Years ago if you get a murlock for 2 manas 1/4 rush windfury people will get nuts, today I don't see anyone talk about this card, what make me think...
The cards become too powerful and anything out of the level of a Zeph or hero card make an impression anymore?
good in vacuum is so 2015, synergistic packages are the new hotness
Maybe is time to return to the roots...
I playing a game with control priest, have luck with the 2 manas spell and get Tickatus from opponent deck and when I played the card burn his Tickatus and he concede, 1 card in 30 cards in the decks should not being so insanely relevant to be a reason for concede in a scenario like this, the same for the hunter hero card before denying any control deck a chance because of endless value.
"Returning to the rooots" is an interesting suggestion to handle powercreep. Not too long ago, Dean Ayala had said on Reddit (or was it Twitter?) that powercreep is inevitable to make more exciting cards. On the one hand, I disagree, because it's all relative, and the supposed advantage of Standard is that cards rotate out and you technically don't need to push the ceiling higher and higher.
On the other hand in all fairness, it's not that easy to do either, and they kind of have a point. Which is why I think it won't happen anymore.
They tried something like that (or at least it looked that way) in 2018. WW, BDP and RR were fairly mediocre sets, with Boomsday standing out a bit, but they were all entirely overshadowed by the previous year (JTU, KFT, KnC) along with Genn and Baku. When ROS came out, all those cards including Genn and Baku rotated, and the game was a bit more "normal" again, but even then, some people complained about the game lacking exciting big powerful cards.
Then SoU happened, and then DoD happened, and we were right back in the spiral where everything needs to be insane again. Hardly anyone took notice of the last rotation, aside from missing Zilliax and a handful of other cards. Most of 2018 was forgotten already before it left Standard. And it's not even that Ul'dum or Dragons were super ridiculous beyond any measure, they were just better than the mediocre stuff again that 2018 mostly had to offer.
This year, AoO and SA were so good, that Dragons seems just "ok" again, and MDF seems a bit underwhelming, despite being a pretty decent set overall. And once again, the stage is set for next year. Even with Classic possibly disappearing, I don't even think it will have much of an impact. Neither on the meta, nor on the powercreep issue, since Classic isn't exactly a high hanging bar anymore, and it's disappearance wouldn't allow for "weaker" cards in the current situation to have a place in the game.
If you want to mitigate powercreep, you have to start somewhere, and you have to stick with it for at least a year for a proper reset in Standard. But then you have a meta that doesn't change much for too long, and the game won't be as exciting. Why would you look forward to new releases, when it's gonna be another TGT or RR?
However, it should be noted that "power" can mean many things, like a super efficient discover or resource generator, an extremely strong swing effect, a very good heal/armor effect, a powerful board clear, etc.. The powercreep doesn't all have to go in the same direction, but can take different shapes. Tickatus is a very powerful disruptor, Archivist Elysiana is a very powerful refill. The game is getting "crazier", but not necessarily faster or more swingy.
So, I don't think powercreep is always a "bad" thing, and it depends more on the specific mechanic or shape, in which it comes.
Yes power creep is a thingy. However, it counts for all classes. So imo, I don't really think it matters a lot. Since you have the standard rotation, the meta keeps shifting. And in cases where archetypes get out of control, Blizzard nerfs key cards. Just look what happened to Evolve Shaman.
Releasing new, more powerful cards needs to happen. There would be no reason to buy new packs otherwise and people want to have a faster aggro type, a more swingy combo or more devastating control archetype than before.
If all three archetypes are pushed the same amount then the game is still balanced.
Say Control gets more boardclears/spells that can immediately interrupt minion based aggro decks in a new expansion and the win ratio of control vs aggro is at about 80-90%, the win ratio with a new boardclear against aggro increases even higher. So there must be a counter balance to retain that win ratio or otherwise control gets too powerful vs. aggro and eventually even against combo (which should be it's bane)
That's why cards like Imprisoned Sungill are created because thanks to its domant effect it can still populate the board but is not affected by board clears (at least for 2 turns) and can be buffed the turn it awakens with e.g. Coldlight Seer and maybe even be buffed out of range of an Explosive Trap. So there is a counter balance to that even though aggro is still unfavoured against control but it needs to have some more tools to withstand it longer. In return, aggro gets more tools to populate the board faster (Murgurgle Prime or Tip the Scales) to have better chances against Controls new tools.
The same applies to Combo btw. While Combo usually lacks the time and tools to deal with aggro, a Summoning Portal, which was part of Warlock Combo in Classic, only has the benefit while the minion is on the board + it can be easily dealt with for minion based decks.
