Anyone saying Tickatus is not insanely OP and broken as hell just remember, this card is a hundred times slower than him and still see play in some lists and looks hot garbage in comparison:
This is a very well design when you think about, there is no problem to be able to destroy opponent deck if you earn that, Tickatus feels much more like a cheat engine than a real card in this game.
And there were constant bitchfests about Rin from control players at the time. I'd necro a few of them if the ridiculously opportunistic warning system wouldn't come calling again.
Now the story is that Rin is well-designed. That's actually comical, especially given that Rin would frequently get there against true control decks by turn 12 or 13, in which case it would destroy considerably more than ten cards. I still have screen shots of the chat abuse that would follow.
Don't get me wrong, Rin wasn't anywhere near over-powered, it simply served a purpose in the meta. Sort of like Tickatus.
You can't compare Rin and Tickatus. Against Rin you had enough Counterplay, against Tickatus you have nothing. I don't think we have a problem right now, because nobody plays Control. Aggro is way to good. Just wait until Rotation, there might be a meta change and if that happens, Tickatus alone will kill Control. Same happened back in the days, when Jade Druid was a thing. At least we had Skulking Geist....
Once again, exact same thing said about Rin. "They can just wait till turn 7 and dark pact the Rin, and there's no counterplay".
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Anyone saying Tickatus is not insanely OP and broken as hell just remember, this card is a hundred times slower than him and still see play in some lists and looks hot garbage in comparison:
This is a very well design when you think about, there is no problem to be able to destroy opponent deck if you earn that, Tickatus feels much more like a cheat engine than a real card in this game.
And there were constant bitchfests about Rin from control players at the time. I'd necro a few of them if the ridiculously opportunistic warning system wouldn't come calling again.
Now the story is that Rin is well-designed. That's actually comical, especially given that Rin would frequently get there against true control decks by turn 12 or 13, in which case it would destroy considerably more than ten cards. I still have screen shots of the chat abuse that would follow.
Don't get me wrong, Rin wasn't anywhere near over-powered, it simply served a purpose in the meta. Sort of like Tickatus.
You can't compare Rin and Tickatus. Against Rin you had enough Counterplay, against Tickatus you have nothing. I don't think we have a problem right now, because nobody plays Control. Aggro is way to good. Just wait until Rotation, there might be a meta change and if that happens, Tickatus alone will kill Control. Same happened back in the days, when Jade Druid was a thing. At least we had Skulking Geist....
Once again, exact same thing said about Rin. "They can just wait till turn 7 and dark pact the Rin, and there's no counterplay".
Sorry for the double post. Someone with the power to can delete plz.
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I've started insta-conceding against them. It's completely pointless.
I mean, the warlock's corrupt package makes the odds impossible for any control/combo player out there. Its power level, compared to other classes' package is simply ridiculous. This is beyond stupid...
10 cards milled (at least, and only if they feel like they need to) plus 12 minions obliterated (no matter their size) for 18 mana.
As long as Tickatus in in the game you can forget about control and combo decks. I keep saying that from the start and I'm happy more and more people see that.
I just give up on ladder and playing for achievement.
(And for people who don't know till now, Tickatus don't have insane win rate game because meta is aggro and meta is aggro because Tickatus)
The main deck I was playing pre-mini set was spell mage and I had no problem against Tickatus.
Tickatus is not even played in any of the 4 most common lock decks. It's in #5, which has 1600 plays and a 47% winrate.
Here's the matchups Control Lock in general loses against.
Its worst matchup is Bomb War, it also loses against Big/Combo Druid, Duel and Pure Pally, multiple control and combo Mage builds, Soul DH, Control Shaman, Highlander Hunter, and Big War.
But let's go over the scenario outlined shall we? I'll use the Gala lock variant as it actually has a positive winrate.
In order to Corrupt Tickatus, it has to be at least turn 7. This build does not run Demonic Studies, so you cannot discount Tickatus. The build that does is the one with 47% winrate so I'm not using that.
There are only three cards in the deck at 7 mana; Galakrond, Malicia, and Siamat. Siamat is an easy 7 drop so that's fine. Galakrond and Malicia however are iffy, you aren't going to want to drop an uninvoked Galakrond, nor will you want to drop Malicia with just 1 or 2 Soul Shards in deck.
8 mana is Twisting which you can't just drop
And 10 mana is Yshaarj which you dont want to drop until after Ticky has been corrupted and played.
