Net decking is normally the best way to introduce new players to hearthstone ladder as helps players understand what cards are good and bad and at least gives them chance against more experienced players. What I don't see however is players moving away from the comfort of netdecking and creating something they are proud to say they made.It gets very old seeing they same couple decks being played on ladder and I wish players would begin to live a little and begin to show some variance on ladder.
Of course there are some difficulties in making unique decks that turn away a lot of players, and too be honest I don't blame them, why try something that might not work when you already have a perfect tier 1 deck in your collection.
These difficulties may include:
-fear of deck not standing a chance against meta
-Not having many cards/fear of crafting cards that are not worth it (the game is too expensive don't lie)
-Not knowing how to build synergies or efficient mana curve (it does seem daunting)
These are what I believe are the boundaries stopping players from moving away from NetDecking, I am not sure if they can be fixed but It's worth discussing anyway.
If I have one thing to say about creating your own decks it would be to work around your collection and to just give it a try, it is a lot of fun and don't be afraid to ask friends for feedback, it is worth it.
Overall, I don't think NetDecking is a problem but I wish more people would explore the possibilities of deck building.
I don't really netdeck, but I like looking at deck bases, and what cards to use as tech, and also what is the meta so that's that. But honestly I find it stupid that people only build one deck, that's so boring. I have 6 tier 1-3 decks built by myself, and have got a win rate of over 59% with them all
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Skidaddle skidoodle your Milhouse manastorm is now a noodle
As long as there is internet, netdecking will always be prevalent. Even in famous physical TCGs like MtG, netdecking exists.
Very rarely in standard format would they have an out of the box deck take over an MtG grand prix.
What's different however is the amount of tech and min-maxing available for Mtg decks based on your deck building skills and read on the current meta/tourney that you will join. With up to 4 cards of a same copy in a deck, similar deck concepts will/may have different ratio of cards. And this I think really differentiates casual players (net deckers) and good players in terms of deck building.
I enjoy hearthstone but I do think it is restricted by the deck size and max 2 card copies in a deck. This makes the deck tinkering very narrow as a whole.
Netdecking is normal but there is not enough tinkering space for decks to truly differentiate/reward good deck builders from outright netdeckers.
Netdecking problem can be mitigate with 2 actions.
Make the deck sizes bigger, a least 40 cards, better 60 cards, with that become much more harder to optimize lists and need to adapt and think for yourself in each game, something much harder to do than copy&paste a Tier 1 deck and follow obvious guides, and insanely OP cards like warlock DK harder to draw, HS with only 30 cards is just a setup for my "I win card" than an actual strategic game.
Make much more faster and often the nerfs and balance changes, play 30 times vs paladin or 25 times vs warlock for each time you play vs warrior or hunter is just wrong, every time the most played class is played 10 times more than the less played class something have to be done fast instead take months.
I don't like to play tier 1 decks...they quickly become not fun to play or play against mostly because of how repetitive matches become. When your opponent has every answer and all of the strongest plays it just feels lame, and when I play it myself I tend to feel bad. I will netdeck fun decks and swap cards to fit the meta, sometimes I'll just throw in memey cards for fun or for an unexpected swing. It's so easy to surprise opponents these days.
Netdecking is a good way to play the game, because as a player it is a good idea to know exactly how the strongest decks play. It's also useful for your laddering experience if all of your opponents netdeck. Even by turn 1 these days you can usually know what your opponent is playing, and theoretically it's possible to play around everything.
It's bad because it stifles creativity, however I think it's also valid to feel that you shouldn't be able to just throw an assortment of cards into a deck and have it automatically perform at 100% winrate.
I will say I have only ever hit legend (3 times in standard) with my own decks. I also build my own wild decks because those are fun and there isn't as much pressure to play netdecks there. With the standard meta as diverse as it is these days (pretty much best ever) netdecking is becoming less and less of an issue anyway IMO.
I don't feel like building and refining a deck list is a good use of my hearthstone time for the most part. I'd rather learn how to play the best decks as well as possible, and other people build and share better decks than I would make on my own. I'll throw something together in Wild or for Casual now and then but I'm realistic about my chances. I think when the meta is well defined and deck lists are more or less open information, there's more informed counterplay. I know what decks play MC Tech and when to play around it, I know to play around silence effects, I know that Leeroy plus Cold Blood could kill me, I know not to shuffle jade idols against a deck that plays skulking geist, etc., etc., and I play my turn based on what my opponent is likely to have. To me this is better than constantly guessing what my opponent's deck does.
Not particulary. But when Blizzard releases the decks that could be good, right at the start of the expension. It only excellerates the proces of net-decking. Which I think is wrong.
