So, by your logic, we need to nerf like majority of druid class cards, including classic and basic ones, half of DKs, some OG cards like Fireball , Acolyte of Pain, or Backstab and Eviscerate .
I m sorry for my French, but are you retarded? Broken card can be used in 1 and only 1 deck and still be OP as fuck. Oakheart is only played in Taunt druid. Rogue quest for some reason only played in Quest rogue, have no idea why tbh. Raza was played only in Highlander priest. Are you catching yet?
But almost half the cards in the set are very good, meta-deck cards, and that's a very high percentage compared to any other set except Naxxramas.
None of these cards listed were "broken". They didn't break the game. They were very powerful, yes. They were meta-defining, yes. Broken? Not in the slightest. People tend to overuse that term without realising what it truly means.
When a card is used in 99% of the decks of that class, it's a broken card and needs to be nerfed, which they did.
How many Zoolock decks ran Lackey or Dark Pact again? As for Call to Arms, Dude-Paladin was the ONLY deck most paladins played (barring the 1% of one or two meme decks), so of course you'll see the card in 99% of those decks. I suppose you think that Dire Wolf Alpha is "broken" as well. That was used in 99% of paladin decks. And in pretty much every aggro deck at the time for that matter. Your logic is sadly flawed.
But almost half the cards in the set are very good, meta-deck cards, and that's a very high percentage compared to any other set except Naxxramas.
None of these cards listed were "broken". They didn't break the game. They were very powerful, yes. They were meta-defining, yes. Broken? Not in the slightest. People tend to overuse that term without realising what it truly means.
So, none of them were broken, which is why they dominated the meta so utterly and were subsequently nerfed, (And some cards still see play!)
What kind of logic is that? Does a card have to crash the game everytime your opponent plays it for it to be broken?
Branching Paths wasn't nerfed. Yet apparently it's "broken". And no, these cards didn't "dominate the meta" at all. 3 of them are class specific. And the nerfs to some of them didn't even do much to change the deck - such as Cubelock which is still virtually as powerful as it used to be. And Call To Arms nerf was too late, since Odd Paladin took it over in terms of power very quickly afterwards. So no. None of these cards were "broken". They worked as expected. Yes, they were powerful, but broken means that they were literally unbeatable. Which they obviously weren't. It has nothing to do with game crashes. I'm not sure you understand the terminology here.
If being used in all decks of similar archetypes is somehow "broken", then you must think cards like Prince Keleseth are "broken"... which is obviously utter codswallop.
Yeah like people play cubelock as frequently as we used to see it. And look at branching paths - it wasn't nerfed but it should have been. Exponentially better than greater healing potion and in every druid deck except one, which used a different KAC card to create havoc. Cube which allows game ending plays on turn six. And keleseth is bs btw. Even paladin was off the charts powerful before they nerfed CTA, it's STILL a good deck, but balanced. Creeper was in every deck (and despite what people say, I bet tons of people called it that it was gonna be ridiculous before the set dropped). Maybe not broken, but way too powerful. If you like that sort of stuff then wild is always available.
But almost half the cards in the set are very good, meta-deck cards, and that's a very high percentage compared to any other set except Naxxramas.
None of these cards listed were "broken". They didn't break the game. They were very powerful, yes. They were meta-defining, yes. Broken? Not in the slightest. People tend to overuse that term without realising what it truly means.
When a card is used in 99% of the decks of that class, it's a broken card and needs to be nerfed, which they did.
Why they didnt nerf kobold librarian when that card is in 99% of warlock decks...only evenlock dont run him...
for me Dark Knights expansion and C&K were to much powercreep. I loved ungoro and will miss a lot of the cards from there next year but i won´t miss the other two expansions and will be glad that cards like rexar, guldan, lich king, cube, ... will be gone from standard.
Branching Paths wasn't nerfed. Yet apparently it's "broken". And no, these cards didn't "dominate the meta" at all. 3 of them are class specific. And the nerfs to some of them didn't even do much to change the deck - such as Cubelock which is still virtually as powerful as it used to be. And Call To Arms nerf was too late, since Odd Paladin took it over in terms of power very quickly afterwards. So no. None of these cards were "broken". They worked as expected. Yes, they were powerful, but broken means that they were literally unbeatable. Which they obviously weren't. It has nothing to do with game crashes. I'm not sure you understand the terminology here.
