I don't see many Shudderwocks, but I agree that standard BADLY needs a neutral anti-combo tech card. There's no worse feeling than knowing it's impossible to win a game no matter what you do.
That's the dumbest thing ever. Why should there be ONE card that beats an entire deck? This is the same reason Demonic Project has an awful design. If there are insta-win counters to combo decks then there should be insta-win one card counters to control decks.
I don't think there is anything wrong with having 1 or more cards that are designed to disrupt a deck that has such little interaction with the opponent as ones such as Shudderwock or Malygos, etc. That adds interaction and strategy to what is otherwise a particularly one-sided match in my opinion.
Shudderwock shaman decks are not doing well atm. They have plenty of bad matchups: Big spell mage, control priest, mechathun decks, even warlock, most druid decks...
Why are so many control players so grumpy about losing to combo decks? It is actually supposed to be like that: Aggro>Combo>Control>Aggro
Why are people grumpy about the natural order? Because most people run around trying to be Ash fucking Ketchum, trying to be the best and beat 'em all, or some shit.
That’s something they touched on Omnistone last week.
HS would definitely feel more interactive, if they had tools to interact/make them play differently with their combo decks.
Tech cards that flat out destroy the combo don’t feel fun either.
If your whole combo relies on one single card (like Shudderwock) and one single card kills it (like Dirty Rat, etc) then that's the risk you have to take. Complaining that you should be able to make an unstoppable combo deck that the opponent can do nothing about is somewhat benign, I feel.
That’s something they touched on Omnistone last week.
HS would definitely feel more interactive, if they had tools to interact/make them play differently with their combo decks.
Tech cards that flat out destroy the combo don’t feel fun either.
That could be attempted, but we know it doesn't really work the way we'd like. New cards would come out, which will inevitably lead people to finding the best ways to abuse pre-existing systems. It always happens like this. And even if something radically different were introduced, we've seen it happen before, when Priest was reigning supreme, people were still using the Tier 1 decks and not using any of the new cards. It was like this for a short time, but still, we've seen that people will play what nets them their wins. It's like familiarity is their only calling.
Sure, I can spam aggro on ladder and beat them 100% of the time but I prefer control decks, especially some of the control decks that are around right now but, they stand 0 chance against Shudderwock. The infinite clears and cheesy Reno combo with Electra and Healing Rain, it's so boring and sad to play against. Does nobody else feel the same way? I feel as though I'm locked into playing more aggressive decks because of this single counter which.. I always seem to meet when I switch to control..
Time to join the rest of the braindeads and spam Zoo Lock I guess.
Sure, I can spam aggro on ladder and beat them 100% of the time but I prefer control decks, especially some of the control decks that are around right now but, they stand 0 chance against Shudderwock. The infinite clears and cheesy Reno combo with Electra and Healing Rain, it's so boring and sad to play against. Does nobody else feel the same way? I feel as though I'm locked into playing more aggressive decks because of this single counter which.. I always seem to meet when I switch to control..
Time to join the rest of the braindeads and spam Zoo Lock I guess.
How do you feel about mechathun?
Ironically, my absolute favourite moment of Hearthstone today was playing against a Druid Mecathun deck. 1 turn before he could play his Mecathun combo, I Psychic Screamed my Archbishop Benedictus into his deck! XD Ahhh he insta-conceded! Lol!
Sure, I can spam aggro on ladder and beat them 100% of the time but I prefer control decks, especially some of the control decks that are around right now but, they stand 0 chance against Shudderwock. The infinite clears and cheesy Reno combo with Electra and Healing Rain, it's so boring and sad to play against. Does nobody else feel the same way? I feel as though I'm locked into playing more aggressive decks because of this single counter which.. I always seem to meet when I switch to control..
Time to join the rest of the braindeads and spam Zoo Lock I guess.
How do you feel about mechathun?
Ironically, my absolute favourite moment of Hearthstone today was playing against a Druid Mecathun deck. 1 turn before he could play his Mecathun combo, I Psychic Screamed my Archbishop Benedictus into his deck! XD Ahhh he insta-conceded! Lol!
Ahaha what a baby POS, we are supposed to STFU because you want us to, yea gl, i been playing hearthstone for about 2 weeks since WoW is broken(mythic xrealm), gotrank 5 with odd warrior just about blind folded and i can say without a doubt this shudderbullcrap is the cancer of this game, pure trash why do think you see it so much at r5-r4. Playing that shit is like trolling the game, the developers really shit on thier face with this one. Love playing a boring ass easy ass game just to lose to that POS card spamming animations, really blizzard, y'all are hella good at your job
A deck only has a 100% winrate against you if you concede every time. Quit being a pansy and fight it out, you'll be able to scrape together a few good wins. Either that, or you can just concede against everything except the decks you best, and then watch them concede against you because they don't have a chance. That sounds fun
I've been playing Shudderwock lately *ducks under flying tomatoes* and every matchup feels winnable. I even beat a quest Mecha'thun Priest last night haha. He got out Amara, and he had played his Hemet. Then he was down to 6 cards at the end after Psychic Screaming twice (not sure what the 6th card was in his hand). And I managed to get the Shudderwock "combo" off.
