One of the most frustrating things that can happen on these kinds of forums is to come here to discuss a problem or potential problem with a card or mechanic, only to get bombarded with comments defending to the death the thing you're criticising. A good example would be Naga Sea Witch. When it was running rampant on wild, I posted a thread showing a screenshot of a turn 5 where a Warlock had a full board of 8/8s and Malganys or something along the line and people responded how it was not a problem and went as far to start insulting my Shaman deck and how bad it was. Then of course the nerfs came in and those people were nowhere to be seen. More recent one would be the rumble run. Yes, a lot of people agreed that it was bad but if you made a thread about it, the first comments would always be stuff like "Well I enjoyed it and it was just challenging enough" even though everyone knows that rumble run was not challenging in a good way, it was an rngfest where some matchups you already lost because of the totem matchups, or if you can't remove their totem turn 1. Now Rumble Run got a supposed fix as well, I haven't tried it yet.
As you can see, there is a clear pattern emerging, community asks for a nerf, only to get loyalists responding with stuff like "the card is fine" or "Why don't we nerf everything then". This is a very frustrating occurrence and from experience, I can say that it makes one not want to post anything or be active, which of course would create the cycle of only fanboys being active and no problem getting adressed because "the card's fine blablba". Let me just say, of course a nerf isn't always the solution and funnily enough, when people ask for nerfs for things like Shudderwock or combo druid, the fanboys are nowhere to be seen, even though with Shudderwock, he is not the problem, it's the otehr pieces, as well with combo druids, Aviana wasn't the problem, Kun is.
I wanted to make this thread, in light of recent Rumble Run fixes because I just fin the pattern frustrating but also kind of funny. To see such a group be consistently wrong makes it tolerable in the end. In conclusion, I would suggest people who respond to calls for nerf express their opinions on why it should or not should be nerfed or if there is a change in general. Do not just post "I fell it's fine" or "omg you people want to nerf everything". It does not add to the conversation and serves only to frustrate those outside of your bubble
The Hearthstone community is great and dogshit at the at the same time. I've been accused of being a "Blizzard fanboy" just because I protested against the game being rigged. Opinions are like assholes, everyone has them. So try to have a thick skin against them.
BTW, I haven't seen anyone defending the Naga Sea Witch combo, like ever.
No. I got it. I simply think that your point has zero validity. Are you some gatekeeper of those worthy of the Hearthstone or other fandoms? Are you designated as some official arbiter of acceptability? Are you even a moderator for these forums?
In fact the answer to all of the above is no. Other people's disagreement with your opinions and/or frustrations does not make them fanboys or incapable of seeing your point. You could potentially learn the same lesson I'm working on with my young children. Accept that maybe, just maybe, you're the one who is wrong or needs to make a change in their behaviour here. Or don't. And whine how you're better and more open minded than us, however incorrect you may be.
Ironically the people you mock for saying "Well I enjoyed it and it was just challenging enough" are quite explicitly stating that it was just their experience, which you certainly can't deny them. Meanwhile you're determined to make a stereotype out of people who do not agree with your anecdotal experience. What you're asking for would be equivalent to if they just labeled you as a generic hater for not agreeing that it is indeed fine.
Also, in order to preemptively avoid you reconciling people disagreeing with you here as the same Blizzard fanboys, I'll just state that I'm extremely worried about the state of Activision Blizzard as a whole and I haven't particularly enjoyed the last few expansions.
I've been called both a fanboy, and a hater at one and the same time, and the conclusion is that people just don't like it, when someone disagrees with one's opinion. Naga Sea Witch decks as your example was in my eyes not as problematic as several other decks, like Kingsbane Rogue and Resurrect Priest. People are allowed to like the Dungeon Run as well. I personally didn't fancy it, but I know several people who really liked the extra layer of pure and clean POWER. All in all we all have different opinions on specific cards and modes.
I'm personally tired of seeing people call out people as "fanboys" and "haters", as both parts are equally stupid. The haters will say that a thing is objectively bad because they don't like it, whereas a fanboy will say it's objectively good because they do like it. The fact of the matter is that some people can like things that other people don't.
Let's bring out a controversial opinion that I have for this sake. I don't personally believe you should be allowed to dust more than 2 of the same card after a nerf for a full dust refund. There is no gameplay reason for this sort of thing, and it slows down progression in the game, as people are hoarding more and more cards. This also makes it more appealing for Blizzard to actually nerf cards, as there won't be people getting an entire year's worth of dust, from a single rounds of nerfs. I've also never felt that i've heard a good argument for why it should remain like this in the game, except for personal greed.