If being used in all decks of similar archetypes is somehow "broken", then you must think cards like Prince Keleseth are "broken"... which is obviously utter codswallop.
Yeah like people play cubelock as frequently as we used to see it.
You do know that this is because other decks appeared that were even more powerful, not because Cubelock got worse, right? Or were you not around when Witchwood arrived?
And look at branching paths - it wasn't nerfed but it should have been.
That's your subjective opinion, not a fact. Sure it's better than Healing Potion, (an old and outdated card that has no bearing on the current meta), but that means literally nothing. Obviously it wasnt "broken" enough for Blizzard to consider it warranted a nerf.
Cube which allows game ending plays on turn six.
How does playing a Cube on an empty board allow game ending plays on turn 6 again? It's not like you need at least 3 other cards to make a crazy combo or anything.... A 4-card game-ending combo? Shocking!....
And keleseth is bs btw.
Said no aggro deck player ever. I... really don't understand how anyone can think this card is bad...
Even paladin was off the charts powerful before they nerfed CTA, it's STILL a good deck, but balanced.
As soon as Call To Arms was nerfed, the deck morphed into Odd paladin which is even stronger. CtA was proven not to be the real problem (as many had suggested before the nerf (but far be it for Blizzard to repeatedly nerf the wrong cards or anything...). Even Paladin is now a completely different type of deck altogether. It has no similarity to the aggro version that came earlier.
Creeper was in every deck (and despite what people say, I bet tons of people called it that it was gonna be ridiculous before the set dropped). Maybe not broken, but way too powerful. If you like that sort of stuff then wild is always available.
Creeper was only in aggro decks. For obvious reasons. It was super powerful but wasn't used across the board like some other cards like Giggling Inventor (for example) have been. The knee-jerk-nerf killed the card completely - ironically, this is a better example of a card that is "broken"; they broke the card - and it's just a joke card now. It sees minor play in Odd Paladin, but it's half-hearted.
We've actually come to the point where not only are folks retroactively reeeeeeeeeeing about the Creeper nerf et al, but longing for a new set of the same power level as K&C.
I love it. So so much.
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Helpful Clarification on Forbidden Topics for Hearthstone Forums:
Enjoying Americans winning in the Olympics is forbidden because it is political. A 14 plus page discussion of state-sponsored lawsuits against a multi-national corporation based on harassment, discrimination, and wrongful death allegations is apparently not political enough to raise an issue.
But almost half the cards in the set are very good, meta-deck cards, and that's a very high percentage compared to any other set except Naxxramas.
None of these cards listed were "broken". They didn't break the game. They were very powerful, yes. They were meta-defining, yes. Broken? Not in the slightest. People tend to overuse that term without realising what it truly means.
You think they got nerfed because they were "overused"? LULZ
Some people measure expansions by its strength and fun, that is completely right, but the issue is when people think an expansion is not better than the other because of the strength of the new set isn't high (as much as KnC in this case), and this is where people get it wrong, it should be in the middle, for example when you take a shower you don't shower with a boiled water nor a frozen one, something in between.
And look at branching paths - it wasn't nerfed but it should have been.
That's your subjective opinion, not a fact. Sure it's better than Healing Potion, (an old and outdated card that has no bearing on the current meta), but that means literally nothing. Obviously it wasnt "broken" enough for Blizzard to consider it warranted a nerf.
Blizzard is hardly a reliable source as to what is or isn't too strong. Look at the situation with Patches. Within the first month, the community knew 100% that he was completely busted.
But how long did it take for Blizzard to FINALLY address him? Them not touching Branching Paths doesn't change the fact that its grossly overpowered.
Well, you see, first there was Mean Streets of Gadgetzan. And the community saw that there were Jades. And there was much reeeeeeeeeeeeeing
Then, there was K&C. And turn 6 voidlords plus 8 life happened. And Doomguards charged for masters with full hands. And there was much reeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeing.
Father Blizzard saw the reeeeeeeeeeeeing and saw it was bad. And Father Blizzard spake, saying, "Let there be a reasonably powered set with powerful but non-game breaking REEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEE
Book of Brode, Chapter 13, Verse 1
And there was much rejoicing, 'yaaaay' -Monty Python & The Holy Grail
But almost half the cards in the set are very good, meta-deck cards, and that's a very high percentage compared to any other set except Naxxramas.