I understand why people hate it, but man is it surprisingly fun to play lol.
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Twitch name: Anatak15 NA Legend Season 48, 49, 52, 53, 54, 74
Combo player: I know im gonna lose to aggro from turn 1!
This is how it works, accept it and stop making this treads one after another. All that crying part of HS community makes me want to leave the game.
Part of it has to do with the mentality of a control player. Control is an entirely reactive deck, and it's main goal is to try to stop whatever it is you are trying to do. The frustration with control players is not that they LOSE to combo decks, it's that they have absolutely nothing in their arsenal that can do anything to stop what you are trying to do.
The additional problem with Shudderwalk decks is that uses so many minions along with the deck that typical Warlock card disruption has a unlikely chance of actually hitting a key card. Warlocks at least have a chance against Druid combo decks, but I haven't had nearly the success against shudderwalk.
All that being said, Shudderwalk isn't such a big deal anymore IMO. But, the fact that control has so little ability to handle combo decks like this is frustrating for a class who's goal is to at least try to stop what you are doing. There's a reason why only control warrior and warlock exist now.
I think that "cool" tech cards are something like explosive runes use against shudderwock as mage. I have attempted to get it the turn before they use shudderwock before as BSM, and it seems to nearly work out for me, but I haven't accomplished it. Of course this isn't the best, but something like that secret that turns the opponents creature into sheep is nice too. I don't think these destroy combos, but rather makes them more cautious.
Shudderwock would be fine if they would just nerf this stupid combo. Almost nobody uses Shudderwock as a value card. It's only seen as a win condition. It would be far more interesting to see it as the N'Zoth of Jade Shaman or other battlecry-intensive decks.
this shithead needs to go: Grumble, Worldshaker... idk... switch battlecry to end-of-turn... or minions cost 2 or 3 mana...
Playing a control deck, especially, it is easy to beat shudderwock. That isn't the issue - the issue is that amount of time we have to sit through the animations over and over and over again as they keep playing them. For that reason alone I concede as I don't have that time nor want to sit and watch the endless animations keep cycling. It's a bad card. It is a card that sucks the fun out of playing the game.
It is Bed Brodes big F U to all of us before he left much like many of the cards he left us with before he took off to start his little company, which will fail like most do.
Shudderwock is terrible but the real game ruiner right now is Keleseth Zoolock. What the fuck was Blizzard thinking? Too many times on turn three or four he has like 6 +1/+1 minions on the board. Because of that stupid 0 mana cost ghoul, lightwarden, doubling imp, little kobold fuckface blah blah blah.
No deck should have that ridiculous a start. The whole strategy is to win by turn 5 and that is just sick. Sicker than any Quest Rogue or Odd Paladin of Token Druid. At least those decks give you time to draw some answers and do... SOMETHING.
Why do people always say "i hate shudderwock, I don't want to play aggro!". Shudderwock is good against aggro lol, i'll take zoolock or odd rogue over evenlock or miracle rogue any day. It's weak to midrange decks that keep playing big threats or combo decks that can out race it.
Shudderwock auto winning against control isn't true either as long as you play a control deck that actually has some relevant threats in it. I've struggled against big spell mages who run alex, LK, the 5/5 that summons a cost minion equal to hand size, etc. Control priest can beat it too, though un-favored. The only control deck that is just auto win is odd warrior, and frankly that deck deserves it. If tank up is you win condition then you're just asking for it.
It's not an op deck. It's a pretty good deck with a pretty decent skill cap. It's not the only infinite value combo / otk deck in the meta so why complain?
I don't think there is anything wrong with having 1 or more cards that are designed to disrupt a deck that has such little interaction with the opponent as ones such as Shudderwock or Malygos, etc.
That adds interaction and strategy to what is otherwise a particularly one-sided match in my opinion.
Why are people grumpy about the natural order? Because most people run around trying to be Ash fucking Ketchum, trying to be the best and beat 'em all, or some shit.
Kids are fucking stupid.
Come visit my Card Emporium. Strange things, you will find inside...
Come take the test, if you're daring. Feel free to show me your results in a message.
That’s something they touched on Omnistone last week.
HS would definitely feel more interactive, if they had tools to interact/make them play differently with their combo decks.
Tech cards that flat out destroy the combo don’t feel fun either.
If your whole combo relies on one single card (like Shudderwock) and one single card kills it (like Dirty Rat, etc) then that's the risk you have to take. Complaining that you should be able to make an unstoppable combo deck that the opponent can do nothing about is somewhat benign, I feel.
Are we still complqining about Shudderwock?
That could be attempted, but we know it doesn't really work the way we'd like. New cards would come out, which will inevitably lead people to finding the best ways to abuse pre-existing systems. It always happens like this. And even if something radically different were introduced, we've seen it happen before, when Priest was reigning supreme, people were still using the Tier 1 decks and not using any of the new cards. It was like this for a short time, but still, we've seen that people will play what nets them their wins. It's like familiarity is their only calling.
