As someone who plays both... Control decks obviously require more decision making, simply because the games go longer and there's more decisions to be made, and you have to think about future moves. Aggro, you have to plan future lethal, which is also tough to plan out sometimes.
I still think my favorite matches in the game are aggro vs aggro. Control vs control just comes to whoever gets to their win condition first (whether it's death knights, quest completion, mini combo cards, whatever). Aggro vs aggro has some of the most intricate decision making in my opinion.
Anyways, aggro decks are usually near top tier because of how small decks are, and how small your opening hand is. It's a lot easier to play on curve when your whole deck costs less than 5 mana haha.
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Twitch name: Anatak15 NA Legend Season 48, 49, 52, 53, 54, 74
This is the best meta I can remember imo. Every playstyle seems to be viable/powerful. Plus, whenever a control meta comes out it leads to whoever has the more greedy deck, which sucks.
Right now at least you can play almost any deck you want.
How do you define "fast deck"? There don't seem to be any on ladder right now, certainly none that are "better" than any others.
Burn Mage and Spell Hunter can kill you by Turn 8 if they go unchecked. Is that fast? There are no decks anywhere as fast as post-MSG Pirate Warrior or Aggro Shaman from Shamanstone days. There are plenty of powerful mid-range and control decks.
They're not. Maybe I'm just a bad aggro player but I've never had an awesome winrate with any aggro deck. Every time I've won 70%+ with a deck on a given day it's always been with control decks.
This is slowest meta we have ever seen and this post still comes up. Like what....?
Yeah it does seem a little funny haha. Odd rogue and odd paladin are still fairly fast decks that are seeing quite a bit of success in upper ranks though. Which is good. If those decks didn't exist, it would come down to who has the deeper pockets and better legendaries to stuff their deck with haha. Meta's in a decent spot right now.
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Twitch name: Anatak15 NA Legend Season 48, 49, 52, 53, 54, 74
Because they are the most consistent with their early game draws and have few if any bad topdecks.
After turn 5, fast decks have almost only bad topdecks, and it can be very frustrating!
Yes, ideally, the best decks should be the most difficult to play, but Blizzard tend to nerf those decks a lot.
If you want to squeeze that extra 5% winrate out of your fast deck, those earlygame decisions do indeed matter a lot! Often even more than as for control decks.
Also like mentioned before, the skill requirement is tiny for fast decks.
Thats usually claimed by people who dislike aggro and enjoy control decks. Not really the type of people who make an unbiased judgement on the topic.
I've seen enough debate on the matter to not bother to much with statements like yours.
While they may be biased, they are still correct in most instances. In general (obviously there are exceptions) aggro decks take less skill to play effectively than control or combo decks. Anyone that plays a lot of decks on both ends of the spectrum can tell you that.
Because of the lack of interaction built into the game's mechanics. If the defender chose targets, the meta would be very control and midrange heavy. Since the attacker chooses targets, aggro will always push the meta first.
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Life before death. Strength before weakness. Journey before destination.
Because fast decks are ... well fast. It's simple math, really
For example, an aggro player and a control player play ladder for 1 hour. The average length of games for each of them are 5m and 10m respectively. The aggro player would have finished 12 games while the control player only finishes 6. If they have the exact same winrate, say 66%, they would have gone 8-4 and 4-2. The aggro player has gained 2 more stars over the control player in the same amount of time even though they have the same winrate
Meanwhile, 12 people would have queued into the aggro player while 6 people queued into the control player on ladder. Despite the fact that there is the same amount of players in the pool with the same gametime, the aggro player would have appeared as an opponent twice as often. This makes ladder-goers feel like aggro is more popular than it really is
Aggro is always going to be solid, but it’s not ‘always the best’. See the Kazakus priest/jade Druid meta for a recent meta that aggro was suffering in.
If aggro can’t do well then combo/control dominate hard which in turn shuts down midrange and tempo. Honestly the current meta seems very nice to me with great diversity that share success.
I think you just might hate losing to aggro because many times (especially with greedy, slow or combo decks) you can lose control so quickly you feel like you never had a chance.
