Priest stomps warlock decks. Even the cheap one Inner Fire combo is like 3k dust and it is easily one of the best decks on ladder that isnt expensive and can be made by anyone even a f2p. Warlocks only issue is N'zoth after using resources on DK the N'zoth is what hurts players the most. Once it rotates out I'm sure it wont be a big issue.
- Best boards clears, check - Best healing, check - Best draw mechanics, check - Best Dk hero card, check - Solid Taunts
And he's not going to lose that much with the rotation next month, so what is Blizzard waiting to fix this messed class ? next expansion will just offer him more and certainly better cards to mess with and it will them another 3 months to react and nerf the wrong card, seriously, this is just getting stupid here.
Warlock became the strongest class because they nerfed Priest.
Were you also one of the people who called for a Priest nerf?
We warned you: If you want to nerf 1 thing, then another will take its place. Learn your lesson now!
I'm sorry but this is just wrong, pally decks been top dog for months, even before the nerf.
LOL ;) Paladins’ were not ‘top dog’ as you so funnily call the aggro decks that got destroyed during the Razakus meta before CubeLock was a thing.
Aggro decks they be but, both pally decks were 1st and 2nd in winrate decks, even during raza. Raza was strong, but was still listed as teir 2.
- Best boards clears, check - Best healing, check - Best draw mechanics, check - Best Dk hero card, check - Solid Taunts
And he's not going to lose that much with the rotation next month, so what is Blizzard waiting to fix this messed class ? next expansion will just offer him more and certainly better cards to mess with and it will them another 3 months to react and nerf the wrong card, seriously, this is just getting stupid here.
Extremly expensiv or selfhurting boardclearers, check
Kill your own stuff for heal, check
Pay 2 life and 2 Mana for for one card draw. Check
Some decks are powerless against Warlock, but others do just fine. So if you're losing to Warlock a lot, switch decks.
In any case, don't expect any nerfs any time soon. I don't think they'll do any changes before the rotation, which is probably about a month away, and they'll want the meta to settle a bit after the rotation before changing any cards. So you can either be unhappy for 2 months or try and play a deck that does well against Warlock.
- Best boards clears, check - Best healing, check - Best draw mechanics, check - Best Dk hero card, check - Solid Taunts
And he's not going to lose that much with the rotation next month, so what is Blizzard waiting to fix this messed class ? next expansion will just offer him more and certainly better cards to mess with and it will them another 3 months to react and nerf the wrong card, seriously, this is just getting stupid here.
Extremly expensiv or selfhurting boardclearers, check
Kill your own stuff for heal, check
Pay 2 life and 2 Mana for for one card draw. Check
Reviev 7 Void Walkers check
Sheep check
1- Defile? Hurt your own minions is an advantage, you can make the chain last longer and kill big opponent minions, I lost a entire jade board because warlock played two 1 mana minions with 1 and 2 health, and the spell cost only 2 manas, tell me how this is "expensive", hurt yourself with Hellfire for example was a big disavantage before, now with spellstone is totally irrelevant, all life lost will be recovered.
2- "Kill your own stuff" means "Prevent my cube to be silenced or transformed and get 18 mana value for 6", that is it?
3- Without need to draw anything, and, don't need to put any draw engine in the entire deck, making 30 slots for your win condition, any other class don't have this.
4- This happen what, 1 in 1 milion times? For me the worst result for warlocks are 5 Void Walkers and 2 Voidlords, this when don't revive 4 Dooms and hit 20 in the face.
5- Transform is avaiable for only 2 classes, shaman is dead and mage secret don't use, so, almost never happen.
Warlock is insanely overpowered right now, the only true contender is paladin and only because Call To Arms, massive nerfs in a lot of warlock cards is needed.
- Best boards clears, check - Best healing, check - Best draw mechanics, check - Best Dk hero card, check - Solid Taunts
And he's not going to lose that much with the rotation next month, so what is Blizzard waiting to fix this messed class ? next expansion will just offer him more and certainly better cards to mess with and it will them another 3 months to react and nerf the wrong card, seriously, this is just getting stupid here.
Warlock became the strongest class because they nerfed Priest.
Were you also one of the people who called for a Priest nerf?
We warned you: If you want to nerf 1 thing, then another will take its place. Learn your lesson now!
I'm sorry but this is just wrong, pally decks been top dog for months, even before the nerf.
