OP I could not disagree with you more. You know nothing. I, as well as many others, anxiously await the Dks, the spellstones, and the weapons being chucked from the meta like the garbage they are. Also, screw druid, hope they enjoy trash tier for a long long time.
OP I could not disagree with you more. You know nothing. I, as well as many others, anxiously await the Dks, the spellstones, and the weapons being checked from the meta like the garbage they are.
won't constructed be boring unless the next expac is insane though? I mean all the best cards are going to wild.
I think it will push the envelope in terms of deck building and allow for some of the lesser decks to shine a bit... I think how standard is in the next few month entirely hinges on the next expac though and whether it will finally tie together some of those archetypes that completely suck from a competitive stand point in the current meta state.
for some reason I just can't see one expac suddenly making all the niche rogue decks reliable enough to compete. It's a shame though man as we had the opportunity for some really awesome and original decks last year and we simply do not have the support cards to make them work regularly enough to be competitive.
I mean really I can say I'm into doing fun things more than winning all I want, but it sucks to loose every single game with a deck because the concept is simply just not nourished enough by a decent roster of supporting cards.
pogo, tesspionage, deathrattle rogue. all 3 have amazing potential but simply just break if they don't draw an exact sequence of cards.
not to say these decks don't work and can't be piloted at high level. just across the board they have abysmal winrates. (granted sometimes that comes down to the skill level of the base players a lot of the time.. not everyone can play like dog or J. alexander with the rogue class.... seriously though my estimations of dog have soared recently after watching him play his spell power rogue decks)
OP I could not disagree with you more. You know nothing. I, as well as many others, anxiously await the Dks, the spellstones, and the weapons being chucked from the meta like the garbage they are. Also, screw druid, hope they enjoy trash tier for a long long time.
alright saltlord,in case you didn't notice this is supposed to be a discussion,you can disagree with my points but you have to make some yourself if you want to be taken seriously and not just whine because strong cards are too much for you to handle
DK Jaina is not only very strong it is also stupidly unfair vs weapon classes, while there are already a lot of ways to counter weapons. The oozes are already borderline unfair. Harrison Jones is a thing. Water elemental is a 4 mana 3/6 that freeze characters that is borderline op.
OP I could not disagree with you more. You know nothing. I, as well as many others, anxiously await the Dks, the spellstones, and the weapons being chucked from the meta like the garbage they are. Also, screw druid, hope they enjoy trash tier for a long long time.
alright saltlord,in case you didn't notice this is supposed to be a discussion,you can disagree with my points but you have to make some yourself if you want to be taken seriously and not just whine because strong cards are too much for you to handle
Requiring everyone to agree with you hardly constitutes a discussion. I made my point - unbalanced cards ruin the game. I'm glad RR has a lower power level, I think deathknights, spellstones , and legendary weapons are garbage cards and it will be just awesome when they cycle. I hope they never print crap like that again and you haven't a clue what you are talking about. Cheers!
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Free to try and find a game, dealing cards for sorrow, cards for pain.
Op I totally agree with you, all the dks and hero cards except stupid rexxar are great and enabled arctypes like controllock, control mage, otk pala and so on.
My guess is that just a lot of players enjoy smorcing and are really pissed of when one card destroys their game plan and basically ends the game on the spot for them or at least makes it last much longer. Which I kind of understand, but at the same time - fuck em. Aggro will always be a thing in hs while I feel like we will lose a lot of control- and combodecks after the rotation.
DK Jaina is not only very strong it is also stupidly unfair vs weapon classes, while there are already a lot of ways to counter weapons. The oozes are already borderline unfair. Harrison Jones is a thing. Water elemental is a 4 mana 3/6 that freeze characters that is borderline op.
I completely agree with you: Water Elemental perfectly represents the DK Frost Lich flavor, however, some classes have natural unfavorable matchup because of this
My issue with Deathknights is that, especially these 3, your deck depends on them so much, too much sometimes. In mirrors, against aggro, against other value decks. How many times you guys did everything fine, but still lost a mirror, cause your opponent got their Jaina, Gul'dan or Rexxar on their respective turn, and yours were hiding in the deck? How many times you practically threw the mirror, but still won, cause you got your DK, and your opponent is punching the keyboard or something? Same goes for Uther, but more recently I guess.
