Frost Lich Jaina is a personal choice of mine (i know you have yours). I do know some people, for some reason, hate this card because she can out value in late game. Although there are plenty of away to go around it... I think this card is the perfect control card for Mage. Im really going to miss this one...
Lich King is just... Lich King. He deserves a place on classic set. He is useful and can be clutch..
I agree with Lich King (although I don't think it's needed per say), but infinite value trains shouldn't be around forever. I hope we get more cool Elemental stuff since Elemental Mage has been one of my favourite decks this year, but Frost Lich Jaina had her time.
I could understand wantig the litchking. But it would be the best 8 drop. Kinda what happened to Rag. I think he had his time to shine in standard already.
For frostlitch Jaina. I would bet we are getting a new mage hero card next expansion.
Do you know why rag and sylvanas were hof? They were the stable legendary you could put in any deck no matter if aggro or control, well sylvanas maybe not to aggro but you know.
If you need a late game card you will 100% of the time pick lich king over any other card, same was with rag
TLDR: If he was put to classic he would be hof later
I actually think that The Lich King could stay in the classic set and take Ragnaros place, but they probably won't do that. DKs have to go, we had enough infinite value from them. Anyway, don't worry about control mage, every deck is losing a lot of cards, we just need to wait wait they'll get.
Lich king should have been in the classic set then hof just lime sykvanas and rag. So it makes sense for him to go. Kuch Jaina js just a big OMEGALUL right? She will be fine in reno mage. Wild exists too
If you want lich king and jania then go play wild I don’t want to see those cards anymore I wanna see new cards being used. So I won’t be signing that stupid petition.
As a Mage player, and Jaina fan, I have to disagree with both, and especialy Jaina.
On lich king: This guy has the same problem as Ragnaros, It's a powerful end of turn effect, with some big swings potential. It's strong, consistent, and yet still creates "coinflip" (or more like dicerolls in lich king's case) to create frustration. Worse, it doesn't enables more intresting decklists. It's just a huge taunt good guy you slap on any deck that will reach turn 8 - 10.
On Frost Lich Jaina, it's even worse. Most Death knights are terribly oppressive when facing non deathknight, and jaina is definitely one of the offender, if not the worse. You cannot beat that kind of infinite value without having some kind of infinite value on your own. that card is not healthy in a standard environnement. It's okay here because other death knight can compete with her.
I have won pratically 2000 games with Jaina on ranked. Ive used a lot more than that.
I know by a fact Jaina can be bothersome but not everytime. Far from it. And you should definie "opressive". A card that makes the opponent unable to play? A card that is basically an insta win? She is none of that. I know Mage's weaknesses and strenghts. Mage lost ice block, and for survivability she only has the Arcane elemental and lich Jaina herself.
The card itself also has counter ability play. I've won plenty against and lost using her. Obviously in a card game you will have the advantage in some games than others but thats is what it is. She is not opressive at all.
As sad as i am to see jaina go to wild (she's my favourite card ever printed and the single reason i'm going ti wild as well) i know keeping her in standard would only bring more hate towards that card from the idio....not so mentally gifted people that Say She gives infinite value,well Guess what:alongside the other DK's (exept maybe rexxar) She does not,Jade druid was/Is infinite NOT jaina/guldan and others...i Hope Anyone Who reads this Will understand why they're wrong
For lich king he would 99% share the same fate as rag
Answer that came to my mind after reading the title: FUCK NO.
Answer that I would write as a polite person on a forum: OH FUCK NO. Jokes aside: why? Those two cards are simply too good: they are auto-include in most of the decks and will limit the design space for future cards.
Let's make some real examples. Every time you are building a deck, you won't think "Is The Lich King good in this deck?" (the answer is obvious) but "Is this random 8 drop better than The Lich King?", and the answer would probably always be no. That's the fact: if LK stays, every future 8 drop (or even 7 and 9 drops) will always have to power creep him in order to be included in the decklist. We've just experienced a whole year of gaming suffering the effects of powercreep and autoinclude cards, so you can imagine the consequences. A similar situation happened with Ragnaros the Firelord too and look at what happened: they removed it from the Classic Set in order to let other cards be played.
