As expected, a huge chunk of ladder is trying out N'Zoth (with Sylvanus and 2x Khartut) in every class that can work it in. I'm interested in discussing your thoughts on the best way to exploit the heavy use of these decks.
I think Holy Wrath Paladin is fast enough to beat most of these lists, but with Emperor Thaurissan back in the format, its quite possible that some kind of Freeze Mage or other burn/alternate win condition combo deck could be more viable. At the other end of the scale, Secret Paladin and Tempo Mage with Mana Cyclone/Flamewaker could certainly look to pressure N'Zoth decks out of the game before they get going.
I've been using N'zoth in Lucentbark Druid. With a lot of healing and N'zoth resummoning all the Lucentbarks the died this game and a few Khartut Defenders and you make yourself an impenetrable wall. Like, I remember, I lasted 3 N'zoth's from a Warlock who played a singleton deck. He, of course, used Youthful Brewmaster to bounce his N'zoth back.
I only used N'zoth once. The game was so long, I had to use Elysiana. And with the most satisfying victory, I defeated him with no cards left. Not in deck and not in hand and no minions on the board.
I've not actually seen N'Zoth in any decks yet since the patch was released. But I've seen a lot of Thaurissans. Highlander Paladin is one such deck - I'm guessing because both Trump and Firebat showcased it recently and everyone's jumping on the proverbial bandwagon.
I've also used him in my Quest Shaman deck for some superb early-lethals. It shortens the lethal turn down considerably. (0-cost Lackeys are stupid, lol)
But yeah, I'll be honest, N'zoth hasn't made an appearance yet, so I can't give experience on him. Though I've been meaning to throw together a new Quest Priest Deathrattle deck at some point. It's Sylvanas I'm rather terrified of right now...
I've been using N'zoth in Lucentbark Druid. With a lot of healing and N'zoth resummoning all the Lucentbarks the died this game and a few Khartut Defenders and you make yourself an impenetrable wall. Like, I remember, I lasted 3 N'zoth's from a Warlock who played a singleton deck. He, of course, used Youthful Brewmaster to bounce his N'zoth back.
I only used N'zoth once. The game was so long, I had to use Elysiana. And with the most satisfying victory, I defeated him with no cards left. Not in deck and not in hand and no minions on the board.
Same, but without Khartut. I feel that Getting 6 Lucentbarks killed and then playing N'Zoth reduces the need for duplicators in the deck which allows you to get other tools.
Ironically (to my last comment), I just faced 4 Priests in a row, all Deathrattles. I assume that these were N'zoth priests, but again, they never managed to actually get N'Zoth online. Quest Shaman pretty much ran them into the ground before they could get going. The key is to basically hold off attacking in the early game, so the priest doesn't get cheap healing to advance the quest.
I've been using N'zoth in Lucentbark Druid. With a lot of healing and N'zoth resummoning all the Lucentbarks the died this game and a few Khartut Defenders and you make yourself an impenetrable wall. Like, I remember, I lasted 3 N'zoth's from a Warlock who played a singleton deck. He, of course, used Youthful Brewmaster to bounce his N'zoth back.
I only used N'zoth once. The game was so long, I had to use Elysiana. And with the most satisfying victory, I defeated him with no cards left. Not in deck and not in hand and no minions on the board.
Same, but without Khartut. I feel that Getting 6 Lucentbarks killed and then playing N'Zoth reduces the need for duplicators in the deck which allows you to get other tools.
Quick question on this: If you've had 6 Lucentbarks killed, then they are dormant on the board, yes? So, how will N'zoth help you in this particular position? Having the same Lucentbark die repeatedly doesn't count as individual Deathrattle minions - at least it shouldn't, if previous mechanics are anything to go by (such as resurrection, etc)
Ironically (to my last comment), I just faced 4 Priests in a row, all Deathrattles. I assume that these were N'zoth priests, but again, they never managed to actually get N'Zoth online. Quest Shaman pretty much ran them into the ground before they could get going. The key is to basically hold off attacking in the early game, so the priest doesn't get cheap healing to advance the quest.
I feel like quest may not be the way forward for Priest. It can be a struggle to make quest progress against anything that doesn't rely on dealing incremental chip damage in the early game, and even though there are a couple of little tricks you can use to advance the quest in a slow game, ultimately you are at the mercy of the opponent's decision to interact with you if you want to complete the quest in good time. I could be wrong however - completing the quest quickly in a slow matchup is likely of very minimal importance, as you're relying more on setting up a good N'Zoth pool and winning in the late game resource battle than giving some taunt minions a small stat boost and some extra stickiness.