See, if your deck depends on finding like 6 or 7 cards, we call them a combo, and they can be pain in the ass every now and then. But most decks playing these DK's depend on them, and almost only them. And this is not fair. Like, other cards are only there to support them. You just try to get to Gul'dan safe and sound, he does the rest.
Hadronox is different, it requires more cards to work, like Naturalize, Cube, Witching Hour and etc. And it is finite value. Jaina and Rexxar are practically infinite. Gul'dan is a bit more tame compared to these guys.
DK's were well designed cards, with all the balance they lack, they were cool, and fun. But I think it is enough them we relied on them, therefore I can't wait for the rotation.
OP I could not disagree with you more. You know nothing. I, as well as many others, anxiously await the Dks, the spellstones, and the weapons being chucked from the meta like the garbage they are. Also, screw druid, hope they enjoy trash tier for a long long time.
alright saltlord,in case you didn't notice this is supposed to be a discussion,you can disagree with my points but you have to make some yourself if you want to be taken seriously and not just whine because strong cards are too much for you to handle
Requiring everyone to agree with you hardly constitutes a discussion. I made my point - unbalanced cards ruin the game. I'm glad RR has a lower power level, I think deathknights, spellstones , and legendary weapons are garbage cards and it will be just awesome when they cycle. I hope they never print crap like that again and you haven't a clue what you are talking about. Cheers!
I said you Can (and should,if you have a differenti opinion) disagree with what i say,but you have to bring reasons for that,or if you don't want to you Need to shut up,this Is a discussion not a salt thread
My issue with Deathknights is that, especially these 3, your deck depends on them so much, too much sometimes. In mirrors, against aggro, against other value decks. How many times you guys did everything fine, but still lost a mirror, cause your opponent got their Jaina, Gul'dan or Rexxar on their respective turn, and yours were hiding in the deck? How many times you practically threw the mirror, but still won, cause you got your DK, and your opponent is punching the keyboard or something? Same goes for Uther, but more recently I guess.
See, if your deck depends on finding like 6 or 7 cards, we call them a combo, and they can be pain in the ass every now and then. But most decks playing these DK's depend on them, and almost only them. And this is not fair. Like, other cards are only there to support them. You just try to get to Gul'dan safe and sound, he does the rest.
Hadronox is different, it requires more cards to work, like Naturalize, Cube, Witching Hour and etc. And it is finite value. Jaina and Rexxar are practically infinite. Gul'dan is a bit more tame compared to these guys.
DK's were well designed cards, with all the balance they lack, they were cool, and fun. But I think it is enough them we relied on them, therefore I can't wait for the rotation.
Aside from the fact that jaina Is NOT infinite value,like at All,you do have a point,still the things you said Can Be applied to every single game of Hearthstone ever,Just instead of relying on a DK imagine you really really Need that last boardwipe to Survive vs an aggro or you can't find your keleseth and you opponent has coin, keleseth,shadowstep keleseth,same goes for every tech card you put in your deck for a specific matchup, you Need to draw it (i made the example of skulking geist vs Jade druid as an Extreme but i Hope you see what i mean)
Those are factors that are frustrating but are not linked to DKs and High Powerlevel cards but instead it's because heartstone Is a card game and as such you Can get rekt by rng at any time
You know the funniest thing about deathstalker Rex being so powerful? He was kinda trash on release because when kobolds dropped everyone realized he only picked beasts from a preselected pool of pre-KC beasts. None of the new stuff.
Everyone complained so they updated it so he couldn't get any beasts over 5 Mana but now every time a new Beast comes out he can grab it, and now everyone's all like "INFINITE VALUE!!!! SO UNFAAAIIIRRR!!!" almost like they knew that lol. Just a thought.