For the regards of Frost Lich Jaina, the line is the same: she is an autoinclude in every mage deck and will prevent the class from having future powerful tools and won't let the designers print great Elementals. Moreover, as someone stated before me, she is an infinite value generator, which is one of the most toxic things that can exist in the game. You want to have the upper hand in the late game? Then fight for the last card: it's too easy to just sit back and ping minions that do all the work for you instead of using your brain.
Just because you like something, it doesn't mean things can't change: let the new come forth and let the old go away, for the sake of the game.
Nope. Great cards like these need to rotate out for the health of the game. It frees up space for *new* great cards. I don't know why that's hard to understand.
I think putting Frost Lich Jaina in the Classic Set would limit design space for new Mage cards to quite a severe degree. It would ruin other possible control Mage strategies, as people would just say "why not just use Frost Lich instead"?
The Lich King is obviously iconic in WoW lore, so I can see an argument for it's inclusion in the Classic Set. But again I think it would limit design space. Didn't Blizzard hall of fame Ragnaros the Firelord for the reason that it held players back from playing other 8-drops. It was just too strong a card at that mana point, that all other cards paled in comparison. I think TLK would have a similar effect.
In summary, no, these cards are too strong to have in an evergreen set.
Jaina has probably been my most beloved card for the past few xpacs, but I think it's time for it to go. One-card win conditions aren't great for the game, imo.
As for the TLK... having one card that dominates a mana slot is always kind of a bummer. There's a ton of cool stuff in the 8-hole right now and I'd love to see some more variety there. Cards like Da Undatakah, Hex Lord Malacrass, Splintergraft, and Princess Talanji could all have some interesting applications. Hopefully we don't get another auto-8 released and people experiment a bit.
Calling it a stupid petition just because you disagree just shows how low level of person you are but thats fine. Specially the reason you gave.
I need better reason that I don’t want to see jania or lich king back. I am pretty sure there are more people that want to see new cards and not the same ones over again. So yes I am calling it stupid petition. Deal with it.
Frost Lich Jaina is a personal choice of mine (i know you have yours). I do know some people, for some reason, hate this card because she can out value in late game. Although there are plenty of away to go around it... I think this card is the perfect control card for Mage. Im really going to miss this one...
Lich King is just... Lich King. He deserves a place on classic set. He is useful and can be clutch..
I agree with Lich King (although I don't think it's needed per say), but infinite value trains shouldn't be around forever. I hope we get more cool Elemental stuff since Elemental Mage has been one of my favourite decks this year, but Frost Lich Jaina had her time.
I could understand wantig the litchking. But it would be the best 8 drop. Kinda what happened to Rag. I think he had his time to shine in standard already.
For frostlitch Jaina. I would bet we are getting a new mage hero card next expansion.
Do you know why rag and sylvanas were hof? They were the stable legendary you could put in any deck no matter if aggro or control, well sylvanas maybe not to aggro but you know.
If you need a late game card you will 100% of the time pick lich king over any other card, same was with rag
TLDR: If he was put to classic he would be hof later
Me? Gongaga.
I actually think that The Lich King could stay in the classic set and take Ragnaros place, but they probably won't do that. DKs have to go, we had enough infinite value from them. Anyway, don't worry about control mage, every deck is losing a lot of cards, we just need to wait wait they'll get.
Lich king should have been in the classic set then hof just lime sykvanas and rag. So it makes sense for him to go. Kuch Jaina js just a big OMEGALUL right? She will be fine in reno mage. Wild exists too
If you want lich king and jania then go play wild I don’t want to see those cards anymore I wanna see new cards being used. So I won’t be signing that stupid petition.
As a Mage player, and Jaina fan, I have to disagree with both, and especialy Jaina.
On lich king: This guy has the same problem as Ragnaros, It's a powerful end of turn effect, with some big swings potential. It's strong, consistent, and yet still creates "coinflip" (or more like dicerolls in lich king's case) to create frustration. Worse, it doesn't enables more intresting decklists. It's just a huge taunt good guy you slap on any deck that will reach turn 8 - 10.
On Frost Lich Jaina, it's even worse. Most Death knights are terribly oppressive when facing non deathknight, and jaina is definitely one of the offender, if not the worse. You cannot beat that kind of infinite value without having some kind of infinite value on your own. that card is not healthy in a standard environnement. It's okay here because other death knight can compete with her.
