Hearthpwn

The Gnomferatu comparison makes no sense. This cards effect is far better than that when silenced. It still won’t be good enough for this combo to ever see play unless some very soecific synergy cards are printed.

And card advantage is far more important in the early game, by turn 7 removing a random minion isn’t as effective unless you hit a big guy or a combo piece.

And even then that isn’t likely enough for this to be a realistic counter. Against Mozaki mage for example you have more chance of hitting an Apprentice, Gadgetzan, or a randomly generated spell damage minion than you do Mozaki.

Tick on the other hand has an extremely high chance of discarding a vital combo piece and isn’t itself a terrible card. It can be played in pure demob decks for consistent mana reduction and can be brought back for 0-Mana alongside a 10/10 on turn 10 to go again.

People who say gnomeferatu and this new card do different things can't understand the basic mechanic behind them, they both remove cards. Some decks may need spells for burst or clears, other decks may need hero cards to grind the late game and other decks will want minions, especially otk decks. Both gnomeferatu and felsoul jailer have the same job, trying to hit one key card but gnomeferatu doesn't need another support card for that. Something similar happened with evolve shaman with Moat Lurker + some kind of evolve and that was a mediocre play. Imagine destroying a minion and get a 7 drop being decent, not even that great. Nobody will run brewmaster nor silence to combo with jailer, the effect and tempo loss will punish the deck too much. The only way this could see play is in an afk combo meta and that's not gonna happen.

Basic mechanic in card games is that removed card in your deck is less important than removed card in your hand since games are rarely go into fatigue mode, you just do not draw all the cards from your deck anyway. Yes, it sucks when they burn an important card, but the fact is that it is just equal as if you simply do not draw it. You just now know that you will not draw it, that's the only difference. And on top of that there is a card advantage mechanic which counts only cards in your hand.

Quote from T1p1t1p >>

Basic mechanic in card games is that removed card in your deck is less important than removed card in your hand since games are rarely go into fatigue mode, you just do not draw all the cards from your deck anyway. 

This ^^
Someone who actually understands the value behind where a discard happens compared to how many cards and how much it costs. 
It's rather ironic that some people are actually making silly insults like "you must be new to this game" and other such obviously hypocritical statements when they then go on to say that they think Gnomeferatu is somehow anywhere near the same power as removing card tempo from the opponent. (When it's completely different)

And still there are people getting hung up on this strange "this is broken" phrase that was not only not claimed, but actively denied in multiple points throughout this thread. Sigh...
Reading comprehension is key, and when you get it wrong both for the argument being made AND the card text it is being made about, then well... no wonder you're mad about it. ^_^

But w8ing for this combo is 2 long

Quote from DeafKnight >>

Quote from TheArcanist236 >>

This is a SEVEN MANA combo that removes ONE SINGLE MINION. In what world is this problematic?

And your comment kind of shows you don't see what this combo actually does. It removes 2 minions, not one

 

 Wait.  How does it remove two minions?  You play the Jailer, and it causes me to discard my (let’s say) Doomsayer.  Then you play the beer bear to return the Jailer to your hand.  Doomsayer is gone, but that’s it.  One card.   No?  

Quote from enoX_36 >>

People who say gnomeferatu and this new card do different things can't understand the basic mechanic behind them, they both remove cards. Some decks may need spells for burst or clears, other decks may need hero cards to grind the late game and other decks will want minions, especially otk decks. Both gnomeferatu and felsoul jailer have the same job, trying to hit one key card but gnomeferatu doesn't need another support card for that. Something similar happened with evolve shaman with Moat Lurker + some kind of evolve and that was a mediocre play. Imagine destroying a minion and get a 7 drop being decent, not even that great. Nobody will run brewmaster nor silence to combo with jailer, the effect and tempo loss will punish the deck too much. The only way this could see play is in an afk combo meta and that's not gonna happen.

 This isn’t hard to get you head around.

If your opponent has 5 cards in hand when Gnomeferatu is played they still have 5 cards. If they have 5 cards (and 1 is a minion) and this - albeit awful - 7 mana combo is played, they only have 4 cards. Which is a significantly worse situation for them to be in.