It's impossible not to have it. People share ideas, that's the way of the world. So you just have to accept it.
I don't net deck formally, aka I don't just play lists I find. But I do often build my own versions of popular decks once I've seen them played or have read about them. Often, the core of the deck is pretty obvious, and then it's about filling out the edges. I like to try different cards, and some of those experiments end up becoming popular (not because of me, just saying I do discover many of them on my own.)
And sometimes I even come up with fairly original decks (as in not super popular) and they catch on later in the season when the meta shifts to make them favorable. That usually makes me feel pretty clever. And there are always some janky decks that almost no one plays but they work just based on card quality and decent play on my part.
I've been playing around with Shudderwock using mostly creature buffing battle cries. It's actually not too bad, not great, but makes for a big value play later in the game when you play Sudderwock, and the swarm of buffing minions keeps people pretty busy.
But naturally, people who invest tons of time in playing and are keen on experimenting are the ones who drive the netdecking world. And that's really a good thing because it actually puts a lot of ideas in front of us to play around with. And if you dig around beyond the top decks in Hearthpown, there is lots of fun stuff to try out.
Rollback Post to RevisionRollBack
Check out my gaming blog: Downy Owlbear Designs and download free P&P games. Or argue with me about games on Qallout, the video debate site.
In part it's due to card design: once some archetypes have settled in meta, alternative builds are far from obvious, time-consuming and uncertain until extensively tested, and, above all, expensive to craft.
If you have issues with at least one of the above, netdecking, or at least netchecking (to see if a card is worth its dust and look for inspiration from other's experience) is a forced routine.
Even if you don't have any such issues, nobody is completely homebrewing on their own, because no dedicated player is completely blind to the game sites and communities.
I want to make control warrior. I love this class Hpower and i love control. For singletarget removal ill take 2x slams and 2x executes. With a lot of pallies i want whirlwind effects. 2x Warpath, Revenges, Blood razors. Cool. Now i want Justicar for hp upgrade to outarmour druid, occasional baku hunters and overall good effect. mkay, 2 brawls is something unquestional. DMHs to win control matchups, mb voodo dolls bcs i have 6 whirlwind effects, drywhiskers to outstand aggro. Need draw - acolytes, coldlights, shield blocks. mb add weapon hate. Consider Bring it on as good armour, sleep with te fishes.
and OMG i actually almost netdecked, what a prick!
Net decking is ok. It was ok 10 years ago when I’ve been playing MTG. Same goes for MMO with their optimal guides for characters.
In hs I’m not interested in building decks. Not because I’m stupid or lazy. I was passionate deck builder when I was playing MTG. It was very interesting and I could spend hours creating them and testing with friends. One of the reason - interesting mechanics and better rotation rules. For example, infect was never very competetive, but i loved it so much and wanted to experiment with all possible options - black, blue, green and mixed in all possible ways.
as mentioned above one of the main reasons are deck size and that the game is very expensive.
Why don't ppl just be honest to themselves and choose "All the Time"?
"NetDeck but swap cards and add tech" is literally netdecking.
I voted "all the time". Reason: net-decking saves my time.
This isn't the case for every archtype.
Take Big Spell Mage from the year of the mammoth. Depending on what direction you were taking your end game threats you could have run a different combination of some of the following including; Sindragosa/N'Zoth (for the deathrattle package), Medivh, Allana, Rag (wild), resulting in very different end game win conditions and this was accomplished through seemingly minor tweaking. Same thing goes for Control Warlock that runs Rin, and those that don't run it.
Tweaks that end up with very big differences in how they play is not what I'd consider the same as net decking the same copy pasta'd tier deck.
Netdecks are the most refined and tested decks around, because they've been created by pro players or streamers most of the time (but ofc there are exceptions). People may change few cards and add/remove tech in order to adapt them to their current standing in the Ladders but the main structure of the deck will remain the same.
Homebrew deck, in a competitive scenario, are often just not so efficient to justify their use for climbing. That's why netdecks will always be the main actors of Standard's Ladder (on Wild there a is a bit more varity because there are more Tier 1-2 decks around).
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For what profit is it to a man, if he gains the world and loses his own soul?
Sad thing is that people netdecking even in casual mode to farm other people with their aggro/t1 decks. Really wish there would be a mode where people play creative decks and not those fucking aggro/t1 kinda crap. Tavern Brawl doesnt count, it depends on the mode, but if people can grind their gold there with some stupid decks they will do it. I tried to play some kind of deathrattle rogue on casual but I only faced t1/t2 meta decks and lost so many games in a row.. Thought there would be a MM system which adjusts to ur winrate
The thing is that creativity only goes so far before that creative idea is stale and considered unoriginal. There are way more many players than ways to make a certain archtype unique. Eventually you will run out of ways to make something different until new cards are released in a new expansion or adventure.