Because fast decks are ... well fast. It's simple math, really
For example, an aggro player and a control player play ladder for 1 hour. The average length of games for each of them are 5m and 10m respectively. The aggro player would have finished 12 games while the control player only finishes 6. If they have the exact same winrate, say 66%, they would have gone 8-4 and 4-2. The aggro player has gained 2 more stars over the control player in the same amount of time even though they have the same winrate
Meanwhile, 12 people would have queued into the aggro player while 6 people queued into the control player on ladder. Despite the fact that there is the same amount of players in the pool with the same gametime, the aggro player would have appeared as an opponent twice as often. This makes ladder-goers feel like aggro is more popular than it really is
That's a really good point about the number of opponents faced by aggro players vs control players.
I don't understand why people feel the need to argue over the amount of proper technical play required to pilot Aggro decks and the rest. This is something that is extremely easy to prove.
You only need to decide on a deck for each playstyle you want to compare, and select two players, one extremely experienced with the game and a completely new player. You give each player the decks of each playstyle and have them play a significant sample size of games, lets say 1000 games with each of the decks.
After that, all you need to do is compare the Win-Rate each player achieved with each of the decks. The most demanding decks in terms of proper technical play will always yield a higher disparity between the unexperienced player and the experienced player.
If you put a Combo deck in the hands of a new player, his winrate will be abysmal while the experienced player will have a very good winrate, it will always result in the highest disparity in winrates and that is why those are the most demanding decks to play.
And the inverse is also the case, the less demanding a deck is, the lower will be the difference between the winrates of an experienced player and a new player with the deck.
Any other kind of argument based on what each individual personally enjoys playing is not really relevant because some people will feel the need to embellish whatever they prefer themselves.
Not scientific process at all, and also very hard to set up.
If you can’t kill your opponent by turn 5 go back to your collection and try again. That’s the way it’s always been with Blizzard. Because who cares about skill when you’re playing on your phone games should be quick and simple. Don’t EVER expect that to change.
PS. Stop making these threads there’s a Billion of em as is
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-Those who do not understand true pain, can never understand true peace.-
Out of the top 11 decks according to VS, 7 or 8 of them are aggro or tempo decks. Just because a deck doesn't look to kill you on turn 5 doesn't mean it isn't an aggro deck.
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Life before death. Strength before weakness. Journey before destination.
1, Fast-paced decks are just more effective grinders. You might do only 27-23 (54%) instead of 14-11 (56%), but due to how Ranks working, the aggro is (27-23=)+4 stars in a period, the control is only (14-11=)+3 stars, so aggro progresses more.
2, They often cheaper, require 1 (Baku) or 0 legendary and easy to substitute most cards with a cheaper version (like, when you don't have leeroy, you can use the pixie, which is worse oc, but substitute).
Out of the top 11 decks according to VS, 7 or 8 of them are aggro or tempo decks. Just because a deck doesn't look to kill you on turn 5 doesn't mean it isn't an aggro deck.
Tier 1: Even Warlock, Taunt Warrior, Cube Warlock, Token Druid, Kathrena Hunter, Big Spell Mage
Tier 2: Odd Paladin, Even Shaman, Odd Rogue, Taunt Druid, Big Warrior
No way are 7 or 8 of these considered "Fast" or "Aggro" decks.
How the hell is big spell mage tier 1??
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As someone who plays both... Control decks obviously require more decision making, simply because the games go longer and there's more decisions to be made, and you have to think about future moves. Aggro, you have to plan future lethal, which is also tough to plan out sometimes.
I still think my favorite matches in the game are aggro vs aggro. Control vs control just comes to whoever gets to their win condition first (whether it's death knights, quest completion, mini combo cards, whatever). Aggro vs aggro has some of the most intricate decision making in my opinion.
Anyways, aggro decks are usually near top tier because of how small decks are, and how small your opening hand is. It's a lot easier to play on curve when your whole deck costs less than 5 mana haha.
Twitch name: Anatak15
NA Legend Season 48, 49, 52, 53, 54, 74
This is the best meta I can remember imo. Every playstyle seems to be viable/powerful. Plus, whenever a control meta comes out it leads to whoever has the more greedy deck, which sucks.
Right now at least you can play almost any deck you want.
Unpopular opinion: Rogue is OP
How do you define "fast deck"? There don't seem to be any on ladder right now, certainly none that are "better" than any others.
Burn Mage and Spell Hunter can kill you by Turn 8 if they go unchecked. Is that fast? There are no decks anywhere as fast as post-MSG Pirate Warrior or Aggro Shaman from Shamanstone days. There are plenty of powerful mid-range and control decks.