It also only targets minions so could theoretically be used to discard certain cards with greater consistency.

Despite your opening remarks neither you or the OP seem understand the mechanics of the game to a great enough degree to fully argue your points.

Now Gnomeferatu can be a better card than this in some circumstances but that is a different argument.

You’re arguing that the combo is ‘problematic’, people have told you it’s actually garbage and you will never come up against it on ladder (barring some extremely specific synergy cards being printed) and you are still arguing with these people.

What exactly is the point of this thread as it is no longer clear? If it was to purely point out a fairly obvious unplayable synergy between 2 bad cards then fair enough, but that should be made clear before you start arguing the toss.

In short, “the combo is terrible and will never be played, Tick and Illucia are far better at beating decks this combo would target. It does however differ from the effect of Gnomeferatu.”

Is this a disagreeable statement? 

Quote from Kinkyjohnfowler >>

You’re arguing that the combo is ‘problematic’, people have told you it’s actually garbage and you will never come up against it on ladder (barring some extremely specific synergy cards being printed) and you are still arguing with these people.

What exactly is the point of this thread as it is no longer clear? If it was to purely point out a fairly obvious unplayable synergy between 2 bad cards then fair enough, but that should be made clear before you start arguing the toss.

In short, “the combo is terrible and will never be played, Tick and Illucia are far better at beating decks this combo would target. It does however differ from the effect of Gnomeferatu.”

Is this a disagreeable statement? 

 What would a night club compere from Hull know about HS??

Quote from enoX_36 >>

People who say gnomeferatu and this new card do different things can't understand the basic mechanic behind them, they both remove cards. Some decks may need spells for burst or clears, other decks may need hero cards to grind the late game and other decks will want minions, especially otk decks. Both gnomeferatu and felsoul jailer have the same job, trying to hit one key card but gnomeferatu doesn't need another support card for that. Something similar happened with evolve shaman with Moat Lurker + some kind of evolve and that was a mediocre play. Imagine destroying a minion and get a 7 drop being decent, not even that great. Nobody will run brewmaster nor silence to combo with jailer, the effect and tempo loss will punish the deck too much. The only way this could see play is in an afk combo meta and that's not gonna happen.

Because the two cards do something different. Yes, both are disrupters, but that’s where the similarities end.

The Jailer is more like a Dirty Rat which you would run to deny battlecries and pull combo pieces for your removal. Gnomeferatu is bad because it can’t target anything and works on the deck. Sure, it can hit that specific key card and win you the game, but it’s more likely something your opponent can afford to lose.

Dirty Rat and Jailer can pull that Malygos, Reno or Mech’thun from the hand because your opponent won’t play it until the combo is ready or Reno is needed.

Gnomeferatu at half the deck drawn is pray to yogg that the key card is still in the deck and we hit it. Dirty Rat/ Jailer is 50% chance that it’s in hand.

Moat Lurker combo is bad because it’s reactive removal and takes two cards. Your opponent gets the battlecry or the end of turn tick that might be enough to activate their combo. What’s the point of destroying Raza or Reno? Sure, go ahead and destroy the Dreampetal Florist that discounted Maly already.

And you need to clog up your deck with two cards that won’t do much alone. That’s why the combo won’t be good, because the panda alone won’t be useful. The Jailer alone might be enough as it forces the use of removal and gives you another turn.

You should be banned for this post. Felosophy also is 100 times better to use than brew. 

Quote from Guymcperson2 >>

You should be banned for this post. Felosophy also is 100 times better to use than brew. 

 And that's why you're not a mod - it requires basic common sense.

Quote from Kinkyjohnfowler >>

You’re arguing that the combo is ‘problematic’, people have told you it’s actually garbage and you will never come up against it on ladder (barring some extremely specific synergy cards being printed) and you are still arguing with these people.

 

Which people? I haven't argued with anyone yet. I've made some pretty standard statements about a card and what I think about it, and how I think it will impact the game. I've also taken on board realistic and valid counter points to that opinion and changed my view on those specific bits.
At which point, a few other random people have lost their collective minds and had a hissy fit that someone on the internet should dare to have an opinion they disagree with. And gone off on their little rants about it.
Am I supposed to care about that? Because I really don't.  

