We all know these decks where you are actually playing against a player doing his solitary game. He draws cards to get his combo, stalls the game to stay alive...gets his combo and gg. You just scramble to kill him before he gets his cards...no playful interaction with the opponent... just my opinion here: sad and boring. So why do many players still use them? Because they are efficient? Unlikely: Most of them are Tier 3 and Tier 4 decks...I think only Clone priest is Tier 2. You can climb the ladder with them but the win rates given tells you that the grinding is heavy with these decks. These combo players are resilient ones... my guess: they must spend a LOT of time playing.
So why do they still use them?
- For Fun? Possible, what can be boring for me could be fun for others.
- climbing the ladder? Certainly, but imagine the grind!!!
- Defensive players? It's just speculation here and I could be way off but lets try: Their style of game is not about confronting, winning with no clash seems to appeal to them. It's not a confrontation it's a race. And if you loose "it's because you did not get your cards in time...not because the opponent was better than you", that's something that the player's ego can take.
- Or maybe it's just about playing...not winning (baffles me but ok why not).
So combo players, what is it that is pushing you towards these decks considering the win rates?
Asking why anyone plays anything in this game is pretty dumb in my brutal opinion. It's an RNG fest in 7/10 games, and EVERY game is just 2 players racing for their specific win condition first.
So i guess you'll just never know and continue to be frustrated. /thread
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Hi i'm Tyler and I play hearthstone and watch anime.
Sometimes i make cards. I'd like to do that for a career one day if ever possible.
It's fun. Remember, Hearthstone is an online video game, not a maths test. If you want to climb, then use the best decks, but if you want to play for fun, then it's fine to go for something suboptimal. Besides, even if the winrate is low, remember that the statistics on HSreplay represent an average across all players. So maybe on average, the deck is total complete garbage, but if you get good enough at the deck, then you'll easily be able to climb ranks. Several people have reached legend with Mecha'thun Druid, but the statistics may tell you something else.
Statistics don't tell you everything. Neither do opinions. You may think combo decks are boring and uninteractive, I may feel the same way about control decks instead. What if I don't like watching a Warrior hit a button for 20 turns, then BM me as I die to fatigue? Or what if I don't like dying on turn 6 to a Rogue? Everyone has their tastes, it's just how humans work.
So combo players, what is it that is pushing you towards these decks considering the win rates?
We hate playing them. It's torture. The only reason we do is because, deep down, we wake up every morning thinking of how much we made your day horrible. That's the only thing that keeps our lives worth living.
Or...because people like playing the decks they play and like playing the game the way they play it.
Uh... because the players are human? And like to try different things? And each player have their own ways to enjoy the game? Why is there a need to ask this question? You even answered yourself in the post.
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JagBone's Wild Adventures! 3 Videos Per Week. Fun, wacky Wild decks and plays!
Over the last 3 days from rank 5 to legend we see the following individual deck win rates:
Mecha'thun Druid - 55.3%
Holy Wrath Paladin - 57.9%
Control Priest (some argue falls under combo) - 60.1%
Clone Priest (in case you don't count control priest) - 58.1%
Mecha'thun Warlock - 60.8%
Your premise regarding win rates is incorrect. Looking at the entire population's win rates with these decks is meaningless. Here are 5 decks that can clearly run the ladder to Legend at high win rates if they are piloted properly. I don't see it as particularly noteworthy that people like to play stuff that wins. The fact that the priest decks also have a particular affinity for putting hunter in the dirt probably contributes to their popularity.
As a side note, the constant insistence that combo decks are not "interactive" is simply untrue under the common usage of the term. Control and Combo decks are the most responsive to their opponent's play, and the way I know this is true is because most of them cannot win under almost any circumstance before turn 9-10 (frequently a while after that). If they did not frequently interact with their opponent's threats, they would die against a large portion of the meta.
The only possible exception to that rule is the Mecha'Druid, which has a tendency to gain a lot of armor as it cycles the deck and thus can sometimes ignore threats for multiple turns.
"Interactive" and "polarizing" are not, in fact, synonyms for the phrase "unenjoyable to lose against".
The deck which most notably lacked interactivity over the past year is undoubtedly aggro mage. You know this because the deck would frequently choose the same line of play regardless of what the opponent has on the board. Fortunately, this deck is rarely found on the ladder in the post-nerf wyrm era.
In any case, the decks you refer to are high level if played correctly. Obviously, the VAST majority of the player base doesn't pilot these decks . . or any decks, for that matter . . . properly, but that's true of every deck in every meta past, present, and future.