So out of the entire deck, there are only 4 cards which could could activate Tickatus, 3 of which are situational. That means that even by turn 10 you would need to get both tickatus and an enabler, and a chance to use that enabler. Assuming you draw a couple extra cards, that's a 50% chance to get Tickatus (15 cards drawn of 30) and about a 70-80% chance to get one of the 4 enablers. I'll say 80 to be safe. So it's 40% chance JUST for that.
And if it's Malicia or Galakrond you'd need to draw at least 2 other specific cards to be able to use them; and for Twisting your opponent would need a good sized board. So now we're at around 25-30% of games getting a single Tickatus activation.
And to draw Yshaarj is another chance, meaning the ability to play two Tickatus in a single game would only happen in about 15-20% of games. It's not a good card because it's not consistent.
Now, I do think it needs a nerf, but because it's not fun to play against when it does go off, not because it's strong. It'll only be 1-2 games out of 10 where you go against a lock and lose to Tickatus bullshit but those games will feel horrible.
So out of the entire deck, there are only 4 cards which could could activate Tickatus, 3 of which are situational. That means that even by turn 10 you would need to get both tickatus and an enabler, and a chance to use that enabler. Assuming you draw a couple extra cards, that's a 50% chance to get Tickatus (15 cards drawn of 30) and about a 70-80% chance to get one of the 4 enablers. I'll say 80 to be safe. So it's 40% chance JUST for that.
Sorry but... No. In certain matchups, you don't think like that.
Ex : I'm against ETC OTK Warrior. Control deck. The warrior puts no pressure at all : i simply WASTE my galakrond or Malicia, even with no stacks, to corrupt Tickatus, as my win con is Tickatus in that matchup there, and not the other cards.
Of course, in aggressive matchups or mid matchups, you don't wanna waste your high cost cards to corrupt a Tickatus you might not end up being able to play. BUT, in combo / control matchups, you'll want to do EVERYTHING to drop Tickatus as soon as possible.
Along with the stats to draw him : as you simply need to drop Tickatus to watch the ennemy concede for certain matchups, all you have to do is waste all your ressources in hand to always be able to draw as much as possible and get Tickatus nearly every time.
Once again, exact same thing said about Rin. "They can just wait till turn 7 and dark pact the Rin, and there's no counterplay".
Having to play, for Rin, the seals and Azari, a total of 41 mana to play mostly non-impactful cards, I would rather say you conterplay yourself by trying to play her. Of course, you might end up winning because of her, but, let's be real : if your opponent's deck isn't able to do ANYTHING while you spend your turn 7 to do nothing THEN spend the next turns to play 25 mana to summon little useless demons THEN spend a whole turn to play a 10/10 with neither charge nor rush, it means your opponent should not have won the game anyways as his deck is simply completely unable to create any pressure, yet winning, or that he plays a combo deck, which means he have already drawn all his deck by the time you play Azari.
Make him 8 mana - harder to corrupt, delays playing him a bit. 6 mana is just too low for such a powerhouse card.
Make his effect destroy 3 cards, rather than 5
...and what 9+ mana card would you ever play in warlock, exactly, outside yashaarj?
That's called deckbuilding and normal constraints for playing a high reward card.
So, again, what 9+ card would you put in your list, deckbuilder?
Jaraxxus? Malygos? Alex? Sathrovarr? an uncorrupted clown? Nozdormu? Ysera? the bunny? scrapyard colossus? colossus of the moon? Phaoris? Or wait... I GOT IT!!! DEATHWING!!! YEAH, THAT'S THE PLAY! TA-DAH!!! TAKE THAT, OPPONENT!!! NOW GET MY TIC... DOH!!!
You already have to draw and play a 7+ mana card to activate the corrupt effect. There are few enough of those that you can get away with playing in standard, and outside of Y'shaarj I can't really see realistic options at 9+ mana. So you just want the card removed from the game? OK, say that then. Upping the requirement to 9+ mana is less about "deckbuilding and normal constraints", and more about making the card actually unplayable. Pretending you want to "balance" the card when you just want it nerfed into unplayability is just disingenuous.
That’s not true at all. Tickatus is usually discounted to 4 mana, thus providing easy fulfillment of conditions.