Anyways they leave standard in 3 months and wild is meant to be busted and unfun so I guess *shrugs*
DK Jaina is not only very strong it is also stupidly unfair vs weapon classes, while there are already a lot of ways to counter weapons. The oozes are already borderline unfair. Harrison Jones is a thing. Water elemental is a 4 mana 3/6 that freeze characters that is borderline op.
I completely agree with you: Water Elemental perfectly represents the DK Frost Lich flavor, however, some classes have natural unfavorable matchup because of this
Every class needs to have an unfavorable match-up...
The goal isn't to make it so that every class has neutral or favorable match-ups.
I played against a mage a few weeks ago, and milled his DK. He conceded on the spot, that was his plan. Kill everything in sight and play Jaina. It's pretty lame if you think about it.
I understand your point about people being a bit whiny and complaining just because they personally don't like something and hope that blizzard nerfs it so they don't have to play against it. However, the fact that any card, slow or not, can potentially win you games by itself because its so outright powerful, and requires little to no build around is pretty awful design in general. The thing about games is they need to be fun, if there are cards or mechanics that make the game unfun, especially if it does so dramatically, like Jades in their heyday, it generally causes frustrated players to leave the game. Yes, some of these cards can be beaten or outvalued if you tech or just get lucky, but having to fight and claw for multiple turns to maybe eek out a win some small % of the time isn't fun. Cards that just directly wreck/ruin something also generally aren't the fun for players who like a deck. Reducing fun is a bad thing because when people stop having fun they stop playing. If that happens enough then the game dies. Extremely powerful cards that have actually ended up nerfed by blizzard are proof of this. They simply made the game unfun more often than they made it fun.
I think in general DK lean toward this, much like Dr. Boom before it rotated out. It was a card that wasn't strictly broken, but being able to play it on curve, and then also having good boombot RNG would make you feel great/terrible based on which side of the table you were on. The card never got nerfed, and might not even be that insane in the current standard, but it was a card that was often times very polarizing, and led to a lot of outcry and debate. And its also frustrating when you like a class with a bad DK. You feel a bit cheated by the fact that your class doesn't have one of these very strong game winning cards. I do think in general there is a bit too much crying, but that is also because Blizzard can and has nerfed cards, something most paper card games can't do, so they either have to ban the card or print answers to it.
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To crush your enemies, to see them driven before you, and to hear the lamentations of the women.
I dislike people that hate on Rexxar DK - it is literally the only card that got me into hunter - before that it was just aggro, face, midrange and undertaker hunter that existed. It allowed control players like me to finally have a somewhat reliable control hunter deck.
Anyway the Dks is fine and is rotating soon so no need to change them. What Blizzard should be fixing is all these OTK deck that kills you from 30hp in 1 turn - so fun and interactive.
The HS community is pretty disengaged from the game. For the most part, the people who post on the subreddit and this site are casual folks who aren't particularly interested in understanding the game - it's just a fun past-time, so when anything happens to the game that isn't "fun" a lot of them shit themselves up and rage-post all their feelings. The subreddit isn't exactly a place for high-level analysis of the game - instead of being the HSdojo.com, it's basically just a place where folks either post dopey screen-shots, or attempt to process their emotions by bitching about the game. This site is quite similar . . . indeed, there really aren't many HS content providers which regularly produce in-depth strategy articles more complex than a point-form "how-to-play" deck-guide, since there simply isn't any demand from the community for much else.
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OP I could not disagree with you more. You know nothing. I, as well as many others, anxiously await the Dks, the spellstones, and the weapons being chucked from the meta like the garbage they are. Also, screw druid, hope they enjoy trash tier for a long long time.
Free to try and find a game, dealing cards for sorrow, cards for pain.
won't constructed be boring unless the next expac is insane though? I mean all the best cards are going to wild.