Have they nerf already this combo? Game is unplayable rn

Ok so obviously it was never suggested to be a deck carrying combo and using silence (if something better than owl turns up) is arguably better than using any bounce effect. I don't think that the first mentioned interaction will be used, but I must give OP that the mechanic could be a decent disruption tool, that btw doesn't force you to do anything if the discarded minion is bad. 

You see what your opponent has, is it a crucial card? SILENCE! Otherwise it's just a mediocre body minion that warns you of what is to come. 

And of course a hand discard is much more powerful than a top deck burn! Try MTG if you disagree. This is very conditional for the same reason, since we have no graveyard or means to interact with discarded cards. 

Do I still think that Tickatus is better for destroying combos? YES! 

 

Quote from DeafKnight >>

Quote from Kinkyjohnfowler >>

You’re arguing that the combo is ‘problematic’, people have told you it’s actually garbage and you will never come up against it on ladder (barring some extremely specific synergy cards being printed) and you are still arguing with these people.

 

Which people? I haven't argued with anyone yet. I've made some pretty standard statements about a card and what I think about it, and how I think it will impact the game. I've also taken on board realistic and valid counter points to that opinion and changed my view on those specific bits.
At which point, a few other random people have lost their collective minds and had a hissy fit that someone on the internet should dare to have an opinion they disagree with. And gone off on their little rants about it.
Am I supposed to care about that? Because I really don't.  

 You have argued with several people across this thread.

Here you are arguing the point that this is a bad 7-mana play:

https://www.hearthpwn.com/forums/hearthstone-general/general-discussion/247609-this-combo-seems-problematic-to-me?comment=4

Here you are arguing that it is a better anti-combo tech than Tickatus:

https://www.hearthpwn.com/forums/hearthstone-general/general-discussion/247609-this-combo-seems-problematic-to-me?comment=12

Also here you are ‘expressing concerns’ about the combo:

https://www.hearthpwn.com/forums/hearthstone-general/general-discussion/247609-this-combo-seems-problematic-to-me?comment=31

You continue to reiterate that it is a better combo killer than Tick here:

https://www.hearthpwn.com/forums/hearthstone-general/general-discussion/247609-this-combo-seems-problematic-to-me?comment=33

You see if there was a 0-Mana card that read “Give a Windfury minion +3 attack” for an upcoming expansion, and a thread created expressing concern about it’s interaction with Raging Worgen and the 1/1 windfury beast. I’m sure you would assume that the OP was new to the game or atleast didn’t fully understand the mechanics, especially if they continued to reiterate their point over the course of the thread? This is a similar situation, as paired with the current set of cards we know are in the game there is 0 chance that this combo will ever be played seriously on ladder. Especially when Warlock has access to a card which is far, far better at wrecking combo decks.

Now don’t take that the wrong way, I’m not claiming you are new to the game, or that you don’t understand it’s mechanics. I’m just saying that you continuing to reiterate what you were saying on the first page makes it seem that way. In reality it’s more than likely just a defensive reaction the people attacking your posts.

The more I look at this card the more I think it will be very powerful as a standalone card for control warlock. It's kind of a "reverse Sap" in a way. It doesn't matter if the opponent gets the minion back later, the truth is you're going to deny and delay a lot of plays just by removing a minion from their hand temporarily, especially against aggro and midrange, because it's a minion that could/would have been played immediately the next turn if it had not been discarded and they have to deal 6 damage that won't go face to get it back. And by the time they get back their minion in their hand, it's 1 or 2 turns laters and you stabilized.

I still don't buy the brewmaster combo though, unless you really try hard to snipe combo decks but I would just do the usual Tickatus+Yshaarj instead and hope they didn't draw their combo yet.

Quote from DeafKnight >>

Quote from T1p1t1p >>

Basic mechanic in card games is that removed card in your deck is less important than removed card in your hand since games are rarely go into fatigue mode, you just do not draw all the cards from your deck anyway. 

