Standard only. I believe those cards should be changed ( nerfed ) in some way. You may disagree with me but it's okay. Feel free to suggest your own idea's.
Hunter:
Venomizer - raise the cost to 3 or remove the magnetic ability. Comment: Unhealthy interaction with Missile Launcher
Master's Call - raise the cost to 4. Comment: Class identity. Hunter's weakness was always getting out of cards quickly, beside tracking, there's wasn't a good spell/minion that draw you card/cards. That's why I don't understand why hunter's master's call costs only 3 mana, Rogue's Raiding party drew 2 pirates and weapon if combo'ed and it was nerfed to 4 mana.
Mage:
Ray of Frost - Swap the mechanic, Deal 2 damage, if you target the same minion twice, freeze it. Comment: Extra cheap freezing tool very often offers a mage player a way to completely ignore opponent's board and go face/ prevent other player from trading. It's very often annoying when you have the power on board to clear giant and prevent conjurer's calling turn but you are cut off in such an easy way.
Conjurer's Calling - Remove the twinspell. Comment: It really needs any explanation? Card's busted.
Paladin:
Crystology - back to 2. Comment: Aggro paladin ( this time mech paladin ) was easily beaten if they ran out of cards, crystology became the best card that draws a card in hearthstone.
Shaman:
Underbelly Angler - raise the cost to 3 and lower the health to 2. Comment: The cheapiest value generator in hearthstone, it doesn't matter that shaman have two cards in his hand, if it's underbelly angler and any other murlock, I bet you will see him flooding entire board next turn. Note: Underbelly Angler also can generate another Underbelly Angler
Spirit of the Frog - raise the cost to 4. Comment: And again, drawing massive amount of cards with a card that is cheap as hell counting it's ability. Remember the time when stealthed Gadgetzan Auctioner was a thing?
Warrior:
Omega Assembly - Just discover the mech. Comment: A one-mana card that generates three cards, isn't it too much? I know, you have to have 10-mana but for a warrior that's not an unpossible task to surive this long. Note: Hallucination is a card.
Omega Devastator - Remove the mech tag. Comment: Getting a numberous amount of these in one game thanks to omega assembly, Dr. Boom, Mad Genius is a also a bit too much
Dr.Boom. Mad Genius - First played mech has rush. Blast shield removed. Delivery Drone is random mech.
Neutral:
Magic Carpet - lower the health to 3 mana. Comment: Giving a rush and permanent + one attack is amazing ( look at Dr. Boom, Mad Genius's rush ability ) and 6 health makes Magic Carpet a really tough target to remove.
I honestly don't see any of these suggestions improving the game at all and each would serve only to either undo a buff (like Crystology - which was buffed for a reason), or destroy the card into non-use, which is a pointless endeavour. Not to mention some of the suggestions outright being ludicrous (such as the Dr Boom idea which is pretty insane).
If you want to suggest nerfs like this, you should at the very least explain why they should be nerfed, how you decided on the nerf and how you think it would make the card more balanced. As it is, unfortunately this just comes across as "I don't like these cards and don't know how to beat them, so I want them to be bad so I don't have to...."
Honestly I agree with scorpyon, though I will admit that some of these do feel nice. I feel like omega devastator would be a good nerf, but I think that you over nerfed dr.boom, magic carpet is waaaay over nerfed, spirit of the frog is unnecessary as it doesn't lead to anything overpowered. Hunter feels unnecessary (not hitting the right cards imo) and Mage feels like you are maybe nerfing wrong. The freeze is fine as is, and conjurer's might require 1 more mana (but not certain) Underbelly Angler doesn't feel so op that it needs that sort of nerf.
All in all, it feels like you've hit every sort of archetype with your call for nerfs though, so it seems like you want to more open space for something less good than others, so you can play your own deck.
My comments: For venomizer you clearly want to target bomb hunter, but I think that another card should be nerfed as Mech as a tribe is too powerful and almost every class has a deck they could make with it. I believe that though I love the card so much, maybe zilliax needs a nerf, but that might not really touch bomb hunter... Maybe silly as it sounds, wargear? make it a 4/5 or a 5/4, removing 1 stat might be enough)
The only nerf I agree with is the Venomizer. Idk if it’s a proper nerf that you suggested, but the card’s interaction with Missile Launcher should not be a thing. Not many classes have hard removal right now, basically Warrior is the only one with some really good removal pieces like Execute or Shield Slam, and these two cards can one-shot more than half of the matchups. I think that either of these cards should have their cost raised or maybe change Missile Launcher to something like ‚at the end of your turn, deal 4 damage randomly split among all other characters’ or make it trigger at the start of turn so the opponent has a way to deal with the comboed minion.