They're not. Maybe I'm just a bad aggro player but I've never had an awesome winrate with any aggro deck. Every time I've won 70%+ with a deck on a given day it's always been with control decks.
Because they are the most consistent with their early game draws and have few if any bad topdecks.
This is slowest meta we have ever seen and this post still comes up. Like what....?
Yeah it does seem a little funny haha. Odd rogue and odd paladin are still fairly fast decks that are seeing quite a bit of success in upper ranks though. Which is good. If those decks didn't exist, it would come down to who has the deeper pockets and better legendaries to stuff their deck with haha. Meta's in a decent spot right now.
Twitch name: Anatak15
NA Legend Season 48, 49, 52, 53, 54, 74
After turn 5, fast decks have almost only bad topdecks, and it can be very frustrating!
Yes, ideally, the best decks should be the most difficult to play, but Blizzard tend to nerf those decks a lot.
If you want to squeeze that extra 5% winrate out of your fast deck, those earlygame decisions do indeed matter a lot! Often even more than as for control decks.
Editor of the Heartpwn Legendary Crafting Guide:
https://www.hearthpwn.com/forums/hearthstone-general/card-discussion/205920-legendary-tier-list-crafting-guide
While they may be biased, they are still correct in most instances. In general (obviously there are exceptions) aggro decks take less skill to play effectively than control or combo decks. Anyone that plays a lot of decks on both ends of the spectrum can tell you that.
Because of the lack of interaction built into the game's mechanics. If the defender chose targets, the meta would be very control and midrange heavy. Since the attacker chooses targets, aggro will always push the meta first.
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Because fast decks are ... well fast. It's simple math, really
For example, an aggro player and a control player play ladder for 1 hour. The average length of games for each of them are 5m and 10m respectively. The aggro player would have finished 12 games while the control player only finishes 6. If they have the exact same winrate, say 66%, they would have gone 8-4 and 4-2. The aggro player has gained 2 more stars over the control player in the same amount of time even though they have the same winrate
Meanwhile, 12 people would have queued into the aggro player while 6 people queued into the control player on ladder. Despite the fact that there is the same amount of players in the pool with the same gametime, the aggro player would have appeared as an opponent twice as often. This makes ladder-goers feel like aggro is more popular than it really is
Legend with : S65 Freeze Mage, S57 Maly Gonk Druid, S57 "Okay" Shaman, S53 Boom-zooka Hunter, S53 Maly Tog Druid, S52 Wild Tog Druid ft.Blingtron, S50 Quest Rogue, S49 Dead Man's Warrior, S41 Wild Clown Fiesta Druid, S41 Hadronox Jade Druid, S40 Wild OTK Dragon Druid, S35 SMOrc Shaman, S33 Jade Druid, S22 Control Priest, S19 Control Priest
Aggro is always going to be solid, but it’s not ‘always the best’. See the Kazakus priest/jade Druid meta for a recent meta that aggro was suffering in.
If aggro can’t do well then combo/control dominate hard which in turn shuts down midrange and tempo. Honestly the current meta seems very nice to me with great diversity that share success.
I think you just might hate losing to aggro because many times (especially with greedy, slow or combo decks) you can lose control so quickly you feel like you never had a chance.
That's a really good point about the number of opponents faced by aggro players vs control players.
Not scientific process at all, and also very hard to set up.
Because face is the place!
If you can’t kill your opponent by turn 5 go back to your collection and try again. That’s the way it’s always been with Blizzard. Because who cares about skill when you’re playing on your phone games should be quick and simple. Don’t EVER expect that to change.
PS. Stop making these threads there’s a Billion of em as is
-Those who do not understand true pain, can never understand true peace.-
But...aggro isn't that good.
Out of the top 11 decks according to VS, 7 or 8 of them are aggro or tempo decks. Just because a deck doesn't look to kill you on turn 5 doesn't mean it isn't an aggro deck.
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Join me at Out of Cards!
The 2 main reason is:
1, Fast-paced decks are just more effective grinders. You might do only 27-23 (54%) instead of 14-11 (56%), but due to how Ranks working, the aggro is (27-23=)+4 stars in a period, the control is only (14-11=)+3 stars, so aggro progresses more.
2, They often cheaper, require 1 (Baku) or 0 legendary and easy to substitute most cards with a cheaper version (like, when you don't have leeroy, you can use the pixie, which is worse oc, but substitute).
We can live without pizza, but then, what for?
How the hell is big spell mage tier 1??