Hearthpwn

Quote from FortyDust >>

Quote from agon_EU >>

The content is still an improvement from last "dungeon runs" but that's not the point of the discussion. AbusingKel said all the things that I wanted to say.

Regarding all the people saying "if you don't want it don't buy it" etc. etc. What you say is true but what I'm complaining about is that Blizzard's business model makes no sense at all. They are trying to sell something that was free before and I haven't seen anyone point this out, so I thought I'd share my opinion. As more and more people are essentially agreeing with me I think Blizzard really missed and opportunity with the Dalaran Heist and I hope they won't keep on doing this in future expansions. 

Adding a bartender and some hero powers is not new content, it's lazy design. Putting a price tag on this sad thing is even worse. 

 "Trying to sell something that was free before" is one of the most effective business models in existence, and one of the most common. Most consumers actually appreciate it.

Do you sneer at the old lady in the supermarket who is handing out free samples? Do you yell at the car salesman for not giving you the car for free after a test drive? How can anyone honestly find this practice upsetting?

"They are trying to sell something that was free before" is completely false, though. This product has never existed before. Similar products have existed in the past, and they were free. That doesn't mean Blizzard is obligated to give away all PvE content for free until the end of time.

This is a new product, and people at Blizzard put a lot of effort into it. Calling it "lazy design" is a massive, immature insult. They improved on a formula people had responded positively to in the past. That's not lazy; that's progress. And it's immature as hell for you to call it lazy while in the same breath complaining that you don't have it for free. If it's such a bed product, why do you seem to want it so much?

You think they "missed an opportunity" to get nothing from the development time and money they put into this? Really? Are you talking about an opportunity to attract more freeloaders to the game? That is the exact opposite of what Hearthstone needs.

On the contrary, this sets better expectation for new players -- you get a piece of the game for free, but if you want the full experience, you need to pay up. Just like regular Hearthstone.

 I cringed irl.

After finishing the two wings in normal and heroic I say that original the Dungeon run was a better gaming experience than these two wings combined. It was new and fresh at the time, free, and with a exciting difficulty curve. The DH has not enough variation, so after playing the Dungeon Run and Monster Hunt It just feel, what It is, another spin of the same. Also It is really easy (yes, heroic too), what is the interest of having more options where every one leads you to victory?

What's with all these poor people in this thread? 20$ is nothing..

Dear HS community,

Will you ever be happy with anything in life?

I gotta say there is virtually no challenge. I think the only time I lost was to armor elf because he got an incredible hand and I had no removal for his 12/12 shield eater. 

Definitely more fun than boring ladder climbs or warlock-infested Arena. 

Quote from AbusingKel >>

Quote from user-100399199 >>

What's with all these poor people in this thread? 20$ is nothing..

The affordability of the content has not been part of any argument in this thread. 

 A lot of people have been crying about paywall or whatever. 20$ isn't even much I spend ten times that much every day

Just because it was once one way doesn't mean it is locked into being that way forever.  A long time ago I bought Kerbal Space Program for less than $20.  Today at full price the game is nearly $50.  Isn't that bullshit?  

No, actually it's not.  The game has new features, it's growing, there's new content, and as a supporter of the game, I want to see it continue and I want to see the development team continue working on it.  

Instead of thinking, "We got it for free a couple times, therefore it should ALWAYS be free and they're just greedy assholes if they charge us even a single cent," maybe a better mindset is, "Sometimes we get free content, sometimes you have to pay for it, but it's enjoyable nonetheless and I support the continuation of the game."

it may be a bummer but you cant deny that they have done alot to make this fun, and there is alot of new stuff and alot of content. it is a shame about the rewards but we cant always get the best of both worlds

Imagine being so obtuse that you would feel the need to stand up to the oppressors so you can defend a multi-billion dollar company commonly employing predatory tactics to squeeze more bucks. But what can you do when all you have to do is look at this thread to see how well it works.

Don't like it, don't buy it, and how it will never stop being funny how these people fail to realize the hypocrisy in this philosophy. Don't like the negativity, don't read it. Or better yet, picture your own hobby getting closer to ruin with every passing year, since clearly Hearthstone isn't yours if you fail to understand how someone who committed thousands of hours and dollars to it might be offended at the thought of being seen as nothing more than a wallet, which this adventure makes abundantly clear. But I'm sure that's just entitlement.

