Hearthpwn

Warlock: 8 attack minion + Shadowflame

Pala: Equality + Pyro

Control Warrior: Brawl

Mage: Doomsayer + Frost Nova

Priest: Lightbomb

Any aggro deck: Kill enemy hero

So yes, only two classes can counter this -.- ... 

Warlock has to have exactly a combination of an 8 attack minion and shadowflame?  Your opponent's giant combo can be played on turn 5 and 6 easily.  If you're trying to play mountain giant and shadowflame, your best case turn is turn 7 (3 mana mountain giant and 4 mana shadowflame), and by turn 7 you've already taken potentially two turns worth of hits from a board full of giants?  Sorry to say man, but Warlock doesn't survive against this... Especially since most Warlocks playing wild are playing Reno decks so they'd have to have a perfect draw of both combo removal cards.  The only scenario I see a warlock clearing a board like that early on is by bloodbloom and twisting nether or a ridiculous defile set up.  The point is that it's easier to play out a handful of giants with hardly any set up than to play against it.

Using shadow flame on a 8 attack minion on turn 5 is joke.

The warlock counter could be Corrupting Mist but doesn't guarantee you'll survive the 24+ damage...

Do you guys think they will nerf this deck style? I feel like it is risky to craft because they will end up changing the mechanic instead of nerfing giants. Leaving me with a bunch of useless giants I spent lots of dust on.

Overall I think something needs to be done about this combo because I cant see people enjoying wild with the chance of coming up against this deck. Although in a week we will probably see much less of it. To the people that say "Omg its wild everything broken and OP, get over it" you obviously do not play in wild very much. Wild is more balanced than you think and Blizzards intention isn't to just let wild go to sh!te. 

I think Blizzard will just wait and hope people get tired of the Naga/Giant combos in hopes that the deck won't show up as much for people to complain about it.  They need to just revert the change and stop messing with stuff that works.  People actually care about wild ranked and this is messing with the meta in a bad way.  Just look at how they handled everyone complaining about druid and ultimate infestation.  They left UI alone (which everyone said needed to be changed because it had too much value), and they messed with basic cards like Fiery War Axe and Innervate.  

Quote from FinalFortune >>

Quote from WickedAiken >>

i just can't believe this, this combo is absolute BS, i'm speechless.... so now a turn 5 29/29 on board is fair? yeah sure, you won't pull it off every turn but it's really unfair when you do.

2 classes can counter it yeah, good to know for the rest.

Time to play gwent i guess

 This doesn't happen, like ever, I put in 70 games today with a 44% win rate and never landed more than 2 giants on Turn 5.

Is it safe to assume the people defending this combo are currently abusing it? lol

Quote from pristamcar >>

Quote from hiko >>

Warlock: 8 attack minion + Shadowflame

Pala: Equality + Pyro

Control Warrior: Brawl

Mage: Doomsayer + Frost Nova

Priest: Lightbomb

Any aggro deck: Kill enemy hero

So yes, only two classes can counter this -.- ... 

Warlock has to have exactly a combination of an 8 attack minion and shadowflame?  Your opponent's giant combo can be played on turn 5 and 6 easily.  If you're trying to play mountain giant and shadowflame, your best case turn is turn 7 (3 mana mountain giant and 4 mana shadowflame), and by turn 7 you've already taken potentially two turns worth of hits from a board full of giants?  Sorry to say man, but Warlock doesn't survive against this... Especially since most Warlocks playing wild are playing Reno decks so they'd have to have a perfect draw of both combo removal cards.  The only scenario I see a warlock clearing a board like that early on is by bloodbloom and twisting nether or a ridiculous defile set up.  The point is that it's easier to play out a handful of giants with hardly any set up than to play against it.

 exactly,well said, this is the second thread with the same discussion and the same posters writing combos that can clear the board ... we know, ok, WE KNOW THE GAME, but as some have mentioned, u don't always HAVE those cards in your hand by that turn and MANY of them are 2 card combos (3 if i count the same person explaining to me in the other thread how i can use a warlock 4att mionion AND power overwhelming to clear the board with shadowflame ... i mean cmon, and hunter can hunters markx2 and unleash for a whooping 3 card 2 giants dead combo! dont forget, hunter has an answer!).

unrealistic, but u cannot expect anything else from ppl abusing this mechanic.

Combination of 2 and 3 I think. It definitely feels unfair when it goes off, but it's a combo deck so it can fall on its face really hard. That said, I'm 26-4 with a Warlock deck, 19-3 with a Druid deck, and I don't play Hunter so yeah, might be a little bit of number 1 too lol.