Is this an objectively wrong opinion? Some of you might say it is. But as all other opinions, it's a subjective one, and can therefore not be seen as objectively anything. I personally respect it, if you disagree with this opinion, for whatever reasoning you have, as long as you don't call me out, because you have a different opinion.
Just because Blizzard decided to tweak Rumble Run doesn't make your opinion about it "correct" and those who supported the original version "wrong". It just means Blizzard decided to listen to those complaining and make it easier to beat.
Your post is also internally incoherent. You start out by saying how annoying it is to have people "defending to the death" the things that others in the community have an issue with. But then you conclude by suggesting that "people who respond to calls for nerf express their opinions on why it should or not should be nerfed or if there is a change in general". But when someone is defending something, that is exactly what they are doing - they are expressing their opinion on why something shouldn't be nerfed or changed. So what exactly is your beef here? Are you saying that people who are fine with the status quo should just keep quiet and not contradict those who want things changed?
Well there are many diehard fanboys that will defend everything and i mean everything... Not agreeing with the criticism is one thing, everyone has the right to express his opinion but please do not tell me some users that i will not name gough*xbenxgoughunknowsomething** arent ballbreaking fanboys...Not only they defend everything but they belittle anyone who expresses the slightest discomfort and shut down every idea.
For example users like EternalHS and most importantly Lyra Sylverstone (sorry if recall the name incorrectly) are worthy of my respect even if we disagree 80% of the times. They are respectful (mostly lyra :P) and present solid arguments.
A common tactic of those who can't argue their points effectively is to attempt to diminish the opposing position by highlighting flaws in the party delivering that position. This is a fallacious argument known as ad hominem. A good example is when someone disagrees with your conclusions on Naga Sea Witch, you label them as 'fanboys' instead of addressing the points in their position. If they have no specific reason why they don't agree, the onus is still on you to persuade them or accept that you have failed to do so - it's your argument, after all.
I often use the term fanboy (sheeple will also do) to denote the uncritical attitude towards anything Blizzard, a.k.a. nothing card designers come up with is wrong. If you challenge beloved developers, you are either:
Salty (move to the salt thread).
Don't know what you are talking about. Blizzard is always right.
conspiracy theorist.
Loyalism on pwn is a serious problem for a thorough discussion. Also very nasty: you argue at length, the fanboy (doesn't read what you write) picks out a line mock you in turn.
I often use the term fanboy (sheeple will also do) to denote the uncritical attitude towards anything Blizzard, a.k.a. nothing card designers come up with is wrong. If you challenge beloved developers, you are either:
Salty (move to the salt thread).
Don't know what you are talking about. Blizzard is always right.
conspiracy theorist.
Loyalism on pwn is a serious problem for a thorough discussion. Also very nasty: you argue at length, the fanboy (doesn't read what you write) picks out a line mock you in turn.
End to end willful ignorance from the post to the signature. Fanboys exist. But, it's not bad design when you come up against something that counters you. That's called balance. So when you're spinning about hurling vitriol without substance, expect to be treated with deserved skepticism. That you think you should always be able to win, every time, just on skill means you don't understand design on these kinds of games at a minimum. Your argument would have merit in chess. Not so much in HS.
Rollback Post to RevisionRollBack
A never-Legend Dad who keeps making rank 2 or 1, but then sliding.
Rumbling around Gurubashi Arena. Shirvallah is the best loa. Go Tigers!
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One of the most frustrating things that can happen on these kinds of forums is to come here to discuss a problem or potential problem with a card or mechanic, only to get bombarded with comments defending to the death the thing you're criticising. A good example would be Naga Sea Witch. When it was running rampant on wild, I posted a thread showing a screenshot of a turn 5 where a Warlock had a full board of 8/8s and Malganys or something along the line and people responded how it was not a problem and went as far to start insulting my Shaman deck and how bad it was. Then of course the nerfs came in and those people were nowhere to be seen. More recent one would be the rumble run. Yes, a lot of people agreed that it was bad but if you made a thread about it, the first comments would always be stuff like "Well I enjoyed it and it was just challenging enough" even though everyone knows that rumble run was not challenging in a good way, it was an rngfest where some matchups you already lost because of the totem matchups, or if you can't remove their totem turn 1. Now Rumble Run got a supposed fix as well, I haven't tried it yet.