None of these cards listed were "broken". They didn't break the game. They were very powerful, yes. They were meta-defining, yes. Broken? Not in the slightest. People tend to overuse that term without realising what it truly means.
You think they got nerfed because they were "overused"? LULZ
guys stop feeding that troll you are giving him what he wants by giving into his bait attempts, just ignore him, better for everyone
I actually changed my attitude on the preorder, most because Team 5 realized "oh wow, we have so many unsupported archetypes that we circle jerked everyone around with for the last year. I guess we should make most of them into playable decks before they rotate out of standard, huh?"
As much as I am upset about their release schedule and their short attention span with ensuring decks have the proper support to maximize the number of playable cards, I at least appreciate that they fixed a lot of the long-standing problems with Hearthstone, from my perspective. I can only hope they learned their lesson from now on.......
Having said that, the initial spoilers for this set were terrible or underwhelming. While Shirvallah, the Tiger seems like a powerful card, it's not really that interesting or exciting (it's not like we haven't seen rush, lifesteal and divine shield on the same card before, and we've been playing Zilliax for awhile now), and it's quite possible the 25 mana is too harsh of a requirement anyway (you gotta play Lay on Hands or you can forget it).
The card that really burned me though was Jan'alai, the Dragonhawk. I don't care to see Ragnaros in standard anymore - especially an identical reprint. Team 5 keeps finding ways to bring this card back into standard after 4 reprints, and I'm just bored of doing 8 random points of 'fill-in-the-blank' every standard. I want something new and I want hearthstone to move on. We're only 5 years in and they keep hitting a nostalgia button that just isn't there.
Once High Priest Thekal was spoiled though, shit got interesting from then on. To me, that card and Flash of Light, Time Out!, and Zandalari Templar are going into my first deck on Tuesday. And I expect it to be pretty good times. Zandalari Templar is vastly underrated. Getting the body of a Lich King for 4 mana is a ridiculous payoff, especially getting out of combo range at the same time. The deck is going to be good. If it turns out not to be good, trust me, I will be the first one bitching to Blizzard about all of the useless life gain pally cards they printed and wasted slots on if it's not possible to make a deck with it all at the end of standard.
Beware of Kingsbane Rogue for a last hurrah. Raiding party will single handed make it viable. more tempo deck to fend off aggro more draw to keep things flowing and always the long value game against control.
this might instigate more OTK decks which in turn should give birth to a hyper aggro deck which we havent seen since the old days were aggro could kill u in 3 to 4 turns so that it not only defeats OTKs as per usual but send Kingsbane Rogue back to wild. In the mean time Warlock dies until rogue disappears. unless such aggro deck is a zoolock one.
of course this prediction is only IF Kingsbane Rogue returns.
if not than Cubelock should make a final return which in turn should make Big Spell Mage viable and Odd Rogue as well, to fend off this old cancer deck. in this battle Big Spell Mage will reign supreme as the Tier 1 apex predator
You're right, and it's wonderful. By reigning in the power level you'll see one of the most diverse and fun meta's ever after the rotation. The stagnation on new meta decks was something that had to happen if we wanted a better overall standard experience. Most of the current meta decks are held together by the power creeped cards from the Year of the Mammoth. When they go away the deck builders are going to go wild with viable decks.
But almost half the cards in the set are very good, meta-deck cards, and that's a very high percentage compared to any other set except Naxxramas.
None of these cards listed were "broken". They didn't break the game. They were very powerful, yes. They were meta-defining, yes. Broken? Not in the slightest. People tend to overuse that term without realising what it truly means.
So, none of them were broken, which is why they dominated the meta so utterly and were subsequently nerfed, (And some cards still see play!)
What kind of logic is that? Does a card have to crash the game everytime your opponent plays it for it to be broken?
Branching Paths wasn't nerfed. Yet apparently it's "broken". And no, these cards didn't "dominate the meta" at all. 3 of them are class specific. And the nerfs to some of them didn't even do much to change the deck - such as Cubelock which is still virtually as powerful as it used to be. And Call To Arms nerf was too late, since Odd Paladin took it over in terms of power very quickly afterwards. So no. None of these cards were "broken". They worked as expected. Yes, they were powerful, but broken means that they were literally unbeatable. Which they obviously weren't. It has nothing to do with game crashes. I'm not sure you understand the terminology here.