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Helpful Clarification on Forbidden Topics for Hearthstone Forums:
Enjoying Americans winning in the Olympics is forbidden because it is political. A 14 plus page discussion of state-sponsored lawsuits against a multi-national corporation based on harassment, discrimination, and wrongful death allegations is apparently not political enough to raise an issue.
Combo decks are probably the hardest form of deck to play, so the win rates average out badly. I've come 180 on them, I dislike pure control more than combo, which is not how I felt when I started playing. Having said that, I'm laddering with control priest at the moment, but it has aspects of a combo, control and midrange (my fave playstyle) deck, and is more vulnerable than something like control warrior or mage, which are purely for people who always want an answer to every board threat at any point in the game. I have respect for combo players now, as I see it's not as easy as it looks. I'm glad shudderwock and kingsbane are not prevalent any more though, as shudderwock was a cumulative combo that ignored the usual set up rules, and kingsbane has an infinite angle and I dislike anything like that. I'd rather play against a combo player than odd warrior.
Interesting reactions! Obviously, not surprised that some showed evident "signs" of the dunning-kruger effect. Just a few got it and gave me sensible responses and that's exactly what I was looking for so thanks.
Combo and control decks are generally quite difficult to pilot resulting in being extremely undervalued in stat-based tier lists like HSReplay and Vicious Syndicate because they use aggregate stats that include those from trash ranks. When piloted correctly, these decks should perform much better than advertised
Which decks specifically are you talking about? I'd say OTK paladin is easily a tier 1 deck if you throw out the stats from under legend. A lot of these should not be terrible for climbing and winning if you're proficient with them. Otherwise, why would we see so many of them in top level tournaments? When there's thousands or millions on the line, people don't screw around with bad decks
For the same reason why other people plays aggro/control/midrange...
I could ask the same question from you. Why are you running the same mindless metadeck, that has no creativity at all? Somebody built it, and everyone se is copying it, because it's strong... I prefer 'inventing' my own decks ( I play a lot of combo decks, but when I dont play combo, usually I play something else which is homebrew and fun ).
I don't understand why people hate combo decks... I always say on these threads, that this is, how the game was designed, there always was/is/will be combo decks, aggro decks, control decks and so on.
I still think OTK decks shouldn't exist - Combo decks is fine, but decks that can kill you in one turn no thanks.
Nothing feels worse than to get matched against an OTK deck and know it is an instant loss.
Atleast back in the days you could play priest and heal your way out of combo distance, but not anymore with all these insane and stupid otk decks. Blizzard must have been forced by Activision to make this horrible decision.
I still think OTK decks shouldn't exist - Combo decks is fine, but decks that can kill you in one turn no thanks.
Nothing feels worse than to get matched against an OTK deck and know it is an instant loss.
Atleast back in the days you could play priest and heal your way out of combo distance, but not anymore with all these insane and stupid otk decks. Blizzard must have been forced by Activision to make this horrible decision.
What do you mean 'back in the days' you are not an old player i can see.... :)) OTK decks ALWAYS existed... And actually all combo decks are and were OTK, or at least TTK.
I still think OTK decks shouldn't exist - Combo decks is fine, but decks that can kill you in one turn no thanks.
Nothing feels worse than to get matched against an OTK deck and know it is an instant loss.
Atleast back in the days you could play priest and heal your way out of combo distance, but not anymore with all these insane and stupid otk decks. Blizzard must have been forced by Activision to make this horrible decision.
What do you mean 'back in the days' you are not an old player i can see.... :)) OTK decks ALWAYS existed... And actually all combo decks are and were OTK, or at least TTK.
Maybe he only joined HSpwn after being a long time player. I can attest, there weren't any good OTKs around the times before and after patron warrior, up until WOG. It was viable to simply attrition out your opponent with warrior or priest and let fatigue deal the damage. Your only counter was Jaraxxus. Those were some good times, not that I'm salty about OTKs nowadays (if you can't beat them, join them ;)
That said, Activision LUL. We all hate Activision and for good reason but I don't think they give a crap about what decks we're playing as long as players keep paying up
We all know these decks where you are actually playing against a player doing his solitary game. He draws cards to get his combo, stalls the game to stay alive...gets his combo and gg. You just scramble to kill him before he gets his cards...no playful interaction with the opponent... just my opinion here: sad and boring. So why do many players still use them? Because they are efficient? Unlikely: Most of them are Tier 3 and Tier 4 decks...I think only Clone priest is Tier 2. You can climb the ladder with them but the win rates given tells you that the grinding is heavy with these decks. These combo players are resilient ones... my guess: they must spend a LOT of time playing.
