Just played against a rogue it was a pretty balanced match till he used the wand for 3 free cards, and got a max buff gala for free as one of the cards.
so they essentially got 4+3 / 7 0 mana cards in one turn.
They are nerfing all the other classes but leave this bs in the game makes me laugh.
As a rogue player, I have pulled this off many times, sometimes even into Dragonqueen after that. But the problem I find is that rogue is generally an RNG based class. Sometimes we hit the nuts, sometimes, and most of the time for me, we draw into backstabs and shadowsteps. Sure these senarios feel bad but they shouldn't be nerfed because it happens so rarely.
Wondrous Wand isn't a balanced card. But there was a reason for its high power. It originally could only be generated randomly by the Chest created by Marin the Fox which is an insanely slow meme card. So the pay off needed to be significant for the card to ever see any play (even as a meme). Then they printed Heistbaron Togwaggle. This card has access to the exactly same treasures, the requirement to activate him is ridiculously easy to achieve and you can choose what you want. The power creep was off the charts. I was baffled when they revealed the card. My immediate thought was: "Wait... isn't this a bit too strong?". And here we are with the 0 cost card clown fiesta powered by Heistbaron and Galakrond. Legendary cards need big pay offs to be relevant but this kind of mana cheat is pretty ridiculous.
Too much randomness always suck. Why do you even give weakness to a class, if randomness can fix it? For example Rogue is pretty good at removing single targets, but he can't deal with wide boards, so it's not bad idea to go wide, instead of playing single threat each turn, right? Well, not anymore, since he can answer with randomly generated Twisting Nether, Plague of Death or Brawl...
It's especially annoying and frustrating, when your class can't do the same thing and is rather predictable, so your enemy can play around anything you have (if he only knows the matchup), while you have to rely on luck and can't really think ahead.
As a rogue player, I have pulled this off many times, sometimes even into Dragonqueen after that. But the problem I find is that rogue is generally an RNG based class. Sometimes we hit the nuts, sometimes, and most of the time for me, we draw into backstabs and shadowsteps. Sure these senarios feel bad but they shouldn't be nerfed because it happens so rarely.
There was very little rng (or, to put it in another way, a fuckton less than now) in old rogue builds/archetypes. Sure, rng was there but it wasn't literally every other card (if not multiple cards in the same turn) that relied only on random results.
As for tog, anyone saying it's OP needs to ask themselves, was tog OP before galakrond came along? The answer to that is no it wasn't, tog was around for a long while and no one gave quite literally two shits about it. It's become broken only since DoD which between shaman and rogue has certainly shown that the devs still have no idea whatsoever about what play-testing means (not like they ever did, but still). Tog is obviously broken when you can generate lackeys at will and draw into a 0 mana kronx or a 0 mana galakrond or any such nonsense.
This is like the same as complaining if every Warlock suddenly started running Bane of Doom which always summoned a 7+ cost demon on turn 4. It's just highroll.
This is like the same as complaining if every Warlock suddenly started running Bane of Doom which always summoned a 7+ cost demon on turn 4. It's just highroll.
I've never known that card to ever summon anything other than imps
I've never been a fan of mana cheating, and the fact that they can chain it makes it even more obscene. Sure, sometimes it can hit trash like backstab and shadowstep, but sometimes it doesn't and I think the problem is precisely that, the rng involved, it's like ragnaros and sylvanas back in the day.
Too much randomness always suck. Why do you even give weakness to a class, if randomness can fix it? For example Rogue is pretty good at removing single targets, but he can't deal with wide boards, so it's not bad idea to go wide, instead of playing single threat each turn, right? Well, not anymore, since he can answer with randomly generated Twisting Nether, Plague of Death or Brawl...
It's especially annoying and frustrating, when your class can't do the same thing and is rather predictable, so your enemy can play around anything you have (if he only knows the matchup), while you have to rely on luck and can't really think ahead.