If being used in all decks of similar archetypes is somehow "broken", then you must think cards like Prince Keleseth are "broken"... which is obviously utter codswallop.
To add to that, Even Paladin is also still very strong. (Tier 1 even according to HSReplay)
They seem to be on the right track. There are some powerful cards coming but wouldn't call them broken. Though, we shall see which card is the sleeper. Most cards will be overrated, I think. This is a good thing!
So, by your logic, we need to nerf like majority of druid class cards, including classic and basic ones, half of DKs, some OG cards like Fireball , Acolyte of Pain, or Backstab and Eviscerate .
I m sorry for my French, but are you retarded? Broken card can be used in 1 and only 1 deck and still be OP as fuck. Oakheart is only played in Taunt druid. Rogue quest for some reason only played in Quest rogue, have no idea why tbh. Raza was played only in Highlander priest. Are you catching yet?
¯\_(ツ)_/¯
How many Zoolock decks ran Lackey or Dark Pact again?
As for Call to Arms, Dude-Paladin was the ONLY deck most paladins played (barring the 1% of one or two meme decks), so of course you'll see the card in 99% of those decks. I suppose you think that Dire Wolf Alpha is "broken" as well. That was used in 99% of paladin decks. And in pretty much every aggro deck at the time for that matter.
Your logic is sadly flawed.
Yeah like people play cubelock as frequently as we used to see it. And look at branching paths - it wasn't nerfed but it should have been. Exponentially better than greater healing potion and in every druid deck except one, which used a different KAC card to create havoc. Cube which allows game ending plays on turn six. And keleseth is bs btw. Even paladin was off the charts powerful before they nerfed CTA, it's STILL a good deck, but balanced. Creeper was in every deck (and despite what people say, I bet tons of people called it that it was gonna be ridiculous before the set dropped). Maybe not broken, but way too powerful. If you like that sort of stuff then wild is always available.
Why they didnt nerf kobold librarian when that card is in 99% of warlock decks...only evenlock dont run him...
for me Dark Knights expansion and C&K were to much powercreep. I loved ungoro and will miss a lot of the cards from there next year but i won´t miss the other two expansions and will be glad that cards like rexar, guldan, lich king, cube, ... will be gone from standard.
You do know that this is because other decks appeared that were even more powerful, not because Cubelock got worse, right? Or were you not around when Witchwood arrived?
That's your subjective opinion, not a fact. Sure it's better than Healing Potion, (an old and outdated card that has no bearing on the current meta), but that means literally nothing. Obviously it wasnt "broken" enough for Blizzard to consider it warranted a nerf.
How does playing a Cube on an empty board allow game ending plays on turn 6 again? It's not like you need at least 3 other cards to make a crazy combo or anything.... A 4-card game-ending combo? Shocking!....
Said no aggro deck player ever. I... really don't understand how anyone can think this card is bad...
As soon as Call To Arms was nerfed, the deck morphed into Odd paladin which is even stronger. CtA was proven not to be the real problem (as many had suggested before the nerf (but far be it for Blizzard to repeatedly nerf the wrong cards or anything...).
Even Paladin is now a completely different type of deck altogether. It has no similarity to the aggro version that came earlier.
Creeper was only in aggro decks. For obvious reasons. It was super powerful but wasn't used across the board like some other cards like Giggling Inventor (for example) have been.
The knee-jerk-nerf killed the card completely - ironically, this is a better example of a card that is "broken"; they broke the card - and it's just a joke card now. It sees minor play in Odd Paladin, but it's half-hearted.
/popcorn
We've actually come to the point where not only are folks retroactively reeeeeeeeeeing about the Creeper nerf et al, but longing for a new set of the same power level as K&C.
I love it. So so much.
Helpful Clarification on Forbidden Topics for Hearthstone Forums:
Enjoying Americans winning in the Olympics is forbidden because it is political. A 14 plus page discussion of state-sponsored lawsuits against a multi-national corporation based on harassment, discrimination, and wrongful death allegations is apparently not political enough to raise an issue.