So why do they still use them?
- For Fun? Possible, what can be boring for me could be fun for others.
- climbing the ladder? Certainly, but imagine the grind!!!
- Defensive players? It's just speculation here and I could be way off but lets try: Their style of game is not about confronting, winning with no clash seems to appeal to them. It's not a confrontation it's a race. And if you loose "it's because you did not get your cards in time...not because the opponent was better than you", that's something that the player's ego can take.
- Or maybe it's just about playing...not winning (baffles me but ok why not).
So combo players, what is it that is pushing you towards these decks considering the win rates?
Asking why anyone plays anything in this game is pretty dumb in my brutal opinion. It's an RNG fest in 7/10 games, and EVERY game is just 2 players racing for their specific win condition first.
So i guess you'll just never know and continue to be frustrated. /thread
Hi i'm Tyler and I play hearthstone and watch anime.
Sometimes i make cards. I'd like to do that for a career one day if ever possible.
Because they enjoy playing those decks? Just because you don't like playing them doesn't mean others don't as well.
Winning is not the only important thing in the game.
It's fun. Remember, Hearthstone is an online video game, not a maths test. If you want to climb, then use the best decks, but if you want to play for fun, then it's fine to go for something suboptimal. Besides, even if the winrate is low, remember that the statistics on HSreplay represent an average across all players. So maybe on average, the deck is total complete garbage, but if you get good enough at the deck, then you'll easily be able to climb ranks. Several people have reached legend with Mecha'thun Druid, but the statistics may tell you something else.
Statistics don't tell you everything. Neither do opinions. You may think combo decks are boring and uninteractive, I may feel the same way about control decks instead. What if I don't like watching a Warrior hit a button for 20 turns, then BM me as I die to fatigue? Or what if I don't like dying on turn 6 to a Rogue? Everyone has their tastes, it's just how humans work.
We hate playing them. It's torture. The only reason we do is because, deep down, we wake up every morning thinking of how much we made your day horrible. That's the only thing that keeps our lives worth living.
Or...because people like playing the decks they play and like playing the game the way they play it.
Choose whatever makes you feel better.
One does not simply walk into Mordor,
unless they want to be the best they can be.
Uh... because the players are human? And like to try different things? And each player have their own ways to enjoy the game? Why is there a need to ask this question? You even answered yourself in the post.
JagBone's Wild Adventures! 3 Videos Per Week. Fun, wacky Wild decks and plays!
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Over the last 3 days from rank 5 to legend we see the following individual deck win rates:
Mecha'thun Druid - 55.3%
Holy Wrath Paladin - 57.9%
Control Priest (some argue falls under combo) - 60.1%
Clone Priest (in case you don't count control priest) - 58.1%
Mecha'thun Warlock - 60.8%
Your premise regarding win rates is incorrect. Looking at the entire population's win rates with these decks is meaningless. Here are 5 decks that can clearly run the ladder to Legend at high win rates if they are piloted properly. I don't see it as particularly noteworthy that people like to play stuff that wins. The fact that the priest decks also have a particular affinity for putting hunter in the dirt probably contributes to their popularity.
As a side note, the constant insistence that combo decks are not "interactive" is simply untrue under the common usage of the term. Control and Combo decks are the most responsive to their opponent's play, and the way I know this is true is because most of them cannot win under almost any circumstance before turn 9-10 (frequently a while after that). If they did not frequently interact with their opponent's threats, they would die against a large portion of the meta.
The only possible exception to that rule is the Mecha'Druid, which has a tendency to gain a lot of armor as it cycles the deck and thus can sometimes ignore threats for multiple turns.
"Interactive" and "polarizing" are not, in fact, synonyms for the phrase "unenjoyable to lose against".
The deck which most notably lacked interactivity over the past year is undoubtedly aggro mage. You know this because the deck would frequently choose the same line of play regardless of what the opponent has on the board. Fortunately, this deck is rarely found on the ladder in the post-nerf wyrm era.
In any case, the decks you refer to are high level if played correctly. Obviously, the VAST majority of the player base doesn't pilot these decks . . or any decks, for that matter . . . properly, but that's true of every deck in every meta past, present, and future.
Helpful Clarification on Forbidden Topics for Hearthstone Forums:
Enjoying Americans winning in the Olympics is forbidden because it is political. A 14 plus page discussion of state-sponsored lawsuits against a multi-national corporation based on harassment, discrimination, and wrongful death allegations is apparently not political enough to raise an issue.