Are those your stats for Warlock Giant deck and Druid Giant deck? If so, that is a good indicator of how consistent this "inconsistent" combo is. 

There are many strong or "op" combos in wild that are difficult to pull off but Id argue this is one of the easiest and quickest ones to pull off. Incredibly simple combo as well. Combo decks are usually well thought out and planned for more than 5 turns.

Quote from King_Con >>

Is it safe to assume the people defending this combo are currently abusing it? lol

u don't always HAVE those cards in your hand

And you don't always have Naga + giants (which can be played for 0) in your hand on turn 5. You don' t always have the combo and not always the answer. So what's the deal? 

Quote from pristamcar >>

Quote from 1xbenx1 >>

Quote from pristamcar >>

Quote from hiko >>

Warlock: 8 attack minion + Shadowflame

Pala: Equality + Pyro

Control Warrior: Brawl

Mage: Doomsayer + Frost Nova

Priest: Lightbomb

Any aggro deck: Kill enemy hero

So yes, only two classes can counter this -.- ... 

Warlock has to have exactly a combination of an 8 attack minion and shadowflame?  Your opponent's giant combo can be played on turn 5 and 6 easily.  If you're trying to play mountain giant and shadowflame, your best case turn is turn 7 (3 mana mountain giant and 4 mana shadowflame), and by turn 7 you've already taken potentially two turns worth of hits from a board full of giants?  Sorry to say man, but Warlock doesn't survive against this... Especially since most Warlocks playing wild are playing Reno decks so they'd have to have a perfect draw of both combo removal cards.  The only scenario I see a warlock clearing a board like that early on is by bloodbloom and twisting nether or a ridiculous defile set up.  The point is that it's easier to play out a handful of giants with hardly any set up than to play against it.

 exactly,well said, this is the second thread with the same discussion and the same posters writing combos that can clear the board ... we know, ok, WE KNOW THE GAME, but as some have mentioned, u don't always HAVE those cards in your hand by that turn and MANY of them are 2 card combos (3 if i count the same person explaining to me in the other thread how i can use a warlock 4att mionion AND power overwhelming to clear the board with shadowflame ... i mean cmon, and hunter can hunters markx2 and unleash for a whooping 3 card 2 giants dead combo! dont forget, hunter has an answer!).

unrealistic, but u cannot expect anything else from ppl abusing this mechanic.

 Likewise unrealistic is assuming that there will be 3+ giants dropped on turn 5.

well the classes abusing this have ways of getting nagas: druid ramps into nurish, warlock taps and we know this works well, even reno lock has twilight/giant in their hand by turn 4 oftentimes, hunter tutors with stiched tracker and tries to draw giants with bright eyed scout (same mana discount though only 1 giant)... so there are good ways to have a higher chance.

running 8 giants means there aren't rly inconsistencies with having those in your hand.

and i'll admit that priest has shadow visions plus lightbomb itself but the rest of the classes rely on a 2 card combo to clear.

again, the giant decks ONLY need consistency for the naga as having sooo much giants pretty much guarantees having AT LEAST one by turn 5, many times more.

 

edit:grammar

And, as an aside, I kind of like that it exists right now (outside of druid) because Hunter and Warlock aren't in a great place in wild at the moment. This gives them a playable high roll-y deck type.

if these decks are able to be really well refined, i reserve the right to change my mind.

Yes, Warlock and Druid decks, but it's not a great indicator I don't think. Sample size of 52 games isn't very large, and a lot of these games were played right after the buff became live so a lot of people were not expecting it. FWIW games were played between rank 10-5.

Still, it's certainly an easier combo to pull off then say the old Patron Warrior shenanigans or Worgen stuffs, and doesn't require as many things to go perfectly like Mill Rogue. However, I don't believe the Naga Giants combo is on the same power level since board clears have become more sophisticated and you have to have all the pieces by turn 5 or else the opponent will likely have a recovery method; comboing this when the opponent has 10 mana and a card full of hands is much less effective. Also, maybe I was just fortunate, but I didn't go against too many face decks in relation to the amount of midrange/control decks.

If you play the deck for about 15-20 games you'll understand how inconsistent the deck really is. Most of the time you have Naga but no Giants, or vice-versa, and it's really hard to fit removal and taunt-givers into the mix. Then occasionally your Bright-Eyed Bitch gives you a 5 mana Innervate/Voidwalker. Yay!

And you don't always have Naga + giants (which can be played for 0) in your hand on turn 5. You don' t always have the combo and not always the answer. So what's the deal?