Net decking is normally the best way to introduce new players to hearthstone ladder as helps players understand what cards are good and bad and at least gives them chance against more experienced players. What I don't see however is players moving away from the comfort of netdecking and creating something they are proud to say they made.It gets very old seeing they same couple decks being played on ladder and I wish players would begin to live a little and begin to show some variance on ladder.
Of course there are some difficulties in making unique decks that turn away a lot of players, and too be honest I don't blame them, why try something that might not work when you already have a perfect tier 1 deck in your collection.
These difficulties may include:
-fear of deck not standing a chance against meta
-Not having many cards/fear of crafting cards that are not worth it (the game is too expensive don't lie)
-Not knowing how to build synergies or efficient mana curve (it does seem daunting)
These are what I believe are the boundaries stopping players from moving away from NetDecking, I am not sure if they can be fixed but It's worth discussing anyway.
If I have one thing to say about creating your own decks it would be to work around your collection and to just give it a try, it is a lot of fun and don't be afraid to ask friends for feedback, it is worth it.
Overall, I don't think NetDecking is a problem but I wish more people would explore the possibilities of deck building.
People look up online to find the best strategies they can use to win in competitive games. It works the same in every single competitive game.
I don't really netdeck, but I like looking at deck bases, and what cards to use as tech, and also what is the meta so that's that. But honestly I find it stupid that people only build one deck, that's so boring. I have 6 tier 1-3 decks built by myself, and have got a win rate of over 59% with them all
Skidaddle skidoodle your Milhouse manastorm is now a noodle
As long as there is internet, netdecking will always be prevalent. Even in famous physical TCGs like MtG, netdecking exists.
Very rarely in standard format would they have an out of the box deck take over an MtG grand prix.
What's different however is the amount of tech and min-maxing available for Mtg decks based on your deck building skills and read on the current meta/tourney that you will join. With up to 4 cards of a same copy in a deck, similar deck concepts will/may have different ratio of cards. And this I think really differentiates casual players (net deckers) and good players in terms of deck building.
I enjoy hearthstone but I do think it is restricted by the deck size and max 2 card copies in a deck. This makes the deck tinkering very narrow as a whole.
Netdecking is normal but there is not enough tinkering space for decks to truly differentiate/reward good deck builders from outright netdeckers.
I love scrubs
Netdecking problem can be mitigate with 2 actions.
Make the deck sizes bigger, a least 40 cards, better 60 cards, with that become much more harder to optimize lists and need to adapt and think for yourself in each game, something much harder to do than copy&paste a Tier 1 deck and follow obvious guides, and insanely OP cards like warlock DK harder to draw, HS with only 30 cards is just a setup for my "I win card" than an actual strategic game.
Make much more faster and often the nerfs and balance changes, play 30 times vs paladin or 25 times vs warlock for each time you play vs warrior or hunter is just wrong, every time the most played class is played 10 times more than the less played class something have to be done fast instead take months.
It is a problem for creativity, but you can't stop people from looking up the best decks.
I don't like to play tier 1 decks...they quickly become not fun to play or play against mostly because of how repetitive matches become. When your opponent has every answer and all of the strongest plays it just feels lame, and when I play it myself I tend to feel bad. I will netdeck fun decks and swap cards to fit the meta, sometimes I'll just throw in memey cards for fun or for an unexpected swing. It's so easy to surprise opponents these days.
Netdecking is a good way to play the game, because as a player it is a good idea to know exactly how the strongest decks play. It's also useful for your laddering experience if all of your opponents netdeck. Even by turn 1 these days you can usually know what your opponent is playing, and theoretically it's possible to play around everything.
It's bad because it stifles creativity, however I think it's also valid to feel that you shouldn't be able to just throw an assortment of cards into a deck and have it automatically perform at 100% winrate.
I will say I have only ever hit legend (3 times in standard) with my own decks. I also build my own wild decks because those are fun and there isn't as much pressure to play netdecks there. With the standard meta as diverse as it is these days (pretty much best ever) netdecking is becoming less and less of an issue anyway IMO.
No, the card poll is small, it is ok to have a lot of people using the same decks, it is common in any small poll card game. :)
Why don't ppl just be honest to themselves and choose "All the Time"?
"NetDeck but swap cards and add tech" is literally netdecking.