Except you just made this scenario up because ethereal lackey can only discover class cards. Brawl and Twisting Nether can be offered by Zephrys if Highlander but Plague of Death is not a thing for rogue. If there’s some way for rogue to actually access it, it involves ridiculous sequencing like cobalt spellkin from draconic lackey into pilfer into plague of death. it just doesn’t happen.
Also every salty soul in here seems to remember only the times where wand/galakrond draws were the absolute nuts and they got steamrolled and not a single game were the draws from a fully invoked Galakrond were Pharaoh Cat, Praise Galakrond, Backstab and Shadowstep and they got the win. It happens far more often than you’d think.
If your class feels boring and predictable, switch decks. There are plenty of decks out there that can do some really nutty sequencing.
Questlock can have a 0 mana draw every turn and blow you out of the game cheating out far bigger threats than rogue (malygos, dqa) whilst zoo can just kill you by turn 5 if they hit imp and your hand is slow.
Druid can kill you by turn 4.
Priest does stuff that is far more retarded than what rogue will ever be able to do.
Too much randomness doesn’t suck, people that can’t deal with it do. If your opponent hasn’t used his Zephrys yes you should play around it and each of its possible outcomes. The same goes with Dragonqueen.
If Galakrond is about to come down you have to accept the fact you may have your board completely flipped by them drawing into faceless/flik/kronx or all three of them because it happens far less than you think. Just look at rogue decklist and work out if there’s more chance of them drawing and discounting their 6+ cards or the other way around.
Um... I mean, you guys realize that this combo has been around for quite a while right? Heistbaron came out in SoU... Were already 10 months away from they rotating naturally, and SoU came out 10 months ago... The free cards are what makes it a viable tempo deck in this insane value meta. Hunter and DH are still overall performing better. People constantly cry about Res Priest and Big Druid with 30 minute games, and Tempo Rogues are the only thing keeping them in check
Yes, Rogue can pull 6 x 0 cost cards, but.have you considered how much of Rogue's deck are cheap combo triggers? Yeah, that's right usually that 0 cost card you pull originally costed 0-2...
I don't play Rogue, and it's fine... You're going to get high rolled by Tempo and Combo decks from time to time... It's part of the game.
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Just played against a rogue it was a pretty balanced match till he used the wand for 3 free cards, and got a max buff gala for free as one of the cards.
so they essentially got 4+3 / 7 0 mana cards in one turn.
They are nerfing all the other classes but leave this bs in the game makes me laugh.
As a rogue player, I have pulled this off many times, sometimes even into Dragonqueen after that. But the problem I find is that rogue is generally an RNG based class. Sometimes we hit the nuts, sometimes, and most of the time for me, we draw into backstabs and shadowsteps. Sure these senarios feel bad but they shouldn't be nerfed because it happens so rarely.
I like playing rogue to not bashing it In anyway just saying drawing 7 0 mana cards is not balanced and should be addressed.
When it does happen, I agree it is overpowered
Blizzard is not going to nerf Galakrond or Tog ever, so yes it is unbalanced and it will stay that way.
We will see about that lol
Wondrous Wand isn't a balanced card. But there was a reason for its high power. It originally could only be generated randomly by the Chest created by Marin the Fox which is an insanely slow meme card. So the pay off needed to be significant for the card to ever see any play (even as a meme). Then they printed Heistbaron Togwaggle. This card has access to the exactly same treasures, the requirement to activate him is ridiculously easy to achieve and you can choose what you want. The power creep was off the charts. I was baffled when they revealed the card. My immediate thought was: "Wait... isn't this a bit too strong?". And here we are with the 0 cost card clown fiesta powered by Heistbaron and Galakrond. Legendary cards need big pay offs to be relevant but this kind of mana cheat is pretty ridiculous.
Rogue will be a problem if hunters don't exist.
Any hunter deck eat rogues for breakfeast.