It's also worth noting that nerfing Venomizer by simply removing the Magnetic keyword from it, won't stop the combo with Missile Launcher since they will just play the two cards the other way around instead.
Now I hate that combo being played against me as much as any (and sometimes it is simply game over), but there are probably other ways of getting around it in terms of it actually required a nerf. I don't think it does personally.
Oh really? So it's better to nerf one class per time? If there's unhealthy interaction that specific card is responsible for then why it shouldn't be nerfed? Every class that is top tier now ( Warrior, Hunter, Mage ) maintain their dominance usually thanks to specifit cards. Warrior - Mainly Dr. Boom. Hunter - Strong mech synergies and great card draw ( midrange hunter ), Mage - Conjurer's Calling. Why it should be this way?
Those aren't nerf suggestions, you're outright trying to destroy the most popular archetypes. Sounds like a player who is bitter because his homebrews are being stomped repeatedly by optimized meta decks.
Would love to see WILD nerfs (Barnes/Resurrect). That would be fucking xmas, easter, bday n shit on one fucking day! But as it seems some ppl from Team 5 love playing Big Priest in Wild. Words cant describe how much I hate Team 5 nowadays :^) (expect ppl whio are in charge for coding and sound and art, those ppl do a great job!)
It's also worth noting that nerfing Venomizer by simply removing the Magnetic keyword from it, won't stop the combo with Missile Launcher since they will just play the two cards the other way around instead.
Now I hate that combo being played against me as much as any (and sometimes it is simply game over), but there are probably other ways of getting around it in terms of it actually required a nerf. I don't think it does personally.
Silence is a cure for so many ills. People should give always give Spellbreaker a try (or even the lowly owl!) before calling for nerfs.
Rollback Post to RevisionRollBack
"Why, you never expected justice from a company, did you? They have neither a soul to lose nor a body to kick." -- Lady Saba Holland
It honestly doesn't look like the OP gave much thought to many of the nerfs he proposed - it's often best practice to actually look at available data in order to figure out which cards might currently be problematic, rather than just randomly targeting cards you "feel" are problematic. Master's Call might "feel" busted, for example - but its played win-rate is merely even. If the card isn't spiking the win-rate of Hunter when it's played, nerfing it seems pointless and counter-productive, since you aren't actually targeting the truly problematic cards - why not simply look at the cards which are actually spiking Hunter's win-rate, and target those if you think the class needs a nerf?
At least two cards on the OP's list appear out-of-place - the played win-rate of Spirit of the Frog is nearly -6%, while Magic Carpet is nearly -5%. Do they really need to be worse? There is a concept in CCGs regarding "the danger of cool things" - I suspect SotF and MC decks are trying their best to do something cool, while they would often be much better off simply playing cards that actually win them the game.
It also isn't helpful to simply delete problematic cards from the game - removing Twinspell from Conjurer's Calling seems a bit aggressive, to say the least. So does simply removing Omega from Omega Assembly.
i love each time ppl complain about conjurers calling. that card seemed busted since the day it was announced specially when we had a similar interaction with Cube. HOWEVER most ppl said the card wasnt good enough. i mean being able to run 4 cube like cards aint good. amateurs. designers and testers alike
Oh really? So it's better to nerf one class per time? If there's unhealthy interaction that specific card is responsible for then why it shouldn't be nerfed? Every class that is top tier now ( Warrior, Hunter, Mage ) maintain their dominance usually thanks to specifit cards. Warrior - Mainly Dr. Boom. Hunter - Strong mech synergies and great card draw ( midrange hunter ), Mage - Conjurer's Calling. Why it should be this way?
Because there can never be perfect balance. There will always be some cards that are slightly better than others.
So if you continually target the strongest cards for nerfs, repeating the process over and over again, pretty soon we're all playing Vanillastone.
You acknowledge that there are three equally strong classes right now -- and a couple of others that are not too far behind -- well, that's actually a pretty healthy place for the meta to be. Compare this to the last few weeks of Rastakhan, or the Rogue-Warrior meta of a month ago. Those were unhealthy. This is not.
Sometimes it's best to enjoy what is in front of you rather than constantly fretting over perceived imperfections that aren't really that big a deal.
Rollback Post to RevisionRollBack
"Why, you never expected justice from a company, did you? They have neither a soul to lose nor a body to kick." -- Lady Saba Holland
Crystology - back to 2. Comment: Aggro paladin ( this time mech paladin ) was easily beaten if they ran out of cards, crystology became the best card that draws a card in hearthstone.
Paladin don't have hero card, don't have reliable mass removal (always need two cards), don't have a reliable, cheap single removal like execute or shield slam, don't have a stupid broken minion "I will solve all your problems" like Omega Devastator, etc...