The myth of amazing value for $20, and how it only works if we not only ignore what 20 dollars usually gets you in the context of video games in general, but also in the context of the very same game, with the adventures of three years ago giving you everything there was to give and the fanbase praising the model because of it, myself included. And now what you get is 15 packs that are already obsolete because as it turns out, when you go a full 2 months into the expansion you will find that everyone has crafted what they wanted already. In addition to that there's a barely usable and undisenchantable legendary, and a golden pack which ends in 300 dust most of the time. Funnily enough you'd be better off just buying the packs off the shop, since not only can you do so day one, but they'd also help fill your collection with rares and bring you closer to a guaranteed legendary, which many people seem to ignore for some reason when they keep bringing up 20 bucks for a legendary that's better than packs!

But you can just buy it with gold says the casual player, with little regard to how he's going to need that gold for the next expansion since most people save up during this time, and when even the 50 packs you'd get with gold aren't really enough for more than 2 meta decks, good luck trying to deal with just 20. Oh, unless, we buy the preorder! Finally it makes sense why some are calling this a scam. It takes advantage of people with poor foresight to leave them in a tight spot, with opening their wallet conveniently being the easiest solution to their predicament. It won't work with a lot of people, but as long as it works with a few then it is worth it, since it's all about the short-term profit.

Notice how I didn't say anything about the actual content so far. That's because I think it's good. It's just not good enough to glance over Actiblizz's eagerness to bend me over. Especially when there's so many people actually praising this and saying there is no problem whatsoever, which led to this entire rant in the first place. Something has to give, simple as that, especially since even what has 'given' in the past to soothe over people like me is not even given anymore.

I played it twice, have not had the will to play again. This is the fourth variation of literally the same concept. It gets old. Fast. I played the heck out of dr. Finished it like 27 times. Since then, each rehash is just less fun. I just dont enjoy it anymore. I dont even complain that its a cashgrab or something. It is just lazy design.

-The chapters all are the same. Just tiny variations. The did not even bother to have all bosses (except the last one) fit the theme. 

- The starting deck does not matter much in dr. Also designing 27 instead of 9 10 card starting decks is literally done in an hour.

- we could already choose playstyles in rumble run. The hero power is way less than that.

So what is the innovation here? The bartender encounters? Yes, but it does only affect the deckbuilding the whole 8 boss concept is still the same. Very much.

The innovation was probably on par with rumble run or whitchwood, both adjusted the formular a bit. 

All in all, I was expecting way more. Please stop rehashing dungeon run. We get it. 

Quote from Rando >>

Imagine being so obtuse that you would feel the need to stand up to the oppressors so you can defend a multi-billion dollar company commonly employing predatory tactics to squeeze more bucks. But what can you do when all you have to do is look at this thread to see how well it works.

Don't like it, don't buy it, and how it will never stop being funny how these people fail to realize the hypocrisy in this philosophy. Don't like the negativity, don't read it. Or better yet, picture your own hobby getting closer to ruin with every passing year, since clearly Hearthstone isn't yours if you fail to understand how someone who committed thousands of hours and dollars to it might be offended at the thought of being seen as nothing more than a wallet, which this adventure makes abundantly clear. But I'm sure that's just entitlement.

The myth of amazing value for $20, and how it only works if we not only ignore what 20 dollars usually gets you in the context of video games in general, but also in the context of the very same game, with the adventures of three years ago giving you everything there was to give and the fanbase praising the model because of it, myself included. And now what you get is 15 packs that are already obsolete because as it turns out, when you go a full 2 months into the expansion you will find that everyone has crafted what they wanted already. In addition to that there's a barely usable and undisenchantable legendary, and a golden pack which ends in 300 dust most of the time. Funnily enough you'd be better off just buying the packs off the shop, since not only can you do so day one, but they'd also help fill your collection with rares and bring you closer to a guaranteed legendary, which many people seem to ignore for some reason when they keep bringing up 20 bucks for a legendary that's better than packs!

