Sending Preparation to Hall of Fame would be the right thing to do. It wouldn't kill Rogue, but it would make it more difficult to pulling its shenanigans. And Raiding Party shouldn't give a weapon, 'cause it almost always leads to giving Rogue a free 3/3 taunt (sometimes two).
But rogue is fine you say? Let’s look at some facts.
-Rogue is by far the most played class on both ladder as well as HTC.
-Rogue is represented the most (15) at HTC.
-it has one of the highest winrates.
-Winrate >55% against 8/9 classes available.
-People are forced to play sleep warrior against it and even then a few tech cards makes it very favourable eg nomi, scheme
-it has the best tempo tools and combo is made easier and idiot proof with the introduction of 1 mana lackeys and discover a spell lackeys, doing combo’s without being good has never been easier in the whole history of hearthstone
-it has the best unconditional single target removal tool in the form of SAP
- A million bounce effect that reduces the minions cost by 2 as well making insane stuff possible
-Some classes maybe have 1viable deck, rogue has endless variations with a core of 25 cards that are amazing
Rogue is the biggest problem class there is with unfair advantage in tempo generation, card draw and value generation , yet the majority of the playerbase is willingly turning a blind eye towards it. This is not a new phenonemon as it existed during the era of deathstalker rexar as well, professional, hunter players thought rexar should be buffed to 5 mana instead of staying at 6 because the hero power and immediate effect was not good enough.
The only reason why tempo/aggro rogue is not a tier 1 deck with over 58% winrate is because of control warrior existing and yet the majority of the people are targeting the wrong class... is there a conspiracy going on here?
Anyway let’s talk about the busted rogue class which is represented the most in the upcoming hct as a nobrainer inclusion because it’s busted according to all the pro players.
Let’s see a list of possible rogue nerfs to test the waters include:
Preparation> change it to 1 mana.
Backstab > zap has 1 mana overload so change it to 1 mana or deal 1 damage
Raiding party > change it to 4 mana.
Sap> it’s a better execute, polymorph, shield slam without conditions, change to 4 mana.
Extra passive to hero power> Rogue always goes first, so they never get the coin.
SI agent > change it to 4 mana
Myra’s unstable element> let’s make it 7 mana, why not?
Evil miscreant > change it to 4 mana.
EdWin van cleef> make it 4 mana.
4 mana taunt pirate> change it to 5 mana
What else am I missing?
Tempo rogue is strong, but according to https://hsreplay.net/meta/ across all rank levels Token Druid, Mech Hunter, Bomb Warrior, Mech Paladin, Murloc Shaman, and Khadgar Mage have a similar win rate with Tempo rogue. A small nerf like changing Raiding Party to cost 4 mana would slow down the pace and even things out.
I can understand people being annoyed at the abundance of "nerf this" threads, but I honestly feel like this is the most reasonable one. Having to play certain types of decks to counter others is a normal part of the meta, but it is not healthy if the only counters to a deck is a specific class.
Maybe people will figure out how to counter Tempo Rogue with other classes and cause the meta to shift, but at the moment Tempo Rogue is looking like the most likely candidate for nerfs.
At least with all the other threads, the decks like Bomb Warrior and Token Druid have a clear variety of counters, but this seems like something that is reasonable to worry about to me:
Several pro players are all over Twitter complaining about Rogue, including Kibler and Zalae.
The class feels awful to play against. It is so strong it is holding back other classes from having a chance are being really competitive.
Over 25% of players at rank 1 and Legend play Rogue. And it's basically the same deck, over and over again.
Blizzard has nerfed cards or HOF'd them recently and the justification has been, "If a card is an auto-include in every deck for that class and it's from the classic set that is a problem." For example, Divine Favour (HOF), Flametongue Totem (nerf to 3 mana) etc.
Prep is the worst offender for Rogue, but there are plenty to choose from. Something needs to be done. The ladder is a Rogue fiesta with a second serving of control warrior. It's become frustrating and boring already.
Reminds me of when KOTFT came out and Druids were the only thing you'd see on the ladder. Remember Spreading Plague for 5 mana? How long did that last?
If they will implement nerfs, they will probably be completely different (both targets and changes) from the ones everyone would like to see. Just wait and see instead of raging between each other on nothing certain.
Yes indeed, they'd probably nerf the hero power to 3 mana or something crazy like that, or the poison weapon card.
The problem is tempo rogue is fun to play. You generate a few spells along the way, you bounce stuff, you sometimes trade, sometimes face, you create lackeys that generate random stuff. It's fairly simple but it's also fun and there is some element of doing odd little things during a game. I know there are some key plays which usually go the same way, but most of the other decks that give some sense of discovery during the game are basically boring control decks. I really wish there were more cool tempo decks.
So why you don´t use this thread to make some suggestions how to solve the "problem" with some techcards or maybe a good deck besides warrior? This would be better than always cry for nerfs.
First of all you need the mainproblems of the deck playing against it. So just write down what exactely the greatest problem is and try to find the best solution to it.