The few things left for the class is cheap card draw and good mech sinergy, you want to kill that too? I will agree with you if this card exists before in murlock paladin or odd paladin but now is the only thing preventing the class become tier trash with priest.
Standard only. I believe those cards should be changed ( nerfed ) in some way. You may disagree with me but it's okay. Feel free to suggest your own idea's.
Hunter:
Venomizer - raise the cost to 3 or remove the magnetic ability. Comment: Unhealthy interaction with Missile Launcher
Master's Call - raise the cost to 4. Comment: Class identity. Hunter's weakness was always getting out of cards quickly, beside tracking, there's wasn't a good spell/minion that draw you card/cards. That's why I don't understand why hunter's master's call costs only 3 mana, Rogue's Raiding party drew 2 pirates and weapon if combo'ed and it was nerfed to 4 mana.
Mage:
Ray of Frost - Swap the mechanic, Deal 2 damage, if you target the same minion twice, freeze it. Comment: Extra cheap freezing tool very often offers a mage player a way to completely ignore opponent's board and go face/ prevent other player from trading. It's very often annoying when you have the power on board to clear giant and prevent conjurer's calling turn but you are cut off in such an easy way.
Conjurer's Calling - Remove the twinspell. Comment: It really needs any explanation? Card's busted.
Paladin:
Crystology - back to 2. Comment: Aggro paladin ( this time mech paladin ) was easily beaten if they ran out of cards, crystology became the best card that draws a card in hearthstone.
Shaman:
Underbelly Angler - raise the cost to 3 and lower the health to 2. Comment: The cheapiest value generator in hearthstone, it doesn't matter that shaman have two cards in his hand, if it's underbelly angler and any other murlock, I bet you will see him flooding entire board next turn. Note: Underbelly Angler also can generate another Underbelly Angler
Spirit of the Frog - raise the cost to 4. Comment: And again, drawing massive amount of cards with a card that is cheap as hell counting it's ability. Remember the time when stealthed Gadgetzan Auctioner was a thing?
Warrior:
Omega Assembly - Just discover the mech. Comment: A one-mana card that generates three cards, isn't it too much? I know, you have to have 10-mana but for a warrior that's not an unpossible task to surive this long. Note: Hallucination is a card.
Omega Devastator - Remove the mech tag. Comment: Getting a numberous amount of these in one game thanks to omega assembly, Dr. Boom, Mad Genius is a also a bit too much
Dr.Boom. Mad Genius - First played mech has rush. Blast shield removed. Delivery Drone is random mech.
Neutral:
Magic Carpet - lower the health to 3 mana. Comment: Giving a rush and permanent + one attack is amazing ( look at Dr. Boom, Mad Genius's rush ability ) and 6 health makes Magic Carpet a really tough target to remove.
I honestly don't see any of these suggestions improving the game at all and each would serve only to either undo a buff (like Crystology - which was buffed for a reason), or destroy the card into non-use, which is a pointless endeavour.
Not to mention some of the suggestions outright being ludicrous (such as the Dr Boom idea which is pretty insane).
If you want to suggest nerfs like this, you should at the very least explain why they should be nerfed, how you decided on the nerf and how you think it would make the card more balanced.
As it is, unfortunately this just comes across as "I don't like these cards and don't know how to beat them, so I want them to be bad so I don't have to...."
Honestly I agree with scorpyon, though I will admit that some of these do feel nice. I feel like omega devastator would be a good nerf, but I think that you over nerfed dr.boom, magic carpet is waaaay over nerfed, spirit of the frog is unnecessary as it doesn't lead to anything overpowered. Hunter feels unnecessary (not hitting the right cards imo) and Mage feels like you are maybe nerfing wrong. The freeze is fine as is, and conjurer's might require 1 more mana (but not certain) Underbelly Angler doesn't feel so op that it needs that sort of nerf.
All in all, it feels like you've hit every sort of archetype with your call for nerfs though, so it seems like you want to more open space for something less good than others, so you can play your own deck.
My comments: For venomizer you clearly want to target bomb hunter, but I think that another card should be nerfed as Mech as a tribe is too powerful and almost every class has a deck they could make with it. I believe that though I love the card so much, maybe zilliax needs a nerf, but that might not really touch bomb hunter... Maybe silly as it sounds, wargear? make it a 4/5 or a 5/4, removing 1 stat might be enough)
The only nerf I agree with is the Venomizer. Idk if it’s a proper nerf that you suggested, but the card’s interaction with Missile Launcher should not be a thing. Not many classes have hard removal right now, basically Warrior is the only one with some really good removal pieces like Execute or Shield Slam, and these two cards can one-shot more than half of the matchups. I think that either of these cards should have their cost raised or maybe change Missile Launcher to something like ‚at the end of your turn, deal 4 damage randomly split among all other characters’ or make it trigger at the start of turn so the opponent has a way to deal with the comboed minion.