Casually claiming that you "usually" get to play both Demonic Studies and then drop Tickatus with no demons in between, all the while surviving the tempo you're inevitably giving up... smh. The decent Tickatus decks don't even run that card as far as I know. If you want to dream up ideal scenarios for a card, then you can make the argument for nerfing a whole bunch of them. Luckily we live in the real world, where the numbers show he's not a balance problem at all. He feels bad to lose against, yes, and that's true for most late-game, set-up power cards - I personally felt a lot worse when jade and Hadranox druid would start running away with games.
Make him 8 mana - harder to corrupt, delays playing him a bit. 6 mana is just too low for such a powerhouse card.
Make his effect destroy 3 cards, rather than 5
...and what 9+ mana card would you ever play in warlock, exactly, outside yashaarj?
That's called deckbuilding and normal constraints for playing a high reward card.
So, again, what 9+ card would you put in your list, deckbuilder?
Jaraxxus? Malygos? Alex? Sathrovarr? an uncorrupted clown? Nozdormu? Ysera? the bunny? scrapyard colossus? colossus of the moon? Phaoris? Or wait... I GOT IT!!! DEATHWING!!! YEAH, THAT'S THE PLAY! TA-DAH!!! TAKE THAT, OPPONENT!!! NOW GET MY TIC... DOH!!!
Are you complaining because you have to think and make sacrifices during deckbuild to get a reward with what is supposed to be a tech card against certain matchups ? Because that's how card games are supposed to work, so quit complaining and start deckbuilding, that'll be way more productive.
Also, as options : - Alexstrasza - Quest Warlock to get him at 0 - N'zoth - Malygos indeed, we still have some 1 mana dmg spells - Pog-Saron
Anyway, seriously, the card has a really powerful effect, can see its cost reduced (The Dark Portal, Kanrethad, Free Admission...), can be duplicated or "Resurrected" (Y'shaarj, Fielosophy...), and can be tutored (Sense Demons). And yet, with all those possibilities, you think it's normal to get access to its effect without ANY deckbuild effort ? What's the next step ? Turn 1, draw this at the start of the game, battlecry "win the game and gain a cookie" ?
Soo, generating tons of free value out of thin air (in case of Priest, Mage or Rogue up to 30-40 additional cards in single match) which the other player can't stop or prevent is fair, but destroying 5-10 random cards (after meeting some pretty strict conditions) is not, because...?
Keep in mind, that Warlock doesn't have easy access to value generation (with some minor exceptions) and in value games he has to rely on 30 predictable cards. This of course cannot compete with 60-70 cards of other value oriented control decks and that's why Warlock could not beat any control deck in like past 2 years. Now he found his way, by taking away some of that value from enemy. It's not ideal, but better than nothing.
Think of it as a weaker version of a combo deck. Weaker, because it does not guarantee you win, even despite meeting all the conditions. If combo decks are acceptable in HS, so is Tickatus Warlock.
Soo, generating tons of free value out of thin air (in case of Priest, Mage or Rogue up to 30-40 additional cards in single match) which the other player can't stop or prevent is fair, but destroying 5-10 random cards (after meeting some pretty strict conditions) is not, because...?
It is, and Blizzard already said they wanted to correct this starting at the next rotation by adding less card-generating cards in the future. So we wait and see and we'll be able to talk about that point afterwards =3
Make him 8 mana - harder to corrupt, delays playing him a bit. 6 mana is just too low for such a powerhouse card.
Make his effect destroy 3 cards, rather than 5
...and what 9+ mana card would you ever play in warlock, exactly, outside yashaarj?
That's called deckbuilding and normal constraints for playing a high reward card.
So, again, what 9+ card would you put in your list, deckbuilder?
Jaraxxus? Malygos? Alex? Sathrovarr? an uncorrupted clown? Nozdormu? Ysera? the bunny? scrapyard colossus? colossus of the moon? Phaoris? Or wait... I GOT IT!!! DEATHWING!!! YEAH, THAT'S THE PLAY! TA-DAH!!! TAKE THAT, OPPONENT!!! NOW GET MY TIC... DOH!!!
Are you complaining because you have to think and make sacrifices during deckbuild to get a reward with what is supposed to be a tech card against certain matchups ? Because that's how card games are supposed to work, so quit complaining and start deckbuilding, that'll be way more productive.