LOL ;) Paladins’ were not ‘top dog’ as you so funnily call the aggro decks that got destroyed during the Razakus meta before CubeLock was a thing.
Aggro decks they be but, both pally decks were 1st and 2nd in winrate decks, even during raza. Raza was strong, but was still listed as teir 2.
According to your source but not the rest of the world. Or can you provide the data?
- Best boards clears, check - Best healing, check - Best draw mechanics, check - Best Dk hero card, check - Solid Taunts
And he's not going to lose that much with the rotation next month, so what is Blizzard waiting to fix this messed class ? next expansion will just offer him more and certainly better cards to mess with and it will them another 3 months to react and nerf the wrong card, seriously, this is just getting stupid here.
Warlock became the strongest class because they nerfed Priest.
Were you also one of the people who called for a Priest nerf?
We warned you: If you want to nerf 1 thing, then another will take its place. Learn your lesson now!
I'm sorry but this is just wrong, pally decks been top dog for months, even before the nerf.
LOL ;) Paladins’ were not ‘top dog’ as you so funnily call the aggro decks that got destroyed during the Razakus meta before CubeLock was a thing.
Aggro decks they be but, both pally decks were 1st and 2nd in winrate decks, even during raza. Raza was strong, but was still listed as teir 2.
According to your source but not the rest of the world. Or can you provide the data?
Things have gone a little back and forth, but according to Blizzpros Ladder Optimizer, Paladin were pretty good at the end of 2017.
Feel free to play a warlock for a while, then get back to me.
Yes, the decks (Control and Cube) are extremely powerful. But they are also very weak against a few different classes / decks. They are nearly auto-concede against secret / burn mage. They will either wreck, or get wrecked by Paladins. If they get their board clears, it can be the most lopsided match you will ever play ... but, a Paladin can also have you dead by turn 6 pretty easy, so get a bad draw, and you are screwed. Priest is a nightmare trying to play around mind controls, 10/10's on turn 4 or 6, mass dispel's, stealing minions and inner fire combos .....
So, IMHO, no ... nothing needs to be done about them. The players have already done it ... they have at least 3 or 4 decks that are medium to hard counters for it. Honestly, I just got my golden warlock hero, and I am switching classes because so much of the meta is made up of "anti-warlock" decks right now.
Exactly this.
Rather than complain, ask for advice.
Go play the deck you hate facing, is one of the greatest as you’ll learn more about the decks weaknesses when you depend on them yourself.
Also, this exact subject has been posted many times before in different threads. Please refrain from making a new thread unless you’re adding something new.
When you play 437 times vs warlocks and paladins for each time you play vs warriors and shamans something is wrong and have to be done, that is the point of the topic.
Of course warlock is not invencible, but don't need to have 100% winrate to be broken and need some adjust.
So let's say you've got some asymmetric version of paper-rock-scissors; paper beats rock 55% of the time, rock beats scissors 60% of the time, and scissors beats paper 65% of the time. That metagame will equalize (that is, all three having a 50% overall winrate) when the field is 1/2 rock, 1/3 paper, and 1/6 scissors. All three will be viable, but assuming that meta began as 1/3 of each, scissors players will feel metagame pressure to switch to rock until scissors is no longer overpopulated and rock is no longer underpopulated. (You can calculate this quickly by visualizing each archeype as an angle at a vertex and each matchup's winrate minus loserate as a side; each angle is proportional to the side it doesn't touch.)
A stabilized meta in a game like Hearthstone is merely a more complicated version of paper-rock-scissors (PRS); for instance, "paper" might consist of three different archeypes, each of which have a PRS relationship among themselves. Although it's possible that this can be applied symmetrically, this is often not the case (and it's arguably not even desired). However, if we imagine a five-archetype meta where there is only one "rock" and only one "scissors" but three different "papers," we would naturally want "paper" to consist of a larger portion of the meta. Thus, in this example we would want "rock" to have a very high winrate-minus-loserate against "scissors" (increasing the angle at the vertex opposite) while "paper" had a relatively low (but positive) winrate-minus-loserate against "rock" and "scissors" a low (but positive) winrate-minus-loserate against "paper."
