Interesting stats. However, I'd be more interested in seeing the decline and ascendance of some of these Legendaries. For example, I know, for a fact, that Odd Quest Warrior has high winrates against Hunter, and I can imagine Fire Plume's Heart has only recently joined the list. As much as I like stats, this is a snapshot, and in no way representing the state of the meta in about 1 month. I would like the same snapshot in about 2 weeks. My predictions are an uprising of Odd Quest Warrior and a decline of Hunter decks.
In addition, basing a class' performance on how well some of the cards are doing is faulty. I would very much like to see how these winrates hold up in lower ranks, and separately, higher ranks. All in all, the stats could say something, but it's nowhere near definitive.
Yeah let's see what happens in about month or so. If it looks the same, it will probably stay like this till the rotation unless people start only countering hunters even if losing to other deck or someone discovers a whole new deck idea/improvement (insert heal zoo as an example)
Everything except for hunter was nerfed. Complainers wanted everything on top to be nerfed in one swing and it wasn't. Regardless of stats or hunter power level people hate on hunter because their deck was nerfed and hunter wasn't.
Also it really should be noted that contrary to popular belief there is not standard meta yet (barring hunter decks since they are a proven laddering deck/class prior to nerfs) so uninspired players (which is almost everyone) only plays the deck(s) that have been proven consistent, ignoring the fact that there are now viable decks that have been pushed up due to the nerfs, but may not have been publicly accepted at this point.
Everything except for hunter was nerfed. Complainers wanted everything on top to be nerfed in one swing and it wasn't. Regardless of stats or hunter power level people hate on hunter because their deck was nerfed and hunter wasn't.
Also it really should be noted that contrary to popular belief there is not standard meta yet (barring hunter decks since they are a proven laddering deck/class prior to nerfs) so uninspired players (which is almost everyone) only plays the deck(s) that have been proven consistent, ignoring the fact that there are now viable decks that have been pushed up due to the nerfs, but may not have been publicly accepted at this point.
That is correct. If I was a good deck builder I would try to figure something new viable but I'm terrible at that. I can only refine decks (most of the time to a worse state lol), not create them. I rarely play meta decks (last time I played a pure meta deck was during shamanstone and even then I only ranked to rank 8 but got bored as hell to play it) but it just sucks to face the same class over and over again, doesnt really matter if win or loss. Just pick some other damn classes there are 8 others lol
hunter is kind of busted and it was before the nerf, it was shaping the meta and they nerfed 3 decks that counter one or more of its archetypes.
Hunter just has soo many good cards. It's not one thing you can point to other than maybe Rexxar like other nerfs (healing in Kingsbane, Level up in odd paly), but hunter just has super strong cards in every slot. Shaw, play dead/terrorscale, Katerina, spellstone, Zul'jin.
They nerfed the best aggro deck against hunter in odd pally and the best control deck against hunter in shudderwock. Shudder was obviously a combo deck but it played the control role against hunter better than any control deck because it had silence/transform for deathrattles, volcano for awkward clears, and it could actually close out the game rather than getting ground out by Rexxar like a lot of control decks do.
I don't want them to nerf it to the ground like the foolishly did everything else with the recent nerfs, but I think they should try to hit some stuff all the decks use to tune it down a bit.
WTF is The Glass Knight doing there ? I have played against a lot of Even and OTK paladin and only seen this card few times. I don't think it is necessary card in those decks, more like a flex card. I would rather expect Crystalsmith Kangor on the list. It has good synergy with buffs in Even Paladin and with loa in OTK Paladin.
Do you think hunters power level is ok at the moment?
Hunter is fine because it has a lot of counters. You can play aggro decks like Odd Rogue have a decent chance against Hunter, Odd Quest Warrior is a decent counter if you like control, OTK Paladin and Combo Priest covers the combo style. None of these are instant win against Hunter but neither they are instant lose. If you are a good player I am sure you can win >50% of the time with these decks, at least at lower ranks.