Seriously stop nerfing Rogue. It's already the most nerfed class in Hearthstone history. It's like a cycle: people complain about Rogue being weak -> Rogue gets busted cards -> People cry after a top tier Rogue deck emerges -> Core cards of that deck gets nerfed -> Said Rogue deck vanishes -> nobody remembers how busted Rogue was before and ask for better cards -> Repeat. Seriously?
When Tempo Rogue was top tier, people cried for shadowstep to be nerfed or HOFed. Quest Rogue was nerfed THRICE. Kingsbane Rogue vanished from the radar after Leeching Poison was nerfed. Mill Rogue was relegated to Wild only. It's like nobody wants Rogue to have a playable deck.
Blizzard devs state in most recent nerfs like the wild growth nerf that they rotate basic cards when they are so good that they become used in every deck of that class. I don't think a nerf is necessary; I just think some rogue cards that are used in every deck need to be rotated out of standard. For instance: Backstab and eviserate. I have never seen a rogue deck without double backstab and double eviserate since the beta of hearthstone. Some of these cards are too powerful when combo'd with new sets.
You obviously haven't met backspace rogue during Miracle Rogue's dominance.
#Rogueslivesmatter let the rogue live a little they were semi unplayable to quite some time, they finally have a chance to shine again, similar to when druid was dominate.
On a different note, maybe nerf Preparation, other than that.. Rogue is fine.
But rogue is fine you say? Let’s look at some facts.
-Rogue is by far the most played class on both ladder as well as HTC.
-Rogue is represented the most (15) at HTC.
-it has one of the highest winrates.
-Winrate >55% against 8/9 classes available.
-People are forced to play sleep warrior against it and even then a few tech cards makes it very favourable eg nomi, scheme
-it has the best tempo tools and combo is made easier and idiot proof with the introduction of 1 mana lackeys and discover a spell lackeys, doing combo’s without being good has never been easier in the whole history of hearthstone
-it has the best unconditional single target removal tool in the form of SAP
- A million bounce effect that reduces the minions cost by 2 as well making insane stuff possible
-Some classes maybe have 1viable deck, rogue has endless variations with a core of 25 cards that are amazing
Rogue is the biggest problem class there is with unfair advantage in tempo generation, card draw and value generation , yet the majority of the playerbase is willingly turning a blind eye towards it. This is not a new phenonemon as it existed during the era of deathstalker rexar as well, professional, hunter players thought rexar should be buffed to 5 mana instead of staying at 6 because the hero power and immediate effect was not good enough.
The only reason why tempo/aggro rogue is not a tier 1 deck with over 58% winrate is because of control warrior existing and yet the majority of the people are targeting the wrong class... is there a conspiracy going on here?
Anyway let’s talk about the busted rogue class which is represented the most in the upcoming hct as a nobrainer inclusion because it’s busted according to all the pro players.
Let’s see a list of possible rogue nerfs to test the waters include:
Preparation> change it to 1 mana.
Backstab > zap has 1 mana overload so change it to 1 mana or deal 1 damage
Raiding party > change it to 4 mana.
Sap> it’s a better execute, polymorph, shield slam without conditions, change to 4 mana.
Extra passive to hero power> Rogue always goes first, so they never get the coin.
SI agent > change it to 4 mana
Myra’s unstable element> let’s make it 7 mana, why not?
Evil miscreant > change it to 4 mana.
EdWin van cleef> make it 4 mana.
4 mana taunt pirate> change it to 5 mana
What else am I missing?
go play rogue and win then..wtf are you whining about nerfs for? Why dont we just take away all ability to mana cheat aka tempo from every class and eliminate all comeback mechanics aka value cards and just alternate turns playing a minion and then attacking. The game would be really FUCKING dumb then. Im so tired of the whining from people here that do not understand wtf they are talking about. if you cant win then you are not doing something right. there are hundreds of cards in the game. go look at them and put together something that works instead of complaining about an OP class with every damn expansion release. This shit gets REAL OLD.
Seriously stop nerfing Rogue. It's already the most nerfed class in Hearthstone history. It's like a cycle: people complain about Rogue being weak -> Rogue gets busted cards -> People cry after a top tier Rogue deck emerges -> Core cards of that deck gets nerfed -> Said Rogue deck vanishes -> nobody remembers how busted Rogue was before and ask for better cards -> Repeat. Seriously?
When Tempo Rogue was top tier, people cried for shadowstep to be nerfed or HOFed. Quest Rogue was nerfed THRICE. Kingsbane Rogue vanished from the radar after Leeching Poison was nerfed. Mill Rogue was relegated to Wild only. It's like nobody wants Rogue to have a playable deck.
because the majority of players have NO IDEA or comprehension of even how to play the game. All these people whining for nerfs show just how inept they are at the game in general. You dont even "win" anything in this game. I can't understand why people get so mad.
Can we nerf the players who plays Rouge? They never trade if there isn't a taunt in their way. Facestone
Nerf this, nerf that....
Another day in the life of Hearthstsone comunity!
Stop crying OP, my god
I lul'd at the title unsure about it being a joke or not.
Then I lul'd again reading the text.
People on hearthpwn are ridiculous sometimes.
