In a vacuum, this card is still good - in fact it might even be better. However a lot of its power related to outcast and hero attack synergies, which this will greatly reduce.
This nerf feels really fair. It gives DH more damage (which will undoubtedly go straight to the face), but it also prohibits them from the absolutely buckwild turn 1 or turn 2 plays that create so much tempo that there's no way the opponent can come back
Also, OP - I would suggest changing the post title to either "Nerf to Twin Slice" or "Twin Slice Nerf." Your current title makes it sound like it's a nerf that you're calling for, not one that has actually happened.
Probably still playable. But completely ruins the tempo of turn 3 satyr. Turn 5 what’s-their-face-4-damage. Turn 1 greedy demon turn. I won’t miss it at all during altruis.
This nerf directly impacts the top 3 of the top 5 highest w/r cards in the deck (and arguably 4 - Itself, Altruis, Battlefiend, and Sayter). DH is going to need to go back to the drawing board.
It feels like DH has been the uncontested #1 for 10 000 years already, I hope this will send him to the dumpster until the next expansion when they print even more ridiculous DH cards.
In my opinion, tempo DH is dead now. Meta is going to be god awful now....
Not any more awful by design, but hella slower with Priest, Warrior, Mage and Rogue going rampage now. So yea slower climbing = potentially awful if you dont want to waste all day.
Probably still playable. But completely ruins the tempo of turn 3 satyr. Turn 5 what’s-their-face-4-damage. Turn 1 greedy demon turn. I won’t miss it at all during altruis.
Two mana for 4 damage is Eviscerate, a staple in Rogue for ages.
As to the rest, yeah, the nerf matters. Old Twin Slice wasn't just Backstab, it was Backstab + Innervate, essentially, given how much tempo a DH gains simply from attacking from stuff like Satyr Overseer, Battlefiend, and Glaivebound Adept.
I think it's an overall good thing that Twin Slice is now going to be purely damage and no longer secretly a ramp card.
Yes, Wild is the smaller format. Still, it has a huge number of players who comparatively have spent more money on the game. It is especially popular in China, which is an important market.
Yes, it was obvious that the class would be weaker than the others due to limited options.
Still the new class was the the main reason why I pre-ordered the larger bundle. Now I can play one deck (Odd DH) that plays out like a GvG curvestone deck.
In Standard people complain how strong DH is, but in Wild you can only complain how LAME it is. Playing as or against Demon Hunter never is much fun. Eventually I think that is true for Standard as well and 50% of the whole issue regarding that class.
They should change Baku to lower the starting hero power by 1. That would enable Even DH and buff Highlander DH, so we would have two or maybe three viable decks then.
They clearly overshot a little on the power of DH and that was on purpose, it is AoO expansion after all. I still think a big part of it is the one mana hero power, it doesn’t seem like a huge deal but it is... because you’re basing all your decisions as the opponent on “ok and if they use their hero power that’ll cost 2 and there turn is over...”. Instead they drop a one mana, power it up with the hero power, remove something from the board with said hero power and retake the momentum. And when you almost catch up the “dormant “ cards come to life and there’s just no way to be competitive. I think a cool hero power would have been like a standard two mana power, that does something like “deal two damage to a demon or beast, if it kills it, gain two health”. It’s not perfect but it keeps the DH flavor going and does away with the one mana nonsense.
Hmmm, this might actually open the door for a more mid-range DH to start being decent. With the mentioned Spellkin, your only 1 cost spells are now Twin Slice, Consume Magic and Mana Burn. There are really no duds in that list.
I just have a feeling there are some good DH decks lurking out there that make more use of neutral cards. They just haven't had a chance to be discovered because the core DH aggro deck is so strong.
Think about what happened with Warlock recently. They nerf Scrap Imp, making zoo just a decent deck. People play around and find that quest warlock is amazing. It was there all along, but people weren't really looking for it because there was this impression that the class was "solved" with the Scrap Imp zoo build. Now here we are with a deck that is arguably stronger than the zoo version ever was.
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New nerfs what do you think? they kill DH?
If Priest and Mage can now beat DH then yes it will kill DH.
In my opinion, tempo DH is dead now. Meta is going to be god awful now....
how were they not killing them before?
Praise Jebus! It took 4 rounds of nerfs, but at last we will be free!
In a vacuum, this card is still good - in fact it might even be better. However a lot of its power related to outcast and hero attack synergies, which this will greatly reduce.
DH kept rogue and priest in check.
Highlander hunter and spell Druid going to wipe the board now. In my opinion they were way harder to deal with then DH already.