People have a right to say what they want even if they want nerfs. If you don't agree with what they are saying then no one is forcing you to reply to these threads. Reporting others for not having a diffrent opinion is wrong
"I'm tired of playing against Druid...f'n Druidstone"...Druid gets nerfed.
"I'm tired of playing against Paladin...f'n Pallystone"...Paladin gets nerfed.
"I'm tired of playing against Hunter...f'n Hunterstone"...(IF) Hunter ever gets nerfed...
"I'm tired of playing against...[insert another class here]..."
There will ALWAYS be a best class regardless of what gets nerfed.
Don't try to explain it to them because they don't understand that. They believe that by nerfing what is on top that magically all 9 classes will be represented AND that the meta will never settle but will continually fart one new deck per week.
The ink isn't even dry on the nerfs yet so the list is meaningless as there is no meta. It takes longer to refine a new control deck than to use existing aggressive builds. Kripp is trying to sensationalize to get people to watch his video and subscribe. Sorry OP but you took the bait.
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Free to try and find a game, dealing cards for sorrow, cards for pain.
WTF is The Glass Knight doing there ? I have played against a lot of Even and OTK paladin and only seen this card few times. I don't think it is necessary card in those decks, more like a flex card. I would rather expect Crystalsmith Kangor on the list. It has good synergy with buffs in Even Paladin and with loa in OTK Paladin.
Do you think hunters power level is ok at the moment?
Hunter is fine because it has a lot of counters. You can play aggro decks like Odd Rogue have a decent chance against Hunter, Odd Quest Warrior is a decent counter if you like control, OTK Paladin and Combo Priest covers the combo style. None of these are instant win against Hunter but neither they are instant lose. If you are a good player I am sure you can win >50% of the time with these decks, at least at lower ranks.
Glass Knight makes sense if you think about it. Glass Knight is only in even paladin and even Paladin is the highest WR Paladin deck overall and one of the top WR decks overall. Kangor is in decks with lower win rates like OTK and the super bad holy wrath thing.
Hunter is not OK. But I find Kripparian to be way above my daily Salt Intake Level so I don't watch him.
Hunter is in a really good spot right now, that's true. But that doesn't stop me playing EvenLock, Tesspionage or Evolve Shaman. And I'm pretty sure that there are ways around it. Mass Hysteria is a good board clear, Odd Warrior might do well, Big Spell Mage.... I dunno about that one, in any case, I just play what I find.
I do run a Hunter Deck from time to time based around Masters Call and its fun. But the Deathrattle/Secret/Spell Hunter don't appeal to me.
He didn't complain about Hunter actually.
Hunter is ridiculous though. I don't find them unbeatable, but my last 10 games were against Hunter. I even spectated 3 matches for a spectate quest and they all involved...you guessed it...Hunter
Here's a crazy thought. Blizzard just released an expac with a hunter legendary hero card as the premier set piece. And now nerfed the things that compete best with Hunter. Hmm ....
WTF is The Glass Knight doing there ? I have played against a lot of Even and OTK paladin and only seen this card few times. I don't think it is necessary card in those decks, more like a flex card. I would rather expect Crystalsmith Kangor on the list. It has good synergy with buffs in Even Paladin and with loa in OTK Paladin.
Do you think hunters power level is ok at the moment?
Hunter is fine because it has a lot of counters. You can play aggro decks like Odd Rogue have a decent chance against Hunter, Odd Quest Warrior is a decent counter if you like control, OTK Paladin and Combo Priest covers the combo style. None of these are instant win against Hunter but neither they are instant lose. If you are a good player I am sure you can win >50% of the time with these decks, at least at lower ranks.
Glass Knight makes sense if you think about it. Glass Knight is only in even paladin and even Paladin is the highest WR Paladin deck overall and one of the top WR decks overall. Kangor is in decks with lower win rates like OTK and the super bad holy wrath thing.
Then isn't this a textbook example of "stats don't lie, people do" ? Glass Knight is played in few Even Paladin which have high winrates while Kangor is played in most Paladin decks right now, with both high and low winrates. In any case I think Kripp made a critical error of taking the data without context, probably because he doesn't play constructed much. Kangor deserve to be on that list and I would argue it should be higher than 10th place.