I've been using N'zoth in Lucentbark Druid. With a lot of healing and N'zoth resummoning all the Lucentbarks the died this game and a few Khartut Defenders and you make yourself an impenetrable wall. Like, I remember, I lasted 3 N'zoth's from a Warlock who played a singleton deck. He, of course, used Youthful Brewmaster to bounce his N'zoth back.
I only used N'zoth once. The game was so long, I had to use Elysiana. And with the most satisfying victory, I defeated him with no cards left. Not in deck and not in hand and no minions on the board.
Same, but without Khartut. I feel that Getting 6 Lucentbarks killed and then playing N'Zoth reduces the need for duplicators in the deck which allows you to get other tools.
Quick question on this: If you've had 6 Lucentbarks killed, then they are dormant on the board, yes? So, how will N'zoth help you in this particular position? Having the same Lucentbark die repeatedly doesn't count as individual Deathrattle minions - at least it shouldn't, if previous mechanics are anything to go by (such as resurrection, etc)
It does count for N'Zoth, you can only play one, resurrect it 5 times, and Nzoth will attempt to spawn 6. Not sure about the inconsistencies this causes but this is how it's working right now.
About how N'Zoth helps even in a full dormant board, with Zephyris the deck got pretty inconsistent due to mass dispel, Nzoth would still help.
On the other end of the "front", Evolve Shaman is capable of some very broken early game turns. N'Zoth decks may be dead long before N'Zoth could possibly be played.
Been running a Control Shaman mostly myself. Double Hex and double Plague of Murlocs leave me less than worried about N'Zoth, the Corruptor. Most deathrattle cards will be transformed before they become a problem. Emperor Thaurissan, however, could still be a pretty potent obstacle by enabling some powerful swing turns and OTK's that could easily catch someone off guard.
Also playing Control Shaman. Against N'Zoth decks it is pretty strong. But Pally and Druid OTK decks are very hard to beat with it... But if you're not facing one of those, the deck is super strong.
I beat a couple of Quest N'Zoth Priest with bog standard Control Warrior (i didn't even bother to update it with the new Wild stuff). Honestly the match up wasnt as hard as i thought it would be. I thought the new Wild stuff would give Priest an edge in the long game in the same way that Warrior removal cant just keep up with all the infinite engines in Wild but 2 Brawls 2 Warpaths and a Plague of Wrath lined up nicely against Priest's power turns.
I guess i underestimated how passive that deck is until they drop Mass Rez and N'Zoth/Seance
Ironically (to my last comment), I just faced 4 Priests in a row, all Deathrattles. I assume that these were N'zoth priests, but again, they never managed to actually get N'Zoth online. Quest Shaman pretty much ran them into the ground before they could get going. The key is to basically hold off attacking in the early game, so the priest doesn't get cheap healing to advance the quest.
I feel like quest may not be the way forward for Priest. It can be a struggle to make quest progress against anything that doesn't rely on dealing incremental chip damage in the early game, and even though there are a couple of little tricks you can use to advance the quest in a slow game, ultimately you are at the mercy of the opponent's decision to interact with you if you want to complete the quest in good time. I could be wrong however - completing the quest quickly in a slow matchup is likely of very minimal importance, as you're relying more on setting up a good N'Zoth pool and winning in the late game resource battle than giving some taunt minions a small stat boost and some extra stickiness.
Oh I mean as quest priest I ussualy complete my quest around turn 8. After you can start dropping the big boys enemy must start trading. Imagine dropping a 2/6. Enemy must contest it, then you ressurect it, and it ussualy is not possible not to leave any damage undone.
In control matchups it's even harder to complete quest. Quest priest Vs quest warrior though key is your hero power. If you get quest complete, warrior ussualy runs 4 so how target removals. You accept that, after seeing all 4 of them, if any minnion sticks you boost it up to levels where warrior must brawl to remove it. Eventually you win. If he brawls too early you mass ressurect or nzoth. When it goes to fatigue you seanse his elyssiana and win fatigue too. Priest wins Vs warrior perfectly. Unless off he gets Dr boom very very early while you don't develop your hero power.
As expected, a huge chunk of ladder is trying out N'Zoth (with Sylvanus and 2x Khartut) in every class that can work it in. I'm interested in discussing your thoughts on the best way to exploit the heavy use of these decks.
I think Holy Wrath Paladin is fast enough to beat most of these lists, but with Emperor Thaurissan back in the format, its quite possible that some kind of Freeze Mage or other burn/alternate win condition combo deck could be more viable. At the other end of the scale, Secret Paladin and Tempo Mage with Mana Cyclone/Flamewaker could certainly look to pressure N'Zoth decks out of the game before they get going.
What are your thoughts?
I've been using N'zoth in Lucentbark Druid. With a lot of healing and N'zoth resummoning all the Lucentbarks the died this game and a few Khartut Defenders and you make yourself an impenetrable wall. Like, I remember, I lasted 3 N'zoth's from a Warlock who played a singleton deck. He, of course, used Youthful Brewmaster to bounce his N'zoth back.