All you've done is target every strong deck in the meta and tried to make them worse. That is not how nerf decisions are made.
"Why, you never expected justice from a company, did you? They have neither a soul to lose nor a body to kick." -- Lady Saba Holland
It's also worth noting that nerfing Venomizer by simply removing the Magnetic keyword from it, won't stop the combo with Missile Launcher since they will just play the two cards the other way around instead.
Now I hate that combo being played against me as much as any (and sometimes it is simply game over), but there are probably other ways of getting around it in terms of it actually required a nerf. I don't think it does personally.
I agree, I should have mentioned the reason why these cards require nerfs. Post edited.
Oh really? So it's better to nerf one class per time? If there's unhealthy interaction that specific card is responsible for then why it shouldn't be nerfed? Every class that is top tier now ( Warrior, Hunter, Mage ) maintain their dominance usually thanks to specifit cards. Warrior - Mainly Dr. Boom. Hunter - Strong mech synergies and great card draw ( midrange hunter ), Mage - Conjurer's Calling. Why it should be this way?
Those aren't nerf suggestions, you're outright trying to destroy the most popular archetypes. Sounds like a player who is bitter because his homebrews are being stomped repeatedly by optimized meta decks.
No nerfs, just buffs!!
the only 1 i agree w is conjurers calling
fuck that op card
Would love to see WILD nerfs (Barnes/Resurrect). That would be fucking xmas, easter, bday n shit on one fucking day! But as it seems some ppl from Team 5 love playing Big Priest in Wild. Words cant describe how much I hate Team 5 nowadays :^) (expect ppl whio are in charge for coding and sound and art, those ppl do a great job!)
Silence is a cure for so many ills. People should give always give Spellbreaker a try (or even the lowly owl!) before calling for nerfs.
"Why, you never expected justice from a company, did you? They have neither a soul to lose nor a body to kick." -- Lady Saba Holland
Hmmm . . .
It honestly doesn't look like the OP gave much thought to many of the nerfs he proposed - it's often best practice to actually look at available data in order to figure out which cards might currently be problematic, rather than just randomly targeting cards you "feel" are problematic. Master's Call might "feel" busted, for example - but its played win-rate is merely even. If the card isn't spiking the win-rate of Hunter when it's played, nerfing it seems pointless and counter-productive, since you aren't actually targeting the truly problematic cards - why not simply look at the cards which are actually spiking Hunter's win-rate, and target those if you think the class needs a nerf?
At least two cards on the OP's list appear out-of-place - the played win-rate of Spirit of the Frog is nearly -6%, while Magic Carpet is nearly -5%. Do they really need to be worse? There is a concept in CCGs regarding "the danger of cool things" - I suspect SotF and MC decks are trying their best to do something cool, while they would often be much better off simply playing cards that actually win them the game.
It also isn't helpful to simply delete problematic cards from the game - removing Twinspell from Conjurer's Calling seems a bit aggressive, to say the least. So does simply removing Omega from Omega Assembly.
i love each time ppl complain about conjurers calling. that card seemed busted since the day it was announced specially when we had a similar interaction with Cube. HOWEVER most ppl said the card wasnt good enough. i mean being able to run 4 cube like cards aint good. amateurs. designers and testers alike
New expansion will come before they can think about new nerf or buff.
Just enjoy the game.
Because there can never be perfect balance. There will always be some cards that are slightly better than others.
So if you continually target the strongest cards for nerfs, repeating the process over and over again, pretty soon we're all playing Vanillastone.
You acknowledge that there are three equally strong classes right now -- and a couple of others that are not too far behind -- well, that's actually a pretty healthy place for the meta to be. Compare this to the last few weeks of Rastakhan, or the Rogue-Warrior meta of a month ago. Those were unhealthy. This is not.
Sometimes it's best to enjoy what is in front of you rather than constantly fretting over perceived imperfections that aren't really that big a deal.
"Why, you never expected justice from a company, did you? They have neither a soul to lose nor a body to kick." -- Lady Saba Holland
Let’s nerf all the competitive decks in hearthstone with terribly calculated nerfs.
Paladin don't have hero card, don't have reliable mass removal (always need two cards), don't have a reliable, cheap single removal like execute or shield slam, don't have a stupid broken minion "I will solve all your problems" like Omega Devastator, etc...
The few things left for the class is cheap card draw and good mech sinergy, you want to kill that too? I will agree with you if this card exists before in murlock paladin or odd paladin but now is the only thing preventing the class become tier trash with priest.
Only class I think that deserve nerfs is Warrior.