WTF is The Glass Knight doing there ? I have played against a lot of Even and OTK paladin and only seen this card few times. I don't think it is necessary card in those decks, more like a flex card. I would rather expect Crystalsmith Kangor on the list. It has good synergy with buffs in Even Paladin and with loa in OTK Paladin.
Do you think hunters power level is ok at the moment?
Hunter is fine because it has a lot of counters. You can play aggro decks like Odd Rogue have a decent chance against Hunter, Odd Quest Warrior is a decent counter if you like control, OTK Paladin and Combo Priest covers the combo style. None of these are instant win against Hunter but neither they are instant lose. If you are a good player I am sure you can win >50% of the time with these decks, at least at lower ranks.
Glass Knight makes sense if you think about it. Glass Knight is only in even paladin and even Paladin is the highest WR Paladin deck overall and one of the top WR decks overall. Kangor is in decks with lower win rates like OTK and the super bad holy wrath thing.
Then isn't this a textbook example of "stats don't lie, people do" ? Glass Knight is played in few Even Paladin which have high winrates while Kangor is played in most Paladin decks right now, with both high and low winrates. In any case I think Kripp made a critical error of taking the data without context, probably because he doesn't play constructed much. Kangor deserve to be on that list and I would argue it should be higher than 10th place.
Kangor wasn't in the list due to it having a lower impact overall in even paladin (▼56.4% mulligan win-rate, ▼56.1% drawn win-rate and ▼53.2% played win-rate, all lower than The glass knight.) However, kripp was definitely wrong as Genn Greymane should have been on the list, considering that Even shaman and even paladin are in the top 4 best performing decks.
While on the topic of Hunter, if you lose to them, just play more control decks
Ok, so Shudderwock, Kingsbane, Odd Paladin, and basically all druids get nerfed.
Let me demonstrate my amazing crystal ball.
1. Hunter is clearly the most powerful deck from the previous meta after nerfs, therefore it will be the most played and probably high on the win rate lists for a while.
2. Odd Warrior (w/Quest) is very powerful against the most popular hunter decks, therefore it will appear more and more frequently in the days following the nerf.
3. What combo decks are left after the nerf have strikingly high win rates against odd warrior. If there are any that can even break even against secret/spell hunter, they will spike in win rates.
4. Aggro is generally not great against odd warrior, but it traditionally shits on combo decks. Thus the triumvirate of deck styles begin to flesh out into a new meta.
5. Even lock still wins against everything more often than not.
Did I do it right?
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Helpful Clarification on Forbidden Topics for Hearthstone Forums:
Enjoying Americans winning in the Olympics is forbidden because it is political. A 14 plus page discussion of state-sponsored lawsuits against a multi-national corporation based on harassment, discrimination, and wrongful death allegations is apparently not political enough to raise an issue.
There will always be a class with the highest winrate deck. HSreplay is evidence however, that hunter has multiple tier 1/upper tier 2 decks, and it's enormously popular on ladder. Probably the most problematic is Rexxar, which is played in every hunter deck, has no downside, and outvalues any control deck. Given the power of aggressive and midrange cards released in recent expansions, Hunter requires multiple nerfs, starting with Rexxar to reduce it to merely the top class, and not the overthetop oppressive god tier status it currently enjoys.
WTF is The Glass Knight doing there ? I have played against a lot of Even and OTK paladin and only seen this card few times. I don't think it is necessary card in those decks, more like a flex card. I would rather expect Crystalsmith Kangor on the list. It has good synergy with buffs in Even Paladin and with loa in OTK Paladin.
Do you think hunters power level is ok at the moment?
Hunter is fine because it has a lot of counters. You can play aggro decks like Odd Rogue have a decent chance against Hunter, Odd Quest Warrior is a decent counter if you like control, OTK Paladin and Combo Priest covers the combo style. None of these are instant win against Hunter but neither they are instant lose. If you are a good player I am sure you can win >50% of the time with these decks, at least at lower ranks.