I only used N'zoth once. The game was so long, I had to use Elysiana. And with the most satisfying victory, I defeated him with no cards left. Not in deck and not in hand and no minions on the board.
I've not actually seen N'Zoth in any decks yet since the patch was released. But I've seen a lot of Thaurissans. Highlander Paladin is one such deck - I'm guessing because both Trump and Firebat showcased it recently and everyone's jumping on the proverbial bandwagon.
I've also used him in my Quest Shaman deck for some superb early-lethals. It shortens the lethal turn down considerably. (0-cost Lackeys are stupid, lol)
But yeah, I'll be honest, N'zoth hasn't made an appearance yet, so I can't give experience on him. Though I've been meaning to throw together a new Quest Priest Deathrattle deck at some point.
It's Sylvanas I'm rather terrified of right now...
if you are priest tech in 2 Shadow Madness against Khartut Defender.
Same, but without Khartut. I feel that Getting 6 Lucentbarks killed and then playing N'Zoth reduces the need for duplicators in the deck which allows you to get other tools.
just lost against to deathrattle rogue with shadowstep N'zoth, feels cancerish
Ironically (to my last comment), I just faced 4 Priests in a row, all Deathrattles.
I assume that these were N'zoth priests, but again, they never managed to actually get N'Zoth online.
Quest Shaman pretty much ran them into the ground before they could get going.
The key is to basically hold off attacking in the early game, so the priest doesn't get cheap healing to advance the quest.
Quick question on this:
If you've had 6 Lucentbarks killed, then they are dormant on the board, yes?
So, how will N'zoth help you in this particular position?
Having the same Lucentbark die repeatedly doesn't count as individual Deathrattle minions - at least it shouldn't, if previous mechanics are anything to go by (such as resurrection, etc)
I feel like quest may not be the way forward for Priest. It can be a struggle to make quest progress against anything that doesn't rely on dealing incremental chip damage in the early game, and even though there are a couple of little tricks you can use to advance the quest in a slow game, ultimately you are at the mercy of the opponent's decision to interact with you if you want to complete the quest in good time. I could be wrong however - completing the quest quickly in a slow matchup is likely of very minimal importance, as you're relying more on setting up a good N'Zoth pool and winning in the late game resource battle than giving some taunt minions a small stat boost and some extra stickiness.
It does count for N'Zoth, you can only play one, resurrect it 5 times, and Nzoth will attempt to spawn 6. Not sure about the inconsistencies this causes but this is how it's working right now.
About how N'Zoth helps even in a full dormant board, with Zephyris the deck got pretty inconsistent due to mass dispel, Nzoth would still help.
On the other end of the "front", Evolve Shaman is capable of some very broken early game turns. N'Zoth decks may be dead long before N'Zoth could possibly be played.
Been running a Control Shaman mostly myself. Double Hex and double Plague of Murlocs leave me less than worried about N'Zoth, the Corruptor. Most deathrattle cards will be transformed before they become a problem. Emperor Thaurissan, however, could still be a pretty potent obstacle by enabling some powerful swing turns and OTK's that could easily catch someone off guard.
Also playing Control Shaman. Against N'Zoth decks it is pretty strong. But Pally and Druid OTK decks are very hard to beat with it... But if you're not facing one of those, the deck is super strong.
I beat a couple of Quest N'Zoth Priest with bog standard Control Warrior (i didn't even bother to update it with the new Wild stuff). Honestly the match up wasnt as hard as i thought it would be. I thought the new Wild stuff would give Priest an edge in the long game in the same way that Warrior removal cant just keep up with all the infinite engines in Wild but 2 Brawls 2 Warpaths and a Plague of Wrath lined up nicely against Priest's power turns.
I guess i underestimated how passive that deck is until they drop Mass Rez and N'Zoth/Seance
Oh I mean as quest priest I ussualy complete my quest around turn 8. After you can start dropping the big boys enemy must start trading. Imagine dropping a 2/6. Enemy must contest it, then you ressurect it, and it ussualy is not possible not to leave any damage undone.
In control matchups it's even harder to complete quest. Quest priest Vs quest warrior though key is your hero power. If you get quest complete, warrior ussualy runs 4 so how target removals. You accept that, after seeing all 4 of them, if any minnion sticks you boost it up to levels where warrior must brawl to remove it. Eventually you win. If he brawls too early you mass ressurect or nzoth. When it goes to fatigue you seanse his elyssiana and win fatigue too. Priest wins Vs warrior perfectly. Unless off he gets Dr boom very very early while you don't develop your hero power.
MIND
CONTROL
TECH.