I think it will push the envelope in terms of deck building and allow for some of the lesser decks to shine a bit... I think how standard is in the next few month entirely hinges on the next expac though and whether it will finally tie together some of those archetypes that completely suck from a competitive stand point in the current meta state.
for some reason I just can't see one expac suddenly making all the niche rogue decks reliable enough to compete. It's a shame though man as we had the opportunity for some really awesome and original decks last year and we simply do not have the support cards to make them work regularly enough to be competitive.
I mean really I can say I'm into doing fun things more than winning all I want, but it sucks to loose every single game with a deck because the concept is simply just not nourished enough by a decent roster of supporting cards.
pogo, tesspionage, deathrattle rogue. all 3 have amazing potential but simply just break if they don't draw an exact sequence of cards.
not to say these decks don't work and can't be piloted at high level. just across the board they have abysmal winrates. (granted sometimes that comes down to the skill level of the base players a lot of the time.. not everyone can play like dog or J. alexander with the rogue class.... seriously though my estimations of dog have soared recently after watching him play his spell power rogue decks)
You're suggesting bad beasts arent printed....that do 5 dmg to yourself tortoise for example...
Fun > Meta
alright saltlord,in case you didn't notice this is supposed to be a discussion,you can disagree with my points but you have to make some yourself if you want to be taken seriously and not just whine because strong cards are too much for you to handle
Yeah but in that case you just don't choose that Beast
DK Jaina is not only very strong it is also stupidly unfair vs weapon classes, while there are already a lot of ways to counter weapons. The oozes are already borderline unfair. Harrison Jones is a thing. Water elemental is a 4 mana 3/6 that freeze characters that is borderline op.
Requiring everyone to agree with you hardly constitutes a discussion. I made my point - unbalanced cards ruin the game. I'm glad RR has a lower power level, I think deathknights, spellstones , and legendary weapons are garbage cards and it will be just awesome when they cycle. I hope they never print crap like that again and you haven't a clue what you are talking about. Cheers!
Free to try and find a game, dealing cards for sorrow, cards for pain.
Op I totally agree with you, all the dks and hero cards except stupid rexxar are great and enabled arctypes like controllock, control mage, otk pala and so on.
My guess is that just a lot of players enjoy smorcing and are really pissed of when one card destroys their game plan and basically ends the game on the spot for them or at least makes it last much longer. Which I kind of understand, but at the same time - fuck em. Aggro will always be a thing in hs while I feel like we will lose a lot of control- and combodecks after the rotation.
I completely agree with you: Water Elemental perfectly represents the DK Frost Lich flavor, however, some classes have natural unfavorable matchup because of this
My issue with Deathknights is that, especially these 3, your deck depends on them so much, too much sometimes. In mirrors, against aggro, against other value decks. How many times you guys did everything fine, but still lost a mirror, cause your opponent got their Jaina, Gul'dan or Rexxar on their respective turn, and yours were hiding in the deck? How many times you practically threw the mirror, but still won, cause you got your DK, and your opponent is punching the keyboard or something? Same goes for Uther, but more recently I guess.
See, if your deck depends on finding like 6 or 7 cards, we call them a combo, and they can be pain in the ass every now and then. But most decks playing these DK's depend on them, and almost only them. And this is not fair. Like, other cards are only there to support them. You just try to get to Gul'dan safe and sound, he does the rest.
Hadronox is different, it requires more cards to work, like Naturalize, Cube, Witching Hour and etc. And it is finite value. Jaina and Rexxar are practically infinite. Gul'dan is a bit more tame compared to these guys.
DK's were well designed cards, with all the balance they lack, they were cool, and fun. But I think it is enough them we relied on them, therefore I can't wait for the rotation.
I said you Can (and should,if you have a differenti opinion) disagree with what i say,but you have to bring reasons for that,or if you don't want to you Need to shut up,this Is a discussion not a salt thread
Aside from the fact that jaina Is NOT infinite value,like at All,you do have a point,still the things you said Can Be applied to every single game of Hearthstone ever,Just instead of relying on a DK imagine you really really Need that last boardwipe to Survive vs an aggro or you can't find your keleseth and you opponent has coin, keleseth,shadowstep keleseth,same goes for every tech card you put in your deck for a specific matchup, you Need to draw it (i made the example of skulking geist vs Jade druid as an Extreme but i Hope you see what i mean)
Those are factors that are frustrating but are not linked to DKs and High Powerlevel cards but instead it's because heartstone Is a card game and as such you Can get rekt by rng at any time
You know the funniest thing about deathstalker Rex being so powerful? He was kinda trash on release because when kobolds dropped everyone realized he only picked beasts from a preselected pool of pre-KC beasts. None of the new stuff.