Now we have cards like Raging Felscreamer which is basically a beefed up Summoning Portal. It has better stats and the ability persists even if the minion dies (making it more efficient vs. Aggro), making Priestess of Fury possible on turn 5 even if the Raging Felscreamer dies to minions. (yes, I know it's a Demon Hunter Combo but it's very similar to the Warlock Big Combo Deck of Classic).
So the game gets crazier and crazier with time and what's certainly the case now is that we have many more Swingy Turns that feel like you can't answer them because of the Power Level we have right now - simply because the cards are crazier and our hero only has 30 hp still.
In the end that makes deck building and on curve synergy much more important than in classic so you can keep up with your opponents turns somehow.
Also because of the reasons stated above I believe we will see many more Dormant cards in the future, similar to how Deathrattles and Taunt minions are always part of an expansion due to its very core game mechanic that is necessary.
As a digital CCG, essentially the first, it didn't need to be this way - There should have a plan of nerfs, from the very start so people got used to the idea of their cards getting worse randomly. The power balance would be kept roughly in check over time, and there is less pressure on the devs to power creep every single expansion to make the new cards stand out. Yes I get it, some people hate nerfs and their favourite cards being make weaker, but if it were like a regular cycle, a bit like HoF or rotation, they would have quickly adjusted and been fine with it.
Instead, and for no reason at all, the devs put hearthstone on the same trajectory as a normal CCG - which eventually collapse under their own bloated weight as power creep gets out of hand, and players slowly but surely make the leap form "Wow cool, that is new and powerful" "Wow, lame, that is new and super broken".
Power Creep (the term for this phenomenon) is and will always be a thing that happens when you introduce expansions to an existing game. Having a rotating system of cards ensures that it doesnt happen endlessly. Its how it is all balanced.
The card is in the worst case scenario x2 4/3 minions for only 5 manas and in the best almost an permanent effect of a Bloodlust with the insane upside of putting 2 minions of your own for the freaking SAME COST OF MANA!!!
I really don't understand why they make cards so insanely undercosted only to be forced nerf after...
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Years ago if you get a murlock for 2 manas 1/4 rush windfury people will get nuts, today I don't see anyone talk about this card, what make me think...
The cards become too powerful and anything out of the level of a Zeph or hero card make an impression anymore?
imo yes.
the new dragon for druid is insane: 3 mana 3/4 taunt and corrupt: gains 3/3.
too much
good in vacuum is so 2015, synergistic packages are the new hotness
Maybe is time to return to the roots...
I playing a game with control priest, have luck with the 2 manas spell and get Tickatus from opponent deck and when I played the card burn his Tickatus and he concede, 1 card in 30 cards in the decks should not being so insanely relevant to be a reason for concede in a scenario like this, the same for the hunter hero card before denying any control deck a chance because of endless value.
"Returning to the rooots" is an interesting suggestion to handle powercreep. Not too long ago, Dean Ayala had said on Reddit (or was it Twitter?) that powercreep is inevitable to make more exciting cards. On the one hand, I disagree, because it's all relative, and the supposed advantage of Standard is that cards rotate out and you technically don't need to push the ceiling higher and higher.
On the other hand in all fairness, it's not that easy to do either, and they kind of have a point. Which is why I think it won't happen anymore.
They tried something like that (or at least it looked that way) in 2018. WW, BDP and RR were fairly mediocre sets, with Boomsday standing out a bit, but they were all entirely overshadowed by the previous year (JTU, KFT, KnC) along with Genn and Baku. When ROS came out, all those cards including Genn and Baku rotated, and the game was a bit more "normal" again, but even then, some people complained about the game lacking exciting big powerful cards.
Then SoU happened, and then DoD happened, and we were right back in the spiral where everything needs to be insane again. Hardly anyone took notice of the last rotation, aside from missing Zilliax and a handful of other cards. Most of 2018 was forgotten already before it left Standard. And it's not even that Ul'dum or Dragons were super ridiculous beyond any measure, they were just better than the mediocre stuff again that 2018 mostly had to offer.
This year, AoO and SA were so good, that Dragons seems just "ok" again, and MDF seems a bit underwhelming, despite being a pretty decent set overall. And once again, the stage is set for next year. Even with Classic possibly disappearing, I don't even think it will have much of an impact. Neither on the meta, nor on the powercreep issue, since Classic isn't exactly a high hanging bar anymore, and it's disappearance wouldn't allow for "weaker" cards in the current situation to have a place in the game.
If you want to mitigate powercreep, you have to start somewhere, and you have to stick with it for at least a year for a proper reset in Standard. But then you have a meta that doesn't change much for too long, and the game won't be as exciting. Why would you look forward to new releases, when it's gonna be another TGT or RR?