Glass Knight makes sense if you think about it. Glass Knight is only in even paladin and even Paladin is the highest WR Paladin deck overall and one of the top WR decks overall. Kangor is in decks with lower win rates like OTK and the super bad holy wrath thing.
Then isn't this a textbook example of "stats don't lie, people do" ? Glass Knight is played in few Even Paladin which have high winrates while Kangor is played in most Paladin decks right now, with both high and low winrates. In any case I think Kripp made a critical error of taking the data without context, probably because he doesn't play constructed much. Kangor deserve to be on that list and I would argue it should be higher than 10th place.
Kangor wasn't in the list due to it having a lower impact overall in even paladin (▼56.4% mulligan win-rate, ▼56.1% drawn win-rate and ▼53.2% played win-rate, all lower than The glass knight.) However, kripp was definitely wrong as Genn Greymane should have been on the list, considering that Even shaman and even paladin are in the top 4 best performing decks.
While on the topic of Hunter, if you lose to them, just play more control decks
Kangor is another lifesteal activator for corpse takers in even paladin, and can straight up win you the game against something like odd rogue.
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Let's be serious though, Has any one truly added King Krush to their deck?
You don't play much, do you? ;).
Missing lethal since February 2014.
Yeah let's see what happens in about month or so. If it looks the same, it will probably stay like this till the rotation unless people start only countering hunters even if losing to other deck or someone discovers a whole new deck idea/improvement (insert heal zoo as an example)
Me? Gongaga.
Everything except for hunter was nerfed. Complainers wanted everything on top to be nerfed in one swing and it wasn't. Regardless of stats or hunter power level people hate on hunter because their deck was nerfed and hunter wasn't.
Also it really should be noted that contrary to popular belief there is not standard meta yet (barring hunter decks since they are a proven laddering deck/class prior to nerfs) so uninspired players (which is almost everyone) only plays the deck(s) that have been proven consistent, ignoring the fact that there are now viable decks that have been pushed up due to the nerfs, but may not have been publicly accepted at this point.
That is correct. If I was a good deck builder I would try to figure something new viable but I'm terrible at that. I can only refine decks (most of the time to a worse state lol), not create them. I rarely play meta decks (last time I played a pure meta deck was during shamanstone and even then I only ranked to rank 8 but got bored as hell to play it) but it just sucks to face the same class over and over again, doesnt really matter if win or loss. Just pick some other damn classes there are 8 others lol
Me? Gongaga.
"I'm tired of playing against Druid...f'n Druidstone"...Druid gets nerfed.
"I'm tired of playing against Paladin...f'n Pallystone"...Paladin gets nerfed.
"I'm tired of playing against Hunter...f'n Hunterstone"...(IF) Hunter ever gets nerfed...
"I'm tired of playing against...[insert another class here]..."
There will ALWAYS be a best class regardless of what gets nerfed.
"There is no spoon"
hunter is kind of busted and it was before the nerf, it was shaping the meta and they nerfed 3 decks that counter one or more of its archetypes.
Hunter just has soo many good cards. It's not one thing you can point to other than maybe Rexxar like other nerfs (healing in Kingsbane, Level up in odd paly), but hunter just has super strong cards in every slot. Shaw, play dead/terrorscale, Katerina, spellstone, Zul'jin.
They nerfed the best aggro deck against hunter in odd pally and the best control deck against hunter in shudderwock. Shudder was obviously a combo deck but it played the control role against hunter better than any control deck because it had silence/transform for deathrattles, volcano for awkward clears, and it could actually close out the game rather than getting ground out by Rexxar like a lot of control decks do.
I don't want them to nerf it to the ground like the foolishly did everything else with the recent nerfs, but I think they should try to hit some stuff all the decks use to tune it down a bit.
WTF is The Glass Knight doing there ? I have played against a lot of Even and OTK paladin and only seen this card few times. I don't think it is necessary card in those decks, more like a flex card. I would rather expect Crystalsmith Kangor on the list. It has good synergy with buffs in Even Paladin and with loa in OTK Paladin.
