any inconsistency. They nerfed the cards generated by Ysera; the closest prior nerf that was similar that didn't give a refund is Thermaplugg with the leper gnome nerf, which was a long time ago now, and paradigms have changed. If the Wondrous wand reduced the cards to 1 mana, not 0, then I'd expect a Togwaggle refund, too.
To clarify - this is not for Ysera rotating. The refund is because the dream cards are getting changed, and most of those changes are nerfs.
Yes, I am aware of the reason for the refund. The inconsistency is in the fact that some cards getting pseudo-nerfed get refunded, whereas others don't. And then there's art changes that have long been debated as nerfs to cards visually which also don't get refunded. So like I say, inconsistency = Blizzard. :-)
I wonder if Deathwing's nerf gets a refund too, actually. Original Deathwing was a core component of Maca'thun Warlock. By nerfing Deathwing, it also has a detrimental effect on Meca'thun meaning the card is not as strong. Since this is exactly the same effect as nerfing the Dream cards for Ysera (when ysera wasn't directly nerfed herself), we should expect a full refund for Meca'thun, otherwise inconsistency once again. I think we know whether that's going to happen or not. :-)
The old dragons are rotating into wild unchanged besides old Ysera whose dream cards are changing to match the new one for some reason. Hence why the refund is valid.
All the new dragon aspects have different names from their classic counterparts and are completely different cards.
Ysera - Ysera the dreamer, Deathwing - Deathwing the Destroyer, etc.
I think this is why you were so confused on the last forum post.
They should actually give WAY more refunds. Yes, they give out the "core" set for free, but ALL other classic cards get a nerf comparable to a HOF rotation: THEY WILL NO LONGER BE AVAILABLE IN STANDARD! What you have built up as a stable, long-term investment for any format got hit by a sledgehammer.
This should really be the outcry here. I actually just recently completed my Classic collection, and given I never bought classic packs for real money, I expect many veteran players to finish theirs around this time. The HOF rotation at least gave some nice extra dust, this time, you get breadcrumbs.
Don't tell me "I can still use them in wild." When was the last time someone bought a classic pack to play the Wild format? It probably never happened...
They should actually give WAY more refunds. Yes, they give out the "core" set for free, but ALL other classic cards get a nerf comparable to a HOF rotation: THEY WILL NO LONGER BE AVAILABLE IN STANDARD! What you have built up as a stable, long-term investment for any format got hit by a sledgehammer.
This should really be the outcry here. I actually just recently completed my Classic collection, and given I never bought classic packs for real money, I expect many veteran players to finish theirs around this time. The HOF rotation at least gave some nice extra dust, this time, you get breadcrumbs.
Don't tell me "I can still use them in wild." When was the last time someone bought a classic pack to play the Wild format? It probably never happened...
I'm missing non-golden Tirion, Edwin (though I DEd the golden of him), Nat, and Cenarius, all of which I have golden, as well as Milihouse, Cho, and Gruul, which I have no copies of. Having played since pre-naxx, but dropped off significantly post-STD creation. So still a way to go for me! Probably be a few eternal holes now, though cho is the most likely to get crafted for any combo shenanigans.
I mean, we do get a different set of cards for free; I can see why they're not givnig refunds for most stuff. And, honestly, most of those cards are either underpowered or eating up design space - look at Cairne/Geddon for the former, or Maly/Boar/Anton/similar. The ones that do see play? They eat design space, generally, or are cheated in (murlocs). Boar, Malygos, Dread corsair, even sea giant with how much flooding classes can have, all eat design space. Bloodlust ensures that token creators for shaman will generally suck. Et al.
We didn't get huge piles of dust when standard became a thing; no reason to expect blizz to break the in game economy now.
The thing is there’s still ways to do this rouge can use shadow step or brewmaster also the card is actually broken it adds 5 cards to your hand including 4 7/6 4 3/5 power overwhelming on crack a better sap and a hellfire that’s just better im actually exited for it.