Also, as options : - Alexstrasza - Quest Warlock to get him at 0 - N'zoth - Malygos indeed, we still have some 1 mana dmg spells - Pog-Saron
Anyway, seriously, the card has a really powerful effect, can see its cost reduced (The Dark Portal, Kanrethad, Free Admission...), can be duplicated or "Resurrected" (Y'shaarj, Fielosophy...), and can be tutored (Sense Demons). And yet, with all those possibilities, you think it's normal to get access to its effect without ANY deckbuild effort ? What's the next step ? Turn 1, draw this at the start of the game, battlecry "win the game and gain a cookie" ?
And why not a single list includes those cards? Because they are bad, you can be sure people tried to run those highroll cards and ended up losing most of their games. I could give you 1000 reasons why most of those cards are garbage and restricting your deck to playing them just to corrupt tickatus is not worth so your nerf idea is simply "kill the card". Numbers talk sweetheart and as long as tickatus warlock doesn't have an insanely good wr against control/combo decks (btw, most combo and control decks beat it) blizzard will not nerf it. Now I see you are a diehard tickatus hater but blizzard's team looks at this card from every point of view, not just the loud minority that hate to play against it.
In fairness, enox, I can think of at least one example where a card was nerfed 100% due to bitching from the community, at a time when it was in no way oppressing the meta. Come to think of it, I can think of an example where a card was nerfed when it was neither oppressive nor a target of complaint. So who knows what will happen?
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If you are thinking of Hex, let's be honest it was basically polymorph for 1 less mana. I know shaman was not meta at that time but the nerf was just to bring the card in line with poly so it was justifiable.
I'm not. I was thinking about Leeching Poison for the bitching nerf and Flametongue Totem for the neither.
EDIT: And ironically, Kingsbane occupied the same spot Tick Lock does now at the time. Namely, something that beats the slowest of control decks a decent amount and . . . basically nothing else.
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Warlock has toooo many removals and draw engines, as a priest player using combo and control im absolutely done against warlock because no matter how smart you play, they just have their entire deck as a removal, mass removals, anti combo cards, and then finishers... Is really sad how priest players has to survive with small tools compared to other classes.
either way... i was able to do this with the new deck im testing jeje
I'm not. I was thinking about Leeching Poison for the bitching nerf and Flametongue Totem for the neither.
EDIT: And ironically, Kingsbane occupied the same spot Tick Lock does now at the time. Namely, something that beats the slowest of control decks a decent amount and . . . basically nothing else.
The things is, kingsbane rogue could beat aggro by drawing an early leeching while warlock won't beat aggro with tickatus. If rogue had a consistent way to draw leeching posion the way they had for kingsbane that deck would've been way worse to deal with. They just needed early survivability and leeching was their only way out, in the late game they had vanish and blade flurry for wide boards or face swings against big threats. Even control decks could be kingsbane rogue if it wasn't for leeching poison. Same for tickatus, control and combo decks can beat it but only if players have an idea how to build their deck and what cards to avoid playing in that match up (card draw mostly).
On the other hand, I partially agree with flametongue totem nerf. It wasn't that obnoxious but played on turn 2 just gave even shaman too much freedom for good trades thanks to their discounted hero power while developing other threats. At that time, even shaman was a tier 1 deck and flametongue helped a lot.
You're misremembering. Even Shaman certainly had its heyday, but by the time Flametongue was nerfed, it wasn't even on the radar. One could dig up the meta snapshots, but given the amount of goalpost movement and unwillingness to acknowledge black and white facts exhibited in this and the sister topic thread, I just can't muster the enthusiasm at the moment.
At a guess, I would be willing to bet Kingsbane had a very similar win rate against the aggro decks of the time as Tickatus does now. I've taken games off Zoo Lock and Face Hunter with Tick Lock before, but it's certainly not the rule. Similar things happened with Kingsbane from time to time, but the nerf was simply not justified by any objective measure. I don't even think the spokesperson who explained the nerf attempted to make the balance argument. He simply trotted out the "lack of fun" concept which is shorthand for, "the community complained enough".
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Other than the fact that he's no fun to play against (and, while subjective, that should matter in a game), there is essentially no counter play outside of "play aggro". Where is the skill element to the card, the deck design constraints, the cost-reward? None of these things exist in a card like Tickatus as he currently stands.
Even if you can play cards like Archivist Elysiana, the rate at which the warlock can burn your deck means that you often won't get to play it anyway, and the excessive draw that Warlocks have mean that they will nearly always have the right cards at the right time.