This ^^
Someone who actually understands the value behind where a discard happens compared to how many cards and how much it costs. 
It's rather ironic that some people are actually making silly insults like "you must be new to this game" and other such obviously hypocritical statements when they then go on to say that they think Gnomeferatu is somehow anywhere near the same power as removing card tempo from the opponent. (When it's completely different)

And still there are people getting hung up on this strange "this is broken" phrase that was not only not claimed, but actively denied in multiple points throughout this thread. Sigh...
Reading comprehension is key, and when you get it wrong both for the argument being made AND the card text it is being made about, then well... no wonder you're mad about it. ^_^

This comment is not strictky true ... and this is where you @DeafKnight just don't seem to want to grasp just exactly what you are trying to achieve with this combo.

Burning/removing a card from deck or hand are BOTH valid if you are playing against what you believe to be a combo deck and you are a control deck that wants to disrupt.

1. From deck ... so, a card like Gnomeferatu (or Tickatus or Hecklebot or Deathlord, Mischief Maker etc.) does have value, and the earlier you can do so, the better. So it is actually handy that Gnomeferatu costs 2 mana because you can get started with disruption asap because the opponent probably does not have all combo cards in hand by turn two, so these cards still have use.
Other options are Mill Rogue or Mill (Dead Man's Hand) Warrior etc. Put the combo opponent under pressure by forcing them to draw and overdrawing while at the same time making it difficult for the combo player to draw more cards.

Then there's the new Rogue secret Shenanigans ... a combo deck wants to draw but you disrupt their draw.

2. Burning/removing a card from hand can be handy the later you get into the game ... so cards like Dirty Rat, Blatant Decoy, Unseen Saboteur can be great when you think the opponent has their combo lined up. Your combo fits here ... but where the previous cards cleanly disrupt with one card your combo needs just that ... a card combo ... because otherwise the opponent might get their combo piece back.
When was the last time you saw Wild Bloodstinger played (by other people than me, I love the card)? It is one mana cheaper and a 6/9 to boot, and only one card (and combos great with Kreen!).

Then there are certain combo decks that require to draw all the cards from their deck to work ... think Mechathun ... which you brought up yourself ... yes, that deck wants to draw every card and get to fatigue ... also they require multiple cards for the combo, so either method 1 or 2 will work just as good.
Other combo decks that work fine if you burn their cards from deck are the likes of the new C'thun ... the chance the opponent has all 4 cards in hand by the end of turn 4 is pretty low.

Burning a card from someone's hand is not really "removing card tempo" from a combo deck ... combo decks do not care about hand size ... combo decks care about having the exact combo in hand, be it 1 or 3 or 6 or 10 cards (see MarkMcKz's YouTube) ... if I'm playing a combo deck you can burn all the cards from my hand, as long as they're not related to the combo. I'm not worried about tempo, because all my "tempo" will come in the one turn where I can take out my opponent ... until that moment, I'm stalling or drawing cards to get to my combo, and I'm using pretty poor tempo cards to do so (Novice Engineer, Thalnos etc.).

3. General disruption like Glide or Stelina or Mana Burn, Counterspell, Oh My Yogg, Chaos Gazer etc. etc.  Have you ever tried playing Mortuary Machine into an opponent's Mechathun combo turn ... it is kinda funny (hey I like meming), but that card is terrible at all other times.

So ... as I said before in a previous post ... there are better, more efficient ways to disrupt a combo player's hand/combo than the 7 mana option you put forward. And there are already a lot of disruption cards in the game ... but they are rarely used.
Stop being stubborn and looking for acknowledgment you found a "great", "problematic" interaction against specific combo decks and just move on ... Let me give you an example.
I made a Hunter deck that has double Arcane Fletcher and Penflingers ... I mean, a perpetual draw machine right ... a really neat interaction when you pull it off ... but in the end it is just such a low impact play for the mana cost ... now where have I seen that criticism before?

Will I be playing the demon myself? Yes, to try it out and probably in a more mid-rangy zoo deck to hopefully remove a minion answer to my board ... but it'll probably be phased out fast and then I'll probably just end up going with it, at times, from Demonic Studies.

So, does anyone remember demonic project breaking the game? No? Than this combo definetely won't

I mean if you are playing against aggro and this hits his 1 drop. The opponent laughs, plays Skull of Guldan, floods the board and kills you next turn for wasting your time playing a 7 mana 3/2