I believe it's been announced on Twitter that there will in fact (somewhat incredibly) be a dust refund for Ysera? Blizzard's inconsistency when it comes to handing out dust for some changes and not others with no semblance of continuity is remarkable, but hey... Blizzard. :-)
I don't see any inconsistency. They nerfed the cards generated by Ysera; the closest prior nerf that was similar that didn't give a refund is Thermaplugg with the leper gnome nerf, which was a long time ago now, and paradigms have changed. If the Wondrous wand reduced the cards to 1 mana, not 0, then I'd expect a Togwaggle refund, too.
To clarify - this is not for Ysera rotating. The refund is because the dream cards are getting changed, and most of those changes are nerfs.
Yes, I am aware of the reason for the refund. The inconsistency is in the fact that some cards getting pseudo-nerfed get refunded, whereas others don't. And then there's art changes that have long been debated as nerfs to cards visually which also don't get refunded. So like I say, inconsistency = Blizzard. :-)
I wonder if Deathwing's nerf gets a refund too, actually. Original Deathwing was a core component of Maca'thun Warlock. By nerfing Deathwing, it also has a detrimental effect on Meca'thun meaning the card is not as strong. Since this is exactly the same effect as nerfing the Dream cards for Ysera (when ysera wasn't directly nerfed herself), we should expect a full refund for Meca'thun, otherwise inconsistency once again. I think we know whether that's going to happen or not. :-)
Deathwing being used in mecha’thun warlock? Only if you want to lose? I believe you are recalling cataclysm. Original deathwing is also going to be playable in wild and unchanged. Ysera will be playable in wild but NERFED. That’s why there’s a refund. Also, if you expect to be refunded an entire deck because of a nerfed card, you’ve lost your mind, and they’ve never done anything like that, so that’s not inconsistent at all. You really find a way to be condescending about everything as well.
The thing is there’s still ways to do this rouge can use shadow step or brewmaster also the card is actually broken it adds 5 cards to your hand including 4 7/6 4 3/5 power overwhelming on crack a better sap and a hellfire that’s just better im actually exited for it.
Please read some of the posts in the thread. It is talking about OLD YSERA, who is giong to Wild, but still getting the nerfed dream cards. Thus Ysera is nerfed, thus we get a dust refund (and Blizz agrees).
I believe it's been announced on Twitter that there will in fact (somewhat incredibly) be a dust refund for Ysera? Blizzard's inconsistency when it comes to handing out dust for some changes and not others with no semblance of continuity is remarkable, but hey... Blizzard. :-)
I don't see any inconsistency. They nerfed the cards generated by Ysera; the closest prior nerf that was similar that didn't give a refund is Thermaplugg with the leper gnome nerf, which was a long time ago now, and paradigms have changed. If the Wondrous wand reduced the cards to 1 mana, not 0, then I'd expect a Togwaggle refund, too.
To clarify - this is not for Ysera rotating. The refund is because the dream cards are getting changed, and most of those changes are nerfs.
Yes, I am aware of the reason for the refund. The inconsistency is in the fact that some cards getting pseudo-nerfed get refunded, whereas others don't. And then there's art changes that have long been debated as nerfs to cards visually which also don't get refunded. So like I say, inconsistency = Blizzard. :-)
I wonder if Deathwing's nerf gets a refund too, actually. Original Deathwing was a core component of Maca'thun Warlock. By nerfing Deathwing, it also has a detrimental effect on Meca'thun meaning the card is not as strong. Since this is exactly the same effect as nerfing the Dream cards for Ysera (when ysera wasn't directly nerfed herself), we should expect a full refund for Meca'thun, otherwise inconsistency once again. I think we know whether that's going to happen or not. :-)
Deathwing being used in mecha’thun warlock? Only if you want to lose? I believe you are recalling cataclysm. Original deathwing is also going to be playable in wild and unchanged. Ysera will be playable in wild but NERFED. That’s why there’s a refund. Also, if you expect to be refunded an entire deck because of a nerfed card, you’ve lost your mind, and they’ve never done anything like that, so that’s not inconsistent at all. You really find a way to be condescending about everything as well.
I don't, that was the whole point I was making. That expecting refunds for cards which are effected by changes to other cards (such as Ysera, for example) is greedy and entitled and you'd have to be out of your mind to expect it. Thank you for the agreement.