As you can see, there is a clear pattern emerging, community asks for a nerf, only to get loyalists responding with stuff like "the card is fine" or "Why don't we nerf everything then". This is a very frustrating occurrence and from experience, I can say that it makes one not want to post anything or be active, which of course would create the cycle of only fanboys being active and no problem getting adressed because "the card's fine blablba". Let me just say, of course a nerf isn't always the solution and funnily enough, when people ask for nerfs for things like Shudderwock or combo druid, the fanboys are nowhere to be seen, even though with Shudderwock, he is not the problem, it's the otehr pieces, as well with combo druids, Aviana wasn't the problem, Kun is.
I wanted to make this thread, in light of recent Rumble Run fixes because I just fin the pattern frustrating but also kind of funny. To see such a group be consistently wrong makes it tolerable in the end. In conclusion, I would suggest people who respond to calls for nerf express their opinions on why it should or not should be nerfed or if there is a change in general. Do not just post "I fell it's fine" or "omg you people want to nerf everything". It does not add to the conversation and serves only to frustrate those outside of your bubble
It's the internet. People have opinions. If you are unhappy or unwilling to deal with them, don't post on public forums.
Learn to either ignore it or debate it. It's up to you.
A never-Legend Dad who keeps making rank 2 or 1, but then sliding.
Rumbling around Gurubashi Arena. Shirvallah is the best loa. Go Tigers!
Ya, it seems like people mindlessly say “salt” or “fan boy” way too easily nowadays. Unfortunate.
Way to completely miss the point.
Wow, these users on my thread don't agree with my subjective opinion. They must be fanboys or shills
Legend with : S65 Freeze Mage, S57 Maly Gonk Druid, S57 "Okay" Shaman, S53 Boom-zooka Hunter, S53 Maly Tog Druid, S52 Wild Tog Druid ft.Blingtron, S50 Quest Rogue, S49 Dead Man's Warrior, S41 Wild Clown Fiesta Druid, S41 Hadronox Jade Druid, S40 Wild OTK Dragon Druid, S35 SMOrc Shaman, S33 Jade Druid, S22 Control Priest, S19 Control Priest
The Hearthstone community is great and dogshit at the at the same time. I've been accused of being a "Blizzard fanboy" just because I protested against the game being rigged. Opinions are like assholes, everyone has them. So try to have a thick skin against them.
BTW, I haven't seen anyone defending the Naga Sea Witch combo, like ever.
No. I got it. I simply think that your point has zero validity. Are you some gatekeeper of those worthy of the Hearthstone or other fandoms? Are you designated as some official arbiter of acceptability? Are you even a moderator for these forums?
In fact the answer to all of the above is no. Other people's disagreement with your opinions and/or frustrations does not make them fanboys or incapable of seeing your point. You could potentially learn the same lesson I'm working on with my young children. Accept that maybe, just maybe, you're the one who is wrong or needs to make a change in their behaviour here. Or don't. And whine how you're better and more open minded than us, however incorrect you may be.
A never-Legend Dad who keeps making rank 2 or 1, but then sliding.
Rumbling around Gurubashi Arena. Shirvallah is the best loa. Go Tigers!
So just because some people disagree with your opinion regarding the nerfs of some cards, that makes them fanboys ? It does not make any sense...
Oh noees people dont think exactly like me, they must be fanboys whaaaaawhaaaaaaa!! (is this how you do a crybaby onomatopey thingie?)
Off topic question (Sorry to bother) how do you start a thread?
I've been looking from the Moment i logged in but i can't find anything
Sorry again but i picked the first thread i found
In all honesty, I'd rather be a Blizzard fanboi rather a Thai Ladyboy, whatever the career progression options that might open up.
In Blizzard appreciation style I do like the approach they've taken to patching the game these last few months.
Golden Hero Collections thus far; -
Europe: Druid, Hunter, Paladin, Mage, Priest, Rogue, Shaman, Warlock, Warrior (9/9)
Americas: Druid, Mage, Paladin Shaman (4/9)
Everywhere else: Workin on it.. (0/9)
Ironically the people you mock for saying "Well I enjoyed it and it was just challenging enough" are quite explicitly stating that it was just their experience, which you certainly can't deny them. Meanwhile you're determined to make a stereotype out of people who do not agree with your anecdotal experience. What you're asking for would be equivalent to if they just labeled you as a generic hater for not agreeing that it is indeed fine.
Also, in order to preemptively avoid you reconciling people disagreeing with you here as the same Blizzard fanboys, I'll just state that I'm extremely worried about the state of Activision Blizzard as a whole and I haven't particularly enjoyed the last few expansions.