I think if Blizzard want to introduce cards which interact with your opponents deck, hand and mana (which they're starting to do more and more), they should exist across all classes and not just warlock and DH. It seems really odd now that Coldlight Oracle was HoF'd when in reality he was no more oppressive than what we have now. Even mill decks could be played around to some extent...
Make it cost 10. I know it’s a corrupt card but they have the ability to reduced the cost of their demons. So I could really care less. Plus they could make the 4 mana destroy 3 minions discard as many cards as it kills. Really don’t care but the state of the game for myself as someone who plays to have fun means that it is not fun to see hunter after hunter after demon hunter while I am trying to get a game in at work. Like I would rather do something else. I would rather have a good game against a priest than see 5 aggro decks in a row. He’ll make tickatus cost 11
You already have to draw and play a 7+ mana card to activate the corrupt effect. There are few enough of those that you can get away with playing in standard, and outside of Y'shaarj I can't really see realistic options at 9+ mana. So you just want the card removed from the game? OK, say that then. Upping the requirement to 9+ mana is less about "deckbuilding and normal constraints", and more about making the card actually unplayable. Pretending you want to "balance" the card when you just want it nerfed into unplayability is just disingenuous.
That’s not true at all. Tickatus is usually discounted to 4 mana, thus providing easy fulfillment of conditions.
Casually claiming that you "usually" get to play both Demonic Studies and then drop Tickatus with no demons in between, all the while surviving the tempo you're inevitably giving up... smh. The decent Tickatus decks don't even run that card as far as I know. If you want to dream up ideal scenarios for a card, then you can make the argument for nerfing a whole bunch of them. Luckily we live in the real world, where the numbers show he's not a balance problem at all. He feels bad to lose against, yes, and that's true for most late-game, set-up power cards - I personally felt a lot worse when jade and Hadranox druid would start running away with games.
I’m not talking about Demonic Studies, I’m talking about Free Admission, which is run in 2’s.
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Once again, exact same thing said about Rin. "They can just wait till turn 7 and dark pact the Rin, and there's no counterplay".
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Once again, exact same thing said about Rin. "They can just wait till turn 7 and dark pact the Rin, and there's no counterplay".
Sorry for the double post. Someone with the power to can delete plz.
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The main deck I was playing pre-mini set was spell mage and I had no problem against Tickatus.
Tickatus is not even played in any of the 4 most common lock decks. It's in #5, which has 1600 plays and a 47% winrate.
Here's the matchups Control Lock in general loses against.
https://hsreplay.net/archetypes/63/control-warlock#tab=matchups
Its worst matchup is Bomb War, it also loses against Big/Combo Druid, Duel and Pure Pally, multiple control and combo Mage builds, Soul DH, Control Shaman, Highlander Hunter, and Big War.
But let's go over the scenario outlined shall we? I'll use the Gala lock variant as it actually has a positive winrate.
In order to Corrupt Tickatus, it has to be at least turn 7. This build does not run Demonic Studies, so you cannot discount Tickatus. The build that does is the one with 47% winrate so I'm not using that.
There are only three cards in the deck at 7 mana; Galakrond, Malicia, and Siamat. Siamat is an easy 7 drop so that's fine. Galakrond and Malicia however are iffy, you aren't going to want to drop an uninvoked Galakrond, nor will you want to drop Malicia with just 1 or 2 Soul Shards in deck.
8 mana is Twisting which you can't just drop
And 10 mana is Yshaarj which you dont want to drop until after Ticky has been corrupted and played.
So out of the entire deck, there are only 4 cards which could could activate Tickatus, 3 of which are situational. That means that even by turn 10 you would need to get both tickatus and an enabler, and a chance to use that enabler. Assuming you draw a couple extra cards, that's a 50% chance to get Tickatus (15 cards drawn of 30) and about a 70-80% chance to get one of the 4 enablers. I'll say 80 to be safe. So it's 40% chance JUST for that.
And if it's Malicia or Galakrond you'd need to draw at least 2 other specific cards to be able to use them; and for Twisting your opponent would need a good sized board. So now we're at around 25-30% of games getting a single Tickatus activation.
And to draw Yshaarj is another chance, meaning the ability to play two Tickatus in a single game would only happen in about 15-20% of games. It's not a good card because it's not consistent.
Now, I do think it needs a nerf, but because it's not fun to play against when it does go off, not because it's strong. It'll only be 1-2 games out of 10 where you go against a lock and lose to Tickatus bullshit but those games will feel horrible.