I'm not sure you know what "condescending" means, though, lol. But I'm sure in your mind that made sense.
I believe it's been announced on Twitter that there will in fact (somewhat incredibly) be a dust refund for Ysera? Blizzard's inconsistency when it comes to handing out dust for some changes and not others with no semblance of continuity is remarkable, but hey... Blizzard. :-)
I don't see any inconsistency. They nerfed the cards generated by Ysera; the closest prior nerf that was similar that didn't give a refund is Thermaplugg with the leper gnome nerf, which was a long time ago now, and paradigms have changed. If the Wondrous wand reduced the cards to 1 mana, not 0, then I'd expect a Togwaggle refund, too.
To clarify - this is not for Ysera rotating. The refund is because the dream cards are getting changed, and most of those changes are nerfs.
Yes, I am aware of the reason for the refund. The inconsistency is in the fact that some cards getting pseudo-nerfed get refunded, whereas others don't. And then there's art changes that have long been debated as nerfs to cards visually which also don't get refunded. So like I say, inconsistency = Blizzard. :-)
I wonder if Deathwing's nerf gets a refund too, actually. Original Deathwing was a core component of Maca'thun Warlock. By nerfing Deathwing, it also has a detrimental effect on Meca'thun meaning the card is not as strong. Since this is exactly the same effect as nerfing the Dream cards for Ysera (when ysera wasn't directly nerfed herself), we should expect a full refund for Meca'thun, otherwise inconsistency once again. I think we know whether that's going to happen or not. :-)
Deathwing being used in mecha’thun warlock? Only if you want to lose? I believe you are recalling cataclysm. Original deathwing is also going to be playable in wild and unchanged. Ysera will be playable in wild but NERFED. That’s why there’s a refund. Also, if you expect to be refunded an entire deck because of a nerfed card, you’ve lost your mind, and they’ve never done anything like that, so that’s not inconsistent at all. You really find a way to be condescending about everything as well.
I don't, that was the whole point I was making. That expecting refunds for cards which are effected by changes to other cards (such as Ysera, for example) is greedy and entitled and you'd have to be out of your mind to expect it. Thank you for the agreement.
I'm not sure you know what "condescending" means, though, lol. But I'm sure in your mind that made sense.
To be honest your initial assessment comparing a 'Deathwing nerf' (which isn't actually happening) to the Ysera nerf was wrong in the first place, something which you've conveniently chose to ignore, so I'd maybe tone it down a little bit.
P.S Anyone who thinks a card is nerfed because they changed the picture to show less demon tits is out of their mind.
To be frank, I think this account might just be trolling based on their post history. Between this post and another about old Ysera they’ve been proven to be wrong a few times and conveniently ignored talking points that dismantles their argument.
But I’ll try here again just in case. If Heistbaron Toggwaggle’s “Wondrous Wand” was changed to: draw 3 cards that cost (1) mana, how is that not a nerf?
I believe it's been announced on Twitter that there will in fact (somewhat incredibly) be a dust refund for Ysera? Blizzard's inconsistency when it comes to handing out dust for some changes and not others with no semblance of continuity is remarkable, but hey... Blizzard. :-)
I don't see any inconsistency. They nerfed the cards generated by Ysera; the closest prior nerf that was similar that didn't give a refund is Thermaplugg with the leper gnome nerf, which was a long time ago now, and paradigms have changed. If the Wondrous wand reduced the cards to 1 mana, not 0, then I'd expect a Togwaggle refund, too.
To clarify - this is not for Ysera rotating. The refund is because the dream cards are getting changed, and most of those changes are nerfs.
Yes, I am aware of the reason for the refund. The inconsistency is in the fact that some cards getting pseudo-nerfed get refunded, whereas others don't. And then there's art changes that have long been debated as nerfs to cards visually which also don't get refunded. So like I say, inconsistency = Blizzard. :-)
I wonder if Deathwing's nerf gets a refund too, actually. Original Deathwing was a core component of Maca'thun Warlock. By nerfing Deathwing, it also has a detrimental effect on Meca'thun meaning the card is not as strong. Since this is exactly the same effect as nerfing the Dream cards for Ysera (when ysera wasn't directly nerfed herself), we should expect a full refund for Meca'thun, otherwise inconsistency once again. I think we know whether that's going to happen or not. :-)
The old dragons are rotating into wild unchanged besides old Ysera whose dream cards are changingto match the new one for some reason. Hence why the refund is valid.