This nerf feels really fair. It gives DH more damage (which will undoubtedly go straight to the face), but it also prohibits them from the absolutely buckwild turn 1 or turn 2 plays that create so much tempo that there's no way the opponent can come back
Also, OP - I would suggest changing the post title to either "Nerf to Twin Slice" or "Twin Slice Nerf." Your current title makes it sound like it's a nerf that you're calling for, not one that has actually happened.
Probably still playable. But completely ruins the tempo of turn 3 satyr. Turn 5 what’s-their-face-4-damage. Turn 1 greedy demon turn. I won’t miss it at all during altruis.
This nerf directly impacts the top 3 of the top 5 highest w/r cards in the deck (and arguably 4 - Itself, Altruis, Battlefiend, and Sayter). DH is going to need to go back to the drawing board.
It feels like DH has been the uncontested #1 for 10 000 years already, I hope this will send him to the dumpster until the next expansion when they print even more ridiculous DH cards.
I'd say pretty huge nerf for DH, no more Turn 5 (4+Coin) Glaivebound Adept Turn for maximum oppression.
Also no more Satyr Overseer Turn 2 + Coin as well
This one is actually gonna make an Impact on the meta.
Not any more awful by design, but hella slower with Priest, Warrior, Mage and Rogue going rampage now. So yea slower climbing = potentially awful if you dont want to waste all day.
Two mana for 4 damage is Eviscerate, a staple in Rogue for ages.
As to the rest, yeah, the nerf matters. Old Twin Slice wasn't just Backstab, it was Backstab + Innervate, essentially, given how much tempo a DH gains simply from attacking from stuff like Satyr Overseer, Battlefiend, and Glaivebound Adept.
I think it's an overall good thing that Twin Slice is now going to be purely damage and no longer secretly a ramp card.
As a wild player, I start to feel cheated.
Yes, Wild is the smaller format. Still, it has a huge number of players who comparatively have spent more money on the game. It is especially popular in China, which is an important market.
Yes, it was obvious that the class would be weaker than the others due to limited options.
Still the new class was the the main reason why I pre-ordered the larger bundle. Now I can play one deck (Odd DH) that plays out like a GvG curvestone deck.
In Standard people complain how strong DH is, but in Wild you can only complain how LAME it is. Playing as or against Demon Hunter never is much fun. Eventually I think that is true for Standard as well and 50% of the whole issue regarding that class.
They should change Baku to lower the starting hero power by 1. That would enable Even DH and buff Highlander DH, so we would have two or maybe three viable decks then.
They clearly overshot a little on the power of DH and that was on purpose, it is AoO expansion after all. I still think a big part of it is the one mana hero power, it doesn’t seem like a huge deal but it is... because you’re basing all your decisions as the opponent on “ok and if they use their hero power that’ll cost 2 and there turn is over...”. Instead they drop a one mana, power it up with the hero power, remove something from the board with said hero power and retake the momentum. And when you almost catch up the “dormant “ cards come to life and there’s just no way to be competitive. I think a cool hero power would have been like a standard two mana power, that does something like “deal two damage to a demon or beast, if it kills it, gain two health”. It’s not perfect but it keeps the DH flavor going and does away with the one mana nonsense.
“Put your faith in the Light!”
This is a major buff to Wild Odd demon hunter. The nerf seems reasonable.
Also, please don't compare spells to hero attack damage. Look at these 2 cards dealing 4 damage, note that the spell has a condition:
Still, Eviscerate is a MUCH better card because of the target flexibility a spell gives, and that your never takes damage when cast.
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Cobalt Spellkin may now give you Twin Slice
Still waiting for hero power to cost 2 mana. Then I will be slightly happier.
Twin slice can, as suggested earlier, now be generated by cobalt spellkin, though no one would run that in DH anyway.
This will impact wild meta hugely. I guess we have to run Skulking Geist in our control decks now lol
Hmmm, this might actually open the door for a more mid-range DH to start being decent. With the mentioned Spellkin, your only 1 cost spells are now Twin Slice, Consume Magic and Mana Burn. There are really no duds in that list.
I just have a feeling there are some good DH decks lurking out there that make more use of neutral cards. They just haven't had a chance to be discovered because the core DH aggro deck is so strong.
Think about what happened with Warlock recently. They nerf Scrap Imp, making zoo just a decent deck. People play around and find that quest warlock is amazing. It was there all along, but people weren't really looking for it because there was this impression that the class was "solved" with the Scrap Imp zoo build. Now here we are with a deck that is arguably stronger than the zoo version ever was.