But you can just buy it with gold says the casual player, with little regard to how he's going to need that gold for the next expansion since most people save up during this time, and when even the 50 packs you'd get with gold aren't really enough for more than 2 meta decks, good luck trying to deal with just 20. Oh, unless, we buy the preorder! Finally it makes sense why some are calling this a scam. It takes advantage of people with poor foresight to leave them in a tight spot, with opening their wallet conveniently being the easiest solution to their predicament. It won't work with a lot of people, but as long as it works with a few then it is worth it, since it's all about the short-term profit.

Notice how I didn't say anything about the actual content so far. That's because I think it's good. It's just not good enough to glance over Actiblizz's eagerness to bend me over. Especially when there's so many people actually praising this and saying there is no problem whatsoever, which led to this entire rant in the first place. Something has to give, simple as that, especially since even what has 'given' in the past to soothe over people like me is not even given anymore.

 Stop crying about this 20$. What's wrong with you? 

im really happy with the adventure its fun and exiting , i already did both in normal end heroic , i want both card backs and the legendary is fun not op but ok idk i think 20 bucks is ok 

Quote from user-100399199>>

 Stop crying about this 20$. What's wrong with you? 

If you have nothing to add to the discussion, why say anything at all? Only kindergartners argue with ad hominems so they can keep on feeling special in their own little bubble where no critical thinking is allowed. Hell, even more so when I already addressed the point you're trying to make with my second paragraph that you obviously didn't even bother to either read or understand my point of view of a long-time consumer, who used to spend money on this game but stopped and hoped things would get better. They didn't.

I presented my views, you either contest them or you shut your brain down and call me names. But I suppose I got my answer already didn't I.

Quote from Rando >>

The truth 

 This guy 100%. 

i actually found some of this pretty "lazy" as well, if you dont unlock the second chapters then the bosses of the first chapter are always the same in the same order and if you unlock the second chapter it just means that bosses from other chapters can show up in the chapter you're running, for example in the bank chapter, i ran in 3 times with rakanishu before deciding wether to get it or not, it was always banker lady first and pretty much every boss in the same order until i gave in and ulocked the prison, then ran the banks again and got Linxi as my first boss....i don't know about this but the fact that chapters are "incomplete" without buying the rest of the chapters does feel really money grabby.

also all the bosses are pretty much super forgetable flat characters and fights, in og dr i remember karl and george, all the final bosses, the guy that evolves critters, gruttmok and the giant murloc, in monster run i remember the gnomenapper, lord godfrey and the guy that uses king's bane, and as for rastakhan rumnble i remember every single character because they have pretty nice written personalities, voone, thekkal, and Malakrass are all about the audience and the flair. hooktusk is a sneak that likes cheating and sneaky people, Zentimo is that awkward guy that gives one word respones..yep, Zul'jin is the underdog and the crowd favorite  hell i even remember some bosses fron naxx and brm which i haven't touched in years. i've played, i've played a fair amount of time of heist yesterday and i only remember the banker lady with the "i can't be bothered attitude"

ON THE GOOD SIDE: all  of the playable characters have their own emotes, there are new really powerful treasures that you can enjoy, my first win of the second chapter was using Big shamman with elixir of Vim and the treasure that repalces your hero power with a Dk hero power, the bartender encounter that allows you to drastically alter cards from your deck or even remove them akin to the shop from slay the spire and other card game rogue likes like monster hunters is a massively welcome addition, the addition of heroic mode and the bucket balance which allows you to go in multiple directions because mosnter hunt and rumble run did pidgeonhole classes into a role as welll as the progression system that allows you to try different hero powers and starting decks.

Quote from AbusingKel >>

Quote from endlesstides >>

Quote from AbusingKel >>

Quote from Haussenfuss >>

Quote from Helweek >>

Man i constantly forget how many trolls are on this site. OP has an opinion, all the comments are in the camp of " you are wrong, your opinion is stupid, Here is  my clearly superior opinion expressing why you have no business having an opinion,". Like chill if the OP doesn't like it that's fine.

It's perfectly appropriate and acceptable to criticize vapid posts. It's also worthwhile recognizing that the OP wasn't simply "expressing his opinions," but intentionally misrepresenting the cost of the new adventure - nothing is "hidden behind a paywall" as he pretended.

You MUST pay for wings 2-5 to play it. How is that not a paywall? Whether it's in-game gold or IRL money, the content cannot be accessed without payment. 