All the new dragon aspects have different names from their classic counterparts and are completely different cards.
Yes. That was the whole point I was making. Old Ysera isnt changing. She is going to wild. Her dream cards are being changed. Which are not the same card. But they dont have a dusrt value, so no dust is really necessary. however Blizzard have decided to refund it anyway, hence : "inconsistancy". Honestly, it's like pulling teeth out on these forums at times.
The point about Deathwing (which seems hard for some to grasp) is that a change to that card would affect other cards in a negative way. Perhaps I meant Cataclysm over Deathwing - though I've seen plenty of DW versions - but that's moot and the point is the same. Going by their history, Blizzard doesn't normally hand out random refunds every time a card is affected y other cards being changed.
All faux-ccusations of trolling and ad hominems directed toward me aside (which in itself is certainly worthy of reporting), I firmly believe what I am saying is correct. Just because one or two people disagreee dismantles nothing and that claim is somewhat laughable at best.
I believe it's been announced on Twitter that there will in fact (somewhat incredibly) be a dust refund for Ysera? Blizzard's inconsistency when it comes to handing out dust for some changes and not others with no semblance of continuity is remarkable, but hey... Blizzard. :-)
I don't see any inconsistency. They nerfed the cards generated by Ysera; the closest prior nerf that was similar that didn't give a refund is Thermaplugg with the leper gnome nerf, which was a long time ago now, and paradigms have changed. If the Wondrous wand reduced the cards to 1 mana, not 0, then I'd expect a Togwaggle refund, too.
To clarify - this is not for Ysera rotating. The refund is because the dream cards are getting changed, and most of those changes are nerfs.
Yes, I am aware of the reason for the refund. The inconsistency is in the fact that some cards getting pseudo-nerfed get refunded, whereas others don't. And then there's art changes that have long been debated as nerfs to cards visually which also don't get refunded. So like I say, inconsistency = Blizzard. :-)
I wonder if Deathwing's nerf gets a refund too, actually. Original Deathwing was a core component of Maca'thun Warlock. By nerfing Deathwing, it also has a detrimental effect on Meca'thun meaning the card is not as strong. Since this is exactly the same effect as nerfing the Dream cards for Ysera (when ysera wasn't directly nerfed herself), we should expect a full refund for Meca'thun, otherwise inconsistency once again. I think we know whether that's going to happen or not. :-)
The old dragons are rotating into wild unchanged besides old Ysera whose dream cards are changingto match the new one for some reason. Hence why the refund is valid.
All the new dragon aspects have different names from their classic counterparts and are completely different cards.
Yes. That was the whole point I was making. Old Ysera isnt changing. She is going to wild. Her dream cards are being changed. Which are not the same card. But they dont have a dusrt value, so no dust is really necessary. however Blizzard have decided to refund it anyway, hence : "inconsistancy". Honestly, it's like pulling teeth out on these forums at times.
The point about Deathwing (which seems hard for some to grasp) is that a change to that card would affect other cards in a negative way. Perhaps I meant Cataclysm over Deathwing - though I've seen plenty of DW versions - but that's moot and the point is the same. Going by their history, Blizzard doesn't normally hand out random refunds every time a card is affected y other cards being changed.
All faux-ccusations of trolling and ad hominems directed toward me aside (which in itself is certainly worthy of reporting), I firmly believe what I am saying is correct. Just because one or two people disagreee dismantles nothing and that claim is somewhat laughable at best.
There could never exist a Mecha'thun deck that uses Deathwing to complete the combo, because in order for Mecha'thun's deathrattle to trigger, you can have no minions on the board. If you use Deathwing to kill Mecha'thun, the deathrattle won't trigger. So I assure you, you haven't seen "plenty of DW" versions.
It is not hard to grasp your point at all, we all get what you're trying to argue. When a couple of key cards in Kingsbane Rogue was changed, it didn't warrant a refund for Kingsbane itself, because it wasn't the card being changed. We all get that, and we all agree on that.