No. Just no.
just play wild ( barnes smiles upon u :D ) and u wont miss it
I have won pratically 2000 games with Jaina on ranked. Ive used a lot more than that.
I know by a fact Jaina can be bothersome but not everytime. Far from it. And you should definie "opressive". A card that makes the opponent unable to play? A card that is basically an insta win? She is none of that. I know Mage's weaknesses and strenghts. Mage lost ice block, and for survivability she only has the Arcane elemental and lich Jaina herself.
The card itself also has counter ability play. I've won plenty against and lost using her. Obviously in a card game you will have the advantage in some games than others but thats is what it is. She is not opressive at all.
Calling it a stupid petition just because you disagree just shows how low level of person you are but thats fine. Specially the reason you gave.
No.
Obviously their powerlevel is far beyond what belongs to an evergreen card.
As sad as i am to see jaina go to wild (she's my favourite card ever printed and the single reason i'm going ti wild as well) i know keeping her in standard would only bring more hate towards that card from the idio....not so mentally gifted people that Say She gives infinite value,well Guess what:alongside the other DK's (exept maybe rexxar) She does not,Jade druid was/Is infinite NOT jaina/guldan and others...i Hope Anyone Who reads this Will understand why they're wrong
For lich king he would 99% share the same fate as rag
Answer that came to my mind after reading the title: FUCK NO.
Answer that I would write as a polite person on a forum: OH FUCK NO. Jokes aside: why? Those two cards are simply too good: they are auto-include in most of the decks and will limit the design space for future cards.
Let's make some real examples. Every time you are building a deck, you won't think "Is The Lich King good in this deck?" (the answer is obvious) but "Is this random 8 drop better than The Lich King?", and the answer would probably always be no. That's the fact: if LK stays, every future 8 drop (or even 7 and 9 drops) will always have to power creep him in order to be included in the decklist. We've just experienced a whole year of gaming suffering the effects of powercreep and autoinclude cards, so you can imagine the consequences. A similar situation happened with Ragnaros the Firelord too and look at what happened: they removed it from the Classic Set in order to let other cards be played.
For the regards of Frost Lich Jaina, the line is the same: she is an autoinclude in every mage deck and will prevent the class from having future powerful tools and won't let the designers print great Elementals. Moreover, as someone stated before me, she is an infinite value generator, which is one of the most toxic things that can exist in the game. You want to have the upper hand in the late game? Then fight for the last card: it's too easy to just sit back and ping minions that do all the work for you instead of using your brain.
Just because you like something, it doesn't mean things can't change: let the new come forth and let the old go away, for the sake of the game.
EDIT: corrected minor grammar mistake
Nope. Great cards like these need to rotate out for the health of the game. It frees up space for *new* great cards. I don't know why that's hard to understand.
"Everyone! Get in here!"
I think putting Frost Lich Jaina in the Classic Set would limit design space for new Mage cards to quite a severe degree. It would ruin other possible control Mage strategies, as people would just say "why not just use Frost Lich instead"?
The Lich King is obviously iconic in WoW lore, so I can see an argument for it's inclusion in the Classic Set. But again I think it would limit design space. Didn't Blizzard hall of fame Ragnaros the Firelord for the reason that it held players back from playing other 8-drops. It was just too strong a card at that mana point, that all other cards paled in comparison. I think TLK would have a similar effect.
In summary, no, these cards are too strong to have in an evergreen set.
Jaina has probably been my most beloved card for the past few xpacs, but I think it's time for it to go. One-card win conditions aren't great for the game, imo.
As for the TLK... having one card that dominates a mana slot is always kind of a bummer. There's a ton of cool stuff in the 8-hole right now and I'd love to see some more variety there. Cards like Da Undatakah, Hex Lord Malacrass, Splintergraft, and Princess Talanji could all have some interesting applications. Hopefully we don't get another auto-8 released and people experiment a bit.
I need better reason that I don’t want to see jania or lich king back. I am pretty sure there are more people that want to see new cards and not the same ones over again. So yes I am calling it stupid petition. Deal with it.
No way anyone is gonna support the mage DK sticking around. Good riddance.