I voted "all the time". Reason: net-decking saves my time.
Rongchoi's heroic adventure decks
I don't feel like building and refining a deck list is a good use of my hearthstone time for the most part. I'd rather learn how to play the best decks as well as possible, and other people build and share better decks than I would make on my own. I'll throw something together in Wild or for Casual now and then but I'm realistic about my chances. I think when the meta is well defined and deck lists are more or less open information, there's more informed counterplay. I know what decks play MC Tech and when to play around it, I know to play around silence effects, I know that Leeroy plus Cold Blood could kill me, I know not to shuffle jade idols against a deck that plays skulking geist, etc., etc., and I play my turn based on what my opponent is likely to have. To me this is better than constantly guessing what my opponent's deck does.
People will always look for the better and less time-consuming options in literally every aspect of his life.
If you play HS to win, you can netdeck. If you play it for fun, you can craft your own decks.
Not particulary. But when Blizzard releases the decks that could be good, right at the start of the expension. It only excellerates the proces of net-decking. Which I think is wrong.
Well said, OP. I chose no and all the time but in reality I now enjoy playing in wild. This week it's been Astrial Druid and Mech Mage.
I enjoy.
It's impossible not to have it. People share ideas, that's the way of the world. So you just have to accept it.
I don't net deck formally, aka I don't just play lists I find. But I do often build my own versions of popular decks once I've seen them played or have read about them. Often, the core of the deck is pretty obvious, and then it's about filling out the edges. I like to try different cards, and some of those experiments end up becoming popular (not because of me, just saying I do discover many of them on my own.)
And sometimes I even come up with fairly original decks (as in not super popular) and they catch on later in the season when the meta shifts to make them favorable. That usually makes me feel pretty clever. And there are always some janky decks that almost no one plays but they work just based on card quality and decent play on my part.
I've been playing around with Shudderwock using mostly creature buffing battle cries. It's actually not too bad, not great, but makes for a big value play later in the game when you play Sudderwock, and the swarm of buffing minions keeps people pretty busy.
But naturally, people who invest tons of time in playing and are keen on experimenting are the ones who drive the netdecking world. And that's really a good thing because it actually puts a lot of ideas in front of us to play around with. And if you dig around beyond the top decks in Hearthpown, there is lots of fun stuff to try out.
Check out my gaming blog: Downy Owlbear Designs and download free P&P games.
Or argue with me about games on Qallout, the video debate site.
In part it's due to card design: once some archetypes have settled in meta, alternative builds are far from obvious, time-consuming and uncertain until extensively tested, and, above all, expensive to craft.
If you have issues with at least one of the above, netdecking, or at least netchecking (to see if a card is worth its dust and look for inspiration from other's experience) is a forced routine.
Even if you don't have any such issues, nobody is completely homebrewing on their own, because no dedicated player is completely blind to the game sites and communities.
Hm, ok, no netdecking today.
I want to make control warrior. I love this class Hpower and i love control. For singletarget removal ill take 2x slams and 2x executes. With a lot of pallies i want whirlwind effects. 2x Warpath, Revenges, Blood razors. Cool. Now i want Justicar for hp upgrade to outarmour druid, occasional baku hunters and overall good effect. mkay, 2 brawls is something unquestional. DMHs to win control matchups, mb voodo dolls bcs i have 6 whirlwind effects, drywhiskers to outstand aggro. Need draw - acolytes, coldlights, shield blocks. mb add weapon hate. Consider Bring it on as good armour, sleep with te fishes.
and OMG i actually almost netdecked, what a prick!
Net decking is ok. It was ok 10 years ago when I’ve been playing MTG. Same goes for MMO with their optimal guides for characters.
In hs I’m not interested in building decks. Not because I’m stupid or lazy. I was passionate deck builder when I was playing MTG. It was very interesting and I could spend hours creating them and testing with friends. One of the reason - interesting mechanics and better rotation rules. For example, infect was never very competetive, but i loved it so much and wanted to experiment with all possible options - black, blue, green and mixed in all possible ways.
as mentioned above one of the main reasons are deck size and that the game is very expensive.
Netdecks are the most refined and tested decks around, because they've been created by pro players or streamers most of the time (but ofc there are exceptions). People may change few cards and add/remove tech in order to adapt them to their current standing in the Ladders but the main structure of the deck will remain the same.
Homebrew deck, in a competitive scenario, are often just not so efficient to justify their use for climbing. That's why netdecks will always be the main actors of Standard's Ladder (on Wild there a is a bit more varity because there are more Tier 1-2 decks around).
For what profit is it to a man, if he gains the world and loses his own soul?