Come visit my Card Emporium. Strange things, you will find inside...
Come take the test, if you're daring. Feel free to show me your results in a message.
How do you feel about mechathun?
Ironically, my absolute favourite moment of Hearthstone today was playing against a Druid Mecathun deck.
1 turn before he could play his Mecathun combo, I Psychic Screamed my Archbishop Benedictus into his deck! XD
Ahhh he insta-conceded! Lol!
That must have been priceless.
It really was! Haha! :-D
Ahaha what a baby POS, we are supposed to STFU because you want us to, yea gl, i been playing hearthstone for about 2 weeks since WoW is broken(mythic xrealm), gotrank 5 with odd warrior just about blind folded and i can say without a doubt this shudderbullcrap is the cancer of this game, pure trash why do think you see it so much at r5-r4. Playing that shit is like trolling the game, the developers really shit on thier face with this one. Love playing a boring ass easy ass game just to lose to that POS card spamming animations, really blizzard, y'all are hella good at your job
A deck only has a 100% winrate against you if you concede every time. Quit being a pansy and fight it out, you'll be able to scrape together a few good wins. Either that, or you can just concede against everything except the decks you best, and then watch them concede against you because they don't have a chance. That sounds fun
I've been playing Shudderwock lately *ducks under flying tomatoes* and every matchup feels winnable. I even beat a quest Mecha'thun Priest last night haha. He got out Amara, and he had played his Hemet. Then he was down to 6 cards at the end after Psychic Screaming twice (not sure what the 6th card was in his hand). And I managed to get the Shudderwock "combo" off.
I understand why people hate it, but man is it surprisingly fun to play lol.
Twitch name: Anatak15
NA Legend Season 48, 49, 52, 53, 54, 74
Part of it has to do with the mentality of a control player. Control is an entirely reactive deck, and it's main goal is to try to stop whatever it is you are trying to do. The frustration with control players is not that they LOSE to combo decks, it's that they have absolutely nothing in their arsenal that can do anything to stop what you are trying to do.
The additional problem with Shudderwalk decks is that uses so many minions along with the deck that typical Warlock card disruption has a unlikely chance of actually hitting a key card. Warlocks at least have a chance against Druid combo decks, but I haven't had nearly the success against shudderwalk.
All that being said, Shudderwalk isn't such a big deal anymore IMO. But, the fact that control has so little ability to handle combo decks like this is frustrating for a class who's goal is to at least try to stop what you are doing. There's a reason why only control warrior and warlock exist now.
I think that "cool" tech cards are something like explosive runes use against shudderwock as mage. I have attempted to get it the turn before they use shudderwock before as BSM, and it seems to nearly work out for me, but I haven't accomplished it. Of course this isn't the best, but something like that secret that turns the opponents creature into sheep is nice too. I don't think these destroy combos, but rather makes them more cautious.
this shithead needs to go: Grumble, Worldshaker... idk... switch battlecry to end-of-turn... or minions cost 2 or 3 mana...
Playing a control deck, especially, it is easy to beat shudderwock. That isn't the issue - the issue is that amount of time we have to sit through the animations over and over and over again as they keep playing them. For that reason alone I concede as I don't have that time nor want to sit and watch the endless animations keep cycling. It's a bad card. It is a card that sucks the fun out of playing the game.
It is Bed Brodes big F U to all of us before he left much like many of the cards he left us with before he took off to start his little company, which will fail like most do.
Shudderwock is terrible but the real game ruiner right now is Keleseth Zoolock. What the fuck was Blizzard thinking? Too many times on turn three or four he has like 6 +1/+1 minions on the board. Because of that stupid 0 mana cost ghoul, lightwarden, doubling imp, little kobold fuckface blah blah blah.
No deck should have that ridiculous a start. The whole strategy is to win by turn 5 and that is just sick. Sicker than any Quest Rogue or Odd Paladin of Token Druid. At least those decks give you time to draw some answers and do... SOMETHING.
Why do people always say "i hate shudderwock, I don't want to play aggro!". Shudderwock is good against aggro lol, i'll take zoolock or odd rogue over evenlock or miracle rogue any day. It's weak to midrange decks that keep playing big threats or combo decks that can out race it.
Shudderwock auto winning against control isn't true either as long as you play a control deck that actually has some relevant threats in it. I've struggled against big spell mages who run alex, LK, the 5/5 that summons a cost minion equal to hand size, etc. Control priest can beat it too, though un-favored. The only control deck that is just auto win is odd warrior, and frankly that deck deserves it. If tank up is you win condition then you're just asking for it.
It's not an op deck. It's a pretty good deck with a pretty decent skill cap. It's not the only infinite value combo / otk deck in the meta so why complain?
Shudderwok Shaman is one of the only things keeping me still playing AT ALL! Without it I would have probably quit.