You think they got nerfed because they were "overused"? LULZ
Some people measure expansions by its strength and fun, that is completely right, but the issue is when people think an expansion is not better than the other because of the strength of the new set isn't high (as much as KnC in this case), and this is where people get it wrong, it should be in the middle, for example when you take a shower you don't shower with a boiled water nor a frozen one, something in between.
Blizzard is hardly a reliable source as to what is or isn't too strong. Look at the situation with Patches. Within the first month, the community knew 100% that he was completely busted.
But how long did it take for Blizzard to FINALLY address him? Them not touching Branching Paths doesn't change the fact that its grossly overpowered.
And there was much rejoicing, 'yaaaay'
-Monty Python & The Holy Grail
guys stop feeding that troll you are giving him what he wants by giving into his bait attempts, just ignore him, better for everyone
That's good, but it also means that we will have cubeshit meta for another 4 month.
I actually changed my attitude on the preorder, most because Team 5 realized "oh wow, we have so many unsupported archetypes that we circle jerked everyone around with for the last year. I guess we should make most of them into playable decks before they rotate out of standard, huh?"
As much as I am upset about their release schedule and their short attention span with ensuring decks have the proper support to maximize the number of playable cards, I at least appreciate that they fixed a lot of the long-standing problems with Hearthstone, from my perspective. I can only hope they learned their lesson from now on.......
Having said that, the initial spoilers for this set were terrible or underwhelming. While Shirvallah, the Tiger seems like a powerful card, it's not really that interesting or exciting (it's not like we haven't seen rush, lifesteal and divine shield on the same card before, and we've been playing Zilliax for awhile now), and it's quite possible the 25 mana is too harsh of a requirement anyway (you gotta play Lay on Hands or you can forget it).
The card that really burned me though was Jan'alai, the Dragonhawk. I don't care to see Ragnaros in standard anymore - especially an identical reprint. Team 5 keeps finding ways to bring this card back into standard after 4 reprints, and I'm just bored of doing 8 random points of 'fill-in-the-blank' every standard. I want something new and I want hearthstone to move on. We're only 5 years in and they keep hitting a nostalgia button that just isn't there.
Once High Priest Thekal was spoiled though, shit got interesting from then on. To me, that card and Flash of Light, Time Out!, and Zandalari Templar are going into my first deck on Tuesday. And I expect it to be pretty good times. Zandalari Templar is vastly underrated. Getting the body of a Lich King for 4 mana is a ridiculous payoff, especially getting out of combo range at the same time. The deck is going to be good. If it turns out not to be good, trust me, I will be the first one bitching to Blizzard about all of the useless life gain pally cards they printed and wasted slots on if it's not possible to make a deck with it all at the end of standard.
Beware of Kingsbane Rogue for a last hurrah. Raiding party will single handed make it viable. more tempo deck to fend off aggro more draw to keep things flowing and always the long value game against control.
this might instigate more OTK decks which in turn should give birth to a hyper aggro deck which we havent seen since the old days were aggro could kill u in 3 to 4 turns so that it not only defeats OTKs as per usual but send Kingsbane Rogue back to wild. In the mean time Warlock dies until rogue disappears. unless such aggro deck is a zoolock one.
of course this prediction is only IF Kingsbane Rogue returns.
if not than Cubelock should make a final return which in turn should make Big Spell Mage viable and Odd Rogue as well, to fend off this old cancer deck. in this battle Big Spell Mage will reign supreme as the Tier 1 apex predator
You're right, and it's wonderful. By reigning in the power level you'll see one of the most diverse and fun meta's ever after the rotation. The stagnation on new meta decks was something that had to happen if we wanted a better overall standard experience. Most of the current meta decks are held together by the power creeped cards from the Year of the Mammoth. When they go away the deck builders are going to go wild with viable decks.
Don't order it then, no one cares.
Free to try and find a game, dealing cards for sorrow, cards for pain.
To add to that, Even Paladin is also still very strong. (Tier 1 even according to HSReplay)
They seem to be on the right track. There are some powerful cards coming but wouldn't call them broken. Though, we shall see which card is the sleeper. Most cards will be overrated, I think. This is a good thing!
I just checked all the cards that will rotate next year. This will be a completely new game!
Right way to get rid of this powercreep.
I still remember the time after Naxx. "We don't want that many powercreeps again" -> Times later level of Naxxramas is laughable compared to this day.