I've been called both a fanboy, and a hater at one and the same time, and the conclusion is that people just don't like it, when someone disagrees with one's opinion. Naga Sea Witch decks as your example was in my eyes not as problematic as several other decks, like Kingsbane Rogue and Resurrect Priest. People are allowed to like the Dungeon Run as well. I personally didn't fancy it, but I know several people who really liked the extra layer of pure and clean POWER. All in all we all have different opinions on specific cards and modes.
I'm personally tired of seeing people call out people as "fanboys" and "haters", as both parts are equally stupid. The haters will say that a thing is objectively bad because they don't like it, whereas a fanboy will say it's objectively good because they do like it. The fact of the matter is that some people can like things that other people don't.
Let's bring out a controversial opinion that I have for this sake. I don't personally believe you should be allowed to dust more than 2 of the same card after a nerf for a full dust refund. There is no gameplay reason for this sort of thing, and it slows down progression in the game, as people are hoarding more and more cards. This also makes it more appealing for Blizzard to actually nerf cards, as there won't be people getting an entire year's worth of dust, from a single rounds of nerfs. I've also never felt that i've heard a good argument for why it should remain like this in the game, except for personal greed.
Is this an objectively wrong opinion? Some of you might say it is. But as all other opinions, it's a subjective one, and can therefore not be seen as objectively anything. I personally respect it, if you disagree with this opinion, for whatever reasoning you have, as long as you don't call me out, because you have a different opinion.
I want a new title, but Flux won't let me have one,
I think you're objectively correct, Tox. But I come from a corporate background.
A never-Legend Dad who keeps making rank 2 or 1, but then sliding.
Rumbling around Gurubashi Arena. Shirvallah is the best loa. Go Tigers!
Just because Blizzard decided to tweak Rumble Run doesn't make your opinion about it "correct" and those who supported the original version "wrong". It just means Blizzard decided to listen to those complaining and make it easier to beat.
Your post is also internally incoherent. You start out by saying how annoying it is to have people "defending to the death" the things that others in the community have an issue with. But then you conclude by suggesting that "people who respond to calls for nerf express their opinions on why it should or not should be nerfed or if there is a change in general". But when someone is defending something, that is exactly what they are doing - they are expressing their opinion on why something shouldn't be nerfed or changed. So what exactly is your beef here? Are you saying that people who are fine with the status quo should just keep quiet and not contradict those who want things changed?
Freaking blizzfanboys not agreeing with me on a public forum with all sorts of different opinions! :(((((
Well there are many diehard fanboys that will defend everything and i mean everything... Not agreeing with the criticism is one thing, everyone has the right to express his opinion but please do not tell me some users that i will not name gough*xbenxgoughunknowsomething** arent ballbreaking fanboys...Not only they defend everything but they belittle anyone who expresses the slightest discomfort and shut down every idea.
For example users like EternalHS and most importantly Lyra Sylverstone (sorry if recall the name incorrectly) are worthy of my respect even if we disagree 80% of the times. They are respectful (mostly lyra :P) and present solid arguments.
A common tactic of those who can't argue their points effectively is to attempt to diminish the opposing position by highlighting flaws in the party delivering that position. This is a fallacious argument known as ad hominem. A good example is when someone disagrees with your conclusions on Naga Sea Witch, you label them as 'fanboys' instead of addressing the points in their position. If they have no specific reason why they don't agree, the onus is still on you to persuade them or accept that you have failed to do so - it's your argument, after all.
Free to try and find a game, dealing cards for sorrow, cards for pain.
I often use the term fanboy (sheeple will also do) to denote the uncritical attitude towards anything Blizzard, a.k.a. nothing card designers come up with is wrong. If you challenge beloved developers, you are either:
Loyalism on pwn is a serious problem for a thorough discussion. Also very nasty: you argue at length, the fanboy (doesn't read what you write) picks out a line mock you in turn.
We make our world significant through the courage of our questions and the depth of our answers.
End to end willful ignorance from the post to the signature. Fanboys exist. But, it's not bad design when you come up against something that counters you. That's called balance. So when you're spinning about hurling vitriol without substance, expect to be treated with deserved skepticism. That you think you should always be able to win, every time, just on skill means you don't understand design on these kinds of games at a minimum. Your argument would have merit in chess. Not so much in HS.
A never-Legend Dad who keeps making rank 2 or 1, but then sliding.
Rumbling around Gurubashi Arena. Shirvallah is the best loa. Go Tigers!