However, that argument does not apply to old Ysera, because the card itself - not a supporting card in a deck - HAS fundamentally changed. Before, you played Ysera with the expectation of getting at least one of five different Dream cards, a card type that is uncollectable and specifically tied to her. The Dream cards ARE her effect. Now, those cards - Ysera's effect - have changed. Therefore, the card has fundamentally changed, and it warrants a dust refound. This is completely in line with Blizzard's dust refound policy and not at all inconsistent.
I believe it's been announced on Twitter that there will in fact (somewhat incredibly) be a dust refund for Ysera? Blizzard's inconsistency when it comes to handing out dust for some changes and not others with no semblance of continuity is remarkable, but hey... Blizzard. :-)
I don't see any inconsistency. They nerfed the cards generated by Ysera; the closest prior nerf that was similar that didn't give a refund is Thermaplugg with the leper gnome nerf, which was a long time ago now, and paradigms have changed. If the Wondrous wand reduced the cards to 1 mana, not 0, then I'd expect a Togwaggle refund, too.
To clarify - this is not for Ysera rotating. The refund is because the dream cards are getting changed, and most of those changes are nerfs.
Yes, I am aware of the reason for the refund. The inconsistency is in the fact that some cards getting pseudo-nerfed get refunded, whereas others don't. And then there's art changes that have long been debated as nerfs to cards visually which also don't get refunded. So like I say, inconsistency = Blizzard. :-)
I wonder if Deathwing's nerf gets a refund too, actually. Original Deathwing was a core component of Maca'thun Warlock. By nerfing Deathwing, it also has a detrimental effect on Meca'thun meaning the card is not as strong. Since this is exactly the same effect as nerfing the Dream cards for Ysera (when ysera wasn't directly nerfed herself), we should expect a full refund for Meca'thun, otherwise inconsistency once again. I think we know whether that's going to happen or not. :-)
The old dragons are rotating into wild unchanged besides old Ysera whose dream cards are changingto match the new one for some reason. Hence why the refund is valid.
All the new dragon aspects have different names from their classic counterparts and are completely different cards.
Yes. That was the whole point I was making. Old Ysera isnt changing. She is going to wild. Her dream cards are being changed. Which are not the same card. But they dont have a dusrt value, so no dust is really necessary. however Blizzard have decided to refund it anyway, hence : "inconsistancy". Honestly, it's like pulling teeth out on these forums at times.
The point about Deathwing (which seems hard for some to grasp) is that a change to that card would affect other cards in a negative way. Perhaps I meant Cataclysm over Deathwing - though I've seen plenty of DW versions - but that's moot and the point is the same. Going by their history, Blizzard doesn't normally hand out random refunds every time a card is affected y other cards being changed.
All faux-ccusations of trolling and ad hominems directed toward me aside (which in itself is certainly worthy of reporting), I firmly believe what I am saying is correct. Just because one or two people disagreee dismantles nothing and that claim is somewhat laughable at best.
There could never exist a Mecha'thun deck that uses Deathwing to complete the combo, because in order for Mecha'thun's deathrattle to trigger, you can have no minions on the board. If you use Deathwing to kill Mecha'thun, the deathrattle won't trigger. So I assure you, you haven't seen "plenty of DW" versions.
I didn't realise that you were watching all of my games to know what I have or haven't seen. >_> That in itself sounds more like a poor attempt at smarm rather than an actual point.
It is not hard to grasp your point at all, we all get what you're trying to argue. When a couple of key cards in Kingsbane Rogue was changed, it didn't warrant a refund for Kingsbane itself, because it wasn't the card being changed. We all get that, and we all agree on that.
Well, that's good. Then I guess we're in agreement.
However, that argument does not apply to old Ysera, because the card itself - not a supporting card in a deck - HAS fundamentally changed. Before, you played Ysera with the expectation of getting at least one of five different Dream cards, a card type that is uncollectable and specifically tied to her. The Dream cards ARE her effect. Now, those cards - Ysera's effect - have changed. Therefore, the card has fundamentally changed, and it warrants a dust refound. This is completely in line with Blizzard's dust refound policy and not at all inconsistent.