I've looked at matchup data from Vicious Syndicate and it seems that our current metagame MIGHT (I'm not sure) roughly fit this five-archetype model. It's a lot more complicated than that, but Control and Cube Warlocks tend to have winrates above 50% against pretty much everything that isn't Priest or Secret Mage. Those decks, in turn, have their own very diverse array counters, most of which tend to lose to Warlocks. So Warlock is Scissors, Priest is Rock, and there are many Papers. However, what seems problematic here is that the Priest matchup against Warlock, while favorable, is not overwhelmingly so, and the Warlock winrates against some of the "papers" seem too high; as explained above, this reduces the meta-stabilized population of "papers."
So if we're going to nerf Warlock, we'd want a change that makes Priest even stronger against them while reducing Warlock's winrate against "Paper" without making it negative. Therefore, if Blizzard is going to nerf Warlock, my suggestion would be
REDUCE THE ATTACK OF VOIDLORD TO 2
This would make the Demon more vulnerable to Potion of Madness and Cabal Shadow Priest, making Priest even more of a counter; it also would probably slightly reduce winrates against minion-based aggression, but I doubt it would be severe enough to make Paladin favored against Warlock.
Again, I'm not sure that Warlock even needs nerfing; I'm just talking about how to nerf.
I swear everyone just stop corridor creeper and patches needed nerfs because they were in every deck. the Raza Nerf was fine, but we dont need a Nerf every time a deck is good.
I have two humble suggestions on this topic. The first is to wait until N'Zoth, the Corruptor rotates. I have seen cubelocks and control both running him, and it reduces the number of voidllords from 8 to 4. The second would be to nerf Dark Pact to match Sacrificial Pact, in that it can only target demons. This gets rid of pacting cubes, lackeys, and Rins.
- Best boards clears, check - Best healing, check - Best draw mechanics, check - Best Dk hero card, check - Solid Taunts
And he's not going to lose that much with the rotation next month, so what is Blizzard waiting to fix this messed class ? next expansion will just offer him more and certainly better cards to mess with and it will them another 3 months to react and nerf the wrong card, seriously, this is just getting stupid here.
Warlock became the strongest class because they nerfed Priest.
Were you also one of the people who called for a Priest nerf?
We warned you: If you want to nerf 1 thing, then another will take its place. Learn your lesson now!
I'm sorry but this is just wrong, pally decks been top dog for months, even before the nerf.
LOL ;) Paladins’ were not ‘top dog’ as you so funnily call the aggro decks that got destroyed during the Razakus meta before CubeLock was a thing.
Aggro decks they be but, both pally decks were 1st and 2nd in winrate decks, even during raza. Raza was strong, but was still listed as teir 2.
According to your source but not the rest of the world. Or can you provide the data?
Hearthstonemeta stats the two pally are still top in winrate. Where is your proof.
- Best boards clears, check - Best healing, check - Best draw mechanics, check - Best Dk hero card, check - Solid Taunts
And he's not going to lose that much with the rotation next month, so what is Blizzard waiting to fix this messed class ? next expansion will just offer him more and certainly better cards to mess with and it will them another 3 months to react and nerf the wrong card, seriously, this is just getting stupid here.
Warlock became the strongest class because they nerfed Priest.
Were you also one of the people who called for a Priest nerf?
We warned you: If you want to nerf 1 thing, then another will take its place. Learn your lesson now!
I'm sorry but this is just wrong, pally decks been top dog for months, even before the nerf.
LOL ;) Paladins’ were not ‘top dog’ as you so funnily call the aggro decks that got destroyed during the Razakus meta before CubeLock was a thing.
Aggro decks they be but, both pally decks were 1st and 2nd in winrate decks, even during raza. Raza was strong, but was still listed as teir 2.
According to your source but not the rest of the world. Or can you provide the data?
Hearthstonemeta stats the two pally are still top in winrate. Where is your proof.
Still?
We’re not talking right now.
Reading is tech ;) Also I do not need to prove the earth to be circular. Everyone knows it. If you want to convince people it is flat, you need evidence :)
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Priest stomps warlock decks. Even the cheap one Inner Fire combo is like 3k dust and it is easily one of the best decks on ladder that isnt expensive and can be made by anyone even a f2p. Warlocks only issue is N'zoth after using resources on DK the N'zoth is what hurts players the most. Once it rotates out I'm sure it wont be a big issue.
Some decks are powerless against Warlock, but others do just fine. So if you're losing to Warlock a lot, switch decks.
In any case, don't expect any nerfs any time soon. I don't think they'll do any changes before the rotation, which is probably about a month away, and they'll want the meta to settle a bit after the rotation before changing any cards. So you can either be unhappy for 2 months or try and play a deck that does well against Warlock.