You made a thread because you aren't a Johnny?
Free to try and find a game, dealing cards for sorrow, cards for pain.
So... you don't like combo decks and want to know why people like something you don't? What a silly thread.
If he's not Ajani, does that make him Gideon?
Combo decks are probably the hardest form of deck to play, so the win rates average out badly. I've come 180 on them, I dislike pure control more than combo, which is not how I felt when I started playing. Having said that, I'm laddering with control priest at the moment, but it has aspects of a combo, control and midrange (my fave playstyle) deck, and is more vulnerable than something like control warrior or mage, which are purely for people who always want an answer to every board threat at any point in the game. I have respect for combo players now, as I see it's not as easy as it looks. I'm glad shudderwock and kingsbane are not prevalent any more though, as shudderwock was a cumulative combo that ignored the usual set up rules, and kingsbane has an infinite angle and I dislike anything like that. I'd rather play against a combo player than odd warrior.
Interesting reactions! Obviously, not surprised that some showed evident "signs" of the dunning-kruger effect. Just a few got it and gave me sensible responses and that's exactly what I was looking for so thanks.
Combo and control decks are generally quite difficult to pilot resulting in being extremely undervalued in stat-based tier lists like HSReplay and Vicious Syndicate because they use aggregate stats that include those from trash ranks. When piloted correctly, these decks should perform much better than advertised
Which decks specifically are you talking about? I'd say OTK paladin is easily a tier 1 deck if you throw out the stats from under legend. A lot of these should not be terrible for climbing and winning if you're proficient with them. Otherwise, why would we see so many of them in top level tournaments? When there's thousands or millions on the line, people don't screw around with bad decks
Legend with : S65 Freeze Mage, S57 Maly Gonk Druid, S57 "Okay" Shaman, S53 Boom-zooka Hunter, S53 Maly Tog Druid, S52 Wild Tog Druid ft.Blingtron, S50 Quest Rogue, S49 Dead Man's Warrior, S41 Wild Clown Fiesta Druid, S41 Hadronox Jade Druid, S40 Wild OTK Dragon Druid, S35 SMOrc Shaman, S33 Jade Druid, S22 Control Priest, S19 Control Priest
For the same reason why other people plays aggro/control/midrange...
I could ask the same question from you. Why are you running the same mindless metadeck, that has no creativity at all? Somebody built it, and everyone se is copying it, because it's strong... I prefer 'inventing' my own decks ( I play a lot of combo decks, but when I dont play combo, usually I play something else which is homebrew and fun ).
I don't understand why people hate combo decks... I always say on these threads, that this is, how the game was designed, there always was/is/will be combo decks, aggro decks, control decks and so on.
I still think OTK decks shouldn't exist - Combo decks is fine, but decks that can kill you in one turn no thanks.
Nothing feels worse than to get matched against an OTK deck and know it is an instant loss.
Atleast back in the days you could play priest and heal your way out of combo distance, but not anymore with all these insane and stupid otk decks.
Blizzard must have been forced by Activision to make this horrible decision.
What do you mean 'back in the days' you are not an old player i can see.... :)) OTK decks ALWAYS existed... And actually all combo decks are and were OTK, or at least TTK.
I enjoy it, because it is like playing control, but with a different win condition than fatigue.
Maybe he only joined HSpwn after being a long time player. I can attest, there weren't any good OTKs around the times before and after patron warrior, up until WOG. It was viable to simply attrition out your opponent with warrior or priest and let fatigue deal the damage. Your only counter was Jaraxxus. Those were some good times, not that I'm salty about OTKs nowadays (if you can't beat them, join them ;)
That said, Activision LUL. We all hate Activision and for good reason but I don't think they give a crap about what decks we're playing as long as players keep paying up
Legend with : S65 Freeze Mage, S57 Maly Gonk Druid, S57 "Okay" Shaman, S53 Boom-zooka Hunter, S53 Maly Tog Druid, S52 Wild Tog Druid ft.Blingtron, S50 Quest Rogue, S49 Dead Man's Warrior, S41 Wild Clown Fiesta Druid, S41 Hadronox Jade Druid, S40 Wild OTK Dragon Druid, S35 SMOrc Shaman, S33 Jade Druid, S22 Control Priest, S19 Control Priest
I play Toggwaggle warrior cause Im different :)
Average winrates are not necessarily the winrate of a specific player. And this is particularly true for convoluted decks.
Good players can climb with t3 decks, and very good players can do so with t4 as well.
And if they prefer those decks, why not?
Ie. There's people playing Malygos Druid through legend.