This is obviously and demonstrably incorrect, based on your previous helpful example and the following detail. A card that was not directly altered is being refunded. Look at it this way. if I put the old version of the card and the new version side by side, just point out the visible difference. Job done. That should be easy enough.
This is obviously and demonstrably incorrect, based on your previous helpful example and the following detail. A card that was not directly altered is being refunded. Look at it this way. if I put the old version of the card and the new version side by side, just point out the visible difference. Job done. That should be easy enough.
The dream cards are, for all intents and purposes, part of the Ysera cards. They are generated by only two cards, one of which is not released yet, and are uncollectable tokens from those sources. That is the crucial difference. The only comparable situation from previous nerfs was Leper gnome, but as Plugg is not the sole source it's not really a direct comparison - and honestly, if that nerf went through today, I think blizz would have given a dust refund due to the position of the design team on such things changing.
If Jaraxxus' hero power went to three mana, or summoning a 5/5, then those would be analogous nerfs to this one, and yes, I feel that a refund would be expected (and given). If Blizz changed ashbringer, I would expect a refund for Tirion (not the best analogy currently because the size of the weapon is specified, but a line of text that is, say, 'You take double damage when attacking' could be added without anything added to Tirion's card).
There could never exist a Mecha'thun deck that uses Deathwing to complete the combo, because in order for Mecha'thun's deathrattle to trigger, you can have no minions on the board. If you use Deathwing to kill Mecha'thun, the deathrattle won't trigger. So I assure you, you haven't seen "plenty of DW" versions.
I didn't realise that you were watching all of my games to know what I have or haven't seen. >_> That in itself sounds more like a poor attempt at smarm rather than an actual point.
However, that argument does not apply to old Ysera, because the card itself - not a supporting card in a deck - HAS fundamentally changed. Before, you played Ysera with the expectation of getting at least one of five different Dream cards, a card type that is uncollectable and specifically tied to her. The Dream cards ARE her effect. Now, those cards - Ysera's effect - have changed. Therefore, the card has fundamentally changed, and it warrants a dust refound. This is completely in line with Blizzard's dust refound policy and not at all inconsistent.
This is obviously and demonstrably incorrect, based on your previous helpful example and the following detail. A card that was not directly altered is being refunded. Look at it this way. if I put the old version of the card and the new version side by side, just point out the visible difference. Job done. That should be easy enough.
Look, I really want to believe you're arguing in good faith, but you're not doing yourself any favours when you're not addressing valid points such as the Togwaggle example and the fact that the Dream cards are uncollectible and intrinsically tied to Ysera. The change is not visible on the card itself, but it is very clearly functional.
A very relevant example is the nerf to Solarian Prime, an uncollectible card that can only be generated through Astromancer Solarian. Players were given a dust refund for Astromancer Solarian because its effect had changed: it no longer shuffled a 7 mama prime into your deck, but a 9 mama one. This change was not visible on the card itself, but it was very clearly still a nerf that warranted a refund. Similarly, the cards generated by Ysera have drastically changed, and Blizzard is, as always, giving a refund.
Also, I'm not saying that I've seen every game you've ever played. I'm just saying that Mecha'thun cannot be activated by playing Deathwing, which is why I highly doubt you've seen it played on ladder. Nerfing Deathwing would not impact the Mecha'thun Warlock combo in any way, so it's very strange that you keep using it as an example. If you're wrong about one thing, maybe you could be wrong about other things too? No judgement, just saying. We're all wrong once in awhile.
Deathwing nerf? Old deathwing is still going to be around and usable in Wild, hence the new one has a different name; same with Ysera/Maly et al.. Is there a change to original deathwing that's not been reported? Only those cards with the same name (and possibly same type, we'll see what happens with Jaraxxus) are getting flat-out replaced. There will be no change to mech'athun lock.
Or am I missing a nerf somewhere here?
The old dragons are rotating into wild unchanged besides old Ysera whose dream cards are changing to match the new one for some reason. Hence why the refund is valid.
All the new dragon aspects have different names from their classic counterparts and are completely different cards.