I think the "deal" is that the stats that it puts out for the mana value does not add up.  For example, Doctor Boom was considered OP for 7 mana because he had the potential of doing 15 damage with his bombs (high rolling), this is a lot more stat-wise for even less mana and it's guaranteed (not randomized) damage.  If you could play one zero-mana 8/8 per game or even per turn, then it might have some balance.  The fact that you could put at least two 8/8's simultaneously on early turns when most decks only have drawn only 25% of their deck, puts the other player at a severe disadvantage unless they have the exact answer for it.  Most players will never draw a weapon removal when their opponent has a weapon equipped, so they'll have to take a 5/2 weapon to the face for 10 damage, so why do they still put it in their deck?  Because it puts you at a slight advantage when you have the answer.  It's an answer for a question.  When you play an aoe removal on a relevant turn like 6 or 7 (dragonfire potion, flamestrike, etc) and the board is just as threatening as it was at the start of your turn, just seems like madness. 

Quote from hiko >>

And you don't always have Naga + giants (which can be played for 0) in your hand on turn 5. You don' t always have the combo and not always the answer. So what's the deal?

I think the "deal" is that the stats that it puts out for the mana value does not add up.  For example, Doctor Boom was considered OP for 7 mana because he had the potential of doing 15 damage with his bombs (high rolling), this is a lot more stat-wise for even less mana and it's guaranteed (not randomized) damage.  If you could play one zero-mana 8/8 per game or even per turn, then it might have some balance.  The fact that you could put at least two 8/8's simultaneously on early turns when most decks only have drawn only 25% of their deck, puts the other player at a severe disadvantage unless they have the exact answer for it.  Most players will never draw a weapon removal when their opponent has a weapon equipped, so they'll have to take a 5/2 weapon to the face for 10 damage, so why do they still put it in their deck?  Because it puts you at a slight advantage when you have the answer.  It's an answer for a question.  When you play an aoe removal on a relevant turn like 6 or 7 (dragonfire potion, flamestrike, etc) and the board is just as threatening as it was at the start of your turn, just seems like madness. 

I honestly haven't played with or against it yet so I wouldn't know.  It sounds cheesy, like many of the things can be.  Though it doesn't sound like it's unbeatable at all.  In reality it sounds a lot like how most things work out in Wild.  You run into a deck that is just a hard counter and you loose hard, or you run into decks that have no answer for what you are doing and win hard.  At least that is my experience like 60% of the time.

Quote from asteroidm

I honestly haven't played with or against it yet so I wouldn't know.  It sounds cheesy, like many of the things can be.  Though it doesn't sound like it's unbeatable at all.  In reality it sounds a lot like how most things work out in Wild.  You run into a deck that is just a hard counter and you loose hard, or you run into decks that have no answer for what you are doing and win hard.  At least that is my experience like 60% of the time.

If you want, watch this video to understand how this deck works (I know Kripp is playing at very low ranks, LOL, but the video still serves its purpose): 

Just because a deck can win in a few turns doesn't mean it always does or even often does.  People only remember the games where they got roflstomped.  There are plenty of games where they don't draw the witch and the opponent is like 'what the hell is this idiot running?' as they clobber them.  I would advise trying out any deck before passing judgement, it may also give insight as to the weaknesses and strategy used to counter it.

There's broken and there's what people think is broken, if you play the deck you'll see that a Turn 5, or even turn 4, 5/5, 8/8 and 8/8 aren't enough a lot of the time because the opponent built a board over those 4 turns and can trade for at least the Naga Sea Witch and one giant. Sometimes you get rolled entirely by things as simple as Savage Roar, Bloodlust or Gentle Megasaur or Pirate Warrior's goldfish.

So if Token Druid, Token Shaman, Merloc Aggro, Midrange Paladin, Pirate Warrior, Aggro Shaman, Face Hunter, any control Priest, any control Warrior, any control Paladin all have good match ups against it what exactly is it broken against in Wild? The Druid version of the deck is getting hit with the Innervate and Spreading Plague nerfs, the Hunter version of the deck is unplayable because it can't survive after it resolves the giants and the Warlock version is arguably the only playable Warlock deck right now in the Jade Druid/Renopriest meta so I don't think it's really a big deal at all.

In truth, I think the only reason the deck wins a lot of games is because players don't identify the deck fast enough and attack the enemy to activate Molten Giants accidentally. The real strength of the deck is that people just don't see it comming from something like Rogue until it's too late, but people are just playing really sup-optimal version of the deck fwiw.

Quote from Sherman