I'm already doing something
Spamming the hell out of Kingsbane Rogue in ladder
So funny to slowly kill warlocks , burn their cards , spam emotes and watch them concede in shame , haha!
Felt the same way as you OP: until, that is, I actually tried playing warlock (both the cube and control variant).
Not really out of control. As others have stated, great against some classes, horrible against others.
well this topic again, pretty sure there won't be any fix until next expansion comes out
warlock is on a different power level, any ranked decks needs to build around cubelock which is extremely boring for me
if they had also nerfed cubelock a bit, there could be way more variety in the ladder
summon 3/9 taunts, 2 mana aoe, 1 mana heal, more 3/9, re-spawn all of them twice, sounds like a fun and interactive game to me :)
Novice engineer & Hearthstone dilettante
Perhaps next expansion provides them the first vanilla class-only 3/3 for 1 mana. They could use a boost after the recent nerfs.
Free to try and find a game, dealing cards for sorrow, cards for pain.
So let's say you've got some asymmetric version of paper-rock-scissors; paper beats rock 55% of the time, rock beats scissors 60% of the time, and scissors beats paper 65% of the time. That metagame will equalize (that is, all three having a 50% overall winrate) when the field is 1/2 rock, 1/3 paper, and 1/6 scissors. All three will be viable, but assuming that meta began as 1/3 of each, scissors players will feel metagame pressure to switch to rock until scissors is no longer overpopulated and rock is no longer underpopulated. (You can calculate this quickly by visualizing each archeype as an angle at a vertex and each matchup's winrate minus loserate as a side; each angle is proportional to the side it doesn't touch.)
A stabilized meta in a game like Hearthstone is merely a more complicated version of paper-rock-scissors (PRS); for instance, "paper" might consist of three different archeypes, each of which have a PRS relationship among themselves. Although it's possible that this can be applied symmetrically, this is often not the case (and it's arguably not even desired). However, if we imagine a five-archetype meta where there is only one "rock" and only one "scissors" but three different "papers," we would naturally want "paper" to consist of a larger portion of the meta. Thus, in this example we would want "rock" to have a very high winrate-minus-loserate against "scissors" (increasing the angle at the vertex opposite) while "paper" had a relatively low (but positive) winrate-minus-loserate against "rock" and "scissors" a low (but positive) winrate-minus-loserate against "paper."
I've looked at matchup data from Vicious Syndicate and it seems that our current metagame MIGHT (I'm not sure) roughly fit this five-archetype model. It's a lot more complicated than that, but Control and Cube Warlocks tend to have winrates above 50% against pretty much everything that isn't Priest or Secret Mage. Those decks, in turn, have their own very diverse array counters, most of which tend to lose to Warlocks. So Warlock is Scissors, Priest is Rock, and there are many Papers. However, what seems problematic here is that the Priest matchup against Warlock, while favorable, is not overwhelmingly so, and the Warlock winrates against some of the "papers" seem too high; as explained above, this reduces the meta-stabilized population of "papers."
So if we're going to nerf Warlock, we'd want a change that makes Priest even stronger against them while reducing Warlock's winrate against "Paper" without making it negative. Therefore, if Blizzard is going to nerf Warlock, my suggestion would be
REDUCE THE ATTACK OF VOIDLORD TO 2
This would make the Demon more vulnerable to Potion of Madness and Cabal Shadow Priest, making Priest even more of a counter; it also would probably slightly reduce winrates against minion-based aggression, but I doubt it would be severe enough to make Paladin favored against Warlock.
Again, I'm not sure that Warlock even needs nerfing; I'm just talking about how to nerf.
I swear everyone just stop corridor creeper and patches needed nerfs because they were in every deck. the Raza Nerf was fine, but we dont need a Nerf every time a deck is good.
I have two humble suggestions on this topic. The first is to wait until N'Zoth, the Corruptor rotates. I have seen cubelocks and control both running him, and it reduces the number of voidllords from 8 to 4. The second would be to nerf Dark Pact to match Sacrificial Pact, in that it can only target demons. This gets rid of pacting cubes, lackeys, and Rins.
WHAT NEEDS TO BE DONE IS REMOVE THE FUCKING SHIT JADES OUT OF WILD
AND THE BROKEN AS FUCK NAGA COMBO