Ysera - Ysera the dreamer, Deathwing - Deathwing the Destroyer, etc.
I think this is why you were so confused on the last forum post.
They should actually give WAY more refunds. Yes, they give out the "core" set for free, but ALL other classic cards get a nerf comparable to a HOF rotation: THEY WILL NO LONGER BE AVAILABLE IN STANDARD! What you have built up as a stable, long-term investment for any format got hit by a sledgehammer.
This should really be the outcry here. I actually just recently completed my Classic collection, and given I never bought classic packs for real money, I expect many veteran players to finish theirs around this time. The HOF rotation at least gave some nice extra dust, this time, you get breadcrumbs.
Don't tell me "I can still use them in wild." When was the last time someone bought a classic pack to play the Wild format? It probably never happened...
Editor of the Heartpwn Legendary Crafting Guide:
https://www.hearthpwn.com/forums/hearthstone-general/card-discussion/205920-legendary-tier-list-crafting-guide
I'm missing non-golden Tirion, Edwin (though I DEd the golden of him), Nat, and Cenarius, all of which I have golden, as well as Milihouse, Cho, and Gruul, which I have no copies of. Having played since pre-naxx, but dropped off significantly post-STD creation. So still a way to go for me! Probably be a few eternal holes now, though cho is the most likely to get crafted for any combo shenanigans.
I mean, we do get a different set of cards for free; I can see why they're not givnig refunds for most stuff. And, honestly, most of those cards are either underpowered or eating up design space - look at Cairne/Geddon for the former, or Maly/Boar/Anton/similar. The ones that do see play? They eat design space, generally, or are cheated in (murlocs). Boar, Malygos, Dread corsair, even sea giant with how much flooding classes can have, all eat design space. Bloodlust ensures that token creators for shaman will generally suck. Et al.
We didn't get huge piles of dust when standard became a thing; no reason to expect blizz to break the in game economy now.
The thing is there’s still ways to do this rouge can use shadow step or brewmaster also the card is actually broken it adds 5 cards to your hand including 4 7/6 4 3/5 power overwhelming on crack a better sap and a hellfire that’s just better im actually exited for it.
Deathwing being used in mecha’thun warlock? Only if you want to lose? I believe you are recalling cataclysm. Original deathwing is also going to be playable in wild and unchanged. Ysera will be playable in wild but NERFED. That’s why there’s a refund. Also, if you expect to be refunded an entire deck because of a nerfed card, you’ve lost your mind, and they’ve never done anything like that, so that’s not inconsistent at all. You really find a way to be condescending about everything as well.
Please read some of the posts in the thread. It is talking about OLD YSERA, who is giong to Wild, but still getting the nerfed dream cards. Thus Ysera is nerfed, thus we get a dust refund (and Blizz agrees).
New Ysera is a completely different card.
I don't, that was the whole point I was making. That expecting refunds for cards which are effected by changes to other cards (such as Ysera, for example) is greedy and entitled and you'd have to be out of your mind to expect it. Thank you for the agreement.
I'm not sure you know what "condescending" means, though, lol. But I'm sure in your mind that made sense.
To be honest your initial assessment comparing a 'Deathwing nerf' (which isn't actually happening) to the Ysera nerf was wrong in the first place, something which you've conveniently chose to ignore, so I'd maybe tone it down a little bit.
P.S Anyone who thinks a card is nerfed because they changed the picture to show less demon tits is out of their mind.
To be frank, I think this account might just be trolling based on their post history. Between this post and another about old Ysera they’ve been proven to be wrong a few times and conveniently ignored talking points that dismantles their argument.
But I’ll try here again just in case. If Heistbaron Toggwaggle’s “Wondrous Wand” was changed to: draw 3 cards that cost (1) mana, how is that not a nerf?
really ysera lol? who played vanilla ysera seriously? except in 2014-2016
Yes. That was the whole point I was making.
Old Ysera isnt changing. She is going to wild. Her dream cards are being changed. Which are not the same card. But they dont have a dusrt value, so no dust is really necessary. however Blizzard have decided to refund it anyway, hence : "inconsistancy".
Honestly, it's like pulling teeth out on these forums at times.