Sorry but... No.
In certain matchups, you don't think like that.
Ex : I'm against ETC OTK Warrior. Control deck. The warrior puts no pressure at all : i simply WASTE my galakrond or Malicia, even with no stacks, to corrupt Tickatus, as my win con is Tickatus in that matchup there, and not the other cards.
Of course, in aggressive matchups or mid matchups, you don't wanna waste your high cost cards to corrupt a Tickatus you might not end up being able to play. BUT, in combo / control matchups, you'll want to do EVERYTHING to drop Tickatus as soon as possible.
Along with the stats to draw him : as you simply need to drop Tickatus to watch the ennemy concede for certain matchups, all you have to do is waste all your ressources in hand to always be able to draw as much as possible and get Tickatus nearly every time.
Having to play, for Rin, the seals and Azari, a total of 41 mana to play mostly non-impactful cards, I would rather say you conterplay yourself by trying to play her. Of course, you might end up winning because of her, but, let's be real : if your opponent's deck isn't able to do ANYTHING while you spend your turn 7 to do nothing THEN spend the next turns to play 25 mana to summon little useless demons THEN spend a whole turn to play a 10/10 with neither charge nor rush, it means your opponent should not have won the game anyways as his deck is simply completely unable to create any pressure, yet winning, or that he plays a combo deck, which means he have already drawn all his deck by the time you play Azari.
So, again, what 9+ card would you put in your list, deckbuilder?
Jaraxxus? Malygos? Alex? Sathrovarr? an uncorrupted clown? Nozdormu? Ysera? the bunny? scrapyard colossus? colossus of the moon? Phaoris? Or wait... I GOT IT!!! DEATHWING!!! YEAH, THAT'S THE PLAY! TA-DAH!!! TAKE THAT, OPPONENT!!! NOW GET MY TIC... DOH!!!
Casually claiming that you "usually" get to play both Demonic Studies and then drop Tickatus with no demons in between, all the while surviving the tempo you're inevitably giving up... smh. The decent Tickatus decks don't even run that card as far as I know. If you want to dream up ideal scenarios for a card, then you can make the argument for nerfing a whole bunch of them. Luckily we live in the real world, where the numbers show he's not a balance problem at all. He feels bad to lose against, yes, and that's true for most late-game, set-up power cards - I personally felt a lot worse when jade and Hadranox druid would start running away with games.
Are you complaining because you have to think and make sacrifices during deckbuild to get a reward with what is supposed to be a tech card against certain matchups ?
Because that's how card games are supposed to work, so quit complaining and start deckbuilding, that'll be way more productive.
Also, as options :
- Alexstrasza
- Quest Warlock to get him at 0
- N'zoth
- Malygos indeed, we still have some 1 mana dmg spells
- Pog-Saron
Anyway, seriously, the card has a really powerful effect, can see its cost reduced (The Dark Portal, Kanrethad, Free Admission...), can be duplicated or "Resurrected" (Y'shaarj, Fielosophy...), and can be tutored (Sense Demons). And yet, with all those possibilities, you think it's normal to get access to its effect without ANY deckbuild effort ? What's the next step ? Turn 1, draw this at the start of the game, battlecry "win the game and gain a cookie" ?
U can treat tikatus as a combo deck rather than control... And combo beats control most of the time..
Soo, generating tons of free value out of thin air (in case of Priest, Mage or Rogue up to 30-40 additional cards in single match) which the other player can't stop or prevent is fair, but destroying 5-10 random cards (after meeting some pretty strict conditions) is not, because...?
Keep in mind, that Warlock doesn't have easy access to value generation (with some minor exceptions) and in value games he has to rely on 30 predictable cards. This of course cannot compete with 60-70 cards of other value oriented control decks and that's why Warlock could not beat any control deck in like past 2 years. Now he found his way, by taking away some of that value from enemy. It's not ideal, but better than nothing.
Think of it as a weaker version of a combo deck. Weaker, because it does not guarantee you win, even despite meeting all the conditions. If combo decks are acceptable in HS, so is Tickatus Warlock.
It is, and Blizzard already said they wanted to correct this starting at the next rotation by adding less card-generating cards in the future.