Nobody is going to talk about shaman? cheating out big stuff? with hella lot of removal ? ok then
Sending Preparation to Hall of Fame would be the right thing to do. It wouldn't kill Rogue, but it would make it more difficult to pulling its shenanigans. And Raiding Party shouldn't give a weapon, 'cause it almost always leads to giving Rogue a free 3/3 taunt (sometimes two).
Tempo rogue is strong, but according to https://hsreplay.net/meta/ across all rank levels Token Druid, Mech Hunter, Bomb Warrior, Mech Paladin, Murloc Shaman, and Khadgar Mage have a similar win rate with Tempo rogue. A small nerf like changing Raiding Party to cost 4 mana would slow down the pace and even things out.
I can understand people being annoyed at the abundance of "nerf this" threads, but I honestly feel like this is the most reasonable one. Having to play certain types of decks to counter others is a normal part of the meta, but it is not healthy if the only counters to a deck is a specific class.
Maybe people will figure out how to counter Tempo Rogue with other classes and cause the meta to shift, but at the moment Tempo Rogue is looking like the most likely candidate for nerfs.
At least with all the other threads, the decks like Bomb Warrior and Token Druid have a clear variety of counters, but this seems like something that is reasonable to worry about to me:
Several pro players are all over Twitter complaining about Rogue, including Kibler and Zalae.
The class feels awful to play against. It is so strong it is holding back other classes from having a chance are being really competitive.
Over 25% of players at rank 1 and Legend play Rogue. And it's basically the same deck, over and over again.
Blizzard has nerfed cards or HOF'd them recently and the justification has been, "If a card is an auto-include in every deck for that class and it's from the classic set that is a problem." For example, Divine Favour (HOF), Flametongue Totem (nerf to 3 mana) etc.
Prep is the worst offender for Rogue, but there are plenty to choose from. Something needs to be done. The ladder is a Rogue fiesta with a second serving of control warrior. It's become frustrating and boring already.
Reminds me of when KOTFT came out and Druids were the only thing you'd see on the ladder. Remember Spreading Plague for 5 mana? How long did that last?
Yes indeed, they'd probably nerf the hero power to 3 mana or something crazy like that, or the poison weapon card.
Diablo + Dungeon Master = Dungeons of Castle Madness
The problem is tempo rogue is fun to play. You generate a few spells along the way, you bounce stuff, you sometimes trade, sometimes face, you create lackeys that generate random stuff. It's fairly simple but it's also fun and there is some element of doing odd little things during a game. I know there are some key plays which usually go the same way, but most of the other decks that give some sense of discovery during the game are basically boring control decks. I really wish there were more cool tempo decks.
No need for nerfs. A new expansion will be released in August which might solve the current problems. So let's all be patient.
So why you don´t use this thread to make some suggestions how to solve the "problem" with some techcards or maybe a good deck besides warrior? This would be better than always cry for nerfs.
First of all you need the mainproblems of the deck playing against it. So just write down what exactely the greatest problem is and try to find the best solution to it.
What about that?
Seriously stop nerfing Rogue. It's already the most nerfed class in Hearthstone history. It's like a cycle: people complain about Rogue being weak -> Rogue gets busted cards -> People cry after a top tier Rogue deck emerges -> Core cards of that deck gets nerfed -> Said Rogue deck vanishes -> nobody remembers how busted Rogue was before and ask for better cards -> Repeat. Seriously?
When Tempo Rogue was top tier, people cried for shadowstep to be nerfed or HOFed. Quest Rogue was nerfed THRICE. Kingsbane Rogue vanished from the radar after Leeching Poison was nerfed. Mill Rogue was relegated to Wild only. It's like nobody wants Rogue to have a playable deck.
Its hilarious. Since expac release we have had a CRY for nerfs on the most popular decks.
until the next week where (hold your breath) someone found a counter!
But then we need to nerf the counter, oh we used our brains and found a counter to that! Wesmart!
but oh no another counter, what will we ever do?
you get the idea right?
You obviously haven't met backspace rogue during Miracle Rogue's dominance.
#Rogueslivesmatter let the rogue live a little they were semi unplayable to quite some time, they finally have a chance to shine again, similar to when druid was dominate.
On a different note, maybe nerf Preparation, other than that.. Rogue is fine.
go play rogue and win then..wtf are you whining about nerfs for? Why dont we just take away all ability to mana cheat aka tempo from every class and eliminate all comeback mechanics aka value cards and just alternate turns playing a minion and then attacking. The game would be really FUCKING dumb then. Im so tired of the whining from people here that do not understand wtf they are talking about. if you cant win then you are not doing something right. there are hundreds of cards in the game. go look at them and put together something that works instead of complaining about an OP class with every damn expansion release. This shit gets REAL OLD.
because the majority of players have NO IDEA or comprehension of even how to play the game. All these people whining for nerfs show just how inept they are at the game in general. You dont even "win" anything in this game. I can't understand why people get so mad.
I think it would be good to Hall of Fame Preparation, but also lower the cost of Sprint to (6).
"Why, you never expected justice from a company, did you? They have neither a soul to lose nor a body to kick." -- Lady Saba Holland