Except Highlander
bet you they hof it a year early like they did with genn n baku
That case is OP, but this happen rarely
Too much randomness always suck. Why do you even give weakness to a class, if randomness can fix it? For example Rogue is pretty good at removing single targets, but he can't deal with wide boards, so it's not bad idea to go wide, instead of playing single threat each turn, right? Well, not anymore, since he can answer with randomly generated Twisting Nether, Plague of Death or Brawl...
It's especially annoying and frustrating, when your class can't do the same thing and is rather predictable, so your enemy can play around anything you have (if he only knows the matchup), while you have to rely on luck and can't really think ahead.
There was very little rng (or, to put it in another way, a fuckton less than now) in old rogue builds/archetypes. Sure, rng was there but it wasn't literally every other card (if not multiple cards in the same turn) that relied only on random results.
As for tog, anyone saying it's OP needs to ask themselves, was tog OP before galakrond came along? The answer to that is no it wasn't, tog was around for a long while and no one gave quite literally two shits about it. It's become broken only since DoD which between shaman and rogue has certainly shown that the devs still have no idea whatsoever about what play-testing means (not like they ever did, but still). Tog is obviously broken when you can generate lackeys at will and draw into a 0 mana kronx or a 0 mana galakrond or any such nonsense.
Throw there dragonqueen and you got yourself a casinostone.
into ysera unleashed into big ol whelp
This is like the same as complaining if every Warlock suddenly started running Bane of Doom which always summoned a 7+ cost demon on turn 4. It's just highroll.
I've never known that card to ever summon anything other than imps
I've never been a fan of mana cheating, and the fact that they can chain it makes it even more obscene. Sure, sometimes it can hit trash like backstab and shadowstep, but sometimes it doesn't and I think the problem is precisely that, the rng involved, it's like ragnaros and sylvanas back in the day.
Except you just made this scenario up because ethereal lackey can only discover class cards. Brawl and Twisting Nether can be offered by Zephrys if Highlander but Plague of Death is not a thing for rogue. If there’s some way for rogue to actually access it, it involves ridiculous sequencing like cobalt spellkin from draconic lackey into pilfer into plague of death. it just doesn’t happen.
Also every salty soul in here seems to remember only the times where wand/galakrond draws were the absolute nuts and they got steamrolled and not a single game were the draws from a fully invoked Galakrond were Pharaoh Cat, Praise Galakrond, Backstab and Shadowstep and they got the win. It happens far more often than you’d think.
If your class feels boring and predictable, switch decks. There are plenty of decks out there that can do some really nutty sequencing.
Questlock can have a 0 mana draw every turn and blow you out of the game cheating out far bigger threats than rogue (malygos, dqa) whilst zoo can just kill you by turn 5 if they hit imp and your hand is slow.
Druid can kill you by turn 4.
Priest does stuff that is far more retarded than what rogue will ever be able to do.
Too much randomness doesn’t suck, people that can’t deal with it do. If your opponent hasn’t used his Zephrys yes you should play around it and each of its possible outcomes. The same goes with Dragonqueen.
If Galakrond is about to come down you have to accept the fact you may have your board completely flipped by them drawing into faceless/flik/kronx or all three of them because it happens far less than you think. Just look at rogue decklist and work out if there’s more chance of them drawing and discounting their 6+ cards or the other way around.
Um... I mean, you guys realize that this combo has been around for quite a while right? Heistbaron came out in SoU... Were already 10 months away from they rotating naturally, and SoU came out 10 months ago... The free cards are what makes it a viable tempo deck in this insane value meta. Hunter and DH are still overall performing better. People constantly cry about Res Priest and Big Druid with 30 minute games, and Tempo Rogues are the only thing keeping them in check
Yes, Rogue can pull 6 x 0 cost cards, but.have you considered how much of Rogue's deck are cheap combo triggers? Yeah, that's right usually that 0 cost card you pull originally costed 0-2...
I don't play Rogue, and it's fine... You're going to get high rolled by Tempo and Combo decks from time to time... It's part of the game.