So we wait and see and we'll be able to talk about that point afterwards =3
And why not a single list includes those cards? Because they are bad, you can be sure people tried to run those highroll cards and ended up losing most of their games. I could give you 1000 reasons why most of those cards are garbage and restricting your deck to playing them just to corrupt tickatus is not worth so your nerf idea is simply "kill the card". Numbers talk sweetheart and as long as tickatus warlock doesn't have an insanely good wr against control/combo decks (btw, most combo and control decks beat it) blizzard will not nerf it. Now I see you are a diehard tickatus hater but blizzard's team looks at this card from every point of view, not just the loud minority that hate to play against it.
In fairness, enox, I can think of at least one example where a card was nerfed 100% due to bitching from the community, at a time when it was in no way oppressing the meta. Come to think of it, I can think of an example where a card was nerfed when it was neither oppressive nor a target of complaint. So who knows what will happen?
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If you are thinking of Hex, let's be honest it was basically polymorph for 1 less mana. I know shaman was not meta at that time but the nerf was just to bring the card in line with poly so it was justifiable.
I'm not. I was thinking about Leeching Poison for the bitching nerf and Flametongue Totem for the neither.
EDIT: And ironically, Kingsbane occupied the same spot Tick Lock does now at the time. Namely, something that beats the slowest of control decks a decent amount and . . . basically nothing else.
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Warlock has toooo many removals and draw engines, as a priest player using combo and control im absolutely done against warlock because no matter how smart you play, they just have their entire deck as a removal, mass removals, anti combo cards, and then finishers... Is really sad how priest players has to survive with small tools compared to other classes.
either way... i was able to do this with the new deck im testing jeje
The things is, kingsbane rogue could beat aggro by drawing an early leeching while warlock won't beat aggro with tickatus. If rogue had a consistent way to draw leeching posion the way they had for kingsbane that deck would've been way worse to deal with. They just needed early survivability and leeching was their only way out, in the late game they had vanish and blade flurry for wide boards or face swings against big threats. Even control decks could be kingsbane rogue if it wasn't for leeching poison. Same for tickatus, control and combo decks can beat it but only if players have an idea how to build their deck and what cards to avoid playing in that match up (card draw mostly).
On the other hand, I partially agree with flametongue totem nerf. It wasn't that obnoxious but played on turn 2 just gave even shaman too much freedom for good trades thanks to their discounted hero power while developing other threats. At that time, even shaman was a tier 1 deck and flametongue helped a lot.
You're misremembering. Even Shaman certainly had its heyday, but by the time Flametongue was nerfed, it wasn't even on the radar. One could dig up the meta snapshots, but given the amount of goalpost movement and unwillingness to acknowledge black and white facts exhibited in this and the sister topic thread, I just can't muster the enthusiasm at the moment.
At a guess, I would be willing to bet Kingsbane had a very similar win rate against the aggro decks of the time as Tickatus does now. I've taken games off Zoo Lock and Face Hunter with Tick Lock before, but it's certainly not the rule. Similar things happened with Kingsbane from time to time, but the nerf was simply not justified by any objective measure. I don't even think the spokesperson who explained the nerf attempted to make the balance argument. He simply trotted out the "lack of fun" concept which is shorthand for, "the community complained enough".
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Other than the fact that he's no fun to play against (and, while subjective, that should matter in a game), there is essentially no counter play outside of "play aggro". Where is the skill element to the card, the deck design constraints, the cost-reward? None of these things exist in a card like Tickatus as he currently stands.
Even if you can play cards like Archivist Elysiana, the rate at which the warlock can burn your deck means that you often won't get to play it anyway, and the excessive draw that Warlocks have mean that they will nearly always have the right cards at the right time.
Even C'Thun, the Shattered has more options to play around...
I think if Blizzard want to introduce cards which interact with your opponents deck, hand and mana (which they're starting to do more and more), they should exist across all classes and not just warlock and DH. It seems really odd now that Coldlight Oracle was HoF'd when in reality he was no more oppressive than what we have now. Even mill decks could be played around to some extent...
Make it cost 10. I know it’s a corrupt card but they have the ability to reduced the cost of their demons. So I could really care less. Plus they could make the 4 mana destroy 3 minions discard as many cards as it kills. Really don’t care but the state of the game for myself as someone who plays to have fun means that it is not fun to see hunter after hunter after demon hunter while I am trying to get a game in at work. Like I would rather do something else. I would rather have a good game against a priest than see 5 aggro decks in a row. He’ll make tickatus cost 11
such salt much BM.
I’m not talking about Demonic Studies, I’m talking about Free Admission, which is run in 2’s.