However, it should be noted that "power" can mean many things, like a super efficient discover or resource generator, an extremely strong swing effect, a very good heal/armor effect, a powerful board clear, etc.. The powercreep doesn't all have to go in the same direction, but can take different shapes. Tickatus is a very powerful disruptor, Archivist Elysiana is a very powerful refill. The game is getting "crazier", but not necessarily faster or more swingy.
So, I don't think powercreep is always a "bad" thing, and it depends more on the specific mechanic or shape, in which it comes.
Not more swingy ??
This must be a joke
Yes power creep is a thingy. However, it counts for all classes. So imo, I don't really think it matters a lot. Since you have the standard rotation, the meta keeps shifting. And in cases where archetypes get out of control, Blizzard nerfs key cards. Just look what happened to Evolve Shaman.
You just need to see how Dr. Boom and Sylvanas Windrunner are jokes nowadays.
Releasing new, more powerful cards needs to happen. There would be no reason to buy new packs otherwise and people want to have a faster aggro type, a more swingy combo or more devastating control archetype than before.
If all three archetypes are pushed the same amount then the game is still balanced.
Say Control gets more boardclears/spells that can immediately interrupt minion based aggro decks in a new expansion and the win ratio of control vs aggro is at about 80-90%, the win ratio with a new boardclear against aggro increases even higher. So there must be a counter balance to retain that win ratio or otherwise control gets too powerful vs. aggro and eventually even against combo (which should be it's bane)
That's why cards like Imprisoned Sungill are created because thanks to its domant effect it can still populate the board but is not affected by board clears (at least for 2 turns) and can be buffed the turn it awakens with e.g. Coldlight Seer and maybe even be buffed out of range of an Explosive Trap. So there is a counter balance to that even though aggro is still unfavoured against control but it needs to have some more tools to withstand it longer. In return, aggro gets more tools to populate the board faster (Murgurgle Prime or Tip the Scales) to have better chances against Controls new tools.
The same applies to Combo btw. While Combo usually lacks the time and tools to deal with aggro, a Summoning Portal, which was part of Warlock Combo in Classic, only has the benefit while the minion is on the board + it can be easily dealt with for minion based decks.
Now we have cards like Raging Felscreamer which is basically a beefed up Summoning Portal. It has better stats and the ability persists even if the minion dies (making it more efficient vs. Aggro), making Priestess of Fury possible on turn 5 even if the Raging Felscreamer dies to minions. (yes, I know it's a Demon Hunter Combo but it's very similar to the Warlock Big Combo Deck of Classic).
So the game gets crazier and crazier with time and what's certainly the case now is that we have many more Swingy Turns that feel like you can't answer them because of the Power Level we have right now - simply because the cards are crazier and our hero only has 30 hp still.
In the end that makes deck building and on curve synergy much more important than in classic so you can keep up with your opponents turns somehow.
Also because of the reasons stated above I believe we will see many more Dormant cards in the future, similar to how Deathrattles and Taunt minions are always part of an expansion due to its very core game mechanic that is necessary.
As a digital CCG, essentially the first, it didn't need to be this way - There should have a plan of nerfs, from the very start so people got used to the idea of their cards getting worse randomly. The power balance would be kept roughly in check over time, and there is less pressure on the devs to power creep every single expansion to make the new cards stand out. Yes I get it, some people hate nerfs and their favourite cards being make weaker, but if it were like a regular cycle, a bit like HoF or rotation, they would have quickly adjusted and been fine with it.
Instead, and for no reason at all, the devs put hearthstone on the same trajectory as a normal CCG - which eventually collapse under their own bloated weight as power creep gets out of hand, and players slowly but surely make the leap form "Wow cool, that is new and powerful" "Wow, lame, that is new and super broken".
[card] Tickatus [/card] indeed. I hope blizz will HoF him one time
Power Creep (the term for this phenomenon) is and will always be a thing that happens when you introduce expansions to an existing game.
Having a rotating system of cards ensures that it doesnt happen endlessly. Its how it is all balanced.
It gets +2\+2 and has a condition. Wrong info and kinda a bad example for power creeps nowadays.
Look at this card, the powercreep is out of the charts compared with many cards before:
Arbor Up
The card is in the worst case scenario x2 4/3 minions for only 5 manas and in the best almost an permanent effect of a Bloodlust with the insane upside of putting 2 minions of your own for the freaking SAME COST OF MANA!!!
I really don't understand why they make cards so insanely undercosted only to be forced nerf after...