The point about Deathwing (which seems hard for some to grasp) is that a change to that card would affect other cards in a negative way. Perhaps I meant Cataclysm over Deathwing - though I've seen plenty of DW versions - but that's moot and the point is the same.
Going by their history, Blizzard doesn't normally hand out random refunds every time a card is affected y other cards being changed.
All faux-ccusations of trolling and ad hominems directed toward me aside (which in itself is certainly worthy of reporting), I firmly believe what I am saying is correct. Just because one or two people disagreee dismantles nothing and that claim is somewhat laughable at best.
There could never exist a Mecha'thun deck that uses Deathwing to complete the combo, because in order for Mecha'thun's deathrattle to trigger, you can have no minions on the board. If you use Deathwing to kill Mecha'thun, the deathrattle won't trigger. So I assure you, you haven't seen "plenty of DW" versions.
It is not hard to grasp your point at all, we all get what you're trying to argue. When a couple of key cards in Kingsbane Rogue was changed, it didn't warrant a refund for Kingsbane itself, because it wasn't the card being changed. We all get that, and we all agree on that.
However, that argument does not apply to old Ysera, because the card itself - not a supporting card in a deck - HAS fundamentally changed. Before, you played Ysera with the expectation of getting at least one of five different Dream cards, a card type that is uncollectable and specifically tied to her. The Dream cards ARE her effect. Now, those cards - Ysera's effect - have changed. Therefore, the card has fundamentally changed, and it warrants a dust refound. This is completely in line with Blizzard's dust refound policy and not at all inconsistent.
Ysera is better now, probably viable in control and in dragon synergy decks. There's nothing to pay respects to.
*Sigh* OLD Ysera has been not only rotated to Wild, but her effect has been nerfed, because she produces the new, nerfed dream cards.
I didn't realise that you were watching all of my games to know what I have or haven't seen. >_>
That in itself sounds more like a poor attempt at smarm rather than an actual point.
Well, that's good. Then I guess we're in agreement.
This is obviously and demonstrably incorrect, based on your previous helpful example and the following detail.
A card that was not directly altered is being refunded.
Look at it this way. if I put the old version of the card and the new version side by side, just point out the visible difference. Job done. That should be easy enough.
The dream cards are, for all intents and purposes, part of the Ysera cards. They are generated by only two cards, one of which is not released yet, and are uncollectable tokens from those sources. That is the crucial difference. The only comparable situation from previous nerfs was Leper gnome, but as Plugg is not the sole source it's not really a direct comparison - and honestly, if that nerf went through today, I think blizz would have given a dust refund due to the position of the design team on such things changing.
If Jaraxxus' hero power went to three mana, or summoning a 5/5, then those would be analogous nerfs to this one, and yes, I feel that a refund would be expected (and given). If Blizz changed ashbringer, I would expect a refund for Tirion (not the best analogy currently because the size of the weapon is specified, but a line of text that is, say, 'You take double damage when attacking' could be added without anything added to Tirion's card).
Look, I really want to believe you're arguing in good faith, but you're not doing yourself any favours when you're not addressing valid points such as the Togwaggle example and the fact that the Dream cards are uncollectible and intrinsically tied to Ysera. The change is not visible on the card itself, but it is very clearly functional.
A very relevant example is the nerf to Solarian Prime, an uncollectible card that can only be generated through Astromancer Solarian. Players were given a dust refund for Astromancer Solarian because its effect had changed: it no longer shuffled a 7 mama prime into your deck, but a 9 mama one. This change was not visible on the card itself, but it was very clearly still a nerf that warranted a refund. Similarly, the cards generated by Ysera have drastically changed, and Blizzard is, as always, giving a refund.
Also, I'm not saying that I've seen every game you've ever played. I'm just saying that Mecha'thun cannot be activated by playing Deathwing, which is why I highly doubt you've seen it played on ladder. Nerfing Deathwing would not impact the Mecha'thun Warlock combo in any way, so it's very strange that you keep using it as an example. If you're wrong about one thing, maybe you could be wrong about other things too? No judgement, just saying. We're all wrong once in awhile.
Let's not pretend the old Ysera was playable in any deck anymore.
That’s not the point of this post though.