 

Quote from Kermorvan >>

seriously i don't getting complains about content you don't need to buy to stay competitive, You know buying is not obligatory? blizzard will not ban you from the game if you don't want to spend money/gold on it. There are ZERO reasons to buy it apart of having fun.

1) you don't like solo content - don't buy it.

2) if you think solo content is not enough value for the price - don't buy it

3) you cant afford - don't buy it

4) you think golden packs and golden legendary are bait - don't buy it

5) any other reason you don't feel like buying it - you guessed right. Just don't buy it.

If you feel like playing it, can afford it, and think it is a lot of fun. Just go and buy it and enjoy.

I don't think there's been a single complaint in this thread that even tangentially mentions the desire to "stay competitive" but there are some that are unhappy with a previously free PvE content model now being a for-purchase-only content model. The cost of the game just went up $20 USD per expac in order to play PvE content that cost $ 0 USD in the last few sets. 

Hopefully that clears up what you don't understand about the complaints.

 

Let me put it this way, if you'd spent £16 ($20 whatever) on 15 card packs, then got a Golden Classic Pack, a Golden Legendary and this Adventure for free would you be complaining?

 Thats what it is. You don't have to buy it. 

I just want to play the dungeon run without paying for the garbage they've attached to it in order to bilk me of in-game gold or IRL money. Your comparison is completely irrelevant, as the only time I buy packs is pre-orders. I likely won't do that anymore, either. I'm pretty reasonable with my criticisms of the dev team. Cancelling new game modes indefinitely and then packaging up a tweaked version of previously free game content as something worthy of payment is bullshit. This is where I say no more. 

 

 Considering on their launcher they advertise this as the biggest thing ever, it's a letdown, it's a mis-mash of shit they've done and copied elements from better games like Slay the Spire.  All for the allure of lootboxes, instead of a stable of guaranteed cards.  

this is actually the best adventure so far to be honest, its the mean street adventure only better and that one was the best one so far.

the adventures between mean street and this one were pretty garbage though.

I agree that hearthstone is too expensive throughout all its possibilities u can spend money on in it, that said I would never spend gold on it, though I would suggest paying 12€ for the whole adventure even if it gets me less or even no packs at all is something I would prefer.

Totally ridiculous.  People buy card packs every day, the standard price for 15 packs is $20.  So now with the Dalaran Heist release if you buy 15 packs you get:  

- The 15 packs you paid for

 PLUS

- A FREE golden legendary 

- A FREE Hearthstone Adventure

- 2 FREE exclusive card backs

Still not sold..?  Fine, you win.  Wait until the sale is over and buy 15 packs (without the perks) like you normally would.  That’ll show ‘em.  

Quote from Tyrano12 >>

Totally ridiculous.  People buy card packs every day, the standard price for 15 packs is $20.  So now with the Dalaran Heist release if you buy 15 packs you get:  

- The 15 packs you paid for

 PLUS

- A FREE golden legendary 

- A FREE Hearthstone Adventure

- 2 FREE exclusive card backs

Still not sold..?  Fine, you win.  Wait until the sale is over and buy 15 packs (without the perks) like you normally would.  That’ll show ‘em.  

 DId you know we got free PvE content in the last expansions? How can you be eager to pay 20 bucks for the same thing we got for free in the past? Man, you must be a genious, because apparently you can see something that i'm missing! Congratulations :)

Quote from Legendarias >>

Quote from Tyrano12 >>

Totally ridiculous.  People buy card packs every day, the standard price for 15 packs is $20.  So now with the Dalaran Heist release if you buy 15 packs you get:  

- The 15 packs you paid for

 PLUS

- A FREE golden legendary 

- A FREE Hearthstone Adventure

- 2 FREE exclusive card backs

Still not sold..?  Fine, you win.  Wait until the sale is over and buy 15 packs (without the perks) like you normally would.  That’ll show ‘em.  

 DId you know we got free PvE content in the last expansions? How can you be eager to pay 20 bucks for the same thing we got for free in the past? Man, you must be a genious, because apparently you can see something that i'm missing! Congratulations :)

 Check out this guy with no appreciation to the free content we got....because making content is totally not time consuming for the developers. Heck it's just as easy as sitting on my ass and letting out some farts. *slow clap*