Everyone complained so they updated it so he couldn't get any beasts over 5 Mana but now every time a new Beast comes out he can grab it, and now everyone's all like "INFINITE VALUE!!!! SO UNFAAAIIIRRR!!!" almost like they knew that lol. Just a thought.
Anyways they leave standard in 3 months and wild is meant to be busted and unfun so I guess *shrugs*
Hi i'm Tyler and I play hearthstone and watch anime.
Sometimes i make cards. I'd like to do that for a career one day if ever possible.
RIP Druid ? You are drunk?
Every class needs to have an unfavorable match-up...
The goal isn't to make it so that every class has neutral or favorable match-ups.
It was kinda ment to be a joke,calm down
I played against a mage a few weeks ago, and milled his DK. He conceded on the spot, that was his plan. Kill everything in sight and play Jaina. It's pretty lame if you think about it.
I understand your point about people being a bit whiny and complaining just because they personally don't like something and hope that blizzard nerfs it so they don't have to play against it. However, the fact that any card, slow or not, can potentially win you games by itself because its so outright powerful, and requires little to no build around is pretty awful design in general. The thing about games is they need to be fun, if there are cards or mechanics that make the game unfun, especially if it does so dramatically, like Jades in their heyday, it generally causes frustrated players to leave the game. Yes, some of these cards can be beaten or outvalued if you tech or just get lucky, but having to fight and claw for multiple turns to maybe eek out a win some small % of the time isn't fun. Cards that just directly wreck/ruin something also generally aren't the fun for players who like a deck. Reducing fun is a bad thing because when people stop having fun they stop playing. If that happens enough then the game dies. Extremely powerful cards that have actually ended up nerfed by blizzard are proof of this. They simply made the game unfun more often than they made it fun.
I think in general DK lean toward this, much like Dr. Boom before it rotated out. It was a card that wasn't strictly broken, but being able to play it on curve, and then also having good boombot RNG would make you feel great/terrible based on which side of the table you were on. The card never got nerfed, and might not even be that insane in the current standard, but it was a card that was often times very polarizing, and led to a lot of outcry and debate. And its also frustrating when you like a class with a bad DK. You feel a bit cheated by the fact that your class doesn't have one of these very strong game winning cards. I do think in general there is a bit too much crying, but that is also because Blizzard can and has nerfed cards, something most paper card games can't do, so they either have to ban the card or print answers to it.
To crush your enemies, to see them driven before you, and to hear the lamentations of the women.
I dislike people that hate on Rexxar DK - it is literally the only card that got me into hunter - before that it was just aggro, face, midrange and undertaker hunter that existed. It allowed control players like me to finally have a somewhat reliable control hunter deck.
Anyway the Dks is fine and is rotating soon so no need to change them. What Blizzard should be fixing is all these OTK deck that kills you from 30hp in 1 turn - so fun and interactive.
The HS community is pretty disengaged from the game. For the most part, the people who post on the subreddit and this site are casual folks who aren't particularly interested in understanding the game - it's just a fun past-time, so when anything happens to the game that isn't "fun" a lot of them shit themselves up and rage-post all their feelings. The subreddit isn't exactly a place for high-level analysis of the game - instead of being the HSdojo.com, it's basically just a place where folks either post dopey screen-shots, or attempt to process their emotions by bitching about the game. This site is quite similar . . . indeed, there really aren't many HS content providers which regularly produce in-depth strategy articles more complex than a point-form "how-to-play" deck-guide, since there simply isn't any demand from the community for much else.