Hunter is fine because it has a lot of counters. You can play aggro decks like Odd Rogue have a decent chance against Hunter, Odd Quest Warrior is a decent counter if you like control, OTK Paladin and Combo Priest covers the combo style. None of these are instant win against Hunter but neither they are instant lose. If you are a good player I am sure you can win >50% of the time with these decks, at least at lower ranks.
People have a right to say what they want even if they want nerfs. If you don't agree with what they are saying then no one is forcing you to reply to these threads. Reporting others for not having a diffrent opinion is wrong
Don't try to explain it to them because they don't understand that. They believe that by nerfing what is on top that magically all 9 classes will be represented AND that the meta will never settle but will continually fart one new deck per week.
The ink isn't even dry on the nerfs yet so the list is meaningless as there is no meta. It takes longer to refine a new control deck than to use existing aggressive builds. Kripp is trying to sensationalize to get people to watch his video and subscribe. Sorry OP but you took the bait.
Free to try and find a game, dealing cards for sorrow, cards for pain.
Glass Knight makes sense if you think about it. Glass Knight is only in even paladin and even Paladin is the highest WR Paladin deck overall and one of the top WR decks overall. Kangor is in decks with lower win rates like OTK and the super bad holy wrath thing.
He didn't complain about Hunter actually.
Hunter is ridiculous though. I don't find them unbeatable, but my last 10 games were against Hunter. I even spectated 3 matches for a spectate quest and they all involved...you guessed it...Hunter
Here's a crazy thought. Blizzard just released an expac with a hunter legendary hero card as the premier set piece. And now nerfed the things that compete best with Hunter. Hmm ....
Then isn't this a textbook example of "stats don't lie, people do" ? Glass Knight is played in few Even Paladin which have high winrates while Kangor is played in most Paladin decks right now, with both high and low winrates. In any case I think Kripp made a critical error of taking the data without context, probably because he doesn't play constructed much. Kangor deserve to be on that list and I would argue it should be higher than 10th place.
Kangor wasn't in the list due to it having a lower impact overall in even paladin (▼56.4% mulligan win-rate, ▼56.1% drawn win-rate and ▼53.2% played win-rate, all lower than The glass knight.) However, kripp was definitely wrong as Genn Greymane should have been on the list, considering that Even shaman and even paladin are in the top 4 best performing decks.
While on the topic of Hunter, if you lose to them, just play more control decks
Ok, so Shudderwock, Kingsbane, Odd Paladin, and basically all druids get nerfed.
Let me demonstrate my amazing crystal ball.
1. Hunter is clearly the most powerful deck from the previous meta after nerfs, therefore it will be the most played and probably high on the win rate lists for a while.
2. Odd Warrior (w/Quest) is very powerful against the most popular hunter decks, therefore it will appear more and more frequently in the days following the nerf.
3. What combo decks are left after the nerf have strikingly high win rates against odd warrior. If there are any that can even break even against secret/spell hunter, they will spike in win rates.
4. Aggro is generally not great against odd warrior, but it traditionally shits on combo decks. Thus the triumvirate of deck styles begin to flesh out into a new meta.
5. Even lock still wins against everything more often than not.
Did I do it right?
Helpful Clarification on Forbidden Topics for Hearthstone Forums:
Enjoying Americans winning in the Olympics is forbidden because it is political. A 14 plus page discussion of state-sponsored lawsuits against a multi-national corporation based on harassment, discrimination, and wrongful death allegations is apparently not political enough to raise an issue.
No Captain Hooktusk in this list, bs ...
There will always be a class with the highest winrate deck. HSreplay is evidence however, that hunter has multiple tier 1/upper tier 2 decks, and it's enormously popular on ladder. Probably the most problematic is Rexxar, which is played in every hunter deck, has no downside, and outvalues any control deck. Given the power of aggressive and midrange cards released in recent expansions, Hunter requires multiple nerfs, starting with Rexxar to reduce it to merely the top class, and not the overthetop oppressive god tier status it currently enjoys.
Kangor is another lifesteal activator for corpse takers in even paladin, and can straight up win you the game against something like odd rogue.